Dáil Éireann debate -
Thursday, 6 Jul 2023

Vol. 1041 No. 5

Ceisteanna ó Cheannairí - Leaders' Questions

Deputy Matt Carthy

What has happened in recent days in Jenin in the West Bank "amount[s] to an egregious [violation] of international law and standards on the use of force and may constitute a war crime." They are not my words but those of experts from the United Nations. Twelve Palestinians were murdered by Israeli forces; five of them were children. Thousands were forced from their homes - which are in refugee camps, by the way. When they returned, many of those homes had been destroyed, water and electricity services were cut and roads had been bombarded. Israel had managed to make refugees out of refugees. For years, in defiance of UN resolutions, the Israeli Government has been carrying out indiscriminate attacks on Palestine as the occupation of the Palestinian territory and apartheid intensified. It is shameful.

This morning I met with the Palestinian ambassador to Ireland and I join the Ceann Comhairle in welcoming her to the House. I extended to her our solidarity with the Palestinian people and take this opportunity to do so again. Our thoughts, solidarity and prayers are with them at this time but they need more than that. The actions of Israel are, as ever, undermining efforts to secure a sustainable and peaceful two-state solution. Those actions must be urgently challenged by the international community. Without sanction or adequate diplomatic response, I fear we will see more innocent civilians killed in the coming days, weeks, months and years. It is long past time the international community, particularly the European Union, took action in response to Israeli aggression and oppression and acted to defend the rights of the people of Palestine.

The onus is also on the Government to respond robustly. The world must say stop and Ireland must lead the way. This House has adopted strong resolutions with cross-party support demanding an end to Israeli occupation and annexation of Palestinian lands. We now need to see action from the Government and from the Tánaiste as Minister for Foreign Affairs. We must take measures to end the EU’s preferential trading relationship with Israel. We should start by withdrawing Irish State investment from companies operating in the occupied territory, as outlined in Deputy Brady’s Bill currently before this House. We should also pass the occupied territories Bill because the Palestinian people need our solidarity but they need much more than that. History tells us Israel will not stop without a strong international response. Only a sustained campaign by the international community to call out Israel’s continual war crimes against the Palestinian people will make them stop.

The Government must now also move to recognise formally the state of Palestine. The Dáil passed a Sinn Féin motion to that effect in 2014; the Seanad did likewise. Yet the Government has continued to drag its heels. I urge it do so at this critical time, make a stand for peace and progress in the Middle East and formally recognise the state of Palestine. When will the Government do that? What other actions will the Tánaiste take on behalf of the Irish people that can be an example to the world and show the world aggression, annexation, apartheid and occupation will not be tolerated anywhere? What actions will he take in the face of the ongoing breaches of international law by Israel against the people of Palestine?

The Tánaiste

I beg the indulgence of the Ceann Comhairle and Deputy to say that last evening we heard the very sad news of the passing of a former Minister and Deputy, Brendan Daly from Cooraclare in County Clare. He was an extraordinarily committed public servant who served in multiple Departments as Minister for social welfare, defence, marine, fisheries and forestry. He worked in the Department of An Taoiseach and the Departments of labour, foreign affairs and finance. He was an active and valued member of our party and a committed County Clare man. He was a witty guy with a great sense of humour. He could pull the odd prank every now and again and he enjoyed that. His warmth, wit, intelligence and regular advice will be sorely missed. I extend our sympathies to his children, Niamh, Iomhar, Ronan, his grandchildren and all his extended family and friends in Clare. I thank the Ceann Comhairle and Members for their indulgence on that.

Deputy Matt Carthy

Hear, hear.

