Dáil Éireann debate -
Wednesday, 4 Nov 2009

Vol. 693 No. 2

Adjournment Debate.

Tiger Kidnappings.

Deputy Charles Flanagan

I wish to ask the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform about the nature of the review he has sought on the matter of tiger kidnappings. Yesterday's event is the latest in what is an appalling ordeal for families to be put through. The sharp rise in tiger kidnappings in recent times is evidence of manifest failure in the criminal justice system. The most recent CSO statistics show that kidnappings increased by 86% in the third quarter of 2009 compared to the same period in 2008 and increased by 57% in the past 12 months. The State is clearly regarded as a soft touch when it comes to tiger kidnappings.

A delegation of senior gardaí and officials from the main banks met on 2 March this year to discuss protocols following a tiger kidnapping on 28 February that netted €7.6 million for raiders of Bank of Ireland on College Green. Following the raid, the Minister had a much-publicised meeting with the Garda Commissioner. Yesterday, as it has been on a number of occasions, the Bank of Ireland was targeted again. It is clearly considered something of a soft touch by those responsible and yesterday's raid was the fourth on a Bank of Ireland branch this year.

Following last week's raid, bank staff themselves called for a major review of bank security by the Government and Garda, as well as by the Bank of Ireland. I understand the Minister is to meet the Garda Commissioner tomorrow to discuss tiger kidnappings, a meeting which was planned before yesterday's raid. Has a limit been agreed in respect of how much money an employee can take out or handle in a bank? If not, the message to armed gangs is that tiger kidnappings are lucrative and rather easy to execute.

I ask the Minister to consider the issue of resources with particular reference to community gardaí. The raiders in these case have clearly put a watch on the victim's house before the kidnap. They had monitored their houses and the movements of officials and their families. There can be no doubt that the absence of community gardaí on the ground is helping raiders who stalk their victims in this way. How many gardaí are assigned to the Ballycallan district of Kilkenny, for example? At 6% of the force, there are simply not enough community gardaí working and living in communities. The €30 million cut in Garda overtime, the cap on Garda recruitment, the downgrading of rural stations and the brain drain from the senior echelons of the Garda force caused by large-scale retirement of senior officers is all combining to make life somewhat easier for criminals.

I ask in this short debate what has the Minister specifically done to address the problem of tiger kidnappings, apart from having a couple of meetings with the Garda Commissioner and bank figures? It has recently been reported that gardaí in the crime and security section at Garda headquarters have been working on internal protocols to advise officers about dealing with tiger kidnappings for over a year, but I wonder have the guidelines yet been agreed, published and accepted. Have gardaí been given details of the agreed protocols between banks and Garda management on tiger raids? Some say they are investigating with one hand effectively tied behind their backs.

If an employee walks into the local branch where he or she works and withdraws money because his or her family has been taken hostage, the duty manager at the branch is expected to dial a set phone number. The number connects to the Garda sergeant on duty at Garda command and control, who then contacts crime and security section.

I ask the Minister to take this matter seriously. We cannot allow a situation where law and order in the State plummets to the depths we witnessed yesterday, last week and on a number of occasions this year. I ask the Minister to ensure that not only are there robust and proper protocols in place, but that these protocols are complied with and adhered to by the bank personnel. If not, then the heads of security at our banks must consider their positions. Co-operation between the Garda and the banks under the direction of the Minister must ensure that these appalling acts are not only not tolerated, but are no longer an occurrence in our State.

Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform (Deputy Dermot Ahern)

First, let me say that my sympathy goes out to Adrian Ronan, his wife, Mary, and to their children for the terrible ordeal they endured yesterday. As well as sympathising with them, I want to praise the courage they showed during the incident.

Tiger kidnappings are a despicable and vicious form of criminal activity which involve targeting working people and their families. Sadly, the Ronan family are just the latest people to have been caught up in them. While yesterday's incident was very traumatic, thankfully, no one was physically injured and no money was handed over to criminals. In other words, the tiger kidnap completely failed in its objective.

Deputies will appreciate that Garda inquiries are still ongoing so it would not be helpful for me to go into the details. However, a major Garda operation was launched to deal with the situation once it arose. An intensive investigation is continuing to bring the perpetrators to justice.

