Dáil Éireann debate -
Thursday, 20 Sep 2012

Vol. 775 No. 2

Topical Issue Debate

Health Professions Admission Test Administration

Deputy Mary Mitchell O'Connor

The health professionals admissions test, HPAT, is not doing what it is supposed to do. It is designed to test the aptitude of potential medical students but it is not doing so in a fair and transparent manner. Some 85% of those who repeat the HPAT secure a higher score on their second attempt. I do not understand how this is possible. The HPAT system is supposed to test for personality traits. The core idea behind the test is to ensure that potential medical students have the aptitude and personality required to become top-notch doctors with suitably caring and empathetic personalities. However, students who repeat the test do significantly better after taking preparatory courses. These students do not magically receive personality transplants in the intervening; they learn how to beat the test and the system.

The test was also introduced to increase the number of boys who enter medical schools. It achieved its aim in its first year but girls are now outscoring boys again. In the second part of the test, which focuses specifically on empathy, girls are outscoring boys. It has also given an unfair advantage to those who can afford expensive preparatory and repeat courses. It has simply become a revenue generator for course providers. I concur with the Institute of Guidance Counsellors that the test is adding yet another financial barrier to students who hope to embark on a career in medicine. One institute offering a HPAT preparation course charges a standard rate of €625 for a platinum package which supposedly includes two full days of quality preparation from an expert educator.

The recent report by the review team of experts in medical education indicates those who can afford expensive preparatory and repeat courses do 10% better on the test. It is estimated that more than 50% of HPAT candidates take these expensive coaching courses. Instead of broadening the type of doctors Ireland produces we are in danger of restricting the profession to those who come from the higher echelons of society. It is wrong and unfair that a student who studies hard, makes sacrifices and gets 635 points in the leaving certificate examination cannot enroll in his or her course of choice, as happened this year. Students with six A1s in relevant subjects such as biology, chemistry and physics cannot get into medical school but a student who has a C1 in biology may do so if he or she paid for a cramming course.

Many students take up a college course in a related field while they are learning how to beat the test and leave the course after the first or second year once they successfully fool the HPAT. In 2010, 111 students vacated another third level course in Ireland to accept a place in medical school. This has financial repercussions for the State.

Minister of State at the Department of Education and Skills (Deputy Sean Sherlock)

I thank Deputy Mitchell O'Connor for raising this matter. The determination of selection criteria and processes for admission to medical schools is a matter for the universities and the medical schools in line with their statutory autonomy in academic affairs. A new entry process for admission to medical schools was introduced in 2009 on foot of a recommendation of the Fottrell working group on undergraduate medical education and training. The report of the Fottrell working group formed the basis for a programme of wide ranging reform and expansion of medical education and training in Ireland. These reforms also provided for an increase in the number of undergraduate places from 305 to 485 and the introduction of a new graduate entry medicine programme with 240 places annually.

The report recommended that leaving certificate results should no longer be the sole selection method for entry to medical education at undergraduate level and that a two stage mechanism should be applied consisting of the results obtained in leaving certificate and a standardised admissions test which would assess non-academic skills and attributes regarded as important for the practice of medicine. The new entry mechanism, which was introduced by the medical schools in 2009, is based on a combination of leaving certificate results and performance in an independent admissions test, HPAT, designed to measure students' problem solving, understanding and reasoning skills.

At the outset the medical schools committed to a review of the new entry mechanism within three years of its introduction. On foot of this commitment, a national research group evaluating revised entry and selection mechanisms to medicine was convened under the auspices of the council of deans of faculties of medical schools in Ireland in 2009. The research group comprised representatives from the academic medical education staff of each medical school, university admission officers and the Central Applications Office. Several international medical education experts have advised the group and continue to do so.

The research group has undertaken a comprehensive evaluation to determine the educational impact, reliability, validity and stakeholder acceptability of the new entry and selection approach. An interim report has recently been completed by the group and is due to be published on the websites of the medical schools in the next few days. I have been advised that the findings of the report of the research group will now be considered by the academic councils in the five institutions concerned. Approval of the academic councils would be required for any possible modifications to the operation of the admissions test.

Deputy Mary Mitchell O'Connor

I have listened to the Minister of State's contribution but I continue to question the validity of the HPAT. I understand it has been recommended that students will only be allowed to sit the test once. In the interest of students who are currently studying for the leaving certificate or are cramming to resit the test, I urge that a decision be made to allow them to resit the test.

The test needs to be phased out or at least amended so that it is fit for purpose.

I draw the attention of the Minister of State to the following actual example. Three leaving certificate students all have higher mathematics in their top six subjects. Not including extra mathematics points, student A achieves 525 points, student B achieves 550 points and student C achieves 600 points. Adding the extra mathematics points, student A will have 550 points, student B will have 575 and student C will have 625 points, a perfect leaving certificate. With the introduction of HPAT, every five points over 550 is worth one point. Thus, student A achieves 550 points, student B has 555 and student C is reduced to 565 points. The system reduces the gap between 525 and 625 points to 15 points. This dismisses the months of work to achieve the difference between these two scores.