The Tánaiste

I thank the Deputy for raising the situation in Palestine, the unacceptable attacks on Jenin and the escalation by the Israeli Government, which I condemn, of violent incursions into the West Bank generally. The last two years have seen a significant escalation in such incursions and violence, which has led to a dramatic increase in the loss of life, particularly the loss of civilian life in the West Bank. We have articulated our strongest concern and condemn the incursion into Jenin. It is part of a very worrying escalation of violence in recent weeks and months. Israel has a legal as well as moral responsibility, as the occupying power, to protect all civilians in the occupied Palestinian territory. We have worked with like-minded states in Europe, as well as Jordan and others, to press for a de-escalation, in the first instance, of the violence not just in Jenin but across the West Bank and Gaza. We are increasingly concerned, also, by the increase in settler violence in the West Bank, which has resulted in civilian deaths, injuries and significant property damage. All perpetrators must be held accountable.

On the broader issues, Ireland is known in the European Union and United Nations as being one of the strongest countries that consistently raises the violation of international law and the UN charter in respect of Palestine. Ireland is recognised globally as supporting Palestinian rights and human rights in particular and, in that context, strongly supporting a two-state solution. It is always a balance as to the levers one uses to try to get the best outcome in this situation, realising our own limitations as well. Suffice to say there is our support for the United Nations Relief and Works Agency for Palestine Refugees in the Near East, UNWRA, and in the United Nations of the recent resolution to hold Israel to account in the international court. When I met President Abbas and the Prime Minister from Palestine, these were measures they wanted us to pursue. We did so and we supported them.

My party, Fianna Fáil, has a long history of supporting Palestinians' right to a homeland. The late Brian Lenihan Snr. was, I think, the first European politician at a ministerial level to recognise Palestinians' right to a homeland. Frankly, there is a need to build stronger consensus across the European Union. While I said there were a number of "like-minded" countries which have strong views on this matter, we need to persuade more within the European Union towards the need for justice and to create a credible pathway to a two-state solution. The real worry and concern is that the two-state solution is becoming increasingly unviable. Israel's ultimate security, which it always puts forwards as the rationale for its behaviour, becomes untenable in the context of not having a two-state solution; in other words, it makes sense that you get on with your neighbours to create a peaceful environment. What is happening in this case is a shocking escalation of violence by a government that has moved, perceptibly and obviously, to the far right, in its composition and there are very dangerous ideas within that government.

Deputy Matt Carthy

I would like to be associated with the Tánaiste's remarks of sympathy for Brendan Daly and to convey the condolences of Sinn Féin to his family, loved ones and the Fianna Fáil Party. Ar dheis Dé go raibh a anam.

A two-state solution is becoming increasingly unviable simply because of the actions of the state of Israel in its pursuit of the absolute humiliation of the Palestinian people, which appears to be its only goal at this time. I welcome the strong words from the Tánaiste and successive Ministers for Foreign Affairs from this State. I recognise that the Tánaiste is in a minority of ministers from EU countries in that regard. However, he should have the absolute confidence that he is in the majority of humanity, which is disgusted by the ongoing actions of Israel and the lack of an international response. Consensus would be fantastic and preferable at an EU level but for a consensus to be reached, at some point, somebody will have to show leadership. Ireland is best placed to be the state that shows that leadership by taking action and forcing the hand of others internationally to take a robust response regarding what is happening. The first thing we can do is simply recognise the state of Palestine, as agreed by both Houses of the Oireachtas. When will that be done?

The Tánaiste

The programme for Government states that the Government will honour its commitment to recognising a state of Palestine as part of a lasting settlement of the conflict, or, in advance of that, when we believe doing so will progress efforts to reach a two-state solution or to protect the integrity of the Palestinian territory. We could go solo and do it next week or next year, but what impact would that have? That is a serious question which we must ask. There is a strong argument that having a stronger, collective voice with a number of significant EU member states and others, if we join forces and collectively recognise the state of Palestine, would be far more impactful than one country going it alone. I accept that is a judgment call. As I said earlier, the levers one uses to put pressure on the Israeli Government require judgment. We have been pushing the need for an association agreement with the Palestinian authority at EU level. Several of us have put forward to Josep Borrell that a much stronger relationship between the European Union and the Palestinian National Authority is required.

