Members will recall that the joint committee met representatives of a number of organisations on 25 May last and discussed housing and homelessness. Subsequently, it was agreed we should meet the Minister of State at the Department of the Environment, Heritage and Local Government, Deputy Noel Ahern. On behalf of the joint committee, I welcome the Minister of State and his officials. We will hear from the Minister of State before taking questions from members of the joint committee.
Housing and Homelessness: Ministerial Presentation.
I am pleased to address the joint committee on housing. I will cover homelessness in some detail, having noted the committee's special interest in the issue. Housing is a major priority for the Government. We will spend some €1.888 billion this year on social and affordable housing programmes. This is an indication of the importance of these programmes in addressing the range of housing needs in the country. Housing was identified for special attention in the partnership agreement Sustaining Progress and the Government's response and commitment of public resources is an indication of its importance.
I will return to social and affordable housing programmes which are implemented within the context of the wider housing market and level of housing need that arises. This need, in turn, is based on a variety of economic and social factors. Our overall response must be judged on the basis on these factors and the wider market. I am sure committee members all know well about the exceptional performance of the housing market in recent years.
Sitting suspended at 11.50 a.m. and resumed at 12.10 p.m.
Members will know of the exceptional performance of the housing construction industry in recent years and its record levels of output. Last year was the ninth record year for house completions, with 68,819 units completed, an increase in output of over 19% on the previous year. In the Dublin area, the increase was approximately 10.5% which is extraordinary, especially given the position in 1993 when approximately 22,000 houses were built. It is a huge jump from this figure to approximately 68,000.
The high levels of output should not result in complacency as regards the different needs in our society. Affordability remains a major concern. However, a number of market commentators, including the Central Bank, are now predicting greater balance in the housing market over the next few years as increased supply has a dampening effect on house prices. Affordability has also been assisted by a range of factors, including high levels of economic growth, which have facilitated lower tax levels, mortgage interest rates and inflation and increased disposable income and employment. Given the Central Bank's recent statements about lending in the housing market, it will be necessary to keep the situation under close observation.
On social and affordable housing, while the housing market has performed well in regard to delivery of a high level of output, large numbers of Irish people remain dependent on some assistance to meet their long-term housing needs. It is important programmes are in place. This year's budget in the Department for housing is over €1.8 billion, an increase of 5.4% on last year, well ahead of inflation. We are continuing to devote very significant public resources to this area. The social and affordable housing programmes seek to ensure a response to the full range of housing needs, from those who find themselves homeless to those who can meet their own needs or buy their own home with a small amount of assistance from the State.
I have asked local authorities to put in place five year action plans covering the full range of their housing programmes. These plans, to be agreed with the Department, will ensure a fully strategic approach is taken by local authorities and will ensure that they avail of the certainty provided by multi-annual expenditure programmes.
Government interventions have boosted the supply of affordable housing under targeted schemes for low and middle income purchasers. Between them, the local authority shared ownership scheme and the 1999 affordable housing scheme benefited over 2,500 households in 2003. Both schemes continue to form a key part of the Government's approach to addressing the increasing need for social and affordable housing. The increases to the income eligibility and loan limits, which I announced yesterday, are intended to improve affordability for potential applicants under both schemes.
I anticipate that the numbers benefiting from affordable housing will further increase this year and into the future as more affordable housing comes on stream as a result of agreements under Part V of the Planning and Development Act 2000 and measures under Sustaining Progress. The two Government announcements in July and December 2003 on the release of State and local authority lands in a number of counties, taken with yesterday's announcement on the further release of State and local authority lands to the initiative, are critical steps in reaching the target. Sites have been identified under Part V of the Act for just under 8,900 units of the promised 10,000.
Homelessness was discussed at this committee some weeks ago. The presentations made on that occasion by representatives of the voluntary sector and the Homeless Agency highlighted a number of important issues which must be addressed if we are to maintain progress in tackling homelessness. However, we must not overlook the progress that has been made to date. The introduction and implementation of the homeless strategies have had a significant effect in tackling the emergency aspects of homelessness and it is generally accepted that there is now sufficient emergency accommodation available for those who wish to access it. The ongoing cost of running these facilities has been significant. Including this year's allocation of €51 million, the Government has provided over €190 million in accommodation related expenditure since 2000. In addition to funding by the Department, there has been substantial expenditure on care related aspects by the health boards and the Department of Health and Children.
We need to move away from the provision of emergency facilities towards moving people away from homelessness and providing them with permanent accommodation. The challenge is not just to provide homeless clients with more appropriate long-term accommodation but with the support they need to sustain the tenancy of this accommodation. The establishment of the housing access unit, run by Threshold on behalf of the Homeless Agency, which is funded by the Department, and the financial provision in the agency's budget for the appointment of dedicated tenancy sustainment staff are positive developments. Continuing attention to the non-accommodation needs of homeless persons is also vital — the health, mental health and education aspects must all be addressed, as must the needs of persons leaving prison and young people leaving care. The need for co-ordinated responses is clear. To ultimately address the issue of homelessness, all agencies must work together to tackle the problems which affect our homeless population.
A number of recent initiatives will help: the introduction of the LINK data system will enable us to obtain more accurate information on homeless persons and, by identifying their needs, enable us to provide more focused and effective responses; local authorities will have to take specific heed of the housing needs of homeless persons in the five year action plans which I have requested; the proposed new approach to long-term rental housing assistance involving public private partnership-type arrangements may also have potential in this area; and the review of the operation of the homeless strategies, to commence shortly, will give all concerned a chance to air their views on not only the current situation but, more importantly, on what concrete steps we can take to make further progress in tackling this issue. Addressing homelessness is an ongoing priority and I am confident that, with the combined and co-operative efforts of the statutory and voluntary sectors, we can succeed.
The Government is also committed to continuing to modernise and develop the private rented sector, particularly on the basis of the recommendations of the commission report on the sector in 2000. Fiscal reforms had already been implemented in the Finance Acts 2001 and 2002 and the remaining recommendations are being implemented by the Residential Tenancies Bill which completed its passage through the Seanad last week and, hopefully, will be signed into law next week. This will allow the establishment of the Private Residential Tenancies Board on a statutory basis as well as introduce reforms relating to security of tenure, registration of tenancies, termination notice periods, rent setting and reviews and dispute resolution.
The private rented sector has a key role to play in meeting housing need alongside home ownership and social housing. The new situation will help it to fulfil this role more effectively, making the sector more attractive to landlords and tenants and, I hope, promoting increased long-term investment and professionalism.
