JOINT COMMITTEE ON ARTS, SPORT, TOURISM, COMMUNITY, RURAL AND GAELTACHT AFFAIRS debate -
Wednesday, 15 Feb 2006

Domestic Violence: Presentation.

Chairman

I am delighted to welcome the delegation from Women's Aid to speak about the role of alcohol in domestic violence. The context is that we propose to say in our report that alcohol should be included in the national drugs strategy. As I said to members before the meeting started, alcohol is a major factor in domestic violence. I suppose we are disappointed that the steering group for the mid-term review of the national drugs strategy decided not to include alcohol as part of the strategy. The issue for our report is to try to encourage those who will form the next national drugs strategy to consider alcohol like any other drug. Past experience informs us that alcohol is one of the biggest drugs in the country. However, Women's Aid will have much more first-hand experience of the problems it can cause.

I welcome the members of the delegation, Ms Margaret Martin, who is the director of Women's Aid, Ms Sinéad Harrison, who is manager of the Women's Aid services department, and Ms Theresa Sweeney, who is a policy officer. I will allow them to introduce themselves and make their presentation. I will then open up the discussion to questions from the floor.

Ms Margaret Martin

I am delighted to be here. I am the director of Women's Aid.

Ms Sinéad Harrison

I am manager of services at Women's Aid.

Ms Theresa Sweeney

I am a policy officer in the policy and research department at Women's Aid.

Ms Martin

I will tell the committee briefly about Women's Aid and the kind of services we offer. Members probably know most of this, but I will repeat it in case they do not.

Women's Aid is a voluntary organisation that provides support and information to women who have been physically, sexually or emotionally abused by intimate partners, whether those be husbands, boyfriends, partners or ex-partners. Women's Aid has worked on the issue of domestic violence for more than 30 years. Among the range of services that we provide, perhaps the best known is our freephone national helpline which is available 12 hours a day, from 10 a.m. until 10 p.m., every day of the year apart from Christmas Day. In 2004, which is the most recent year for which we have statistics, the helpline received 19,901 calls. A serious concern for us is that, because of a lack of resources, we were able to answer only three out of every five of those 20,000 calls. We do not know what happened to the two out of five whose calls went unanswered or whether they rang back.

The services we provide include a one-to-one confidential support and advocacy service, which is managed by Ms Harrison. That support is often provided on a one-off or ongoing basis over a period of weeks, months or even years and it can include court accompaniment. In addition, we provide an arts programme for women and children in our three refuges in the greater Dublin area and a summer project, which is a crucial service. We also provide a range of training aimed at all who deal with women experiencing domestic violence. For example, we provide training for gardaí, for legal, social and medical professionals and for social workers. As the specialist support agency on domestic violence, we are rolling out a code of practice for the community development programme and the Family Support Agency. Having completed the pilot of that, we hope to roll it out nationally over the next two years.

Women's Aid also engages in work on policy and research, which is part of Ms Sweeney's responsibility. As members will see from our website, we have provided some crucial pieces of research that are used frequently in discussions of violence against women. Our communications department's main task is to heighten awareness of the issue of domestic violence. Approximately 50% of our income comes from Government and our fund-raising department raises the remainder. Our website provides more useful information.

Members will probably be interested in the recent World Health Organisation report that was published last year. The report identifies domestic violence as the most common form of violence in women's lives — much more so than assault or rape by strangers or acquaintances — and it shows that women are more at risk from violence in the home than on the street. In that regard, it is important to understand that domestic violence is quite different from many other types of crime. A prevalence study entitled Making the Links, which was produced for Women's Aid in 1995, found that 18% of Irish women experienced violence and abuse at the hands of a male partner. That is almost one in five women. Obviously, anything that can help tackle this serious issue is encouraging. Therefore, Women's Aid very much welcomes the opportunity to highlight the issue of domestic violence and abuse at today's meeting.

Women's Aid is often asked about alcohol. It is important to point out that there is a common misconception about the connection between alcohol and domestic abuse. Although there is often a strong link between the two, we see no evidence of a causal link between alcohol and domestic violence. Our experience suggests, however, that alcohol abuse by a partner greatly increases the risk of severity and frequency in the abuse, especially of physical and sexual abuse. For that reason, alcohol abuse is always included in risk assessment procedures such as those being developed by agencies such as our national domestic violence intervention agency and the women's safety unit in Cardiff, Wales. Both those agencies are carrying out very interesting work on the issue of domestic violence.

Risk assessment is a crucial tool used in homicide prevention that recognises that alcohol and drugs are major risks that need to be taken into account in domestic violence situations. For example, we know from the homicide records that we keep that, of the 115 Irish women who have been murdered since 1995, 65% were killed in their own homes. In all cases that led to a conviction, a man was convicted of the murder. In the 77 cases that have been resolved, almost half the women were murdered by a partner or ex-partner.