Deputy Ivana Bacik

First, on behalf of the Labour Party, I wish to join the Tánaiste in offering sympathies on the loss of Brendan Daly, the Tánaiste's former colleague, to his family and community. I also offer my deep sympathies to the families, friends and all those affected by the tragic deaths of Andrew O’Donnell and Max Wall in Ios last weekend. The devastating losses of these two boys who had just finished the leaving certificate examination at St. Michael's College, Ballsbridge, has impacted so many. I offer my sympathies in particular to the school community at St. Michael's College, where I attended a memorial service last night for the two boys. We saw an immense outpouring of grief and support for the families and friends of the boys. It was especially poignant as it took place in the same chapel where they had their graduation ceremony just six weeks ago. I offer sincere condolences to the O’Donnell and Wall families and all affected. The Tánaiste's Department has been to the fore and has been working hard to support the families and all those other students in Ios at the same time. Last night, school principal, Tim Kelleher, gave particular thanks to Department of Foreign Affairs staff.

I also wish to join the welcome to the Palestinian ambassador, H.E. Dr. Jilan Wahba Abdalmajid. It has been my pleasure to meet the ambassador on several occasions. I join others in calling for stronger leadership from Ireland on solidarity with the people of Palestine, in particular this week, following the horrific actions of the Israel Defense Forces in Jenin. Several of us raised this issue earlier this week. I reiterate my calls for the Government to seek to pass the Control of Economic Activity (Occupied Territories) Bill 2018, for which there is cross-party support.

I wish also to refer to another issue related to the Tánaiste's ministerial brief. The Women of Honour group expressed serious concern about the plans for the Government’s statutory inquiry to investigate allegations of sexual assault, discrimination, harassment and bullying of women in the Defence Forces, brought forward, courageously, by the members of the group. They say they cannot support what they see as a grossly inadequate inquiry with deeply flawed terms of reference. I understand the Tánaiste will meet the group today at 5 p.m. in advance of bringing forward proposals for the inquiry to Cabinet next week. We welcome the Government's commitment to holding a statutory inquiry. I ask that the Tánaiste take on board the concerns expressed by the group and that the Government moves swiftly to establish a tribunal of inquiry based on the proposed terms of reference the Women of Honour drafted. The group is anxious to ensure that the terms include an investigation into the workplace culture pertaining in the Defence Forces. It is a key issue because, as the Labour Party defence spokesperson, Senator Wall, said, the Defence Forces are in crisis following years of neglect and there is a recruitment and retention crisis, in particular. To address that, we must ensure we are addressing the toxic culture which the allegations from Women of Honour uncovered. I ask the Tánaiste if he accepts that the calls of the Women of Honour must be heeded as part of an overall response to the recruitment and retention issues plaguing our Defence Forces today.

The Tánaiste

I share the Deputy's expressions of sympathy with the families of Andrew O'Donnell and Max Wall and the entire St. Michael's College community. It is every parent's nightmare that something like this would happen. It is deeply saddening and shocking. In time, I hope, the great memories they shared with their sons and families will give them some consolation in the very traumatic and difficult time ahead. I thank our consular staff in the Department of Foreign Affairs, who worked with the families.

I am conscious of the role of the Women of Honour in bringing forward and shedding a public light on these issues. I had several discussions with the group and other organisations and representative bodies on the form of inquiry and the terms of reference. The Attorney General met the legal representative of Women of Honour this week. I will have a further meeting with them this evening. I have an open mind regarding the issues; I am not closing anything off but a balance must be struck between trying to get things moving and timelines. I am open to people's perspectives in the House on that matter. I would like to try to get the tribunal up and running before we recess. The Deputy will be aware, from her legal background, that a lot of preparatory work must then happen, such as discovery and work-up before hearings even take place. I have discussed with the groups and others the question of a public tribunal of inquiry or a commission of inquiry and how to protect people who may wish to come forward but may not want the subject matter of their issue to be in the public domain.

That is a legitimate issue. There may be ways we can deal with that such as in camera hearings and so forth. I have listened intently to what has been said in that regard and I will be mindful of what people say in that context when I bring recommendations to the Government in respect of both the form or format of the inquiry and the terms of reference.

