Vol. 534 No. 3
39 Mr. Hayes asked the Minister for Social, Community and Family Affairs the cost involved in distributing social welfare payments through the national network of post offices; the number of recipients who receive payment from post offices; the number who receive payment by electronic transfer; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [10743/01]
An Post will deliver approximately 43 million social welfare payments to customers of my Department during 2001. The cost of this service will be approximately £36 million. The payments delivered by An Post are mainly delivered through books of payable orders cashable weekly at a designated post office in the case of pensioners and recipients of certain other weekly payments and monthly in the case of child benefit. An Post also delivers payments to recipients of unemployment payments through the postdraft system. Under this system payment data are transferred electronically to An Post and can be accessed at the designated post office through the use of a swipe card or, in the case of non-computerised post offices, manually.
In addition to the payment system, An Post operates the household budgeting scheme under which persons using the postdraft system can opt to have payments made directly to certain utilities. For a number of schemes payment is generally made by cheque produced internally by the Department and mailed to the person concerned. My Department's customers may also opt to have their social welfare payments delivered by electronic fund transfer to their accounts at banks and building societies.
Of 1.430 million people who receive payment on a monthly or weekly basis, 20% are paid by direct credit to bank and building society accounts, l0% are paid by cheque and the remainder are paid through post offices.
Further development of the payment systems for social welfare customers will take account of developments in payment systems generally across the country. My overall aim is to ensure that the most modern and the widest range of payment methods is available to my Department's customers and to provide access, on an incremental basis, to the new services and facilities which have become available in the money transmission market so that my Department's customers can choose the service which best suits their personal needs and preferences.
Given the publication of the Flynn report on An Post, will the Minister take this opportunity to guarantee that the An Post model, through which social welfare recipients can obtain their allowances and payments, will continue into the future? Given the confusion that has arisen over the past week on this issue, will he put it on the record that social welfare recipients will still be entitled to receive their payments directly from An Post? Is it the intention of the Department to put out to tender to other financial institutions, namely, the banks or the credit unions, a tendering process where they will be able to compete against An Post for the provision of the services he has just outlined to the House?
I guarantee that as long as my party is in Government, we will do our level best to ensure that An Post has the contract in regard to social welfare payments. We will, as we have done already, renew the contract, although that is subject to an objection to the EU Commission on a number of grounds. We will not do what the Government of which the Deputy's party, the Labour Party and the former Democratic Left were members, that is, to say it would renew the contract but that the next time it would be renewed, it would have to go out to public tender.
That was never said.
It said that a number of years ago and Deputy Durkan was in that Department.
The Minister knows he is not telling the truth.
The Government contract letter—
Please allow the Minister to speak.
It said it would have to go out to tender and Deputy Durkan was a member of that Government. This Government renewed this contract—
That was never said.
—unconditionally.
The Chair is on its feet.
On a point of order—
I will take the point of order in a second. Deputy Durkan, I ask you to withdraw the allegation that the Minister told an untruth.
All right. I will rephrase it.
I did not even hear it.
Deputy Durkan does not have to explain. Deputy Hayes, on a point of order.
What the Minister said was incorrect.
I will give Deputy Durkan the letter – the Government contracts committee.
Please, Minister, I have called Deputy Hayes.
The Government contracts committee.
That was never said.
The Government contracts committee.
The point of order is that this is Question Time and it is an opportunity for Members of the Opposition to put questions. Will the Minister reply to questions rather than give his party political propaganda—
That is not a point of order.
—and his revision of history to which we are all used on this side?
The Minister to continue.
I reiterate that as far as this Government is concerned, we understand that it is the desire of people throughout the country to use the post offices for the delivery of their social welfare payments. We will do our level best to ensure that continues.
When does the Minister expect completion in respect of the EU challenge to this scheme and the right of his Department to use An Post networks to distribute income?
We have received no indication at this point but I understand that it will not take any action in regard to one of the complaints. There are two complaints – one on procurement and the other on competition. It will not take any action on one of them. In relation to the other issue, we have received no indication as to when it will make a determination.
That concludes Priority Questions.