The links between alcohol and domestic violence were explored in a piece of research published last summer by the National Crime Council. The report, which was a national study of domestic violence, includes a section on potential triggers for abusive behaviour. Women who had been subjected to domestic violence were asked if there was anything in particular that seemed to them to set off this behaviour. Although the greatest number — 36% — reported that the behaviour seemed to be triggered by nothing in particular, minor incidents, the fact their partner did not like their attitude or indeed that anything could start it, the next highest number — 34% of the total — identified the use of alcohol. The report also quotes K.E. Leonard's research published in 1999:

[T]he majority of aggressive episodes occur without alcohol, and men who have behaved aggressively with alcohol have often behaved aggressively without alcohol as well. The role of alcohol appears to be one of a facilitative nature, a contributing cause.

Exploring the issue further, the National Crime Council report concludes that the results are "far from clear-cut, but are not strongly suggestive of a causal link between alcohol consumption and abuse". When asked if there was ever alcohol involved when a partner behaved in this way, 29% said "never", 44% said "sometimes" and 27% said "always".

Another point about alcohol abuse needs to be emphasised. As alcohol consumption lowers inhibitions, it can be used and accepted as an excuse by a violent man for his behaviour. In our experience, however, treating or dealing with the alcoholism will not stop the violence and the two issues must be dealt with separately. Women using Women's Aid services report that even when their partners have stopped abusing alcohol, they have not stopped abusing them.

Our experience in Women's Aid indicates that abusive men use alcohol as an excuse for the violence and abuse — and judges continue to accept this in the courts. In some cases where a woman is being abused by her partner — who is abusing alcohol — the woman may feel that an order is not enough to protect her as the man's violence and abuse can be very extreme. What is more worrying is that a court will often send a man on a treatment programme for his alcohol abuse, but not issue any orders to protect the woman.

Often, a woman will believe that the abuse will stop if the man stops drinking. More often in our experience, this is unfortunately not the case. In some cases the physical violence may reduce or even stop, but the mental abuse increases. Living with alcoholic partners, women become stuck in a poverty trap. An abusive man using alcohol can take on the role of victim in that he is alcoholic and therefore the one who is suffering. The focus of attention can therefore shift to him, rather than remaining on those who are being abused in this situation. Where there is heavy drinking the physical and sexual abuse can be very severe and dangerous and very often quite sadistic.

Women living with abusive partners can develop alcohol problems of their own as a consequence of the abuse they are experiencing. This can further exacerbate the abuse, as the abusive male partner can then use this as a way to further control the woman. For example, he may threaten to take the children away from her if she tries to leave or use her alcohol abuse to discredit her, if necessary, should she seek a barring order or whatever. Violent men very often use women's use of alcohol as an excuse for their abuse.

This is turn can make it more difficult for a woman to access help as she can be viewed as the problem by the agencies to which she turns. Women with alcohol problems who experience domestic violence need specific types of interventions. Many women who have alcohol problems, cannot access domestic violence services, as these do not have the resources or expertise to respond. There is no alcohol allowed in any of the refuges in Ireland and they are often reluctant to admit women with drink problems due to concerns for the welfare of other women. Behaviour of such women can, perhaps, be chaotic and disruptive and their support needs can be a high drain on resources.

A study done in 2003 showed that a total of 1,113, equivalent to two out of every five women and their children who sought protection were not accommodated in the 15 refuges surveyed. Of those, one in five women seeking accommodation was refused for reasons other than the refuge being full. No breakdown of the figures is available, but obviously alcohol was a factor.

Our experience in Women's Aid indicates that women who are social drinkers can be told by abusive partners that they have a drink problem and are made to feel guilty. Some women accessing services need to be reassured that the amount they drink is normal and non-problematic. Some women develop a drink problem when living in an abusive relationship. It can be in the abusive partner's interest to keep a woman drinking. We hear stories regularly of men not encouraging or supporting women in their efforts to cease drinking — or a man might continue to buy a woman drink and ensure that there is always drink available in the house.

An abusive man often uses alcohol abuse as a weapon against the woman if she tries to get out of the relationship. Women with drink problems are often reluctant to leave abusive relationships due to guilt, fears about losing the children. They also fear that they will not be believed in court due to their alcohol problems. Often women who use alcohol are treated much worse than men, and this is a pattern we observe. Apart from front line services working with alcohol abuse, agencies tend to be very judgmental and harsher as regards women drinking — especially where a woman has children.

Since 2002 front line services working on this issue have not received any increase in funding, while we have experienced an increase in the level of demand. As a result of this it is very difficult to extend the range of our services or to respond to the specific needs of any group of women such as those who are using alcohol.

Women's Aid strongly supports the recommendations from our sister organisation, Sonas Housing, that:

All women who are out of home due to domestic violence should have access to a safe, secure crisis refuge. A high dependency unit for women with alcohol and drug issues should be established in Dublin and additional resources should be provided to all refuges to enable them to further examine and develop responses to this vulnerable group of women.

I thank the Chairman and members of the committee for their attention, time and interest.

Chairman

That was an excellent presentation and it cut to the chase in some respects. This committee is trying to have alcohol recognised as central to the drug strategy. I am sure Women's Aid will agree that alcohol should be recognised as being as much a part of the drug problem as cocaine or anything else. That naturally leads on to the question of financial support for agencies dealing with these issues.