On the terms of reference, I do not detect a great difference between the issues. In many instances it is about how the terms of reference are interpreted as to whether they cover a range of issues or whether they do not. We have received legal advice that many of the issues that have been raised are covered. For example, the Department Ministers are covered in the terms of reference. Protected disclosures, which a number of groups raised, are covered. Civilian employees are covered. Quite a range of issues were raised which we have clarified and brought within the terms of reference, but there could be further discussions about those terms of reference.

Deputy Ivana Bacik

I thank the Tánaiste for the response, in particular his comment that he has an open mind on the plans for the inquiry. That is a very fair response. I agree with him that it would be positive to move swiftly on this. I think he has said he hopes to bring the recommendations to Cabinet next week. I see that the terms of reference for the inquiry are not on next week's Dáil schedule at present. We would certainly be very happy to facilitate their inclusion in order that we could move ahead on this. I listened carefully to some of the points the Tánaiste has made about what is a creative approach to looking at how best to meet the requirements of Women of Honour - for example, through having capacity for in camera hearings and so forth. That is very welcome. We want to see progress on this, clearly, and we welcome and appreciate that there is ongoing engagement with members of the Women of Honour group. Given, however, their allegations and the immense courage they have shown in bringing forward all these issues, the allegations have to be addressed to address the bigger issue of recruitment and retention at a time when we see our Defence Forces having a falling strength, with numbers now below 8,000. That is really the greatest threat to our security. In the context of the recent and rather controversial consultative forum on international security policy, that is certainly a point we will make in our Labour submission to the forum, that we need to address the issue of falling numbers and we need to ensure we maintain our proud tradition of international peacekeeping, adherence to the triple lock and military neutrality while, of course, being very clear in our political expression of support - for example, for the people of Ukraine under such appalling bombardment from Russia this week and for the past year and more.

The Tánaiste

I am conscious that I am before Dáil Éireann. I was hopeful I would be in a position to communicate my intentions to the Women of Honour group today. I am minded to recommend to the Government a public tribunal of inquiry. It is a matter of trying to tease through the mechanisms by which we would try to protect certain people who might wish to come forward but not be in the public glare. I think the argument has been made that if we go for a commission of inquiry, that will be very much secret - at least, that is the language that has been used - or confidential, to put it that way.

Deputy Brendan Howlin

Behind closed doors.

The Tánaiste

It would be behind closed doors, and people feel that the whole disciplinary process historically has been behind closed doors, hence the lack of transparency. I am jumping ahead because I have not got to the Government yet, but that is my view and I was going to communicate that today to Women of Honour and then have further discussions with them. There is only one genuine motivation here. I know, having been involved in various inquiries in the past, how time slips. If we lose two or three more months before we come back after the summer recess, we will then go forward, between preparation and discoveries, and there is a lot in this. Let us be honest: we are looking at a number of years before this work concludes. The Deputy is absolutely correct about the importance of this work for the future of our Defence Forces. It is absolutely essential that it is a catalyst for a change in culture and how we do things in the future.

Deputy Seán Canney

I want to raise the issue of planning in Ireland and how we are going about that business. The context is that I met the Planning Regulator yesterday and we discussed policies. He was in the audiovisual room presenting to us. It is glaringly obvious that the housing situation in this country, especially the private housing market, is dysfunctional. Developers are not building housing estates and we have an issue in that we have a lack of infrastructure in the regions and so on. The most significant thing I see happening, however, is that we are preparing county development plans and local area plans and we seem to be dezoning land, or the famous phrase is that we have to follow a core strategy. I have another name for that core strategy. It is pure nonsense. It is creating-----

The Tánaiste

Which strategy?

