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Dáil Éireann debate -
Thursday, 15 Dec 2022

Vol. 1031 No. 3

Ceisteanna Eile - Other Questions

Climate Action Plan

James O'Connor

Question:

74. Deputy James O'Connor asked the Minister for the Environment, Climate and Communications if his Department intends to carry out an audit on the capital infrastructure projects contained within the national development plan, in relation to the Climate Action Plan 2021. [62459/22]

At the outset, I will very quickly refer to the situation this morning. Many of us awoke with horror at the news that has come from Lebanon. I express my sincere condolences and sympathies to the bereaved family of the soldier who died and to those who were injured this morning. Unfortunately, there is a connection to our local area. I wish the individual well and hope for his speedy recovery, which we are praying for.

My question is on the national development plan, our carbon targets and capital projects contained within the plan. With the Galway ring road, we all saw what can happen with new road projects when these things are not brought into consideration. Will the Department of Transport carry out an audit to see whether all projects can be completed while complying with the targets set by this Government in the Climate Action Plan 2021? Will the Minister indicate what the ramifications and impact of those targets will be?

The Climate Action Plan 2021 set out policies, measures and actions to support the achievement of Ireland's legally-binding emissions reduction targets for 2030 and 2050. The 2021 plan was a cross-departmental effort with inputs and commitments from a range of Departments and State agencies. It provided indicative ranges of emissions reductions required for each sector of the economy to reach our 2030 target while also setting out the actions needed to deliver these targets.

A review of the national development plan, NDP, was undertaken by the Department of Public Expenditure and Reform in October 2021 and an assessment was provided on the contribution that Exchequer-funded capital spending in the NDP will make to seven climate and environmental outcomes, namely, climate mitigation, climate adaptation, water quality, air quality, waste and circular economy, nature and biodiversity and the just transition. Priority investment programmes included in the NDP were assessed on the above environmental outcomes and given a score of +3 to +1 if the estimated impact was positive, 0 if it was neutral and -1 to -3 if negative. Departments were initially asked to self-assess their programmes based on the criteria above and those scores were reviewed by a panel of experts across the public sector.

It was not the role of the NDP review to set out a specific blueprint for the achievement of the climate action plan actions nor is it the role of my Department to undertake an audit on the capital infrastructure projects contained within the NDP. Rather, Departments in receipt of the capital investment allocations are directly responsible for developing a detailed suite of policies and measures to maximise the impact of this planned investment in delivering actions and achieving targets detailed in the climate action plan, including staying within the sectoral emissions ceilings agreed by the Government last July. Furthermore, in bringing forward proposals for consideration, Departments must set out for the Government the climate impact of those proposals.

I thank the Minister for the information. I am not necessarily coming here with a wrecking ball, but the State has put everything into the national development plan that we intend to build in all facets of infrastructure. It must, though, consider other plans put forward by the Government. My great concern is that, if we look at the calculations for the capital development of new projects around the emissions of those projects, I understand the Department of Transport and the agencies within it would be tasked to the 2018 emissions levels. If we look at those levels, they will show us very quickly that not much was going on in major capital development projects in infrastructure in 2018. I refer to projects at an advanced stage and where a great deal of heavy activity was under way. Building public transport and roads involves the use of a significant amount of machinery and manpower, from a mechanical and emissions perspective. It would be worthy to look at this aspect, because we need to know if these targets are realistic.

The targets are based on science, in respect of what was agreed in Paris in 2015, as well on what has been further agreed on by science since. If we do not, as an example of a developed country, halve our emissions this decade and get to net zero by 2050, then we risk going over certain tipping points where climate change will become a runaway phenomenon. It is impossible to know exactly where these tipping points are and the choice made in the context of the Paris agreement of the 1.5°C target, to not allow the global average temperature increase to go above that level, gives us not the certainty but the probability that we may avoid this runaway scenario. This is, though, based on the targets set.