It is a demonstration of the ruthlessness and brutality of the criminals involved that they threaten the families or ordinary working people, even young children. I condemn them utterly and I know that the Members of this House are at one in agreeing with me in that regard.

There is an implicit assertion in the Deputy's contribution that simply pouring more resources into this area would be a panacea for all our problems. The fact is that, even in the current extremely difficult financial circumstances, the Government is devoting enormous resources to the fight against crime. I have made it clear that it is an absolute priority in the allocation of resources within my Department. The programme for Government commits us to continuing to maintain policing services at the highest level possible.

The issue here is not primarily one of resources and it is disingenuous for anyone to imply otherwise. The key to curbing this type of incident is to ensure to the greatest extent possible that attempts to extort money in these circumstances are unsuccessful. To do so requires everyone involved to adhere to the protocols which have been drawn up by the Garda and the financial institutions. Deputy Charles Flanagan said he wanted the protocols published. I am not sure that would be the wisest course.

Deputy Charles Flanagan

I do not want them published.

Deputy Dermot Ahern

I thought the Deputy said that.

I do not underestimate the pressure which people who are the victims of tiger kidnappings find themselves under. It is very easy for us to be critical of them in those circumstances and easy to demand that they adhere to the protocols. Obviously, in circumstances where they are under extreme duress, they have to think of themselves and their loved ones first. However, these protocols are there to protect them and where they have been implemented, they have worked in recent times. The greatest advantage the criminals have is fear. I want to assure the House and the employees of financial institutions that the Garda Síochána's absolute priority when faced with an incident of this kind is to ensure that no harm comes to the victims.

Let me be clear. It is in the interests of all, in particular the staff of the financial institutions, that they follow the protocols which have been agreed. When we have a situation where the protocols are operated and these kidnaps are thwarted, it should help bring an end to the gangs attempting them. When people in banks find that one of their colleagues is in this situation, of course, at a human level, they want to do everything to help. However, the fact is that by operating the protocols they will help prevent these incidents happening and their own families or those of their colleagues being put at risk.

The Deputy may be aware that I intend to meet the chief executives of the various financial institutions tomorrow, a meeting that was scheduled before Tuesday's incident. I have asked the Garda Commissioner to attend as well. I will also meet representatives of banking employees in the coming week.

I do not doubt the commitment of the banks to the well-being of their staff, nor their desire to help foil these crimes in question. However, I will be asking them what further measures are being put in place to ensure that only a limited amount of money is accessible to a single employee at any one time. I will once again be emphasising that the full implementation of the security arrangements for such incidents, on each and every occasion they arise, is vital to our efforts to make such raids a thing of the past.

In the face of such tactics, it is incumbent on the Government, the law enforcement agencies and the banking industry to work together to combat this threat. I have no interest in shirking my responsibility as Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform in facing up to these gangs. In addition to maintaining the high level of resources currently devoted to the fight against crime, I have enacted various Bills that will directly assist the Garda Síochána in its work in tackling such crimes. I cannot give details publicly of the activities being undertaken by the Garda in this regard, but I can assure the House that the force is sparing no effort in tackling gangs who carry out these deplorable acts.

The Garda Síochána is fully committed to combating this form of criminality as part of the concerted efforts being made to tackle organised criminal gangs. We are fortunate in having a highly professional police force with great experience of tackling organised criminal and subversive activity, and I am sure all Members will join with me in commending the efforts of the Garda Síochána in this respect.

Harbours and Piers.

Deputy Terence Flanagan

Howth sea scouts is a voluntary organisation which contributes greatly to the Howth area. The people of Howth built a den at the west pier and it should therefore be retained for public use. The den has been used by generations of scouts and needs to be retained for this purpose.

The sea scouts use the scout hall every day and also provide activities such as camps, competitions, first aid training, canoeing, hikes, treasure trails, boat maintenance days and training courses. At present 120 children ranging in ages from six to 20 years use these facilities. The sea scouts provide an outlet for these young people. It instills a maritime tradition in our youth and provides training in all aspects of seamanship.

Howth is a fishing village which has seen a loss of white fishing vessels in the last number of years. The maintenance of this tradition is imperative to the village. The recent decision taken by the Minister of State with responsibility for the marine not to renew the lease on the land currently used by Howth sea scouts is devastating. The sudden termination of the lease has come as a shock to all concerned and I call on the Minister of State to review his decision immediately and to grant an extension to the lease.

