It is proposed to take No. 20, Local Government Bill 2003[Seanad]– Report Stage (Resumed) and Final Stages; No. 21, Criminal Justice (Illicit Traffic by Sea) Bill 2000 – Order for Report and Report and Final Stages; No. 2, Garda Síochána (Police Co-operation) Bill 2003 [Seanad]– Second Stage. It is proposed, notwithstanding anything in Standing Orders, that the proceedings on the resumed Report and Final Stages of No. 20 shall, if not previously con cluded, be brought to a conclusion at 5 p.m. by one question which shall be put from the Chair and which shall, in relation to amendments, include only those set down or accepted by the Minister for the Environment and Local Government. Private Members' Business shall be No. 34, motion re decentralisation (resumed), to conclude at 8.30 p.m.
Order of Business.
There is one proposal to be put to the House. Is the proposal for dealing with No. 20, Local Government Bill 2003[Seanad]– Report Stage (Resumed) and Final Stages, agreed to?
I wish to raise a matter on No. 2, a Cheann Comhairle.
The Deputy cannot speak on No. 2 as there is no proposal before the House in that regard. We are dealing with No. 20.
The Labour Party opposes the guillotine on this Bill. By the time we conclude the Order of Business and Question Time, there will be about three-quarters of an hour left in which to take Report Stage of the Local Government Bill 2003[Seanad], which has 25 amendments to be dealt with, some of which relate to issues which touch on the constitutionality of some of the Bill's provisions. It is unwise of the Government to place a guillotine on the Bill and it is unnecessary since it is likely that, with the degree of co-operation evident on Committee Stage, the proceedings on Report Stage could be concluded in normal time, without a guillotine. I request that the Government remove the guillotine.
I also request that the Government remove the guillotine in view of the fact that the Bill affects all Members of the Oireachtas in one way or another, as well as the fact that major questions have been raised about its constitutionality and, as Deputy Gilmore pointed out, there was co-operation on Committee Stage. Maybe the initial stages last week took a bit longer than we had planned, but we can deal with this in a professional and speedy way if allowed. I oppose the principle of the guillotine.
The Green Party supports the call for the Government to remove the guillotine on this Bill. It is a Bill of enormous interest to many Members of this House and not only has the Government secured co-operation in the conduct of the Bill on Second and Committee Stages, it also has support from Members on this side of the House in seeking the passage of the Bill. On those grounds, there should be no reason for a guillotine today.
I add my voice to the appeal to the Taoiseach and the Chief Whip to facilitate the extension of time to deal with Report and Final Stages of this Bill. I also ask them to note that while they did indeed enjoy the support of some Members from the Opposition benches through Second Stage, the indications so far in terms of Government acceptance of key and critical amendments are likely to result in the hardening of positions, and this is most unfortunate.
I accept Deputy Gilmore's point. I understand from his contribution that he is asking for another hour, so we will go from 3.45 p.m. until 6 p.m. instead of 5 p.m., if that is acceptable.
I am prepared to agree to that.
No. 2, the Garda Síochána (Police Co-operation) Bill 2003, is in part to do with the implementation of the North-South policing arrangements. I met Chief Constable Orde recently and one of the issues raised was the requirements for remuneration and allowances for members of the Garda who might join the PSNI under the terms of this Bill. Will that require secondary legislation? If so, I urge that it all be done together so that there can be no cause for delay. In other words, once co-operation is in place and the arrangements have been made for people from the South to join the Northern force or vice versa, there should be no further delay due to secondary legislation requirements dealing with financial arrangements or allocations.
I accept Deputy Kenny's point. I am not sure whether secondary legislation or regulations are required – it may be just procedure. However, I agree that there should be no delay. When we pass the legislation we should proceed quickly to the implementation stage. That is necessary for many reasons, including the ongoing work on the policing boards and the necessary arrangements and reforms that are being put in place. I know the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform is conscious of that and wants to move on with the regulations as soon as the legislation is passed. Deputy Kenny is saying that during the passage of the legislation, the other matters should also be dealt with. I am not sure whether secondary legislation is required but I know the Minister is anxious to advance so that once the Bill is passed there will be no great delay before implementation.
Legislation has been promised to provide a statutory system to cater for patients who have complaints about the health service. Is he aware that some patients in Tallaght hospital are being treated in the mortuary?
We cannot discuss the contents of the Bill. The Taoiseach should comment on the health complaints Bill.
It is important that the Taoiseach is aware of this situation.
The heads of the Bill are expected in the middle of this year and the Bill will be published next year.
Will he ensure that this legislation is fast-tracked?