Even with all the challenges that come with this, especially in a country with a growing population, a rapidly growing economy and the emissions that come from some of the solutions, as the Deputy said, in the context of building a railway system, which involves emissions in its own right, we must still make this change. We have committed to it in our national law but we have also seen this being committed to in European law. We are not going to go to the EU and ask it to count Ireland out of this green transition. Equally, if the Deputy were to look at many of the large industrial players in his own constituency, the big foreign direct investment, FDI, companies in east Cork, these are also committing to this climate target. They will want to work with countries and governments similarly committed. We do not, therefore, have an option. We must go for this. It is hugely challenging but it is the right thing to do.

Without the lecture, I came here this morning with a valid point about the projects contained in the national development plan. It is a bit ironic that the national development plan has projects in it that are being brought to court and then subsequently being blocked because of our climate action targets. What has happened in Galway has created a precedent that will impact other areas of the country if the planning process is not done right. I know there is an error within the documentation from a planning perspective, but I have come here with a valid point. All I am asking is that some degree of an audit is carried out in this regard.

I say this because, effectively, if we want to build new public transport infrastructure, as well as roads, we must also acknowledge the fact that the 2018 targets in respect of capital development of new infrastructure are so low that it is very difficult to give the State agencies that must carry out this work the space they need to do it. I know exactly how important it is that we tackle our climate emissions target. I am just making the point to the Minister, however, that the new limits in place now are prohibitive when it comes to putting in new public transport infrastructure and roads. I ask the Minister to please take this point on board.

Whatever one's position on the Galway ring road is, this development has highlighted, as Deputy James O'Connor has pointed out, a disconnect between the planning system and the appraisal frameworks we have to ensure that project proposals are climate-aligned, climate-proofed or carbon emissions-assessed. We also have read newspaper reports in recent weeks that a similar appraisal tool is to be used now for the IDA and Enterprise Ireland. Is a body of work under way at Government level to develop appraisal tools to ensure decision-making in that context is climate-proofed, emissions-proofed and climate-aligned?

A major transport capital project in my constituency, the Ardee bypass, has been held up for more than a year now because of a High Court action. The case does relate to environmental issues. It is important, though, that projects in the plan should be pushed forward. If there needs to be special sittings of courts or special courts to deal with issues concerning environmental and other climate change issues, then these should be set up urgently. The people of Ardee are faced every day with very large heavy goods vehicles, HGVs, polluting the atmosphere around people as they are walking up and down the town, going about their business, to and from schools, doing their shopping, etc. This is not good enough. I am not blaming the Minister personally, but we must have significant action from the Government to ensure there is a finite time for all these legal actions by having quick and due process in the courts.

I accept Deputy O'Connor is making his arguments. I hope I was not lecturing the Deputy but when he asked whether the targets were feasible, from my perspective it is important for us all to understand that while these targets are extremely challenging, the question is whether it is feasible for us to let this go and to take this risk. I do not think it is. This, then, forces us to be challenged and to reach these targets. In doing so, we must constantly review what we are doing in the context of the climate action plan. To answer the question from Deputy O'Rourke, as well, this will include a rethink of how we appraise projects. We must do this, and we are already doing it. The national investment framework for transport in Ireland, NIFTI, is a new way of looking at investment policy that knits in with our climate targets. We do need new appraisal structures, as the IDA has, in transport and every other sector to ensure we meet these targets.

Turning to the query from Deputy O'Dowd, the planning legislation the Government considered this week includes measures, such as new environmental courts, which will help to improve our planning system and consideration of environmental issues. We cannot, however, ignore this aspect. This is why An Bord Pleanála, correctly and independently, to my mind, made its decision that it could not ignore, or that it had ignored, this aspect. I must be careful here because it is a legal context and I do not wish to say much more. The board recognised, though, that the climate must be considered. Much of this will happen at local authority level, such as in Galway. A new metropolitan transport strategy must be developed there next year and it must have climate as its core, or else it will fall at the first hurdle. Every local authority must develop climate plans next year to ensure it is in tune with what we are doing. As I keep saying regarding the scale of this undertaking, no one yet understands the impact it is going to have, but ignoring it or not doing it is not an option.

Questions Nos. 75 and 76 taken with Written Answers.

Climate Action Plan

Éamon Ó Cuív

Question:

77. Deputy Éamon Ó Cuív asked the Minister for the Environment, Climate and Communications the progress that has been made to date since the approval of the national climate action plan to achieve the targets in the plan; if he is satisfied that the full objectives of the plan will be achieved by 2030; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [62724/22]

What progress has been made to date since the approval of the national climate action plan to achieve the targets in it and is the Minister satisfied the targets laid out to be reached by 2030 will now be achieved?