The original lease was for 20 years, so surely the sea scouts have some rights. The lease expired in 2007 and a two year lease was subsequently granted. The lease was due to be renewed on 1 November but instead the sea scouts were given notice to leave the building, leaving them homeless and with nowhere to store their equipment. The Minister of State made the decision to pass the land to the highest commercial bidder, subsequently disregarding the interests of the sea scouts and the people of Howth who helped build this community facility. Scouting groups are unable to compete with commercial organisations.

The Minister of State has suggested that the sea scouts co-use the premises occupied by Howth Sea Angling Club. This possibility has been examined and it has proved to be unsuitable. A purpose built ground floor is needed to store their rowing boats, dinghies, kayaks and canoes. As a youth organisation, the sea scouts have a policy of no alcohol and a venue containing a bar such as that occupied by Howth Sea Angling club is unsuitable.

The lease should be renewed as it is the right thing to do. This premises belongs to the community. The sea scouts have used this premises for the last 22 years. It is needed to preserve maritime traditions, promote water safety and to provide a safe environment for our youth. We also need to instill confidence in our young people, and the sea scouts achieves this. We need to help our young people to learn in a positive manner, and they learn skills at the sea scouts which they retain for life. Anti-social behaviour is a scourge of society, and while young people are using their time constructively with organisations such as the sea scouts, the last thing the Government needs to do is to put these people on the street.

I ask the Minister of State to look sympathetically on the request of the sea scouts in Howth, by renewing their lease at No. 20, West Pier for the foreseeable future. In his response, I ask him not to talk about public procurement processes, because it is a community we are talking about, not a commercial organisation.

Minister of State at the Department of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food (Deputy Tony Killeen)

The Fishery Harbour Centres Act 1968 made provision for the establishment, maintenance and management of the fishery harbour centres fund. Orders made under the Act have provided for the transfer to the fund of all property, rights and liabilities within the six fishery harbour centres. By way of statutory instrument, responsibility for Howth harbour was transferred from the Commissioners of Public Works in Ireland on 1 January 1990. The other five fishery harbour centres are located at Dunmore East, Castletownbere, An Daingean, Ros an Mhíl and Killybegs.

The Department of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food manages a large property portfolio in the six fishery harbour centres. All funds generated within the fishery harbour centres, including rental income from leased property, are appropriated directly to the fishery harbour centre fund. The fund is used for the operation and development of the harbours and there is an obligation on the Department to ensure that the property portfolio is used to its maximum potential.

The Scout Association of Ireland Trust Corporation Limited signed a 20 year lease in respect of site No. 20, West Pier, Howth fishery harbour centre with effect from 1 November 1987. At that time, the site and indeed all of Howth Harbour was owned and managed by the Commissioners of Public Works. The site was occupied by the Howth sea scouts for the full period of the lease. A nominal annual rent was agreed with the Scout Association of Ireland Trust Corporation Limited in 1987 and was not increased during the term of the lease. This low rent was set on the understanding that the premises would be used for scouting activities, for which there was significant demand, and on the basis that the site would be developed to the lessors' satisfaction and in accordance with the plans and specifications already approved by the lessors within a year of the lease being signed.

The lease agreement contained many other clauses, one of which was that at the end of the term the lessee will "quietly yield up the demised premises with all buildings erected thereon in a good and tenantable state of repair and condition". In 1986, the State Valuation Office advised that if the site were let on a commercial basis, the rental valuation would have been 325% more than the nominal rent agreed with the Scouting Association of Ireland Trust Corporation Limited. There was no provision in the lease signed in 1987 that allowed for the lease to be renewed by the Scout Association of Ireland Trust Corporation Limited.

The lease expired on 31 October 2007 and a two year licence to occupy the premises was issued to the Scout Association of Ireland Trust Corporation Limited on 1 November 2007, on the same basis as the original lease agreement. This licence expired on 31 October 2009.