A couple of matters came to mind as Ms Martin was speaking. She indicated that violence might be experienced regardless of whether a partner has had alcohol. Can a differentiation be made between alcohol and alcoholic in these cases? Does the male in question always have to be alcoholic? It could be that he just has not had enough alcohol and the need for drink has helped create the violent situation. Does one have to be an alcoholic to be an abusive partner? That is straightforward question.

Has Women's Aid experienced any reduction in the age groups involved in domestic violence, given that we hear the number of people seriously abusing alcohol, or the alcoholics of the past, were people in their forties or fifties. Nowadays, it could be people in their late twenties or even younger. Is this being reflected in terms of those who present for help and support? The bottom line is that if there is no alcohol, there will be no domestic violence. Some 27% of those surveyed about abuse indicated that alcohol consumption was always involved.

Ms Martin

Domestic violence, in a way, is almost the most democratic of crimes. I am sure that this could be said of other crimes as well. However, it cuts right across age, social background and geographic locations. It is more obvious when people are at the lower end of the income scale, when they are on the street and trapped in poverty, because such people have to access more public services. People who have an income cushion are often able to address many of their problems in a more private way. In our 30 year experience, we have not seen any change in the pattern of age, class or social and educational background.

Chairman

Drink was always culturally accepted in Ireland. Is there any evidence that it is gaining any greater cultural acceptance among the younger generation? If it is becoming a problem for younger people, the numbers involved will increase. How would we start to tackle the cultural acceptance of domestic violence?

Ms Martin

There are some really interesting examples in Scotland. The Scottish Government launched a very systematic awareness campaign. There was a campaign launched yesterday across the UK backed up by posters, newspaper advertisements, radio and television. The campaign tackled the issues head on. Those advertisements are on the Women's Aid website in the UK. The Scots have systematically identified myths about domestic violence, such as the myth that it happens to women from certain backgrounds, or the myth that it is all about physical abuse and that emotional abuse can be neglected. They have taken those myths and run a set of advertisements about them. They evaluated the campaign and they were very successful. We can send the committee information on that if it is useful.

Chairman

Definitely. There is much in what Ms Martin said that we can use as a starting point, such as how courts and judges see the issue.

Deputy Deenihan

I welcome the three witnesses here this afternoon. This issue has not been discussed to any great extent in the Oireachtas over the years. From that point of view, this discussion today is very welcome. Women's Aid is being given the opportunity today to outline the problems. In this country, we were inclined to leave matters between partners to themselves. Even within the extended family, parents of the people involved hoped they would sort it out themselves. That attitude was very strong in the past. Women are no longer prepared to accept it or accept that form of treatment, which is welcome.

How much penetration does Women's Aid have in Ireland? Are services available in some centres that are not available in other centres? Have all women in all parts of the country access to Women's Aid? Domestic violence against women is not confined to any particular part of the country and maybe women who are in remote parts are even more vulnerable, as they may not have close neighbours to whom they can go for help. The fact that there is a neighbour may be a deterrent. This is an issue for isolated women in rural areas.

It is quite worrying that of the calls received by Women's Aid, two out of every five went unanswered. We have no idea what happened to the women who called but did not receive an answer. That is quite frightening. This is simply because Women's Aid does not have the resources to answer these calls. That is a very serious indictment of the system. Women's Aid is only partially funded and it has to collect the rest of the money through various fund raising initiatives. If this is a voluntary organisation, it must be very difficult to keep going. Women's Aid should be at least 90% funded and the witnesses have raised a big issue here today. Is there any way of following up or recording unanswered calls such as ID callers? It would be interesting if a sample was taken of those calls that went unanswered and if we could find out what happened.

The witnesses played down the role of alcohol in domestic abuse. From the feedback I receive in my clinics from women, most of the time the violence is related to alcohol, although I have not kept any statistics. If drink was taken out of the situation, surely the figure of 27% would decline. Alcohol lifts inhibitions, as they have pointed out. I have met people who have abused women and they are very apologetic the next day. The excuse they often use is that they were under the influence of drink. It is a useful excuse for both partners, or to one partner if it comes up in court. These men can go and get treatment for alcohol problems, but they may have other problems for which they do not receive treatment. However, if people did not consume as much alcohol, the level of domestic violence may be reduced to some extent.

We have had graphic advertisements warning about dangerous driving and the accidents that can occur. Ironically, the numbers of accidents have not gone down. However, there seems to be no major public awareness campaign on the issue of domestic violence, only a few minor ones. The witnesses pointed out that there is a big campaign in Scotland at the moment. More campaigns could get the message home, but that would take financing as well. There should be a Government sponsored campaign on domestic violence here, separate from Women's Aid altogether. Such a campaign could come from this committee and I suggest we write to the Taoiseach to ask the Government to sponsor a campaign raising awareness of domestic violence here. Another useful vehicle is the church. Where there is a congregation the clergy of all denominations should take a proactive approach and preach from the pulpit about the incidence of domestic violence and how it is ruining family life. All the churches support the family unit. They have a role in sending a clear message that this is damaging family structure and creating other problems for the future.