We have also announced a new initiative, in conjunction with the Department of Social and Family Affairs, to meet long-term housing needs of rent supplement recipients whereby local authorities will progressively assume responsibility over three years for accommodating rent supplement recipients of 18 months continuous duration who have been assessed as having long-term housing needs. Currently, the private rented sector helps to meet a significant volume of social housing need through the rent supplement scheme. Under the new arrangements we will continue to make use of the private rented sector but in a more structured and effective way. Long-term housing solutions will be provided for people with long-term housing needs and long-term dependence on ad hoc subsidy payments to tenants will be reduced. Local authorities will meet long-term housing needs through both social housing and private rented accommodation, involving a variety of arrangements. These could include specifically built premises and existing supplementary welfare allowance rented properties, as well as new developments under public private partnership type arrangements. Funding will be provided for local authorities to support the cost of the new accommodation based scheme through the redirection of resources from the rent supplement scheme. This funding is in addition to funding already being provided under the local authority housing programmes.
In overall terms, I am confident the new arrangements will provide an additional positive response to housing needs and give a better outcome to tenants, taxpayers, accommodation providers and the housing market generally. I assure the committee that we will continue to work to ensure our housing programmes are effective in meeting needs and that the substantial resources that have been made available are spent in a manner which contributes effectively to breaking cycles of poverty and social exclusion.
That is just a summary of the main points under the housing brief in the Department. There are lots of other smaller programmes, and if committee members wish to ask questions on any issue I will try to answer them as best I can.
I thank the Minister of State for attending. There may be a temptation to compartmentalise homelessness. The homelessness problem is quantified at about 5,500, a figure which is questioned and contested by some of the organisations which deal directly with homelessness.
Since 1997, a year the Government often quotes in replies to questions, house prices have trebled and local authority waiting lists have doubled. No amount of massaging of figures within the local authority areas can mask the fact that there are over 100,000 people on local authority waiting lists. All of these areas are interlinked. The difficulties in the private sector have a knock-on effect with the local authorities, which is reflected in the doubling of the numbers on waiting lists.
The Minister of State is right in saying supply and demand is one of the key principles. Supply is approaching demand, and he is hoping, rather than stating, that things will level out in regard to prices in the near future. Every sector is interlinked, and the homelessness figures are ultimately a fall-out from policy failures in other areas. I do not wish do simplify the problem of homelessness, but if we do not supply houses we will have homeless people. That is putting aside health issues, delivery of psychiatric services in communities and so on.
In regard to supply and demand, we were promised in 2003 that we would be supplied with the report on hoarding of land in the Dublin area that was carried out by consultants appointed by the Minister of State. They reported in December 2003. Why is that report being suppressed? Why are we not getting the facts on the hoarding of land in the Dublin area? Why has it been supplied to NESC but not to Members of this House in order that we can assess whether there is a problem of hoarding of land in Dublin and other areas? The consultants looked specifically at Dublin. Will that report now be supplied in the Oireachtas Library and to members of this committee in order that we can assess whether there is an artificial market, especially in the Dublin area where price increases have been moredramatic than anywhere else?
Yesterday I was shocked to hear a statement that under Sustaining Progress more land would be made available for affordable housing. Two years ago, under Sustaining Progress, the Government promised 10,000 houses. How many have been built? The last time I asked that question some months ago not one had been built. Not one consultant or architect had been appointed to even build one house. How many have been delivered now?
I am not talking about Part V of the Planning and Development Act 2000. These were extra houses promised under Sustaining Progress. I found it incredible yesterday that Sustaining Progress is being reviewed. Again, to borrow a phrase used in Cork, fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me. The social partners are being fooled again into the promises of 1,000 houses, as if it were a further 1,000 houses. Where are the 10,000 houses promised under Sustaining Progress?
The Minister of State talks somewhere in his submission about 8,800 houses. These houses are under Part V of the 2000 Act on affordable housing, but the houses promised under Sustaining Progress were in addition to the ones that would normally be built. Where are those houses? When will we see them?
I read about the new rental accommodation arrangements in the newspaper but we have not received any information from the Minister of State on it. The information provided in today's submission is so vague as to be meaningless. Is this new arrangement really designed to replace the social welfare supplementary rent allowance scheme? The bottom line is what extra resources will be made available to deal with people in emergency situations who cannot house themselves and are potentially homeless.
What extra resources will be provided? Will it just be a transfer of money from social welfare to the Minister of State's Department? If so, is this just an attempt to massage the housing waiting list figure in local authorities? If people are offered rented accommodation under the replacement of the rent supplement scheme it will have the effect of merely taking the 100,000 people off the official lists. Is this a massaging exercise for public consumption? What extra resources are being made available for these new rental accommodation arrangements?
The Deputy talked about house prices trebling. Yes, prices have gone up an awful lot in recent years but one must look at it in the context of a booming economy. I know it can look very frightening when one talks about prices but the more important index is affordability. Look at the situation for a couple buying their home five or ten years ago. What percentage of their take home pay do they spend on their mortgage?
Houses have become less affordable, but only slightly. In fact, houses are more affordable today than they were in 1992. I am sure everybody remembers the general election of 1992. One of the big issues on the doors was interest rates of approximately 17%. The following year we devalued and houses suddenly became more affordable because interest rates dropped. Prices have gone up hugely because of enormous demand. That is why the real solution lies in supply.
If one looks at it from an affordability perspective, due to lower tax rates, higher salaries, historically low interest rates——
That is the only thing saving us.
I go along with that, although it is not the only matter. Taxes are lower and take home pay is higher. The percentage of income that the first-time buyer is now paying on the mortgage is only fractionally over what it has been in recent years. Houses are less affordable, but not to the extent of being doubly or trebly more expensive.
Yes, there are concerns, and it bothers me that the dividend from those historically low interest rates have not been passed on to the buyer. However, one must view the matter in the context of last year's census figures which indicated the population increased by 8% in a six year period. One cannot find another country in the world in which the population increased in this manner. The figures do not just reflect the fact that 8% more babies are being born, but people who emigrated in the 1980s, when the economy was not good are returning home. Such people are in their 30s, an age when they are setting up home. Therefore, there has been enormous demand and pressure.
The housing market is totally integrated from homeless people to those in need of social and affordable housing to those who have plenty of money to buy their own home. One must examine these issues in the context of the huge rise in population. All these people have contributed hugely to the Celtic tiger, although I hate the phrase, but also created huge pressure and demand on housing.
The budget for social housing is €1.8 billion. The waiting lists are higher than they were during the years. The last official figure from the three year assessment was 48,000 families. However, this year some 13,000 families of the 48,000 will have their needs met and a further 13,000 had their needs met last year. I am not saying the list will necessarily fall by 13,000 because we all know that more will join the list. However, a sizeable programme is in place. Some 5,000 local authority houses have been built and 17,000 housing units have been built under the voluntary sector, a figure which is rising all the time.