My question deals with the water services Bill and the Taoiseach's seriousness in dealing with climate change. Will the Taoiseach, in bringing forward this Bill, change it from being a recipe for privatisation to one that actually deals with the need for conservation?
We cannot discuss the contents of the Bill.
We will need to discuss this very soon. The water services Bill is on the list and I am asking a question about it.
It will be dealt with this session.
It took five years to get the Children Act on the books and it has been in force for two years. The key parts of the Act, Parts II, III and XI, have not yet been introduced. When will the regulations come into operation to activate these parts of the Children Act?
A range of the sections have been activated and there have been some difficulties with some of the others. The Minister has answered questions in the House on this matter and this should be taken up with him. He has given the reasons for the delays, which are related to implementation and enforcement. His view is that it is better that some of the work is going on before the regulations are brought in. The Deputy should table a parliamentary question to the Minister.
Seeing two criminal justice Bills on the Order Paper is like seeing the first swallow in spring. It is very welcome – obviously the Minister has returned. The Minister made statements at the Garda conference yesterday to the effect that he would establish a Garda reserve force. Obviously, legislation will be required to determine what powers it would have and so on. When is it proposed to introduce this legislation? Does the Taoiseach have any idea how it will operate and what powers it might have?
On the same subject—
Sorry, we cannot have another question on the same issue. Has legislation been promised?
Perhaps it was in the Minister's speech, but it is not on the list of legislation as yet.
The Deputy should submit a question to the Minister.
I am sorry—
I will call the Deputy later on and if he has a question appropriate to the Order of Business—
I wanted to dispose of the matter now because it was appropriate under Standing Orders with regard to matters promised inside or outside the House.
We are talking about legislation.
Yes, of course.
What is the Deputy's question?
Just when we thought the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform was setting down his proposal to bring back the auxiliaries—
Has the Deputy a question?
Has a Government decision been made on this issue? When will the legislation come forward? Legislation will be required on this issue.
It is not on the list of legislation. If the Deputy puts down a question, the Minister will explain when this will be brought forward.
It is the first the Taoiseach has heard of it.
The Deputy is just making another speech.
Does the Taoiseach not agree that the Garda Síochána (Police Co-operation) Bill scheduled to be taken later today is premature in the extreme when its content is taken into account? Certainly in relation to the issues—
These issues can be brought up when the Bill comes before the House.
In relation to the Stevens report—
Deputy Gay Mitchell.
Surely we cannot contemplate serving members of the RUC who were involved in those actions working within the Garda Síochána.
The Deputy is out of order. He can raise those matters when the Bill comes before the House.
I understand the legislation to replace the Official Secrets Act 1963 will not come before the House until next year. This is very important legislation. Will the Taoiseach precede it with a White Paper dealing with all the issues?
The first preliminary draft has been received in the Department and is under consideration, and some of the heads have been approved. It is listed for next year but I will ask the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform if that can be improved upon.
What is the situation in relation to the Grangegorman development agency Bill, which has been promised for a number of years?
The legislation is under preparation in the Department. I understand a large amount of the work has been done in conjunction with the Dublin Institute of Technology and the legislation has now gone to the draftsman.
I am sure the Ceann Comhairle will have read with dismay, as I did, that Ireland's competitiveness among smaller economies has slumped from fifth to a position outside the top ten. In that context, will the Taoiseach explain the lack of urgency in his legislative programme on inflation and competitiveness. That survey shows we are ranked twenty-ninth on infrastructure and twenty-fifth on—
The content of the Bill or what the Deputy would like to say in his Second Stage speech on it does not arise at this stage.
For example, in relation to the insurance Bill, we will see only the heads of that Bill.
On the insurance legislation, Taoiseach.
Some urgency needs to be injected into that. I would like to know what other legislative proposals the Government has in this area of competitiveness inflation because it is something it has created to which we need a response.
On the promised legislation.
On the insurance legislation, the heads of the Bill will be prepared and a second Bill is required in the justice area, the heads of which will also be ready shortly.
Is that all the information the Taoiseach has on that?
If the Government is intent on introducing a loan system for third level students, I assume it will require a financial legislative measure in order to implement that.
Is legislation promised on this area?
Can the Taoiseach give us a categorical assurance that there is no legislation promised in this area before the summer recess?
Has legislation been promised?
No.
Not before the summer recess. Therefore, we can take it that fees will not be reintroduced in September.
I asked the Taoiseach yesterday about the lack of time specifics in the legislative programme, particularly in relation to the Department of Justice, Equality and Law Reform where no time scale is specified for 13 of the 25 Bills on the programme. Given that the Minister has now announced another policy initiative for which no legislation is specified, can the Taoiseach indicate to what extent these Bills represent a wish list by the Minister or to what extent are they real Bills?