Has Women's Aid examined the social fall-out from households where there is domestic violence? What happens to the children in these cases? Is research available to show that where there is domestic violence, there is a higher level of delinquency or other problems among children, which I am sure is the case?

Chairman

On Deputy Deenihan's point in regard to sending letters, the aim of today's meeting is to try to elicit information on exploring the link between domestic violence and alcohol in order that it can be put into the report and it can make recommendations as to awareness campaigns and similar measures, although I do not want to pre-empt the report.

Deputy O’Shea

I compliment Ms Martin on an excellent presentation. With regard to the comment on judges taking the line that as drink was involved, they can be a bit more lenient, is there a general problem with judges vis a vis women? While I accept that my question is not quite within today’s remit, I ask it advisedly.

Deputy Deenihan

We need more women judges.

Deputy O’Shea

When the Deputy is in power, he can look after that.

With regard to the telephone calls that are not returned, has Women's Aid a priority system to ensure certain calls are responded to but not others because resources and time will not allow it? How many of the calls received are nuisance calls? Are all the calls listed genuine calls, to the best of the witnesses' knowledge?

Is it the case that as women achieve more financial independence, they will tolerate less abusive behaviour, of whatever sort? Can they escape an abusive situation if they can provide a reasonable standard of living for themselves? I could say much more in this regard, because we, as Deputies, have experience of many such cases, but I do not intend to expand on the matter at this time.

In terms of violent partners, one type is the alcoholic or Jekyll and Hyde-type partner. I have experience of cases where when the alcoholism is treated, the problem seems to be resolved. However, with regard to the violent partners who do not need alcohol to be violent or for whom alcohol exacerbates the situation, are treatments available? What is the success rate in weaning people off that kind of behaviour?

Deputy Deenihan referred to the position of children. From my experience, children who are exposed to fairly regular violence, particularly physical violence, can exhibit outbreaks of violent behaviour. They do not understand why they are doing it but they do it nonetheless, and can attack friends and others, sometimes viciously, in a seemingly inexplicable way. Has work been done in this regard? If so, the committee would like to hear about it.

Senator Ó Murchú

I welcome the delegation. I was impressed by the presentation. It is somewhat ironic that the date on the presentation is 14 February, St. Valentine's Day. Some of the sordid details and statistics we have heard are a long way from that concept. We are lucky that groups such as Women's Aid exist to lift the veil on what is happening behind closed doors. As can be seen from the statistics, most abuse takes place within the home rather than on the street.

Some of the statistics are important. If I read it correctly, the presentation suggests that one in five women are abused, which is horrendous. That statistic alone, which is exceptionally worrying, should make us all more aware and encourage us to ascertain how we can help.

While the statistics might in one way not prove it, the incidence of the involvement of alcohol with abuse within the home might be even higher than the witnesses have demonstrated. On the other hand, we must be careful not to see alcohol as an excuse — it is the opposite, if anything.

The message sent out at times by the courts is very wrong. Has Women's Aid been involved in a proactive way in getting a message across, in a legislative fashion or by trying to influence the judicial system, that the message from the courts is wrong? I have always been amazed that alcohol is put forward as some kind of excuse, including with regard to road accidents. This is not acceptable. When that message goes out, in some way it gets replicated in other cases. Can something be done in this regard or is there some way of legislating in order that alcohol will not be accepted as an excuse?

Alcohol is not an excuse under any circumstances. If somebody has a medical problem that type of behaviour might be understandable but that a person imbibes to a great extent is an act of his or her own volition. It is not acceptable.

I take it the study the witnesses quoted from was a comprehensive and scientific one.

Ms Martin

It was carried out by the ESRI on our behalf.

Senator Ó Murchú

Good. For that reason, we must take its findings as being definitive. We are no longer in the realm of guesswork. To some extent, the people interviewed as part of that study had anonymity and therefore they would have been able to express themselves in a forthright manner.

I was struck by the cases of those who were turned away from a refuge. This was sometimes due to the rules of the house, for example, if the woman involved was under the influence of drink. What happens in these cases? Are the women involved simply turned away from a centre and left to fend for themselves? In this day and age, it would be worrying if that were to happen because such women could be victims of worse crimes. They are very vulnerable when outside and in a drunken state.

When a woman is turned away from a centre, is there a follow-up process? Is somebody notified that a woman presented herself at a given centre on a certain night and that the centre was not able to take care of her? I presume there is some type of follow-up with the Garda. It is worrying that there are instances where a person presenting as a victim of a crime and seeking protection cannot get that protection. Somebody must take responsibility for having been notified of this.

How does the delegation view the recent court decision in a case of rape within marriage? This is an important milestone in terms of correcting certain situations. The precedent is now established within the court and it is also important in sending out a message to victims and perpetrators. Can this decision be exploited to bring about further reform? This is an issue that must be examined seriously. In many cases, a person will be reluctant to make a complaint against a partner and, of those who do, many will subsequently withdraw it.

From its experience, has Women's Aid found economic issues ever play a part in bringing a relationship to this particular stage? No more than is the case with alcohol, I do not put this question with the intention of suggesting any excuse for violence but merely to discover statistics. Has the transient nature of partnerships any bearing on the incidence of domestic violence in so far as people's sense of responsibility may not be the same as it was in the past? We are a changed society and there may be less stability in relationships generally. However, perhaps that stability may have disguised some of these issues in the past. Does Women's Aid have a view in this regard?