Deputy Seán Canney

The core strategy. It is preventing us from zoning lands to have a supply of lands available for residential development in our towns, our villages and our cities because we have to follow this core plan based on population increase. In most cases, however, we are zoning lands that may not be available at all for one reason or another, we are zoning lands that will never be sold for development and we are zoning lands that may be landlocked. We end up with a situation in which the price of land which is zoned goes through the roof and creates huge viability issues for housing - and we wonder why we have a dysfunctional market. I am of the strong belief that we should take this whole planning process and decide that we are going to make it user-friendly and try to encourage developments rather than preventing developments from happening.

The Tánaiste

I thank the Deputy for raising this issue in the context of planning and its obvious relationship to housing. As the Deputy will know, 30,000 houses were completed last year, in 2022. That is a 45% increase on 2021. Our target for this year, the end of 2023, was 29,000. We hope to hit that, if not exceed it. In the year to April 2023 some 50,000 homes were purchased by households. Of those, 17,000 were purchased by first-time buyers. There is therefore a growing number of first-time buyers in a position to buy houses. A record 6,716 new homes were added to the national housing stock in the first quarter of this year. That is the highest recorded since the series began in quarter 1 of 2011. Mortgage drawdowns rose by 10%. The commencements are also, thankfully, on the increase: 28,000 homes were commenced in the year to May 2023, 13,000 from January to May of this year. That is the highest level of commencements for this period since records began in 2014. Planning permissions granted for new homes increased by 38% nationally in the year to quarter 1 of 2023. The temporary time-limited waiver in respect of development contributions to local authorities, as well as Uisce Éireann water and wastewater connection charges, will reduce costs by about €12,500 per home, on average.

On the planning side, I take the Deputy's point. At the moment I think the review of development plans across 31 counties is more or less complete. They make provision for about 48,000 housing units to be constructed annually on zoned lands. That shows there is a bit of headroom. I take the Deputy's point that some zoned lands may not be immediately available due to infrastructure issues or other issues with development. As he will know, we have other initiatives around residential zoned land tax to incentivise the activation of zoned and serviced land for housing to avoid it being hoarded. Also, the recent publication of maps shows that about 11,000 ha of zoned and serviced land is available for housing. I think that is about 48,000 units to be constructed annually in terms of the zoned land. We probably need to drill down more as to how much of that land is available, but there is no doubt but that there is a lot of serviced zoned land out there that could be developed and needs to be developed. That is a key focus of our policy.

On the urban regeneration and redevelopment fund, URDF, very substantial funding, about €2 billion, is being made available to enable local authorities and areas to get the infrastructure in place for substantial housing projects. However, a lot of that infrastructural work is taking time, with the various local authorities working in partnership with the private sector. That fund is key.

Deputy Seán Canney

I meant to say it at the start but on behalf of the Regional Group I want to extend our sympathies to the family of the late Brendan Daly, a man who I met on a number of occasions. May he rest in peace.

I want to come back to the Tánaiste's reply. He said the Government has to drill down into it and he spoke about a strategy for building houses. We all know that the private housing market is dysfunctional. Anybody who is building houses will say that, apart from people who are building apartment blocks in the cities. If you take developers who might be looking at land, the first place they will go is to the local authority to see if it is interested in buying the houses off them when they are finished. I acknowledge that a lot of local authority houses are being built, including in Galway East, but if you take a town like Tuam, we have not had any substantial private housing development since 2007, and Athenry would be the same way. We have bits and pieces happening but we do not have the substantial developments that we need.

We are doing a local area plan for these places and we do not seem to get that we are zoning lands and that the status quo remains. In some cases we are dezoning lands. The other thing we are doing is R2 phasing, which is daft because it means the land cannot be built on or sold as development land, and yet the Government is talking about putting residential tax on it, which I hope the Government will change. There is no common sense in this. If we do not tackle this now, we will end up in five years still wondering why we are not building enough houses in areas where they are needed for young families to buy at affordable prices.