That matter does not arise now.
We need to know whether these Bills have been prepared in any way.
I call Deputy Coveney.
Have these Bills been prepared or are they merely a list of titles on paper? Can the Taoiseach not answer that question?
I suggest the Deputy tables a question on the matter.
Is this promised legislation?
Has the Deputy a particular Bill he wishes to inquire about?
The 13 Bills to which I referred. I will list them. I wish to ask about the status of the 13 Bills listed as expected but in respect of which it is not possible to indicate when they will be published.
That question was dealt with yesterday.
They are the civil evidence Bill, the contractual obligations applicable law Bill, the coroner's (amendment) Bill, the crimes Bill, the drug offenders Bill, the enforcement of fines Bill, the family law Bill, the gaming and lotteries (amendment) Bill and the ground rents Bill. There are 13 Bills. There is also the prison service Bill, the proceeds of corruption Bill, the provision of the Director of Public Prosecutions appeal against unduly lenient sentences in serious cases before the District Court Bill and the trust Bill. Those are 13 of the 25 Bills promised in respect of which there is no indication whether they exist, how they insist or when they will come before this House.
The Department of Justice, Equality and Law Reform is always out in front in terms of the number of Bills passed in any year or in any Dáil term. There are always 30 or 40 legislative measures pending in that Department. Any Member who has served as a Whip in this House would know it is always difficult to secure enough time to enable justice Ministers to introduce and bring such legislation through the Houses. There are a number of Bills before the House and a number of Bills that will be published by the Department of Justice, Equality and Law Reform, but all the Bills on this list are in the process, for example, the heads are being prepared, the Bill has gone for full drafting or for full checking. All the Bills listed on the legislative programme will come forward in due course, but they cannot dominate the entire legislative programme. That is how the process works.
Does the Taoiseach share my concern at the state of preparedness of Ireland to deal with or to prevent a major oil spillage along our coastline? Will he ensure that the sea pollution (miscellaneous provisions) Bill will be passed before the summer?
A promise was made to set up a broadcasting authority of Ireland to replace the BCI seven or eight months ago. Legislation will be required for that to happen, but such legislation is not even on the list before us. Why is such legislation not on the list, given that it has been promised on numerous occasions? Will the Taoiseach indicate a time scale for its introduction?
The second matter raised by the Deputy is not on the list. I suggest he tables a question on the matter to the relevant Minister and seek an explanation for that.
On the sea pollution (miscellaneous provisions) Bill to give effect to the protocol to the international convention for oil pollution, the heads of the Bill are completed and the Bill should be ready before the summer recess.
The Taoiseach may have been asked this question already, but is it possible to make time available to discuss the trade justice issues?
That is a matter for the Whips.
I ask the Taoiseach whether some time could be made available to discuss these important issues.
I must move on to Deputy Timmins.
I have a second question.
On legislation?
Yes. In relation to the two important reports on the ports we received yesterday, is it is intended to bring forward legislation or is the Minister for the Marine and Natural Resources intent on rushing headlong to privatise all our ports on foot of those reports?
Is legislation promised on this matter?
There is no specific legislation on this matter as of yet.
On a point of order, the Ceann Comhairle regularly rules out questions about future debates in the Dáil which he is not entitled to do under Standing Orders on the basis that they are a matter for the Whips. There is no such thing in the Standing Orders of this House as any reference to the Whips. There might be a precedent of referring matters to the Whips.
Sorry, Deputy—
The Ceann Comhairle is wrong in his ruling.
No. Deputy Stagg, the Chair is not wrong in the ruling.
The Chair is wrong.
That may be the Deputy's opinion, but the Chair is not wrong in his ruling.
The Ceann Comhairle can stand up as high as he likes, but he is still wrong in his ruling.
I ask the Deputy to resume his seat while the Chair is on his feet. There are long-standing rulings by my predecessors in this House in this regard. The reason for this is quite simple.
There were also different Whips then.
The reason is quite simple. It is that if one allows a Member to ask the Taoiseach on the Order of Business if time will be allowed for a debate—
A Member is entitled to do so.
—every Member on each side of the House would ask the Taoiseach each morning about local and major issues.
The Chair has been up that route.
That has been the precedent. The ruling is there. The Chair has ruled on this matter.
Members are entitled under Standing Orders—
They are not entitled to do so under Standing Orders. If the Deputy wants to bring in a Standing Order to entitle them to do so, the Chair would be glad to implement it.
The Ceann Comhairle is wrong in his ruling.
The Chair is not wrong in his ruling.
There is no reference to the Whips in the Standing Orders.