Prior to the expiry of the licence, the Department was in contact with a representative of the sea scouts group in Howth to explore alternative accommodation within Howth fishery harbour centre. The Department arranged discussions between the scouting group and another club based in Howth fishery harbour centre with a view to exploring the possibility of sharing accommodation. The Department is required to secure the maximum return from its resources. The public procurement guidelines issued by the Department of Finance on the disposal or letting of Government property state:

The disposal or letting of property should be dealt with by competitive tendering or by auction. This approach provides a disposal mechanism which is both transparent and is likely to achieve a fair price.

Accordingly, and in line with existing fishery harbour centre property policy, it is a requirement that the site would be valued and a public tender process put in place to award a lease on the site to the most economically advantageous tender that meets the qualifying criteria set out in the request for tender documentation.

I realise the concerns of the sea scouts in this case and following the valuation of the site I intend to discuss the issues with my officials and the Department of Finance, with a view to exploring a solution that is agreeable to the sea scouts and consistent with the public procurement guidelines. I want to acknowledge the positive proposals put forward by my party colleagues in the area which I hope will lead to a resolution. On 22 October 2009, I had a meeting with the chief scout and the chief executive officer of Scouting Ireland. This meeting was very informative and clearly showed the valuable work being carried out by Scouting Ireland, and particularly the volunteers who work at a local level with the sea scouts in Howth. The Department has sought advice regarding a legal mechanism by which the sea scouts might be allowed to continue to use the premises in the short term while a request for tenders is being prepared or until a resolution is reached.

Schools Building Projects.

Deputy Michael McGrath

I thank the Ceann Comhairle for selecting this matter for inclusion in the Adjournment debate. Ballintemple national school, which has an enrolment of 214 pupils, is an old school with a rich history. It first opened its doors in 1904. It has an excellent staff under the leadership of its principal, Mr. Denis O'Sullivan. The school receives strong support from the local community and the active parents' association, which supports the school's activities in every way possible. Its catchment area is the parish of Ballintemple. The school operates from two sites. Since 2002, the junior and senior infant classes have been based in portakabins at a site on the Blackrock Road that was provided by the SMA Fathers. The remaining six classes are based in the old school building at Crab Lane, which is the base of the school. The school's lease of the site that is currently occupied by the junior and senior infant classes will expire in May 2010. The school faces a real risk that the lease will not be renewed. I would like to know whether progress can be made with the development of a new school building for the school. It is important to point out that approximately 700 residential units have been built in Ballintemple since 1995. The proposal before the Department of Education and Science involves the development of a new 12-teacher school building at a 1.5 acre site on the Blackrock Road in Cork. While the SMA Fathers have generously offered to provide the site free of charge, the Department would be unwise to assume that the offer will remain in place indefinitely. The Department has deemed that the site in question is appropriate for the construction of a new school building.

It is important to emphasise that there are serious capacity issues at Ballintemple national school at present. I understand that eight local children were turned away this year, unfortunately, because of the lack of capacity at the school. As a single stream school, it can accept just one class of junior infants each year. The demographics of the area, about which I have spoken, mean that this problem will get worse in the years to come. In advance of the 2010-11 school year, some 45 children have already sought a place in the school's single junior infants class of 28 or 30 pupils. That demonstrates the need for the Department to take action in this regard as quickly as possible. The proposed site, which is being made available free of charge, is in an excellent location. There should be no other impediment to the development of this project as quickly as possible. As I have said, the site has been deemed appropriate as the location of the new school building. In September 2007, the Department's school planning section confirmed in writing that the Department, having conducted a technical study of the site, recommended its acquisition for the purpose of developing a new school. It appears that no substantive progress has been made with the project since that time. I ask the Minister for Education and Science to seriously consider the inclusion of Ballintemple national school in the Department's 2010 school capital programme. I understand that an announcement in that regard will be made before Christmas or early in the new year. I appeal to the Minister, Deputy Batt O'Keeffe, to make the right decision so that the staff and pupils of the school can have an appropriate environment in which to teach and learn. The children should be allowed to continue their education in what is otherwise a fabulous school environment.