Given the good work Women's Aid is doing as a voluntary organisation, I assume it needs extra resources at all stages. In addition, we must also consider the question of legislation. Given that we did not tend to act on these types of abuses in the past, to some extent legislation was not to the forefront in finding a solution. Ms Martin made the point that a judge will often not even make an order, which means there is no legal protection for the victim. The judge may send the defendant for treatment, for example, but this does not provide protection for the victim in the home. Judges only interpret and implement legislation. Therefore, it may be a matter of examining the legislation. It should not be a matter of the judge making a decision based on some type of character reference. Does Women's Aid believe fundamental legislative changes are required?

I compliment the delegates on their work and their presentation. There will always be sensationalist headlines about a particular case but we have now been provided with stark statistics and are aware of the inadequacies in this area. I hope alcohol will be put in the same category as drugs because there is absolutely no difference between them in terms of the possible consequences arising from the abuse of either.

Deputy Wall

I congratulate the delegates on the work they have done and in putting their case to the committee. I am struck by two issues in reading the submission. First is the fact that in 2004, 40% of calls to Women's Aid went unanswered. Are there any fresher figures in this regard? Second is the issue raised by Senator Ó Murchú, that people were turned away from the centre. There must be many lonely people suffering abuse in their homes who have been unable to get help.

We are informed that Women's Aid must raise 50% of its funding itself. What is the total funding required even to provide an emergency helpline service adequate to ensure all calls are answered? This is something that must be addressed, whether the funding comes from the health system, local authorities, the Exchequer or some other source. This is one issue we must set down as an agenda today. There should never be a situation where a person suffering abuse has nobody to whom to turn. Unfortunately, despite the wonderful work Women's Aid is doing, 40% of those seeking help, many of whom may have young children, have no recourse. This is an indictment of our society.

What can we say today that will put forward the delegates' case for addressing these matters? It is not the fault of Women's Aid that calls are unanswered; the system has failed in addressing this problem. How can we ensure nobody is turned away from hostels and refuges? There is a wonderful hostel in Athy and the woman who runs it is superb to deal with. I am not aware of anybody being turned away from that facility but it is generally full. Ms Bernie Geoghan is to be congratulated for her efforts in this area. If women seeking refuge are turned away, we create a society that is friendless for those most in need at the time in their lives when they are in greatest need of support.

Senator Daly

I join my colleagues in welcoming the delegates and thanking them for the work they have done for the last 30 years or more. I take the opportunity to thank Clare Haven House in Ennis for the services it provides. Will the delegation outline how Women's Aid is organised regionally? Is it in the main a city-orientated service? The delegates are aware there are many problems in rural areas also. Victims there find it more difficult to access support and assistance. How does Women's Aid reach out to victims in rural areas, especially isolated areas in the west where there are the same problems one encounters in the cities?

In view of the research it has done, what two or three elements of legislation does Women's Aid consider to be of priority? What are the areas in which legislation is required and in which there is none currently? Do the delegates believe that in some respects financial support is more important than legislative support? In my experience, it has been extremely difficult to maintain some of the refuges because of the absence of the necessary finances.

In the main, this report deals with alcohol. I would like to follow up on a point touched on by Senator Ó Murchú regarding issues apart from alcohol, such as multiplicity of partners which is now common, the breakdown of what were regarded as traditional family units, depression, jealousy or affairs. How do the delegates see such issues evolving? There is a need to examine them more deeply than has been the case up to now, in order to assess how problems arise, especially when a person has a multiplicity of partners, and to develop methods of avoiding some of those problems now and in the future.

In general, I compliment Women's Aid on the work it has done and wish it well. The joint committee members will help in any way possible.

Chairman

Before returning to the witnesses, I must ask one question, as the men present are obviously too shy to do so. We are familiar with the stylised image of the man who drinks, who beats the woman and who becomes dependent on alcohol. Is there much evidence of the reverse, namely, where domestic violence occurs the other way around — with the same role for alcohol or otherwise — and men are abused? I could not let that question go. In cases where abuse takes psychological or sexual forms, rather than physical, are people believed?

The witnesses have a range of questions to answer. They may do so in any order they wish.

Ms Martin

I will give this my best shot, although I may ask my colleagues to contribute at various points.

I will start with the first set of questions. Women's Aid has a national role in two respects. First, it has a national freefone telephone line and our statistics show that while approximately half of the calls received are from the greater Dublin area, half are from the rest of the country. We receive calls from women in isolated rural areas. Such women use a helpline like ours because there are few other support services available to them. The services which we provide such as the one-to-one services and the court accompaniment services tend to be available in the greater Dublin area where we have a series of outreach centres. The National Network of Women's Refuges and Support Services has 38 members around the country. Many have established independent services. If the joint committee wishes, I can submit to it a link to the network's website which will provide a map indicating where services are located.