I urge greater transparency in our education system. Project Maths skewed the leaving certificate results this year. Some will say more students did honours and that 97% of them passed the paper. If students attempted all sections of the honours paper this year they achieved 49% of the total mark. In 2010, students who attempted all sections of the paper scored 38% of the overall mark. In Scotland, for example, the pass rate for students aged 18 on the advanced level mathematics paper was 66%. Ours was 97%. There is something glaringly wrong with our HPAT tests and with the correction of the Project Maths papers of June 2012.

Deputy Sean Sherlock

This began as a conversation about HPAT and has turned into a conversation about Project Maths.

Deputy Mary Mitchell O'Connor

It skewed the results for everyone.

Deputy Sean Sherlock

With all due respect to her, I ask Deputy Mitchell O'Connor for the courtesy of allowing me respectfully to respond to her query. I would be happy to engage with her on the issue of Project Maths, knowing that she has made some quite vociferous statements in the last month or so regarding Project Maths. The offer is there for her to engage further on the issue of Project Maths. Is that fair enough?

Deputy Mary Mitchell O'Connor

I have written to the Minister on the matter.

Deputy Sean Sherlock

As Minister of State with special responsibility for STEM and Project Maths, I am happy to sit down with her myself in that regard.

I have not seen the findings of the report of the research group. As I have indicated, the report is expected to be published within the next few days. I have not seen the report but Deputy Mitchell O'Connor suggests she has already seen some of its recommendations.

Deputy Mary Mitchell O'Connor

No, I have read newspaper reports of it.

Deputy Sean Sherlock

The report will be submitted to the academic councils of the institutions concerned for consideration. It is understood that the report will be considered by the academic councils before the end of the year, most likely in November or December. The implementation of any changes will be a matter for the institutions and their medical schools.

More generally with regard to third level entry mechanisms, the Minister for Education and Skills has also received an interim report from the Irish Universities Association of their consideration of recommendations in the NCCA-HEA transitions report which was published last September. The universities have also established a task force to develop more specific proposals regarding changes to the entry criteria for third level programmes, which is also expected to consider issues relating to high points courses such as medicine. The task force is expected to complete this work by the end of the year.

I respect the fact that the Deputy has raised these issues. Concerns are being brought to her attention and she has articulated them in the House. I am sure the Minister and I would be delighted to engage with her further on the question of Project Maths, or at least have officials engage with her. I am sure the Minister would be happy to sit down with her to discuss this area.

Unemployment Data

Deputy Dara Calleary

I thank you, a Cheann Comhairle, for giving me the opportunity to raise this issue and I thank the Minister of State, Deputy Sherlock, for taking the debate.

Figures released by the Central Statistics Office, CSO, yesterday may have got lost among everything else that was happening in the House. They are incredibly stark. The total number of people unemployed, according to CSO measurements, is 308,500. The long-term unemployment rate has increased from 7.7% to 8.8% over the year to the second quarter of 2012. Long-term unemployment accounts for 59.9% of total unemployment in the second quarter. That figure, in itself, is incredibly stark and it has been rising consistently for the last number of years.

I know the Minister of State will outline a list of initiatives that people think are working and that we want to work. I have been that soldier. However, they are not working, as is illustrated by the CSO figures. The long-term unemployment figures are particularly worrying. These people are moving into a situation where they may become unemployable and suffer all the consequences of long-term unemployment.

Despite this, we have a skills shortage. We have companies that cannot fill vacancies. I pay tribute to the IDA and to the work it is doing and acknowledge the announcements made this week, but some IDA client companies are unable to fill vacancies. We have a skills challenge as well as an unemployment challenge. Surely, somewhere in the Government system - I am not speaking about the political parties - someone needs to knock heads together and match up the skills shortage with the 308,500 people who are unemployed, 60% of whom are long-term unemployed.

We are putting so much effort into getting a deal on bank debt and fiscal debt. When the Government came to office the Tánaiste moved the trade function to the Department of Foreign Affairs to beef up that Department and make it more commercial. However, in Ireland and across Europe, governments are not putting a similar level of effort, fire power and imagination into resolving the unemployment problem. We see the measures Ben Bernanke has announced in the United States, where the unemployment rate is 8%. That is the kind of fire power we need on an EU-wide basis.

Many of those who are unemployed come from a construction background, and the country still needs major capital investment. Many of them could do with the old style conversion courses that were run back in the mid and late 1990s, although the course content may need to change. That would allow people to move their skills over the course of a year or 18 months into technology or to where there are labour market vacancies. We need a huge investment in that kind of course.

If the message goes out to the multinational community that Ireland is a great place to invest but the jobs, when they are announced, cannot be filled, we will lose further jobs to places such as Singapore, to the BRIC countries and elsewhere. Meanwhile, 308,500 people are looking for work.