The Chair cannot change the Deputy's opinion. There can be no more explanations. I am moving on. I call Deputy Durkan.
What about Deputy Timmins?
I am sure the Chair will allow me some leniency in recompense for that.
I do not know about that.
In the next few weeks there will probably be agreement on the most fundamental reform of the CAP since its initiation, yet we have not had the opportunity to discuss it in this House. While I do not mean to be disorderly following the Chair's last ruling will the Taoiseach request the Minister for Agriculture and Food to make statements in this House on where the Government stands on the Fischler proposals?
I pointed out a number of times today that this is a matter for the Whips.
Also, when will the veterinary medicines Bill come before the House?
This session.
On 1 April last the Minister of State with responsibility for housing, Deputy Noel Ahern, told the House there were 79 people homeless on the streets of Dublin. However, the figures published by his Department on Monday confirmed that the number of people homeless in Dublin is not 79 but 4,060.
Has the Deputy a question appropriate to legislation?
What arrangements are being made for the Minister of State with responsibility for housing to come into the House to correct the record?
This matter does not arise now.
It does arise.
I call Deputy Durkan.
Deputy Gilmore knows that those figures refer to two different categories. The Deputy is playing with the figures. He is misleading the House.
A Cheann Comhairle—
The Deputy is being disorderly. The Chair has already ruled on the issue of raising those types of matters.
What I have requested is the normal practice when a Minister gives inaccurate information. Even on 1 April, there is a big difference between the figures 79 and 4,060. When will the Minister of State correct the record of the House?
He referred to the homeless people on the street.
The Deputy should submit a question directly to the Minister of State.
Which of the two Bills in terms of promised legislation anticipates the wishes or views of the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform as expressed in one of his rural forays yesterday?
Has the Deputy a relevant question on promised legislation?
Yes, I have a relevant question. Does the criminal justice (miscellaneous provisions) Bill or the criminal justice (Garda powers) Bill anticipate the wishes or the views expressed by the Minister yesterday?
We cannot discuss the contents of Bills.
The Taoiseach may wish to indicate whether an amendment is likely to be made given the Minister's expressions yesterday—
The Deputy is out of order.
—and especially given the cost—
The Deputy will have an opportunity to contribute when the debate takes place. I call Deputy Enright.
A Cheann Comhairle—
We want to let your colleague contribute, Deputy. We are running out of time.
Surely the Taoiseach can indicate whether either of these two Bills covers the wishes expressed by the Minister yesterday.
I call Deputy Enright.
The Taoiseach wants to answer.
I can only answer on the Bill. The Criminal Justice (Miscellaneous Provisions) Bill provides for miscellaneous criminal law reform matters. Work is at a preliminary stage of examination and the heads of the Bill are expected in the middle of this year with the legislation published next year.
The Minister for Education and Science stated that employment of school staff is primarily a matter for boards of management, and school authorities have a duty of care in this regard to their pupils. In that context, will the Bill dealing with the registration of persons considered unsafe to work with children include screening procedures and Garda vetting? When will it come before the House? On related legislation, when will the commission to inquire into child abuse (amendment) Bill be published?
The Taoiseach said in terms of promised legislation in reply to Deputy O'Sullivan that it was not promised legislation relating to third level fees and loans. Is it intended to bring legislation in this regard before the House?
The last question is not appropriate. The first two are in order.
The Bill dealing with the registration of persons who are considered unsafe to work with children is to give effect to the recommendations of the child protection joint working group. This arises from the North-South Ministerial Council. I do not have a date for the Bill but the Minister intends to bring proposals to Government in the near future with a view to establishing a working group to finalise the programmes for the legislation. The publication date is dependent upon the recommendation of the child protection working group which comprises officials from both North and South. The heads of the Bill are due this month but I do not have a date for the publication of the legislation.
The heads of the commission to inquire into child abuse (amendment) Bill were approved a few weeks ago and the Bill should be before the House this session.
When will the Pharmacy Bill be before the Dáil? Will the Taoiseach intervene immediately in the doctors' dispute? It is not right that these public servants are protesting on the streets. It is time someone resolved the dispute with them.
There are other ways of raising this matter in the House.
Will they be represented in the Health (Complaints) Bill?
This has already been raised by Deputy McManus.
Work is under way on drafting the heads of the Pharmacy Bill and they are expected some time during this year. It is unlikely that the legislation will be published before next year.
I call Deputy Crawford to ask a question appropriate to the Order of Business.
It certainly will be appropriate. Given that St. Vincent's Hospital has suggested it will not accept any more patients from outside Dublin, will the Health (Complaints) Bill be brought be before the House to allow us discuss—
This is the third time this was raised. We will move on to No. 20.