The Tánaiste

I appreciate the Deputy's points, although I hope the Croí Cónaithe funds - the towns fund, in particular, now provides a grant of up to €50,000 for the refurbishment of vacant properties, and that has been increased recently - will help with vacancy in towns and villages. If the property is derelict, you can get a grant of up to €70,000. There are the help-to-buy and first home schemes, which are enabling people to purchase houses. I gave the figures for those earlier. The State is the biggest actor but I take the Deputy's point that more development is needed in the private sector. I mention the likes of Croí Cónaithe and the cost rental scheme - you name it - because the State is backing every project and every type of scheme with funding and financial support. That will continue but we need a more vibrant private sector market as well. We consistently look at all of this.

If there are flood plains, for example, I understand dezoning if it is not appropriate to build. I am conscious that across the country, some county councils are being told to dezone land, which does not seem on the surface to make sense to me. I mention the likes of Arklow and the Deputy has mentioned one or two places. That is particularly true when we are investing a lot in infrastructure like wastewater treatment plants and so on and since we have 5.2 million people. The Irish population will continue to grow; we are an outlier across Europe in that respect. In that regard, all stakeholders need to reflect on those fundamentals.

Deputy Seán Canney

Common sense.

An Ceann Comhairle

It is not that common.

The Tánaiste

The Deputy loves the phrase "common sense", as do his colleagues.

Deputy Seán Canney

It is scarce.

The Tánaiste

It is as if we are all devoid of it but those in the Opposition. I know what the Deputy is saying and I take it on board.

Deputy Mattie McGrath

On behalf of the Rural Independent Group I would like to express our sympathies to the family of the late Brendan Daly, iar-Aire, iar-Aire Stáit agus iar-Theachta Dála. I had many an interaction with him. He was a jolly man and a hardworking and diligent public representative always. Ar dheis Dé go raibh a anam dílis.

Last week the Federation of Early Childhood Providers launched a document outlining the challenges facing the sector. Over 200 of them came and protested outside the front gate of Leinster House. The sector is facing huge challenges. It has concerns about its financial viability and the level of control that organisations have over their business decisions due to the restrictions and increased regulations that are being placed on them regarding access to core funding and a freeze on fees. Private providers are being forced to operate at a loss and their running models are insufficient. The largest costs are down to Government impositions.

The sector has also experienced a staffing crisis, between retaining and recruiting, and that is another problem for it. This all has an impact on the number of places available for parents, families and people who want to enter the workforce, etc. The sector also faces numerous challenges in meeting the growing and diverse needs of children with additional needs, including funding constraints, staffing issues, limited resources and long waiting times for people to get assessments, and then there is no lead-in time. We must financially support staff, parents and families. While the employment regulation orders, EROs, and the freeze on the fees being introduced are welcome for parents and staff, they impose additional burdens on the providers. In return, access to core funding has been promoted as a means of reward. Private services suffer from the imposition of additional duties and regulations. There are many regulations putting huge pressure on these services. We want to have them and the vast majority of them are running impeccable systems in childcare. However, the model is clearly not working in its current form and providers are being forced to reduce choice and flexibility in services that should be meeting the demands of families.

As I said, providers are being forced to adapt models and reduce flexibility, with people being forced to choose full-day services while early childhood care and education, ECCE, and sessional options are being dropped. That is not good for families either. These impositions are harsh on the providers. Forcing them to trade non-viably is considered a crime and the Government is forcing this. One cannot knowingly trade in a reckless situation; that would be described as trading without proper financial funds but the Government is forcing this on top of them and putting them in a difficult situation. These are people who had the initiative and business acumen to set up their own centres and give loving care to our páistí óga. They are also giving great solace to the families who put their children in these places and they are giving those children a great start in life. We need to do something here to relax the regulation. We should sit down, listen to them and engage, which the Minister is not doing, and we should support them.

The Tánaiste

I thank the Deputy for raising this issue because tending to the early developmental needs of our children is perhaps the most important thing we can do in terms of the development of our society and country. I am a great believer in resourcing early childhood education and childcare. Our brains learn more between zero and three than we do for the rest of our lives. I said that to a more senior Cabinet Minister some years ago and he asked, "What hope does that give me?" but it is an important point.

Deputy Mattie McGrath

What hope does that give us?