I apologise if I gave the impression that we tried to play down the role of alcohol. Our concern is that alcohol is sometimes seen as being an excuse for violence, rather than a factor which escalates its severity and frequency. However, we acknowledge that strong links exist. We believe that the work of this joint committee, or any measure which will tackle the level of alcohol abuse, will certainly have an effect on the impact on women who experience abuse, in terms of injury levels, frequency etc.

Several members raised the issue of the number of calls we miss. Approximately half our calls come from first-time callers, while the other half are from women who have used our services and the helpline in the past. We have no way of knowing the identity of those callers, because we must offer a confidential service. This point is absolutely critical for women who use it, and consequently we are unable to find out who called and decided to ring back.

We have three lines and a message service. While we have a good cohort of volunteers and extremely committed staff, we have a difficulty with the level of coverage. As we are quite strapped for resources, we even find it difficult to staff two lines at any given time. Sometimes, only one person mans the helpline. This is a resource issue and as more women become involved in the paid workforce, fewer women are available to volunteer during the day. An analysis of our statistics has demonstrated that the biggest gap in coverage occurs during the day and we need additional paid staff to cover it.

Communications is a major issue. The joint committee members may have seen the advertising campaign almost one year ago which featured a doll's house. It was taken from a Scottish advertising campaign and was run jointly by RTE and UTV. It focused on the impact of domestic violence on children and ran over three weeks. We saw a major escalation in the number of calls to our helpline at that point. However, soon after the advertising stopped, the number of calls dropped. When women know that a service is available, they will use it and consequently advertising is extremely important, both in terms of public education and of highlighting the service's availability, when needed.

As for the question regarding research conducted on the social fall-out of domestic violence, children experience an enormous range of problems in this regard. Perhaps my colleagues will wish to add to this. It is important to state that while children can be brought up in a house where domestic abuse occurs, it does not necessarily mean they will become abusers or will be abused themselves. It can mean they will not become abusive, despite having been affected by such behaviour in the past. We receive strong support from people who lived in abusive homes and who make it clear that they witnessed the damage caused. However, children face a range of problems. Often, they state that they do not want to go to school because they are worried about their mothers. Such children are anxious, fret, do not sleep or do not do their homework. Conversely, some children feel safe in school and can perform really well in school. Hence, one has a spectrum of experience.

Ms Harrison

I agree with Ms Martin's comments. At the very least, living with domestic violence is emotionally abusive to children. There is also quite a correlation with a considerably higher risk of child abuse. Barnardo's has done some research in this regard and estimates that in 40% to 70% of cases, children are also directly physically abused and there is a high likelihood of sexual abuse. At the very least, it is emotionally abusive to children.

Ms Martin

The research I cited earlier included a piece which examined the impact on children. A total of 64% of children were actually in the room or in an adjoining room when abuse took place. Hence, they are aware of it. Sometimes people think that although children are present in the house, they do not know about it. I hope this has answered Deputy Deenihan's questions.

Judges are a problem. Women who try to access legal protection face enormous difficulties. Even when they succeed, difficulties frequently arise, as the pressure placed on the family law courts by their caseloads is an issue of concern. The probation and welfare service used to provide a strong support to judges. It provided information and, crucially, risk assessments, especially when it came to contentious and difficult issues such as access, whether it should be granted and whether it should be supervised or otherwise. We produced a report on this subject and strongly support the reintroduction of the provision of support to judges by the probation and welfare services, as such information is absolutely crucial to them.

When a woman is financially independent, it greatly enhances her options. We continually work towards women having more choices. This does not always mean that such a woman will leave, or that women who are independent are unaffected by this issue. However, it means that if a woman does decide to leave, she is likely to be able to survive and to be less affected by the financial consequences. Some women who use our services actually speak about how they hope, in X number of years, to return to education and to secure paid employment. They have a plan as to what they intend to do within a certain timescale.

On the question of violent partners, we strongly feel that while there is legislation, the level of convictions for men who offend, particularly men who breach barring orders, is extremely low. While I cannot remember the figure offhand — perhaps Ms Sweeney can — it is certainly less than 10%. Strong messages are not being broadcast and a strong sanction does not exist.

While domestic violence is a crime, it is not often recognised as such, which is very significant. The National Domestic Violence Intervention Agency, NDVIA, is modelled on very effective international practice where multi-agency approaches work very well. In this model, the Garda, the probation and welfare service, the health services and the courts services are all brought together.

This model has been applied in Cardiff in the UK and has been very successful in increasing women's safety and attempting to bring about a more joined-up system in terms of the data recorded and the way in which women are treated. If a woman in Cardiff is in extreme danger, a multi-agency risk assessment is used on a weekly basis. If a woman is living with a very violent and abusive partner, she is "marked" as being particularly vulnerable, along with five other women in her area. The resources of the different agencies are then concentrated on protecting these women. This can range from engaging the services of locksmiths to protect women's houses if they have barring orders, to additional police protection and relocating the women to other areas. These approaches are very effective and we strongly support any measure which would encourage their use. I am aware that an evaluation of the NDVIA is being carried out. While the NDVIA is a pilot project, we hope it will secure further funding on an ongoing basis.