I believe they can be but it is not certain. Earlier, I read out some of the analysis of what has happened in recent years. The increase last year in our transport, agriculture and power generation emissions makes it harder. Every year we see emissions continuing to increase makes the scale of the change required on the other side of the equation all the greater. I believe, however, that we can do this for a variety of reasons. First, this is going to be good for our country. Let us take agriculture as one example. To meet the reductions necessary in this area, which are much lower than in other sectors, the action to be taken will largely be about providing new income streams to farmers in agroforestry. I do not know what the Deputy's expectation is, but I think the Government's new programme for forestry will take off. I think there will be very significant demand for something new and innovative in the areas of riparian and other agroforestry schemes, because they pay and are achievable and deliverable. This is an example where this approach is better. I am just taking agriculture as one sector now, and the switch to anaerobic digestion gives us energy security, provides a new income stream for farmers and it is a known technology. It is not impossible. This is being done all over Europe.

Why can we not do it here? I am absolutely convinced we can. Our diversification into the likes of tillage or other markets would give us a more stable and secure agricultural system, particularly for the north and west of the country. The country is divided agriculturally very much into the north west and the south east with different characteristics, different climates and different soils, with one dairying and more intensive and one less so. For the north and west, there is significant potential here to turn it into an income stream by going genuinely orange and green and marketing ourselves. However, to be able to market it, one must do it. The worst crime here would be to greenwash - to say we are green but not in practice.

It is deliverable. My sense is - I do not know what Deputy Ó Cuív's is - that most of the people who I meet around the country buy into it, want to play their part and do not want to leave their children with the planet destroyed. If we can show them the way, which is not a punitive or a shaming way but a better way, we can make the leap, but it is a leap.

My sense of it is that we are not achieving the targets so far and, as the Minister said, that we are going backwards. On the real big wins, of the ones that have the real opportunity to change everything, the one outstanding one, of course, is renewable energy from the ocean, whether it is wind, wave or tidal. I wonder how quick are we progressing towards harnessing that enormous resource of energy which could not only energise this country but could provide Europe with a great deal of energy. Could the Minister tell me, with forced policy on planning and on the environment, how quickly we are progressing and what is his expectation for wind energy? Will we achieve what we set out to achieve by 2030 in renewable generation of major sources of power?

Before the Minister responds, I call Deputy Durkan on the same issue.

I agree with the Minister on the need to meet targets and to ensure that the targets are met insofar as is possible. However, this is not simply about replacement of income for landowners and farmers, etc. It is also about food production. In a world where there is a scarcity of food where millions of people are dying of starvation, we may well find ourselves in the not-too-distant future facing a serious food shortage. It is not only about one issue of replacement of income. It is about a number of issues. We need to take as much action as can be taken on the alternatives, maximise them, and try to keep our food production and keep our independence. There are those who say that it cannot be done. It can be done with the help of science.

In deference to Deputy Durkan, I might focus on Deputy Ó Cuív in the short few minutes I have because I spoke about agriculture in the first response.

It is not only offshore wind. We also have to develop further onshore wind. Many State companies, such as Coillte and Bord na Móna, have considerable potential to do that if our planning system can free up and deliver some of the projects that are stuck in planning. Solar and offshore wind will be a significant part.

The offshore wind is in three phases. We are now starting the first phase. As we speak, consents are starting to be issued, the auction process is starting and it is going to planning next year. We have to develop ports for the deployment of that. We have been appraised of that, in connecting it together. There are about five megawatts of projects to go to their first auction. They will not all get through for a variety of different reasons but we expect a significant element to do so.

The second phase will probably be broken into two or three phases, with further development in the Irish Sea in the south east. This will be very much connecting into the grid, because that is the biggest constraint. The power grid is a real challenge. That is next year. We will start to set out, map and develop those and start the consenting. Quickly afterwards, in the lifetime of this Government, we will start in looking south and west and going towards both floating and conversion to hydrogen.