Deputy Tony Killeen

I am happy to reply on behalf of my colleague, the Minister for Education and Science, Deputy Batt O'Keeffe, who cannot be present, unfortunately. I thank Deputy McGrath for raising this matter and giving me an opportunity to outline to the Dáil the Government's strategy for capital investment in education projects, particularly the proposed project at Scoil lósaf Naofa, Ballintemple national school. In March 2002, the school submitted an application to the Department of Education and Science for capital funding towards the provision of a new school. The school has a current staffing level of a principal and eight mainstream teachers. It also has the services of two learning support or resource teachers. The school has advised the Department that a site has been offered by the SMA Fathers. It has been agreed that appropriate accommodation should be provided to cater for a long-term projected staffing of a principal and 12 mainstream assistants, along with appropriate ancillary accommodation. The school authorities were advised in September 2007 that the proposed site for the new school building was suitable for the construction of a 12-classroom school and that they should proceed with its acquisition from the SMA Fathers.

As the Deputy will be aware, all applications for capital funding are assessed in the planning and building unit of the Department. The assessment process determines the extent and type of need presenting, based on the demographics of an area, proposed housing developments, condition of buildings, site capacity, etc. The process ultimately leads to an appropriate accommodation solution. As part of this process, each project is assigned a band rating under the published prioritisation criteria for large scale building projects. The criteria were devised following consultation with the education partners. Projects are selected for inclusion in the school building and modernisation programme on the basis of priority of need. This is reflected in the band rating assigned to a project. In other words, a proposed building project moves through the system commensurate with the rating assigned to it. There are four ratings overall, of which band 1 is the highest and band 4 the lowest. Band 1 projects, for example, involve the provision of buildings where none exists, but where there is a high demand for pupil places. A band 4 project involves the provision of desirable but not necessarily urgent or essential facilities. Each band rating has a number of sub-categories which more specifically describe the type of works needed and the urgency attaching to them. The application from Scoil lósaf Naofa, Ballintemple national school, has been assigned a band 1.1 rating.

As the Deputy will appreciate, the modernisation of the facilities in our existing building stock, like the need to respond to emerging needs in areas of rapid population growth, is a significant challenge. The Government has shown a consistent determination to improve the condition of our school buildings and ensure the appropriate facilities are in place to enable the implementation of a broad and balanced curriculum. However, the level of demand on the school building programme means that all projects cannot be carried out together. They will have to be carried out over time in a structured and coherent manner. This is the reasoning behind the Department's published prioritisation criteria. The project at Scoil lósaf Naofa, Ballintemple national school, will be carried out in a manner that is consistent with this approach. I thank the Deputy again for raising the matter and, as I have already said, to assure him that the Minister is committed to advancing the project at Ballintemple national school.

School Transport.

Deputy Jack Wall

I would like to begin by thanking the Minister of State, Deputy Seán Haughey, for the replies he has previously given me in response to my ongoing queries about this matter. I accept that he has agreed to include it in the national review of school transport. However, it would be remiss and negligent of me to fail to attempt to bring it to a conclusion. The question of whether the children in the village of Narraghmore are outside the catchment area of the proposed bus route is a debatable one. Although it is worth mentioning that the village is 7.2 km from Kilcullen, 7 km from Athy and 6.1 km from Dunlavin, that is not the point I wish to make.

It cannot be denied that the pupils to whom I refer are entitled to travel on the school bus that leaves Narraghmore for Kilcullen each day. While they may be travelling outside their catchment area, that does not enter the equation because there is room on the bus for them. They are entitled to avail of the school bus service under the rule which states that children may be accommodated if there is room for them. In this instance, there is enough room for them. However, one aspect of this arrangement is worrying for me and the parents of these children. The parents of 12 families, rather than being allowed to use the well-designed bus stop in the village of Narraghmore, are required to bring their children a mile and a half outside the village to gain access to the school bus service. The children are forced to get on the bus at a crossroads that is an absolute death trap. If common sense were to prevail in his respect, safety would be the priority and the matter would be resolved straight away. In his previous replies to me, the Minister of State, Deputy Haughey, said that any change in this arrangement could have national repercussions.

I hope no child gets hurt as a result of the crazy ruling to the effect that the school bus should pass the bus stop in Narraghmore, which has been prepared by the local authority, and instead proceed to a crossroads outside the village. The children in question also have to be driven to the crossroads. As we enter the time of the year when the mornings and evenings are dark, it is worth pointing out as that the crossroads is unlit, the children are dropped off and collected in total darkness. There are at least 12 cars, not counting the general traffic in the area, including milk lorries. These are included in the photographs I have to hand.