Supply is the key issue. Although we only have figures for the first three months, the production of houses has shown a slight increase on last year and we hope the final output will be approximately 68,000 or more. If we can keep that level going, we can get ourselves out of problems. When one examines the rental market, in which supply has reached demand, there is no doubt that rents have fallen in the past two years, certainly in Dublin and elsewhere, because there is extra supply. We are finally beginning to see the benefit of increased supply.
The Deputy referred to homelessness and the fallout with which point I agree. At a meeting, someone described homelessness as a safety net. There were 3,700 or 3,800 families comprising approximately 5,500 persons. Many of these are on local authority housing lists. In other words, there are not 5,500 living in hostels. Many are signed on as "homeless" because some are homeless, most are in bed and breakfast accommodation and some are on 50 points or so and come to tell me in my clinic that they are going to register as homeless. This does not mean they are going on the streets, rather they are signing on to bed and breakfast accommodation because they see their chances being on the homeless list as being better than on the housing list. Homelessness ends up being the safety net for every other measure.
The Goodbody report was completed and given to the Department some months ago. The NESC is carrying out a major study into the issue and will not finalise its report until the autumn. At that stage, there will be action from the Government and all the reports — the report of the Oireachtas all-party committee on the Constitution, the Goodbody report and the NESC report — will be published together. The Goodbody report will not be issued until NESC has completed its work. At that stage all the reports will be published and the Government will move forward and take action on the matter.
A total of 10,000 houses were requested by the social partners in Sustaining Progress and the Government committed itself to trying to achieve that response.
It did not say it would try to do it. It was part of the agreement of Sustaining Progress.
It was. Some 10,000 houses were agreed and, up to yesterday, some 8,900 sites have been identified. The houses have not yet been provided or keys handed over. The Deputy has raised this issue before and I have tried to explain to him that, as everyone knows including the Deputy, one cannot just click one's fingers and get houses. It is a slow process.
Have the schemes been designed?
Some of them.
Have they been put out to tender?
No.
We are not being impatient. I am just asking if the architects have been appointed.
I am trying to answer.
Have the schemes been designed?
No.
Has a foundation stone been laid?
I am trying to answer the Deputy. Some 10,000 houses were referred to. Between Part V and the Government land, some 8,900 of the sites have been identified. Construction has started on one site on Finglas Road, which is in my constituency. The St. Bricin's Hospital site is included in the major regeneration of O'Devenney Gardens and has gone out for tender and expressions of interest. We expect to be issuing invitations for expressions of interest on Jamestown Road in Inchicore and Infirmary Road very shortly.
People are still working in the Jamestown Road and Infirmary Road sites from OPW or the Department of Defence, one of whom attended my clinic a few weeks ago wondering when he was moving and where to. As is the case in the construction industry, one identifies sites but it can take a couple of years for a developer before one starts digging a hole in the ground. Nevertheless, construction has started on Finglas Road.
Many sites will not be commenced until next year, although a number may start late in the year, and will be ready in 2006. As the Deputy stated, we are referring to 10,000 affordable homes, for which 8,900 sites have been identified, and the remainder of which will be identified too. That includes yesterday's 2,500 sites in south Dublin and Kildare at Backweston and Athenry in east Galway. Those sites bring the overall figure to 8,900.
The new rental arrangement was issued last week. It is a joint Department of Social and Family Affairs and Department of the Environment, Heritage and Local Government initiative. The committee would have received paperwork on it last week. We have been examining this issue for years. When I was a member of a local authority ten years ago, there was a report on rent allowance which started 20 years ago. I remember debates when we were spending £8 million per annum on rent allowance and people wondered whether we should be doing so. We are now spending €330 million per annum on rent allowance, which is necessary as a short-term measure, but it was decided last week that the Department of Social and Family Affairs would continue to look after short-term housing needs in the way it has been. People who have been in receipt of rent allowance for up to 18 months will still be looked after by the Department of Social and Family Affairs but if a person has long-term housing needs, for instance, if one is in receipt of rent allowance for more than 18 months, he or she becomes the responsibility of the local authority system. That will happen over a couple of years. We have picked six or seven local authorities to start the system now and six or seven more will begin before Christmas. That is a big job. Some people may move into local authority accommodation while some will stay in the accommodation they are in. We hope the system will act as a catalyst to start a PPP-type arrangement. In many cases, people who have been in receipt of rent allowance for 18 months will no longer receive their cheque in the clinic. Instead, the local authority will make a long-term deal with the landlord, whether it is in respect of an individual house or a house of bedsits. Initially some will be in the same accommodation. It is refocusing. There is no new money involved as the local authorities take over the task of looking after those who have been more than 18 months in the rental sector.
It will drive the rental sector mad. It is an artificial intervention in the private sector.
No, the timing is correct. If this was launched two years ago it might have driven the rental sector mad. If a landlord had put an advertisement in the evening newspaper, shortly after there would have been 20 people standing on his doorstep. There is currently surplus capacity in the rental market. Landlords are not filling their accommodation as quickly as they did a few years ago.
The Minister of State is bailing out the rich guys who invested and now havevacant accommodation.
Clients are becoming more choosy and we believe local authorities will be in a better position to make——
They are friends.
(Interruptions).
Please allow the Minister of State to finish.
They are not my friends. We can make good long-term arrangements and good deals, which we could not have done two years ago, because there is a capacity in the market for rental accommodation.
Will the local authority select the tenants?
Many of the tenants are already receiving rent allowance.
: What about new people?
: New people will always be the responsibility of the Department of Social and Family Affairs. Only after 18 months on the rent allowance scheme will they become the responsibility of the local authority.
The Deputy referred to massaging figures. We are not massaging figures.
The Minister of State admitted there are no extra resources.
Not under that heading. We are transferring the money from the €332 million for people on the long-term list. Long-term accommodation should not be the responsibility of the Department of Social and Family Affairs. The local authorities are responsible for looking after long-term housing needs. The extra €1.88 billion comes under the general programme. It has increased by 400% in the past six or seven years, which is huge.
The Minister of State did not answer the question on suppressing the documents relating to land hoarding.
The Goodbody report is not suppressed. It will be published when NESC reports.
The Minister of State gave it to them before giving it to us.
The Minister of State promised it in December. The committee should demand to see the report in order that we can judge for ourselves. There is no point talking in a vacuum about supply and demand when the Minister of State is suppressing a report which has information on supply and demand in regard to hoarding of land.
To clarify, was the report promised to Deputies?
Either the Minister, Deputy Cullen, or I said a year ago that when the report is finalised it will be published. I do not think we said when this would happen.
It was the end of 2003.