As we are doing that, in the lifetime of this Government, we will set out the so-called "enduring regime", which is the really big project. In truth, the big power is to the west and north west, if one looks at where the resource is - where the really strong winds are - and where our largest sea area is. Critical to that is getting the environmental conditions right and, therefore, one designates marine area protections and special protection areas, SPAs. Bird life is the critical constraint. We have done a great deal of work. Deputy Ó Cuív will be familiar with High Island in Connemara. Over the years, we have done an assessment of how the Manx shearwaters and other birds go out into the Atlantic, what their feeding patterns are, etc. We can use some of that historical data to ensure we match the areas where we put the turbines with good ecological restoration. That is one of the key things we need to do.

We will do all that in the remaining lifetime of this Government, so that we will begin to see the turbines coming and set in train a process that will not stop where that power powers our country and powers part of Europe too because we have a surplus. That is why this is an economic opportunity.

The Minister will have another minute to respond.

That is exactly my point. When the Minister goes for the big winds, he will wind up with an energy surplus.

The Minister has a target in the climate action plan of 1 million electric vehicles, EVs, by the end of the decade. At the rate of progress to date, is that likely to be achieved?

The second part of the question relates to hydrogen. The Minister, quite rightly, mentioned hydrogen because that could be a transportable type of energy and used for energising heavy goods vehicles, railway vehicles, etc. Will we achieve the 1 million EVs by the end of the decade? When will we start producing hydrogen at scale on this island?

The EV target is on track. On the sale of EVs, although I cannot remember the exact percentage, roughly one in five new cars is plug-in electric or plug-in hybrid. Everything I see with the car companies shows that they are all switching because of better cars, maintenance is lower, and running costs are lower. That target is the one that is most achievable. I cannot remember the exact figure. It is less than 1 million. That is not the key target. The emissions issue is key. If we only replaced all the cars we have currently with electric cars, we would also have a remaining problem, which is the congestion problem that comes with that.

Not where I live.

We need to look at how we can improve the transport system so that it works, not only on a climate basis but also that we are not all stuck in traffic. It is not only about switching one car for the other. It is about reducing the demand for travel by the likes of remote working and other mechanisms, and not everyone having to drive to Dublin or to move to the big city. For example, our towns being revived would be a way that we could reduce the emissions and reduce the demand for travel.

In regard to hydrogen, there is already hydrogen being used in many industries, but at a small scale. The deployment of it for new and additional sources is starting across Europe. It is at early stages. It is usually on industrial sites, such as refineries and heavy industrial use where they have hydrogen in their fuel mix. That will be in the next two to three years.

The large-scale deployment of hydrogen, and our use of it as a way of storing some of the wind power we have, is towards the end of this decade and, more significantly, into the next decade. This Government has decided to set aside 2 GW of the new power offshore we have for such so-called "power-to-X" solutions as a way of saying we want to be in this new industrial revolution, we want to be good at it and we will do it as we are developing the offshore industry.

Energy Conservation

Darren O'Rourke

Question:

78. Deputy Darren O'Rourke asked the Minister for the Environment, Climate and Communications if he will increase the grant support for lower income households to aid the installation of solar PV; the target number of homes for solar PV installation in the years 2023 to 2025, inclusive, to help meet the recently announced increased target of 5 GW of installed solar power capacity by 2025; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [62754/22]

I ask the Minister if he will increase the grant support for lower income households to aid the installation of solar photovoltaic, PV, and the target number of homes for solar PV installation in the years 2023 to 2025, inclusive, to help meet the recently announced increased target of 5 GW of installed solar power capacity by 2025.

Solar PV panels are installed under a number of circumstances. For domestic installations, solar PV is installed on new homes, as one of the measures to achieve compliance with Part L of the building regulations. They are also installed on existing buildings through grant supports offered by Government, through the Sustainable Energy Authority of Ireland, SEAI.

The microgeneration support scheme approved by the Government last December set a target of supporting more than 380 MW of new microgeneration capacity. This amounts to more than 60,000 homes and 9,000 non-domestic installations, including small businesses, schools and community groups. With the success of the scheme to date these targets are expected to be increased under the forthcoming climate action plan in 2023.