The Tánaiste

It is an important point because traditionally and historically we did not see it that way, and primary school started at four years old and so on. Children learn vicariously and they learn in different ways but structured childcare and development can be powerful for children. The Government has invested strongly in early learning and childcare. The budget in 2015 was €260 million and it is now €1.025 billion in 2023. That has reached the 2028 investment target five years ahead of time.

We need to do more and we want to do more. I pay tribute to the Minister, Deputy O'Gorman, in this regard. Some 120,000 children now benefit from a national childcare subsidy and that is an increase of more than 118% since this time last year. As we know, core funding has also developed and there are improved pay and conditions. I mention the EROs that were agreed by employer and employee representatives in a landmark pay deal for the sector, with over 70% of staff receiving a pay increase as a result. When we met the social partners in the context of the Labour Employer Economic Forum, LEEF, they saluted this development as a watershed moment in terms of pay and conditions for people working in the childcare sector, and that should be acknowledged. For year two of core funding the Minister has secured an additional €28 million, meaning an increase to €287 million in the budget for the sector, and that will give us a sustainable model with increases for all services.

There is an independent financial review of sessional services ongoing and the Minister has announced targeted measures for core funding for year two to support and fund smaller and sessional services. Services that are experiencing difficulty and would like support are encouraged to contact their city or county childcare committee to access case management supports. Services can be assisted on an individual basis through this route. Sustainability funding is available to partner services, community and private, that are experiencing financial difficulty.

Yesterday evening I briefly met some groups on the plinth. I encouraged them to engage with us in this respect. With the core funding scheme in operation since last September there is already significant evidence of success with 95%, or well over 4,200 providers, signed up, 98% of community not-for-profit services signed up and 93% of private for-profit services signed up.

Deputy Mattie McGrath

This is serious. A total of 7%, or one in every 14, of early learning and care providers for school-aged children will not reopen in September. This is a startling figure. The Government has failed to address the concerns of early childhood care providers regarding low pay and core funding. The failure not only impacts on providers but also on families who desperately need these places for them to survive and stay in the workplace. This is resulting in 68%, almost 70%, of childcare providers being unsure out their business future. They cannot provide on thin air. They cannot provide when they are being regulated out of existence and not getting support.

The Minister, Deputy O'Gorman, seems to be tone deaf about their needs and he is not engaging. He is more interested in every other kind of thing that he is bringing in here and is certainly not dealing with our most young and vulnerable children who need those supports and their parents who need to be in the workplace. The reality is that the sector is completely underfunded, with 68% of providers saying they are not sure about their future in September. They cannot continue trading at a loss. They cannot put on extra fees. They cannot fundraise in these hard times. It is a serious issue and I am asking the Tánaiste to sit down and engage with them. I ask the Minister to engage with them meaningfully.

The Tánaiste

The rate of closures was down this year. It was the lowest this year compared with previous years. This is a fact that we need to take on board. The other side of this equation is parents paying very high fees. Part of the core funding model is to have management of fees in return for an allocation of additional funding. The results have been fairly significant for many parents in terms of the reduction of the fees and the bills they received in December last year. There has been an appreciable improvement in terms of the reduction of fees. We want to go further.

The model is one that we need to stick with and work with. If there are issues with particular providers we must see if we can tweak it and refine it to ensure sustainability. No one here is wilfully trying to put people out of business. The big concern of Governments all along has been that we allocate resources but the parents do not see the outcome of the allocation of those resources. There has to be a quid pro quo if we give more sustainable funding. We now have the employment regulation order. The costs were simply too high for people and they are still very high. This initiative has reduced significantly for the first time in a long time the costs for people availing of childcare.

An Ceann Comhairle

I join with the expressions of sympathy to the family of Brendan Daly, whom I considered a friend. He was a great character and an outstandingly dedicated public servant. The stories he could tell about his entanglement in the rod licence affair were legendary. He was a truly wise man with a razor-sharp wit, which many of us experienced over the years. Ar dheis Dé go raibh a anam.