Since then three things have happened. There is the all-party committee report on the Constitution, which is finished. There was the Goodbody report commissioned by my Department, which is finished, and the Department of the Taoiseach and NESC are carrying out an overall study. Government thinking currently is that the Goodbody report will be published, but not until NESC has reported. The three reports are related, therefore, to release one at this point would not give the full answer. The Oireachtas report is already in the public domain. The other two reports will be published at the same time and everyone can move forward from there. It would not be appropriate to publish one report at this stage.
In regard to the Dublin area, there are eight years supply of zoned serviced land.
It is being drip-fed.
It is being hoarded for friends.
I would not know them if they came in the door.
The Minister of State will not release the report.
(Interruptions).
Why do we have the all-party Oireachtas committee report on the constitutionality of land ownership? Given that this report was published, why will the Minister of State not publish the report on land hoarding? What is being hidden?
Nothing.
How can the committee deal with these issues if the information is not made available to us? I am asking, and I hope the committee will ask, that the report be made available to the committee. Otherwise we are hampered in considering this issue.
Arising from what the Minister of State said about lower taxation, how could he make such a statement in regard to housing when 45% of the price of each house purchased goes in tax. Since he became Minister of State, stamp duty and VAT on housing has increased, developmentlevies have been imposed on new houses and the first-time buyer's grant has been removed. This is why affordability is a big issue for most people. The figures the Minister gave are rubbish. A nurse or teacher on a salary of €25,000 a year cannot possibly purchase a house.
That is nonsense.
It is not. How can one get a mortgage of €175,000 on an income of €25,000?
The average house price in Dublin is €300,000.
That is correct. Young people are now dependent on their parents to either remortgage or give them a contribution from their own resources. The Minister of State is not dealing in reality. He is working from an unreal situation. All he is doing is moving resources from one Department to the other and bailing out those who have invested and speculated and are now caught in a dip in the private rental market. He is not helping vulnerable people. How can the Minister of State stand over a statement that the taxation system is currently more favourable to house purchasers?
It is. We are talking about income tax. We all recall when tax rates were 35%, 48% and 65%. Personal income tax has been greatly reduced. We are talking about rates of 20% and 42% for those buying houses.
I am talking about the tax element being taken by the Government. Some 45% in tax is taken from the price of every house purchased.
I do not accept that figure.
Is the Minister of State saying the figure is unreal?
The rate of VAT increased by 1%. The first-time buyer's grant was abolished because it was in existence for 24 or 25 years and was costing the Government €42 million a year. We are now spending approximately €28 million a year on site subsidies. This is much more focused and targeted. Practically the same amount of money——
Who is the Government subsidising?
The less well-off, those in the affordable bracket. I was in Blanchardstown yesterday to launch an affordability road show for Fingal County Council. It had a whole selection of houses on display at prices ranging from €140,000, €160,000 and €170,000 for those on local authority loans, which we increased yesterday, not to mind nurses or professional people on higher salaries.
In line with inflation?
There is a big range of houses in the Dublin area costing €140,000 or €160,000. One does not have to spend €315,000. These prices are average, but they are not average prices for first-time buyers. They are average prices for elaborate houses. Fingal County Council has a range of family type houses ranging in price from €140,000 upwards. I am sure the same applies in other local authorities around Dublin. I recommend strongly that people should get on to these local authorities and they will qualify for local authority loans.
I will give one example. Some 700 applicants applied for a house in a scheme of 35 affordable houses. They had to raffle them. They had to put 700 names in a hat and draw out the names of 35 persons who were successful. That is the level of impact on the market being made by the Minister of State's actions in respect of people who cannot afford to buy in the open market.
There is a number of members offering.
The Minister of State should not try to say houses in Blanchardstown are readily available and all people have to do is sign up for them. That is misleading.
They are selling them.
They are, but——
People's names may have to be put into a hat.
——demand will far outstrip supply, as it does currently — except on rare occasions — and we have examples.
I am angry because not only are the Minister of State's friends, the corporate donors to Fianna Fáil, hoarding land, but the Minister of State is hoarding a report about hoarding land. Why will he not release the report? I cannot understand the mindset of a Minister who will not release Government documents to the public, particularly when they are on the issue of hoarding land, a matter of public interest. As the Minister of State said, there is seven years supply in this regard, but it is being drip-fed. Why will the Minister of State not release the report on this?
Will he comment on the trend in local authority housing completions? How many local authority housing units have been built in recent years? It is all very well to talk about completions in the private sector, but we are here to talk about social and affordable housing and that includes local authority housing completions. What has been the trend in local authority housing completions in recent years?
How many social or affordable housing units have been delivered under Part V? I wish to ask a similar question regarding announcements the Minister of State has made every six months about State and local authority land being released. An announcement in that regard was made last July and December and again this July. The Minister of State is trumpeting State and institutional lands. When will the houses promised be built? I am familiar with some of the sites, on which briars are growing. Nothing is happening on them. Have any planning permissions in respect of them being granted?
There are objections to far too many of them.
With respect, there are not even planning applications submitted or consultants appointed in respect of them, yet the Minister of State pops up every six months to say another several thousand sites have been selected. Did the Minister of State say that he has not even worked out to where the Army personnel working on these sites will move? With respect, he should cop himself on. What is really happening on these sites and when will these housing units be delivered? I am angry about this because I saw the Minister of State pop up a year ago, last Christmas and a few days ago to say that 10,000 housing units will be delivered. They are not being delivered, although perhaps some are being delivered in the Minister of State's constituency. He mentioned a scheme in Finglas. However, there are other vast tranches of land on which thorn bushes are growing and in respect of which there is no sign of a site notice or a consultant being appointed. What is happening with those sites? When will building commence on them?
Is the Minister of State making a commitment to multi-annual funding for the Homeless Agency? He mentioned in his address that he hopes local authorities will avail of multi-annual expenditure programmes, but will he provide multi-annual funding to the Homeless Agency? Representatives of the National Roads Authority were before this committee a few weeks ago and they spoke about the great commitments they can make. They can do this because they have a multi-annual funding commitment. Will the Minister of State give such a commitment to the agencies dealing with homelessness?
Some €330 million per annum is being spent on rent allowances. That amount of money would build 1,500 houses. All the Minister of State is doing in this regard is moving the fellow who pays the cheque from the health board to the local authority. It is a case of business as usual. When is the Minister of State going to take people out of this cycle of poverty and despair? In terms of depravation, compared to other member states of the European Union, Ireland is ranked two or three from the bottom. When will people in receipt of rent allowance be taken out of this cycle of poverty? I refer to lone parents and women with one or two children who cannot hold down a job because they have to give half of their social welfare payment to the landlord. When will the Minister of State ensure those people are taken out of poverty? He is not giving any commitment in that regard. All he is doing is saying that responsibility with be transferred over three years to local authorities who will have ability to write the cheque. Can he make some commitment to ensuring people are taken out of this cycle of poverty and despair. He must make a commitment in that regard.
