I remind members who wish to raise matters at the joint committee that they should notify the clerk to the committee, not the Chairman, of their request.
Business of Joint Committee.
Issues may arise at short notice.
I like to facilitate members and have done so in the past.
Time may not permit notice to be given and the committee may need to make an urgent response. While the Chairman's is the preferred solution, there may be occasions when an issue must be raised at a meeting.
I do not have a problem with that. However, when requests are made, they should be directed to the clerk to the committee, not the Chairman.
Urgent or emergency business may be raised without notice.
That is why one seeks suspension of Standing Orders. Deputy Aylward may remember what happened when he was chairman of Kilkenny County Council.
I did not rule on that matter.
Irrespective of who asks me to raise a particular issue, I will do what I have done this morning. I wish to make it quite clear that Fine Gael, the Labour Party, Independent Members and Fianna Fáil are all the same to me.
I thank the Chairman and apologise for not informing the clerk to the committee of the matter I wish to raise. My action was not political. I am disappointed that it was insinuated that the matter had been dealt with on a nod and wink basis. I inquired in good faith and the Chairman responded that the question of the farm waste management scheme could be raised, for which I thank him.
This is a serious issue, about which I am sure many members have been contacted by constituents. A huge amount of work is under way throughout the country, although the weather is not helping and a backlog has built up. Can the closing date be extended beyond 31 December? Many have only recently received planning permission and final approval after a long and arduous process and now find they cannot get contractors or suppliers to give quotations. They are reluctant to enter contracts which they may not be able to fulfil, leaving them in danger of being sued. During previous economic downturns the farming community kept the country afloat. Farmers have always been prepared to put their shoulders to the wheel. We must appeal to the Minister to meet the committee to discuss the extension of the closing date by at least three months.
There are two issues which need the urgent support of the committee, one of which is prompt payment. Grants are not being paid and will not be paid until the beginning of 2009. These works create no financial gain for individual farmers. There is a legal obligation to meet higher environmental standards. The works will not enable any farmer to increase production or profits. It is important to point out that the benefit primarily is to the environment. At a time when margins in most enterprises are being squeezed, banks are putting pressure on farmers to seek their slice of the action in terms of the grant payable. Many farmers will find it difficult financially to continue with these works if problems arise with the banks. We must ensure at a minimum that there is adherence to the Charter of Farmers' Rights which makes provision for timely payment of grants. Our first request must be that all payments meet the terms agreed between the farming organisations and the Department under the farmers' charter.
As stated by Deputy McGrath, there is undoubtedly a case to be made for extending the deadline beyond the end of 2008. I have raised this matter previously with the Department and with the previous Minister. I also raised it in July with the current Minister at Question Time in the Dáil. There is a school of thought that the Government has a vested interest in not extending the deadline beyond the end of December in that the Exchequer's exposure in paying the grants would be reduced and that in the current economic climate the financial pressures on it would ease. However, this is an entirely false argument in denying an extension of the deadline.
I appreciate the points made by Deputy McGrath. I have received correspondence from his colleagues regarding a major steel supplier in his constituency whose order books are full but who cannot meet the requirement for steel between now and the end of the year. People are faced with the prospect of being laid off if the scheme is terminated in December, despite the fact that companies in the building, construction and steel sectors have orders that could keep them in employment well into next year. There has been an enormous decrease in activity in this area. We must ensure people remain in productive employment rather than in the dole queues.
The weather has played havoc with farmers' attempts to have the works completed on time. There is now such a clamour to have them completed before the deadline that I fear health and safety will be compromised at site level. This is a matter of serious concern, especially given the inclement weather we are experiencing and the number of accidents that often occur at such times. The Department must send a clear message that it appreciates the value of the work being done, economically and environmentally; that it recognises farmers are putting a lot of their own resources into the work being done from which they are receiving no economic return and that it acknowledges that the timeframe for completion of the works is too tight. A six month extension is the minimum required at this stage. I fear a short term extension will not be adequate. Many farmers may not be able to complete the works during the winter and it may be next April, following the first cut of silage, before they resume the works again. That we can drop the curtain on those who do not complete works on time, thus ensuring the Exchequer will not be exposed to the liability, is a false argument because we will have to pay the people concerned when they join the dole queues. The cost in that regard would far outweigh the cost of extending the deadline.
The committee should support the request that the deadline be extended and for prompt payment to those whose works have been completed, in accordance with the terms of the farmers' charter.