The children are entitled to be on the bus and there is no problem with the school they are attending. The only problem is that the Department, through Bus Éireann, will not pick up and drop off the children every day at a safe, well-lit destination in the village in which they live. It beggars belief that they are being put in such circumstances. It affects the parents also because the crossroads are unlit and present a danger.

Although the Minister of State in attendance, Deputy Killeen, is not the Minister of State responsible, I ask him to present my photographs to the Department and ask it to see the logic in what I am saying. I ask the Department to prioritise the children's safety in making a decision.

I will continue to pursue this matter. It would be remiss and negligent of me if I did not put the children's safety first. If they were not entitled to be on the bus, it would be a different ball game. That is not in question here. There is nothing in question only the location of the bus stop where the children are collected. What is occurring is unfair and unjust. It is wrong to make the kids travel to the crossroads. They have to get up earlier in the morning than they should and their parents have to pool resources to transport them to the pick-up point, thereby incurring a cost.

The overall picture is such that the common good is being ignored. The Department will experience problems if a child is badly hurt as a result of what is occurring. I hope common sense will prevail and the Department will consider my case positively. I ask the Minister of State, Deputy Killeen, to pass on the photographs to the Minister of State, Deputy Haughey, who has helped me in every way regarding this matter, even to the point of saying it will be included in the national review. The children are in too much danger at present and I hope common sense will prevail even before the national review is completed.

Deputy Tony Killeen

I am taking this Adjournment matter on behalf of my colleague, the Minister of State responsible for lifelong learning, Deputy Haughey. I thank the Deputy for raising this matter as it provides me with an opportunity to clarify the general position regarding post-primary school transport for children residing in the area referred to by the Deputy.

The Deputy will be aware that the provision of school transport is a massive logistical operation involving the transportation by Bus Éireann of more than 125,000 children each day to primary and post-primary schools, including more than 8,000 children with special educational needs.

Under the terms of the Department's post-primary school transport scheme, a pupil is eligible for transport if he or she resides 4.8 km or more from his or her local post-primary education centre, that is, the centre serving the catchment area in which he or she lives.

The scheme is not designed to facilitate parents who choose to send their children to a post-primary centre outside of the catchment area in which they reside. However, children who are eligible for transport to the post-primary centre in the catchment area in which they reside may apply for transport on a concessionary basis to a post-primary centre outside of their own catchment area, otherwise known as catchment boundary transport. These children can be facilitated only if spare seats are available on the bus after all other eligible children travelling to the post-primary centre in which they live have been catered for.

In regard to the specific case raised by the Deputy, the Minister has outlined in previous replies to his parliamentary questions that children availing of concessionary transport must make their own way to the catchment boundary.

The safety of schoolchildren, irrespective of whether they are eligible for transport or availing of concessionary transport, is of paramount importance to the Department and to Bus Éireann. In recent years, a range of measures to enhance safety and to improve the quality of the school transport service has been put in place, both in the vicinity of and on board school buses. These measures include the phasing out of the three-for-two seating arrangement on both primary and post-primary services and providing all children with an individual seat equipped with a seat belt.

The Deputy will be aware that the planning of school bus routes, which includes the designation of pick-up and set-down points, is an operational matter for Bus Éireann. It is a feature of the school transport scheme that children availing of transport, other than those with special needs, have to make their own way to pick-up points.

The position in this case is that a child with special needs is picked up at home in accordance with the terms of the school transport scheme for children with special needs. The bus then proceeds to the next pick-up point which is close to the catchment boundary.

The children in question are not attending the post-primary centre in the catchment area in which they reside. Concessionary transport is not guaranteed and can be offered only from the nearest designated pick-up point under the terms of the scheme, which in this case is close to the catchment boundary. While individual cases regarding school transport are brought to the Department's attention from time to time, such cases are generally dealt with under the terms of the school transport scheme. Persons who are not satisfied with the Department's decision may appeal to the independent school transport appeals board.

The value for money review of the school transport scheme, including catchment boundaries, is due to be completed by the end of 2009. I thank the Deputy once again for raising this matter.

The Dáil adjourned at 11.10 p.m. until 10.30 a.m. on Thursday, 5 November 2009.