The Minister of State might like to respond.
I have tried to answer some of those points previously. The Goodbody report is work in progress. It is being considered and is part of the study by NESC. It is part of the deliberative process. It is a Department decision that it will be released when the NESC report is finished, which I hope will be in the early autumn.
In other words, it is being buried.
As to the trend in local authority housing completions, as I said, there are 48,000 families on the local authority housing list. The needs of 13,000 of those families will be met this year and the needs of a similar number were met last year. That is in contrast to the position five or six years ago when the needs of 8,500 families a year were met.
I want to know about local authority house completions.
The figure for local authority housing completions is approximately 5,000. There were some 50 or 70 additional completions last year but there have been approximately 5,000 house completions for the past three years.
Therefore, they have decreased.
The number of completions has been roughly 5,000 for the past three years with the number increasing by 50 or decreasing by 50 in a year. Prior to that the number of completions increased from approximately 3,500 to 5,000. There was an enormous and rapid increase in the number of completions. I do not have the figures with me but one need only check the number of completions six years ago. There were 3,207 completions in 2000. We can talk about house completions or house starts.
I would like the figures for completions for 2000, 2001 and 2002.
There were 3,207 completions.
In 2000.
What?
I take it that was the figure for 2000.
Yes. The number for the next year was 4,964.
Yes.
The number for the next year was 4,754.
Yes.
The number for the next year was 4,633.
Therefore, the number of completions has decreased in the past two years.
No, I probably should not have given the Deputy those figures in isolation. As well as that number of completions, there were an additional 500 or 600 units that come under remedial works and regeneration schemes.
Do they come under voluntary housing?
No, voluntary housing is extra.
What about housing in Ballyfermot, would that come under refurbishment works?
No, it would come under regeneration schemes. That would include housing in Ballymun and in the inner city. Some 400 or 500 units a year would come under that heading.
Are they completions or refurbishments?
No, the remedial works scheme constitutes refurbishment and work under the regeneration schemes are totally new units. I refer to housing in Bridgefoot Street — I cannot think of a scheme in Dún Laoghaire.
Half of the flats in Bridgefoot Street are being demolished.
We will demolish them and where we regenerate units they will constitute new builds.
The Government is removing hundreds of housing units on Bridgefoot Street.
Yes and if we rebuild them in total we would call that regeneration.
Therefore, they will not be an addition.
That could also be said in respect of housing in Ballymun, but €160 million a year is spent on regeneration. The Deputy could put the position the way that he did, but that is not the way in which people who are moving into brand new homes would view it. We regard that as part of our production figure each year. For the past three years the figure has been around 5,000. If one reflects on the figures three years prior to that period, one would note that the number increased rapidly from 3,000 or 3,500 to 5,000. We secured a 5.4% increase in the overall figure this year, which was not easily achieved in the climate of the past year or two. What other questions did the Deputy ask?
Will the Minister of State clarify if he was referring to new house completions?
Yes.
I thank the Minister of State.
:I apologise, I was referring to house completions and acquisitions.
It was the number of house completions I was seeking.
Some local authorities such as Dublin City Council and authorities in some urban areas that do not have land banks may buy some second-hand houses in the market.
Therefore, the Minister of State is including acquisitions in those figures?
They constitute additions to our housing stock. That is how we view them. Authorities in some counties would not consider purchasing such houses, but authorities in built-up areas would purchase a small number of houses in that bracket. They would probably number no more than a few hundred.
Deputy Cuffe asked the number of units that would be delivered under Part V of the legislation. That initiative will be a big winner but like everything in the housing area it is a slow burner. It will not come on-stream quickly. Last year under that initiative there were about 160 units; this year we believe the number of units might be 500. This initiative is a slow burner but we believe it will result in the delivery of 2,000 to 3,000 units over the next four years. The number of units that will be delivered under it will rapidly increase. It will be a significant measure into the future and the dividend from it will be considerable.
On the matter of Sustaining Progress, I have answered Deputy Allen on that question. There are 10,000 sites, the location of 8,900 of which we have indicated.
It was 10,000 houses, not sites.
House or site, what is the difference? We can call them units; it is the same thing.
I would not say that.
The Deputy will be aware from his professional qualifications that it is not simply a question of acquiring a site and moving in the bulldozers the next morning. Life is not like that. The first of those sites was announced this time last year and they will be delivered, but there is a long lead-in time and much work is going on behind the scenes. I mentioned earlier what is happening with a number of the sites.
With respect, I would not mention a site if the people working on that site did not know to where they were being moved.
That was just——
Is it true that the Department of Defence staff do not know to where they are being relocated?
I referred to that because a constituent spoke to me about one of those sites. That is not my responsibility. Obviously, the contact group is working with the Departments who were previously located on those sites. Some of these sites are clear at this stage; others are not, but that is not the issue. The work can continue — site investigations, the financial aspects, design——
That is no helpto the people on the lists.
We will probably have to wait until all the objections from Deputy Cuffe's friends to any development are dealt with.
Would Deputy Cregan be part of the "build anything anywhere" brigade?
No but Deputy Cuffe's party is part of the "stop anything everywhere" group——
I am not.
——as are his friends.
I am strongly pro-development.
Please allow the Minister of State to continue.
Deputy Cuffe also asked about multi-annual funding. We now have a long-term envelope for capital developments. We do not yet have an envelope for current projects. Everybody wants multi-annual funding but in regard to the Homeless Agency we are talking about current funding. There is no difficulty in that respect but there is an arrangement with the Department of Finance that the capital envelopes are outlined into the future. The current envelopes have to be approved annually by the Dáil. That is the system as of now but there is no doubt about——
It creates uncertainty.
There is always uncertainty. I am not sure if I will wake up tomorrow morning——
Neither are the homeless agencies, by all accounts; they could find themselves out of jobs.
——but I hope I will. The Deputy knows what I mean. I do not have a difficulty in that regard. Every yearthese agencies pitch for additional funding for additional services. We would all have liked if these developments had happened earlier but there is no doubt, and everybody in the sector would agree, that the funding for dealing with the homeless has increased from €12 million to €51 million per year over the past four or five years. An enormous amount of money has been provided.
Is it delivering value?
That is a good question because in trying to address a problem we sometimes see a slow increase in funding year by year. When a good deal of money is available we are all good at spending it. If people get too much too quickly we do not always get good value for money but taxpayers worked hard to ensure the availability of some €51 million in funding and it is important to get good value for money in that regard. However, we have made much progress and given that the money has been made available so quickly, perhaps we are analysing it, making sure it is providing for people who are homeless and that it is spent in accordance with the way taxpayers would like it spent. A rise in funding from €12 million to €51 million in four years represents a major increase.