Since the introduction of the microgeneration support scheme domestic solar PV grant earlier this year, the SEAI has seen application levels increase significantly month on month. It is expected that applications will exceed 15,000 by year end, with more than 8,500 supported. To put this in context, the SEAI supported 4,000 applications for solar PV last year under the previous iteration of the scheme. It has more than doubled in one year.

For 2023, the SEAI is expecting to support more than 12,500 homes and more than 1,000 small businesses and community organisations. While the overall level of interest in the grant schemes indicates that the microgeneration support scheme is working well, its operation and effectiveness will be kept under review and adjustments made where necessary.

A new solar PV scheme for vulnerable customers registered as being dependent on electrically powered assistive devices is also being finalised with stakeholders by the SEAI which will operate the scheme. This €20 million scheme is targeted to provide direct support to more than 3,000 vulnerable customers who may have limited opportunity to reduce their demand. The scheme will provide customers with a 2 KW solar PV system with a hot water diverter in order to meet some of their electricity and hot water requirements.

The increased target of 5 GW of installed solar power capacity will be addressed through a combination of increased microgeneration, small scale generation and renewable electricity support scheme connections in the coming years.

I thank the Minister. We can all agree there is great potential and appetite for solar power, particularly for residences, businesses and farm buildings. There is a barrier at residential level and we can see it in the design of the scheme. From the large number of applications we can see there is demand. I believe the demand goes beyond the scheme, and it needs to do so to reach 5 GW. Cost is a significant barrier for people. Sinn Féin has proposed tiered support. At present the upper level of support is €2,400. A decent system could cost in the region of €8,000. Is the Minister looking at increasing financial supports, tailored financial supports or tiered financial support to expand the audience for residential solar power?

From speaking to solar PV installers there are two real obstacles to the further massive expansion we need to see. The first is the workforce. The people installing it say there is not a shortage of demand but a shortage of skilled workers. These workers will come. I mentioned the apprenticeships the Minister, Deputy Harris, is delivering at scale. These will start to address this. This is the first big constraint. Installing solar PV is difficult to do as every house is slightly different and we need to see whether it has the right system, whether it is working and whether the right equipment is in the house. The second obstacle is that for scaling up we need aggregation, whereby 50 or 100 houses would be done at a time. There are people doing this. Recently I was in Lahinch in County Clare where voluntary local community groups are aggregating the delivery. This is the best way to reduce the cost. It needs further work from the SEAI and others so it becomes a community issue and an entire road is done at the same time. This, more than increasing the grant, would be the way to reduce the price and get as many houses as possible done. Aggregation and the workforce are the two issues we need to develop.

I ask the Minister to have a clear line of sight on who applies for the grants and who is getting the work done. We have seen in other schemes where many of the 500,000 B2-rated premises are the relatively warm homes of relatively wealthy people who can afford solar. They get solar PV installed, it takes the building up to a B2 rating and one of the 500,000 target premises is met. We need to look at those who are living in energy poverty or at risk of energy poverty and ask how many of them are getting solar PV. If aggregation is the solution well and good. Will the Minister keep a clear eye on where the works are being done?

The Minister mentioned private wires as a key enabler. This is something on which there is agreement across the political spectrum. Like a number of things, it seems to be taking far longer than it should. When will legislation or regulation be introduced to address this?

I want to raise a similar issue regarding energy security in homes. It is reported the Minister recently said he would seek to ban oil burners in 2025. I am not aware of this being in the programme for Government but I am aware of a concerted effort by that industry to encourage the conversion of oil burners to accommodate hydrotreated vegetable oil, HVO. This is a transition fuel that has the impact of reducing emissions by 85% over a ten-year period. It would be advisable and I encourage the Government to look favourably on this commitment as a means by which homes can transition and retrofit at a scale that is not akin to the €40,000, €50,000 or €60,000 that many cannot afford. These are certain stages of improvement that need to be considered, allowed and catered for. I encourage the Government not to put any barrier in front of such a proposal.

Deputy O'Rourke has mentioned families living in energy poverty. I have tabled another question, Question No. 96, on this issue. Families are living in caravans as permanent residents. On the coldest nights of the year, they cannot benefit from the €200 electricity payment. I have asked the Minister to look at this. Perhaps he can answer the question now. It is unacceptable that the poorest people in the coldest dwellings or in caravans cannot benefit from the payment. It is unacceptable on these appallingly cold nights. I dread what might happen to some of the older vulnerable people among them.