The Minister of State will read the list of jobs initiatives and funding for businesses. I know the loan guarantee scheme is on the way and I congratulate the Minister of State and the Minister for Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation on that measure. The opposition to it in the Department of Finance was intense but it was eventually brought over the line. It is incredibly important. Businesses and employers are crying out for capital investment from banks and they are not getting it. The banks, the Government and various Departments come up with figures but all of us in the Chamber know it is not happening on the ground. Very little new investment is happening. Without new investment we will not create jobs. I do not speak in any party political sense. As an Oireachtas, we have a duty to the country to put this issue front and centre.

Deputy Sean Sherlock

I thank the Deputy for the tenor in which he made his contribution. I acknowledge that the latest quarterly national household survey, QNHS, figures show an increase in unemployment, but we never said recovery would be fast or easy.

The Government inherited a jobs market in free fall with more than 250,000 private sector jobs lost in the three years before we took office. That is not a political charge; it is a fact.

At the peak of the boom, almost 24% of GNP was attributable to construction, 12% of total employment. The economy is in transition and since assuming office, we have delivered on the plan to build a new economy. Part of this is supporting a transition from the old failed economy based on property, banking and debt to a new sustainable economy based on enterprise, exports and innovation. The Cabinet sub-committee on economic recovery and jobs, through the action plan for jobs, has direct identifiable targets that are addressed directly with the Taoiseach on a regular basis using that reporting mechanism. Part of that process involves the small business advisory group, which includes all of stakeholders, such as ISME and IBEC. They are part of the process of getting the recovery we so badly need.

Deputy Calleary mentioned the skills shortage. There is a constant engagement with industry. I met with Google the day before yesterday to see how we could get a further engagement with such companies on the STEM area and that will directly feed into how we address the skills shortage. There are already programmes in play in terms of bridging courses but we must ensure there is a longer term policy goal that ensures we have a throughput of students from secondary into tertiary who are actively engaged in the STEM agenda, through courses such as Project Maths, so the right sort of software engineers and ICT graduates exist for the skills pool needed to sustain the economy in the longer term.

Unfortunately, as part of the necessary transition, jobs continue to be lost in construction, banking and the public sector as these sectors return to more realistic levels. While the headline numbers out of work have risen in the latest returns, the CSO data show that, on a seasonally adjusted basis, there was a quarterly decrease of 3,700 in the number of persons unemployed in quarter two compared to quarter one, from 312,000 to 309,000.

We are in a period of transformation of the public sector as a necessary step to managing our public finances in a better way. The number of employees in the public sector has declined by 25,800 or 6.3% in the year to June 2012 while the number of employees in the private sector decreased by 0.3% over the same period. This is an improvement on the decrease of 2.2% in those employed in the private sector in the previous year.

Deputy Dara Calleary

The Minister of State mentioned the small business advisory group. Small business will be the engine of recovery. Yesterday, Senators Feargal Quinn and Mary Anne O'Brien hosted a briefing by those who make up the small business advisory group in their independent capacity on the proposals - or kite flying - by the Minister for Social Protection on employee sick pay. Her suggestion has been floating around for a while now that she will completely change that regime. Small businesses are incredibly nervous about the potential impact of that proposal on existing business and their ability to create employment, even if we enter a phase of growth. What is the Minister of State's view on this issue? Has the Department of Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation taken a view on those proposals?

What are we doing at EU level? As a small country with one of the most open economies in the world, are we brave enough to bring proposals to the EU to challenge it to act on unemployment as a bloc in the way we saw the US Federal Reserve acting this week? As well as getting the deals we need on banking and fiscal debt, we must get a programme to deal with unemployment.

I am not in the business of creating expectation but last December the Taoiseach, referring to the end of year figures, said that he hoped by the end of this Government that anyone currently long-term unemployed will have re-entered the world of work or become involved in upskilling or a change in direction. Of the 308,500 people unemployed, 60% are now long-term unemployed. How many of those will have a job by the end of 2015?

Deputy Sean Sherlock

The Deputy has stood where I am standing today and knows I will not be drawn on the budgetary process. Let me talk, however, about the EU Presidency. One of the central themes of the Irish EU Presidency will be job creation. There will be statements on Ireland's position on getting Europe to engage on this agenda in due course. The planning is ongoing and this week there was a Cabinet sub-committee on European Affairs where each of the Ministers and Ministers of State involved had an opportunity to discuss the EU Presidency and the core themes we want to ensure are at the forefront. Job creation and growth with the European economy will form part of that.

I take the Deputy's point on the public utterances of Ben Bernanke on the US Federal Reserve. There is a different dynamic in the US because it operates on a federal basis. There is a challenge for a member state like Ireland to ensure greater EU co-ordination but it is the Government's view that the role of job creation must be to the forefront of the Irish Presidency.

Horizon 2020 is a major pot of money, around €80 billion, that must be negotiated, along with the multiannual financial framework. There are many Irish companies that will ultimately benefit from that once it is negotiated. It will do more to inject further capital into the research and development arms of Irish companies and SMEs in particular to create those jobs that we want in the economy. There is much to be done on the macroeconomic side. I reiterate, however, that the action plan for jobs is a clear policy statement by the Government that involves all of the stakeholders, including small business, IBEC and so on. That will be a key driver for job creation in the future.