The fifth and final question I put to the Minister, and one which Deputy Allen also asked, was whether any more resources will be given to the local authority in regard to rent supplement or is he simply moving people from the clinic to the council in terms of from where they will receive their cheque?
As I mentioned, the overall funding of the housing unit is €1.88 billion, which represents an increase of 5.4% this year——
If inflation is taken out of that——
Inflation was 1.7% and it is now 2.3% or thereabouts but that increase is way above the rate of inflation. The specific measure announced last week was that there will be no additional funding in that regard but we expect that as the people concerned move from under the responsibility of the Department of Social and Family Affairs to the local authorities, the money concerned, some €332 million, will move with them. In the current market we believe that by doing that we will get better value. Someone might have a house in Dún Laoghaire, the inner city or wherever which is made up of four or five bedsits whose tenants get rent supplements from the clinic. Many of the people concerned are vulnerable. They might not be good negotiators with their landlords, but if the local authorities negotiate on their behalf with the landlords, they will get a far better deal and we believe some money will be saved which can be put towards other housing measures if needs be.
We believe there is a mood for some PPP type arrangements and others may enter the market to provide extra accommodation more specifically geared to those with long-term housing needs. That is the way we are working. We expect some savings from this and it will give us options as regards catering for those who have been in long-term receipt of such rent allowance.
How many households will such funding of €330 million cover?
There are approximately 60,000 people on rent allowance. An analysis was done which indicated that approximately one third — 19,000 — appear to fall into the category of being in receipt of rent allowance for more than 18 months. In broad terms, about one third of those should come over, so to speak.
I thank the Chairman for granting me permission to attend the meeting.
We are happy for the Deputy to attend.
I hope the rest of my colleagues enjoy their three months holidays and that our friends in the media are aware that we are at a committee meeting debating a serious issue in the month of July.
Before going into the details of the Minister of State's response, I want to ask him a broader question. Having listened to his remarks earlier, does he accept that we have a housing crisis despite our wealthy economy? There are 48,000 people on local authority housing waiting lists, and approximately 5,000 people are homeless. The average house price in Dublin is €300,000, which is out of the reach of many working people. In that regard, I found some of the figures the Minister of State mentioned earlier misleading.
In addition, 13,000 elderly people live in homes on their own and they are crying out for help. That is all under the Minister of State's watch and that of the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government, Deputy Cullen. The reality is that in poorer times Governments built more houses. Does the Minister of State accept we are facing a crisis?
On specific issues, the Minister of State said he will spend €1.8 billion on social and affordable housing programmes in 2004. Does he believe that will be money well spent? Does he believe he is getting value for money when one considers the number of units built and the amount of money spent?
On the affordable housing programmes, the Minister of State referred in his response to the wider housing market and the level of housing need that arises. What is his attitude to the role of the market? Does he, as a Minister of State, have a role in intervening in the market because. Some people within the Cabinet believe we should not intervene in the market but let it operate according to market forces.
The Minister of State said the issue of affordability remains a major concern. We all accept that but in Dublin the average house costs €300,000. The Minister of State referred to the Central Bank's recent statements about lending in the housing market and he said he would keep that under close observation. It is not good enough for him to say he will keep this under close observation because he must accept that we have a major crisis, particularly in respect of the 48,000 families on the waiting lists. Does the Minister of State intend to ensure that more houses are built to deal with this crisis? The Minister of State said the affordable housing scheme has benefited over 2,500 households in 2003. That seems to be a very low base for 2003 on which I ask the Minister of State to comment.
Homelessness is a very complex issue. It is not just a case of somebody with an alcohol problem sleeping out on the streets. There are many other issues in regard to homelessness. Does the Minister of State accept that as part of the solution? The Minister of State talks about this year's allocation of €51 million and the fact that the Government has provided over €190 million in accommodation-related expenditure since 2000. I touched on this earlier, but a lot of people would ask how, if the Minister of State is granted that amount of money, we still have people on the streets and homeless? The national figure for homelessness is 5,000.
When one sees the sum being spent one wonders whether it is being spent in the right areas, whether we are getting value for money and if it is going down to the people on the streets. I worry about this. In addition, I have given the figure of 5,000 homeless persons nationally. Some are saying it could be higher, some suggest it is lower. What is the actual figure for the number of homeless in this State?
I ask the Minister of State about extra finance and resources. Will he make any extra finance and resources available for people with disabilities and their accommodation needs over the next 12 months?
I do not use the word "crisis". Some of my colleagues in politics are talking about crises every day. I see problems as challenges and do not talk about crises. As I mentioned, with a population increase over a six year period of 8%, it is obvious that there has been pressure on all sides of the housing market over the last seven to ten years. If it were all babies being born it would not really matter. It might put pressure on the education system but they would not require extra extensions or whatever.
Much of the increase was made up of people in the 25-35 age bracket, which is a key family formation age group. For any country in the world, such an increase in population among that age group in particular obviously puts pressure on the housing market.
Are we getting value for our €1.88 billion? I hope so. We try to give good value for money. I am very conscious of the fact that it is the taxpayer's hard earned money, or hard borrowed money. Regarding the Central Bank's comment, I am glad in a way that the bank is now expressing concern because I have been expressing concern over my two years in this job. I have more or less asked and urged the Central Bank to talk to some of the financial institutions and get the message across to them.
People who want to buy a home will always borrow up to the limit of what they are given. In recent years different financial institutions have been falling over themselves to give out money and I am glad the Central Bank is showing concern. However, in its previous report three months earlier the Central Bank did say that it felt things were settling down and steadying and that we looked like finding our way out of the problem. Sometimes the message of these reports can change significantly over a short time.
For people who have taken out mortgages in recent times, if life goes on as it is and interest rates stay low, they will be grand. There is a danger, however. As I mentioned, the historically low interest rates have made these houses very affordable but if interest rates go up, there could be tears all round. If people are taking out a mortgage they should look at the trends and direction in which interest rates might go in the next year or two. If they feel they might go up by 1% to 1.5% they should think ahead.
When many of us bought a house, interest rates might have been as high as 10%. To some extent first-time buyers are now getting fantastic deals, but they should look forward before taking out a mortgage and consider not just what they can afford now but whether they could afford a 1% increase.
Some 2,500 affordable homes were built under the affordable housing and shared ownership schemes in 2003. That is fantastic. The local authority affordable housing scheme was only introduced in 1999. The shared ownership scheme was in place a few years prior to that. We are trying to target a particular segment of the market, namely, people who have always bought their own homes, are quite willing to buy their own homes but are under pressure because of the general rise in prices in recent years. These people want to buy their own homes and we do not want them on the social housing list. With a small amount of assistance from the State they will do their own thing.