The figures we discussed came from research carried out by the ESRI and are very much in line with international figures. As I understand that the European figures are approximately one in four, we are certainly not out of step with Europe or the US. It is a very worrying statistic. My daughter was in school when I first learnt about it. Of a group of 25 girls in school, five of them will be affected by domestic violence in their lifetime, which is a very sobering thought. It is an area of deep concern to us which we wish to highlight continually.

The NDVIA is working its way through each agency. One of the difficulties in Ireland is that there is no judicial studies programme, as there are in other jurisdictions. Irish judges rightly have a deep attachment to their independence. However, this independence can be problematic when it comes to trying to inform people about the dynamics of domestic violence. While we are able to work with other professionals in the area, we have never had access to judges who are dealing with a very complex situation, often in very tight time constraints.

The issue of refuges is deeply worrying. It is extremely dangerous if a woman cannot find accommodation in a refuge as she is often fleeing for her life or safety or that of her children. If she is turned away from a refuge, she will be offered bed-and-breakfast or homeless accommodation. However, this accommodation does not offer her protection. Refuges frequently have physical protections and a woman needs these protections if she is to feel safe. Women who are offered alternative options will frequently chose not to take them and return home because they believe it is their best option. This frequently leads to these women being punished for leaving home in the first place and taunted, which will make it more difficult for them to leave again.

Chairman

There is an upcoming vote in the Dáil but I would opt to continue the meeting if a member from the Opposition would pair with me. Bar that, everyone else can choose what to do. I am satisfied if someone is happy to stay on because I would like to conclude the meeting. Members of the committee will pair informally to allow the committee to continue.

Ms Martin

Unfortunately, there are no follow-up services for women turned away from refuges. As Senator Ó Murchú noted, this compounds these women's isolation and sense of despair and helplessness, which is extremely worrying.

With regard to the recent decision in a case involving marital rape, the legislation introduced 15 or 16 years ago was very important. It has taken this length of time for one case of marital rape, which had to be retried, to be expedited. This in itself illustrates how difficult it is to prosecute marital rape and that women need considerable support. While the decision in that case was an important landmark, it took the woman involved eight and a half years to secure a conviction, while her husband received a six-year sentence. This does not look like justice to many women. While it is important that the decision occurred, it is not necessarily sufficient encouragement for women to go to the police and pursue their cases.

Rape by a spouse or partner is frequently further down the list of matters to which a women must attend. If she is fleeing for her life and worried about the abuse of herself and her children, she might think of dealing with many of these issues sometime in the future but does not want to attend to them at the moment. We find that there is a low level of disclosure to the national helpline. The level of disclosure increases when the woman is dealing with services because there is an ongoing relationship. Women are more likely to disclose rape by a spouse or partner when they get to know someone. It is a difficult matter to disclose because it is an intimate and very disturbing matter. While we know from, for example, the Sexual Abuse and Violence in Ireland report, that statistics of rape by a spouse or partner are much higher, it is not being revealed even to us. If it is difficult for women to discuss it with an organisation like Women's Aid, which was established to support women, it is much more difficult to talk about it to the Garda, who have so many other matters to attend to.

The 40% of calls which are unanswered is an ongoing worry. Statistics for 2005 are not yet available but we are witnessing an increase in calls but no increase in the amount of calls we are not getting to. It was extremely difficult to get coverage over Christmas due to illness, holidays and the times when volunteers are trained. We were stretched very thinly. Therefore, it is possible that there will be an increase in the number of unanswered calls. The additional coverage we need for our helpline would necessitate two additional support workers who would each work 20 hours per week. We also use panel workers who work additional shifts of approximately four hours each. This amounts to approximately €70,000 on an annual basis.

Women's Aid is not the only organisation which deals with this issue. We work with other organisations in the coalition, which recently discussed the under-funding of the sector with the Tánaiste and Minister for Health and Children. The sector is seeking an increase in funding of approximately €7 million so that we can at least go back to supplying the level of services supplied in 2002. We are trying as hard as we can to maintain the level of services but our level of resources is shrinking and the level of demand is increasing, which is an impossible situation. Deputy Deenihan is correct in stating that the system is failing.

We have considerable respect for Clare Haven House which, like so many other organisations, carries out amazing work. Women in rural areas face considerable difficulties. Living in small, close-knit, dependent communities can make it very difficult to access support. The local Garda station may not be available to them when they need it. While the garda may be very supportive, he may, for example, be the coach of the local team on which the husband is playing. The interconnections between people can be seen more easily, which makes it more difficult to approach the Garda. We feel for these women who do not have the anonymity of women in a large urban area of city. Services such as our freefone helpline are vital. A woman should at least be able to talk to someone about this issue, develop a safety plan and examine her legal options. She should have this type of support and information.

We have not encountered much in respect of the multiplicity of partners. We are sometimes aware that when a woman leaves an abusive partner, she knows he will go on to abuse another woman. That is the side of the matter we see.

Ms Harrison

Statistically, when a woman is married it increases the risk. Perhaps what is seen as a secure relationship is more risky. A pregnancy can be a time of very high risk for women also.