The Department is working on the matter Deputy O'Dowd has raised but I do not have the details with me. I will come back to him.

To respond to Deputy Cowen, it was interesting to meet some solid fuel supply companies yesterday and hear them state they are interested in developing low carbon alternatives for use in solid fuel heating systems. They see this as a big opportunity to develop a new market. There is an issue with regard to HVO because it will be in much demand. It is a waste product that has real value. I am sure the Deputy Cowen would be the first to agree the aviation sector, which is of critical economic importance to the State, has its eye on it as a sustainable aviation fuel, as does the land transport industry in which it is used to increase the blend of low carbon fuels. Transport is probably the most difficult sector. There is no alternative for truckers in haulage vehicles. There are no easy alternatives. We need some of the material for this sector rather than for domestic heating for which we can turn to other alternatives.

To respond to Deputy O'Rourke, we will have to do a variety of things differently. For years we have not allowed people to sell back power to the grid and now we are. For years we had planning restrictions for solar power. This has also changed. For 20 years I have heard arguments here and in meetings as to why we could not have private wires. We need to start to do this now because this is the scale of the change we need to make. It is not only private wires for industry. It is also looking at hybrid interconnections where there might be a wind farm with a good grid connection. Could we use solar power in the surrounding area or nearby area to make best use of it? Wind and solar power often complement each other. On a cold day, such as today, when there is no wind, we would get quite good solar output even at a dark time of the year.

We are going to have to do so much. It might just be a line in the climate plan that people think does not say much, but there are several key lines in the plan that have real legal strength behind them now. We are changing direction in a variety of ways in this regard and the solar revolution will be central to this.

Question No. 79 taken with Written Answers.

National Broadband Plan

Colm Burke

Question:

80. Deputy Colm Burke asked the Minister for the Environment, Climate and Communications if he will provide a progress report on the roll-out of the national broadband plan in County Cork from 1 January 2022 to 30 November 2022; the number of premises connected during this timeframe, including schools and broadband connection points in the county; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [62537/22]

Will the Minister provide a progress report on the roll-out of the national broadband plan in County Cork from 1 January 2022 to 30 November 2022, the number of premises connected during this timeframe, including schools and broadband connection points in the county and will he make a statement on the matter?

There are 81,507 premises located in County Cork that will be passed by National Broadband Ireland, NBI, with high-speed gigabit fibre broadband as part of the State intervention under the national broadband plan, NBP. NBI has advised that 15,711 premises in Cork are passed by the NBP high-speed fibre broadband network and are available for immediate connection. Some 11,196 premises were passed in Cork in 2022 to date and 4,091 premises in Cork have been connected to date with 2,989 of those connected in 2022.

Strategic connection points, SCPs, are a key element of the NBP providing high-speed broadband in every county in advance of the roll-out of the fibre to the home network. As of 2 December 2022, a total of 823 SCP sites, including 280 broadband connection points, BCPs, which are publicly accessible sites, and 543 schools, have been installed and the high-speed broadband service will be switched on in these locations through service provider contracts managed by the Department of Rural and Community Development for BCPs and the Department of Education for school SCPs. Further details are available on the NBI website.

In County Cork, 24 BCPs have been installed to date, of which two were installed in 2022, and 85 school BCPs have been installed to date for educational access, of which 55 schools were installed in 2022. My Department continues to work with the Department of Education to prioritise schools without high-speed broadband that are within the intervention area.

Does the Minister of State know the number of schools outstanding that have yet to be connected? I am coming across many problems in County Cork where there are properties that Eir has the capacity to connect, but is not allowed to because they are in the amber area. Has there been any progress with Eir on that issue? For example, in one case the pole that provides the connection is at the entrance to a farm yard. The farm house could not be connected, yet a house 200 yards down the road could be connected. Four other houses in the area could not be connected because they were within the amber area. What engagement has there been with Eir? We could connect a very significant number of additional houses in a very short timeframe. The infrastructure is there but because properties are in the amber area, Eir is not allowed to connect them.