Some 2,500 new houses built last year is very significant. I was very impressed with what I saw out in Fingal yesterday, where a range of homes are being built around a number of sites. This is happening more in Fingal and south County Dublin than in the city council area, where there are fewer land banks and fewer options. In Finglas, in my own constituency, which was originally a local authority, a number of affordable, in-fill sites have been created on wasteland on which there was once much anti-social behaviour and from which the community got nothing but trouble. The local authority has built on a number of those sites now. It included provisos with many of them that 30% or 50% of the houses would go to people from the estate. People have gladly gone along with that because they have seen a community gain for the estate.
Some 2,500 houses is very significant. I would like to boost that figure but the scheme is targeted at a specific income level. In 1999 some 40 houses were built under the affordable housing scheme. Of the 2,500 houses, about 1,500 were built under the affordable housing scheme and about 1,000 under the shared ownership scheme. Different local authorities opt for one scheme or the other.
What was Deputy McGrath's question about homelessness?
I asked about it being a complex issue and about the amount of money spent on it.
It is complex. The last assessment showed the number of homeless households at 3,773, with the number of individuals at about 5,500.
As the Minister of State is talking about 5,500, the figure is accurate.
The situation changes significantly between different local authorities. In Dublin, if one claims to be homeless one probably must enter homeless accommodation. We all remember that this was not necessary about five to seven years ago. In a lot of local authorities people are registered as homeless but still live at home, with friends or whatever. They do not have a long-term arrangement at home. However, we all know that only a very small fraction of these people, maybe 60 or 70, are actually sleeping rough in Dublin.
The number of emergency accommodation units has increased significantly over recent years.
There are 60 or 70 such people within 500 metres of here.
I am talking about sleeping rough.
Yes, homeless people.
There is not. We all know——
We see them every night driving out of this building.
The local authority of which the Deputy was a member up to a few months ago sends a bus around every night. Some sleep outside my own Department but the bus comes around every night. Some nights people take the bus and on others nights they do not take it. That is their right. A bed is available every night for anyone who wants it. Different studies have been done on the number of rough sleepers. The last one asked the clients themselves whether they had slept rough over the previous six weeks.
When one hears a figure like 200 or whatever it does not mean that there were 200 people out on the streets last night. It means that people may have slept rough on two or three nights over the previous six weeks. We have added 1,000 beds to our hostels in recent years. We have also provided for wet weather hostels. The energy, strategies and action plans are being re-evaluated this year. Most providers now recognise that the direction is to address homelessness. We have enough emergency accommodation. We want to move people on. The €51 million I mentioned is our spend through the local authorities and the agency for the homeless in my Department. The Department of Health and Children spends almost as much again through the care facilities.
Many homeless persons, if given their own homes, will be all right and are capable of independent living but many are not because they have complex addiction and psychiatric problems. They need sheltered accommodation. We must move them from emergency to transitional accommodation where they can be helped by building up a relationship of trust with carers who can assess the level of support they need. There is concern at the delay in moving people on from transitional accommodation. Some are well able for the move and through the agency for the homeless we funded a unit in which Threshold actively helps them find accommodation in the private rental market. Some landlords would not want to do business with a person who had been homeless or in a hostel. We have employed some staff through Threshold to deal with this, yet I have read recently that the unit has more landlords than prospective tenants on its books.
Some agencies seem to delay making a deal with a landlord and putting forward people who have been in emergency or transitional accommodation and are ready to take up their own accommodation. That surprises me and I do not understand it. I saw that information only in recent days and there are questions to be answered. I worked on the belief that we have enough emergency accommodation, although we might need more transitional accommodation. The emphasis is on moving people on, determining who needs long-term sheltered care and who is able for independent living, then giving them an opportunity to get their lives together and look after themselves.
We are providing €65 million this year for the disabled person's grant, an increase of €10 million from last year.
What about housing units? Dublin City Council has some great examples of these.
We provide approximately 5,000 local authority housing units and 1,700 housing association houses, many of which cater for disabled groups or other specific groups. The budget for those is probably €250 million. They are for the elderly and the disabled. I have seen some very special units around the country but they are mainly provided by the voluntary groups who also provide the care. There is little point in my Department building for those with special needs if the Department of Health and Children and the health boards are not present to give the services. There have been cases of one Department moving ahead of the other. We are trying to create an integrated package in which the arrangements are made in advance in order that when we provide the money to build, the health board is on site and has the staff ready to do that. Voluntary bodies, such as the Wheelchair Association, do most of this work.
I thank the committee for allowing me to attend this meeting. Like the other Dublin based Deputies, I find that most of my time is spent dealing with the housing issue. It may be a challenge for the Minister of State but it is a crisis for many of those who come to me. I was at the launch of a recent report by the Dublin Simon Community which pointed out that none of the single people living in the dormitory of the Simon hostel moved on to social housing. How many this year will move on to social housing? There is a crisis. The Minister of State talked about private accommodation but there is a crisis in that the local authorities, including my former local authority, South Dublin, are not building accommodation for single people. We all know how difficult it is for a single person, in particular a single man, to be registered on a housing list. How many will move on from the lists that Dublin Simon has?
On 30 June 2002 there was 3,062 hectares of undeveloped land zoned as residential in Dublin, and 294 in the Dublin City Council area. What is the Government doing to ensure that land is released for housing? Most commentators say there is a crisis, in particular for young people trying to get housing. Social housing is the only solution for many of the people I represent, especially the young working people. Affordability is a misnomer. Housing is no longer affordable. The Minister of State quoted figures but social or local authority housing is the only way forward for many of those couples. The figures are not falling. The Minister of State has set targets of 10,000 for housing but that will not do anything for the numbers requiring social housing. There may not be votes in this issue but I am concerned about homelessness because it affects people. One has only to step outside this building to see it. A young single man who comes to my clinic has been on the waiting list in South Dublin County Council for eight years. It is a crisis for him.
I saw the statement from Simon some weeks ago and it amazed me because that is not my understanding of the reality. A total of 300 allocations last year by Dublin City Council, which has the most dealings with homeless persons, was for people on the homelessness list. I am very surprised that Simon did not put forward any of its residents or was not successful in getting any of them into mainstream local authority accommodation. Perhaps it is catering for a particular clientele.
Simon is not here to defend itself. That is an unfair statement. It labels everyone in the Simon hostel.