Ms Martin

That a woman's level of abuse would increase at this point is a matter of concern. While it shocks most people, as one imagines people would be more protective of a woman who is pregnant, it is a serious concern. We are trying to advance the issue.

Chairman

Has any research been done on the causes? Do they not want a child, something that takes attention away from them?

Ms Martin

I do not know of any research. Ms Sweeney might know of some off-hand. Women often tell us they are physically abused when they breastfeed. Attention is an issue in that it is being switched from his needs to the baby's. The woman is not available to listen or attend to him. When a woman becomes pregnant, people are very attentive to her and the wider community's attention can shift from him onto her. As the woman becomes pregnant and has children, she becomes embedded in the relationship and more vulnerable. Men will sometimes exploit this.

We are often asked whether there are women who abuse men. There are, but if one examines the international statistics, the figure is less than 10%. The majority of people who are abused are women and the majority of people who abuse are men. We do not wish the situation to be that way and we know that the majority of men are not abusers but, while people may like the situation to break down equally in gender terms, this is not the case. I apologise if I did not answer someone's question.

Deputy Wall

Must our guests generate funds for the freefone helpline or does Eircom give them the line out of generosity?

Ms Martin

Eircom does not give us the freefone line. Previously, we were able to guarantee a woman who phoned us that her call would not show on her telephone bill because it was a freefone line. However, with the increase in the number of telephone service providers, this is no longer the case. While there is not a charge, women's partners sometimes examine the bills and see that Women's Aid was called, thereby exposing the women and raising the issue of their safety.

It would be useful were the joint committee to provide us with information or act on our behalf to guarantee confidentiality. While we have tried to address this matter, we have not been able to do so. I was jealous when, at a recent conference in Scotland, someone was able to guarantee confidentiality in that the calls do not show on any telephone bills. This was the case in Ireland until approximately five years ago. It is a concern for many women.

Senator Daly

Are there any glaring gaps in legislation?

Ms Sweeney

We are campaigning on the issue of legislation. This year marks ten years of the Domestic Violence Act 1996, the legislation allowing for orders to be made in the family law courts. In this context we have been campaigning on the matter of cohabitees. Strict criteria are in operation if someone who is not married wants to get a barring or safety order. One cannot get such orders if one has a child in common with someone to whom one is not married or living with. Research indicates violence often continues post-separation.

The significant inconsistencies in how different family law courts operate concerns us. The 1996 Act provides no guidelines on the minimum level of evidence for a barring order. One is statistically more likely to get an order in one part of the country than elsewhere. This should not be the case as domestic violence is spread equally throughout the country. We have been lobbying for training for everyone involved in the family law system, such as court clerks, the Judiciary and solicitors. Many other groups have joined with us in this campaign but we have not been successful.

Ms Martin referred to the probation and welfare service. The family law courts are very overstretched. They are placed in the position of making decisions without perpetrator risk assessments. A key issue is the courts'in camera role. Due to the way in which the family law courts operate, very little information is available on how decisions are made. For example, we are unable to determine how many of the 3,500 applications for barring orders in 2004 were made by women or men. We need to know the grounds on which decisions are being made in the family law courts.

We carried out research in 1999, which found that between 1% and 6% of perpetrators of domestic violence received prison sentences. These were men already criminalised in the justice system. This is a significant issue, particularly in terms of cultural acceptance. If people are not seen to be sanctioned for their crimes, they will continue abusing.

The Courts Service and the level of resources available to it is also of concern. One can wait for as long as three months for a barring order hearing in Dolphin House in Dublin. The Legal Aid Board has improved its waiting time, lowering it to four months, but this is still a long time to wait in circumstances of domestic violence.

Chairman

The committee appreciates that——

Deputy Wall

I have one more question. Our guests must raise 50% of the income for Women's Aid. Does fundraising take place throughout the year or on one or two specific occasions? Does it take up time that could be used to better effect?

Ms Martin

It takes place the whole year around. It is a constant headache.

Chairman

In our clinics members of the committee encounter instances that we believe are the exceptions rather than the rule. When one talks about getting a locksmith to change locks to protect a woman, who is getting locked out or in?

The message today is clear, that domestic violence must be recognised as a crime. The statistics back this up. Given that one in five women are being abused and 71% state alcohol is involved at some point, alcohol must be recognised as a problem. Another interesting statistic is that 40% to 70% of the children of abused women will suffer either emotional or sexual abuse also. The numbers involved are serious for a small country. We recognise the issue of calls going unanswered. We prepared a report on volunteerism recently, which is available on our website, and it was clear that it has become more difficult to attract people.

The issue of people being turned away from refuges is important and I hope the information we collate, with the assistance of Women's Aid, will advance the case. I am aware of the Inishowen Women's Outreach refuge and the Donegal Women's Refuge Group. Are people satisfied with anonymous telephone calls and can one be anonymous in small areas? The practical question of maintaining anonymity is most important. I hope the delegation has found the discussion useful; I know the committee has. The committee would appreciate the continuing support of Women's Aid on issues of interest as we seek to produce a report that is embracing. Go raibh maith agaibh.

The joint committee adjourned at 5.45 p.m. until 4.15 p.m. on Wednesday, 1 March 2006.