How far behind target, whether in Cork or nationally, is the NBI roll-out? That is the critical question everyone is asking. Second, when is the roll-out now expected to be complete for the last house in the last valley? That is another question people are asking.

The first question is on how many schools have not been connected. I do not have this data to hand but the final schools to be connected across the entire country are to be completed by June 2023.

The next question was on the number of homes that Eir will not connect, because they are in the intervention area, or is "not allowed to" connect as the Deputy said. Eir can connect a home anywhere in Ireland if it wants to. The provider is not excluded from providing broadband in rural areas and it does so in many cases, and we have double fibre connections going into homes where it is easy for Eir to do so. Therefore, Eir is not prevented from doing that. Let us consider a person on the border of intervention and non-intervention areas. I understand that people on the edge of the area may feel frustrated if they do not have broadband but the person next door has. In the same way, the person next door may be in County Tipperary and you may be in County Cork and you cannot play for the other person's team. That is the nature of deployment areas.

The next question was on how engagement with Eir works. I meet with Eir extremely regularly. I met with representatives this and last week. I am constantly meeting with all the industry players, including NBI and, in fact, with every broadband company and mobile operator in the country.

Deputy Ó Cuív asked where we are on targets. We met the target for this year two months ahead of schedule. We had a target of 102,000 that was to be met by the end of January 2023 but was met by 1 December 2022. It is a seven-year project that started in 2020 and will be complete by the end of 2026. It has doubled the deployment speed this year compared to last year, in other words the number of homes being passed. It will complete on time and according to budget.

I refer to engagement with Eir. I understand when a property is in the amber area, Eir will not engage. It is saying it is being prevented from engaging because it will not get the same remuneration as the contractor doing the national broadband roll-out. That is the reason Eir will not connect properties in the amber area. As we are behind to a large extent in real terms, can we not fast-track the properties on the borderline areas?

There is a financial disincentive to connect within a rural area for a commercial operator. It is because it has to compete with a State-subsidised provider. National Broadband Ireland has to provide 25 years of fibre broadband to people for the same price in a rural area as it would cost them in an urban area and we have State-aid approval from the EU to do that because of the market failure in those areas. It can be difficult for commercial suppliers to compete in such areas because they are competing against a provider that is State subsidised. It does occur particularly at the edges of urban area that is just as easy for commercial suppliers, such as Eir, Virgin Media, or SIRO, to deploy fibre. There are two options then for the customer which is great as they have double approval.

I would need to engage further with the Deputy to understand better exactly what is the issue. I regularly meet with all the players in the industry and I am happy to talk to the Deputy. We also have the mobile phone and broadband task force, which meets with all parts of the Government, local authorities, the Department of Rural and Community Development etc. I am happy to meet with the Deputy to try to better understand the issue.

National Broadband Plan

Colm Burke

Question:

81. Deputy Colm Burke asked the Minister for the Environment, Climate and Communications if NBI is continuing to engage with a company (details supplied) to provide broadband to premises in cases in which the company's fibre broadband infrastructure is bordering an amber area under the national broadband plan and given that the company has sufficient capacity to accommodate more premises on this line; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [62538/22]

This question relates to the same issue I have just raised. Can the Minister provide information where Eir is prepared to engage on properties along the borderline areas? We certainly have not come across it in the Cork area. Every time we get on to Eir about such a connection, we are told "No". Does the Minister have other information in that regard?

The architecture of the network design for the national broadband plan is specifically based on the design of the National Broadband Ireland network coming from the Open Eir exchanges or the metropolitan area networks managed by Eir. It is based on an engineering design that allows NBI to get to every premises as quickly and as efficiently as possible working within the confines of how fibre networks are built. The design uses existing infrastructure to a very significant degree.

NBI have advised that it has run a tender process for the provision of alternative solutions that would complement the NBI build, while delivering the NBP specified broadband product and its associated service level agreements. Five providers passed the pre-qualification stage and were provided with the tender documentation to respond. Three of the qualified bidders provided a response to the tender. One of the three subsequently withdrew from the process, leaving two providers to enter the product testing phase of the tender process. The product testing trials, to validate the proposed products meet the NBP specification, are in progress at present. Subject to successful completion of the technical validation, commercial evaluation of the proposals will begin.

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