I will not labour the point. Deputy McGrath has proposed a six month extension of the deadline applying to the scheme. This was echoed by Deputy Creed and I support that for the pragmatic reasons outlined. The Labour Party would support the proposals also.
I concur with previous speakers. With regard to the payment of grants for the rest of 2008, while the article in the Irish Independent did not say the Government would not pay the grants, it suggested it might not. I followed up on that and was told by the Minister that grants are being paid as they become payable. I know a farmer who was paid his grant yesterday. It is wrong to say they are not being paid. Some €178 million has been paid out this year and the Minister assured me that any grant due will be paid. It is a fantastic scheme and has been very successful from the point of view of waste management. It has also been good for employment in the construction industry, particularly in this year of downturns. If possible, the scheme should be extended because many jobs are dependent on its extension.
There are issues with regard to completion of works. I know of two cases involving planning issues with An Bord Pleanála and the situation is dodgy with regard to whether the people involved will get their sheds finished. There is also an issue with regard to steel as there is some delay with provision of steel for roofing and construction. I agree with the sentiments expressed by previous speakers.
I agree with everything said. I am a farmer and my son is taking part in the grant scheme under my name. I have spoken to the Minister on the issue. He told me that initially Ireland had to get approval from the European Union to put the farm waste grant scheme in place. The Union did not want to sanction it initially because it felt it gave an unfair advantage to Irish farmers. However, on account of the nitrates directive it was allowed, but under strict conditions, including that it would be completed by end-December.
I do not want to repeat what has been said, but there has always been a problem with the time scale. The steel and concrete suppliers and the contractors have always considered it would be difficult to have the works completed by 31 December 2008. The atrocious weather conditions we have had this summer have added to the problem and made the situation more severe. I agree with Deputy Creed that we must get derogation of at least six months. Three months would be insufficient as we could have further bad weather and it might not be possible to do the work. I support the call for a six-month derogation. I am delighted my colleague has raised the issue and support the proposal that the Minister should return to the European Union to seek derogation for a minimum of six months so that farmers can complete the work.
Currently some farmers have commenced building jobs that will cost €60,000 or €80,000. They may already have half the job done and have spent up to €40,000, but with a closing date of 31 December they are unable to finish the work in time and are caught in no man's land without a grant. We must do something about this. I know much of the problem is largely due to weather conditions. I know of one farmer who tried to get on with the work whose equipment got bogged down on three occasions when digging out a site for a slatted unit. Even when he got the site dug out, after several weeks instead of three days, the area continuously filled with water, delaying him for a further six weeks before he could pour any concrete on the site. This is just an example of what is happening.
I appeal to the Minister to return to the European Union to seek a minimum six-month derogation so that work can be completed on this waste management work, which will be of inestimable value to farmers and in controlling pollution in the country.
It seems there was a precedent last year, when the date was extended to the end of March. We should seek clarity as to whether derogation was required then or whether this was done with the imprimatur of the Minister of the day.
Given that it was easy to do it last year, why is it not possible to extend it for this year into next year? I believe it is possible. I have tabled parliamentary questions regarding the local agriculture office in Wicklow town where staffing levels were reduced due to sick leave and other factors, and a person was only being replaced part time, which resulted in a backlog in processing. People could not even start work under this system. I was assured by the Department that it would not be at fault for anyone's project not being completed in time. It will claim that everything was sanctioned in time. However, all the other reasons now come into play as to why people will not be in a position to complete their construction projects on time and comply. It has been said here that this is the only area of the construction industry that is thriving at the moment. We are going to kill it off and put more people on the dole when we do not need to.
I go back to the basic question I asked at the start. We need to find out how this was allowed to be extended from 2006 until the end of March and the same cannot happen going into next year. I propose that the committee convey a message of the unanimous all-party decision to recommend that it be extended by six months both to the Minister and to the Secretary General of the Department.
I support Deputy McGrath's proposal. Planning permission has caused considerable problems.
It causes problems in every area.
Some people have approached me about that issue. It would be a shame if it is being held up over that. I support the proposal to raise the matter with the Minister. I hope a time extension will be given.
Is it agreed that the clerk to the committee will notify the Minister and the Secretary General of the Department of the discussion that took place here? Agreed.
I ask that it should address both the extension and the payment in compliance with the terms set by the Department.
That is all included.
The joint committee adjourned at 13.27 p.m. until 11.30 a.m. on Wednesday, 1 October 2008.