That is not a criticism. Dublin City Council gives 30% of its allocations to people on the homelessness list and it gave allocations to 300 of those people last year. Many of them come out of hostels or similar accommodation. Perhaps some of the service providers cater for people with more specific needs but Dublin City Council deals with more homeless people than do other local authorities. Some even go on the homelessness list because they feel their chances are better than on the other lists.
That may have been the case some years ago but it is not so now. In reality it takes years before someone is considered for local authority housing in Dublin. That is not an option any more. It is a waste of time going down that road or even talking about it.
The Deputy has a point about single people. Traditionally, local authorities were responsible for families. However, now 32% of the 48,000 people on the housing list are single, many of whom are separated, middle-aged men. Approximately 30% are lone parents, while only 38% are families. Many of the local authorities have been slow to move from the traditional attitude of building three-bedroom semi-detached houses. When criticised, local authorities will respond with an analysis of the housing list, citing the number of single people and the need for providing single person accommodation. However, when the bloody plans are published, they seem to have forgotten this. Some housing plans are moving away from this. However, just plans for 100 units for separated men or unmarried mothers are not needed. What is needed are integrated plans——
There is a need for accommodation for both singles and couples.
Yes, there is a need for a better mix in the local authority housing design plans to cater for the housing lists. For the past four years we had a multi-annual programme. Now, we are working with the local authorities for much more comprehensive action plans. We want to know what they will do over the next four or five years based on analysis of housing lists. The plans must be a reflection of who is on the list. We recently approved a large mixed development of 100 units in Fortunestown Way. The action plan should be all-embracing of the concerns of local authorities, homeless organisations, etc. to ensure a broad view of what is needed and more co-ordination at local authority level. They must take account of the type of people on the list and get away from the three-bed semi-detached idea. If families are on the list, that is fine. However, we want a mix of design to reflect the reality of the housing list.
Land-hoarding may well have happened in the past, but I do not believe it is happening now.
Is that what the report says?
Sometimes I cannot remember where my knowledge comes from.
It is a simple question.
I am trying to answer it. In Dublin, there is an eight year supply of serviced zoned land. In ten years, we have been successful in moving the house construction industry from 22,000 units built per year to 68,000 units. If people were sitting on land banks for years, I do not believe they are now. The problem now is capacity and who will build the units. A number of foreign companies have entered the market owing to the volume of demand and have brought some realism into the prices. There are no developers hoarding sites and not building on them. They are all building at a rate of knots. The Government is encouraging them with the serviced land initiative and building infrastructure. The only way to meet demand is to build the houses.
I compliment the Minister of State for doing a good job. Is he in favour of timber built houses? There is factory in Kenmare that is building timber houses. It would be an opportune time for the Minister of State to visit this factory. In Kilgarvan, the first showhouse is being erected. It shocked me——
The Deputy is not easily shocked.
I do not know about that. I was amazed that when the foundation was ready, the house was erected within a day. As it is the start of the holidays, I would like the Minister of State to make an official visit to Kilgarvan to see this new form of development. Deputy Cuffe claims there are all these sites available in Dublin. The Minister of State could buy 60,000 houses from the Kenmare factory for these sites. I am expecting to hear from the Minister of State when he is down in County Kerry for his holidays.
As the Minister of State will not have much reason to be in Croke Park, he will have plenty of time to visit Kenmare.
I look forward to the Minister of State seeing these houses in County Kerry in the summer.
I thank the Minister of State for his comprehensive replies. I see the benefits of these policies in north inner-city Dublin. In the past five years, local authority, private and co-operative housing has developed and improved. A number of model developments in north inner-city Dublin are now being examined by experts here and in other countries. In an area that was once deprived and devastated, it is a sure sign that the policies are working.
When various homeless agencies and Threshold attended the committee, it seemed there was a deficit of information on homelessness, leaving many working in the area confused. How far developed is the LINK data system and when will we see the results? When will the five year plans from the local authorities be published?
I welcome the Minister of State and compliment him on the good job he is doing. Mention has been made of the difficulty in trying to place single male applicants in local authority housing. Local authorities tend to prioritise families and single parents. Limerick County Council mainly supplied family type housing. Now, more two-bedroom units are supplied for single mothers with one child. As a result, the single male applicant cannot be prioritised by local authorities. In County Limerick, 22 voluntary housing organisations have become recognised housing bodies by way of approval of the Department of the Environment, Heritage and Local Government. They are catering for the special needs type to which the Minister of State referred, namely, people with disabilities and single males in the 30 to 50 age bracket, as well as catering for elderly people. We should encourage more voluntary groups to become recognised housing bodies. Funding is provided by the Minister and his Department and has increased dramatically during the years. Communities can cater in this way for those groups of people who unfortunately cannot be prioritised by the county councils.
There is a Part V affordable housing pilot scheme in my own county which had difficulty in attracting applicants. The scheme was designed in three phases. Phase one was to provide 25 units, and 25 applications were eventually received. Subsequently a similar scheme in north Cork was advertised on television when there were insufficient applicants for the affordable housing units. I do not know why that is. The units were of high specification in a nice area. Obviously we live in a different world in rural Ireland. There are different issues and problems in the urban centres.
We would welcome any increase in funding for disabled persons' grants and local authorities should always prioritise spending in that area. We all beat our breasts over looking after our elderly and disabled people, but if we want to look after them we must insist when the Estimates come up for discussion that adequate funding is provided to meet the needs of all those applicants. That can be successfully done in many parts of the country, including my own county, and we should be setting targets in other counties.
People seeking standardised three-bedroom semi-detached housing in urban areas qualified for the first-time buyer's grant. In rural areas, however, people acquiring land and building houses, if they wished to get that grant, were confined to a particular type and size of house, to the extent that very few of them decided to apply for the grant. They felt they were being inhibited as they wanted to build larger and better houses. That is progress, but I am making the point that there is a difference between the urban and rural situations. In any case, where the grant was not availed of, tax breaks were given to the applicants. Therefore, there was no net loss to them. I compliment the Minister of State. Figures given to the committee today indicate a continuous increase in housing output and funding, and if we continue in that direction we are doing a good job.
I too welcome the Minister of State. With regard to the multi-annual local authority housing programmes, every encouragement should be given for land purchase. Where local authorities have development plans for towns and villages it is important that they would be encouraged under the land purchase initiative, and should dictate the development. Mistakes have been made in the past whereby too many local authority houses have been built in certain areas. The local authority with the help of the Department should be able to dictate what development takes place in areas, along with the housing price, in a controlled fashion so that houses could be made available at an affordable cost to meet the needs of the local communities.
Deputy Healy-Rae spoke about timber houses. There are timber houses and timber-frame houses.
I was talking of timber-frame houses.
They have become big business and are not just confined to two-storey houses. I saw a three or four-storey apartment block recently which to my surprise was timber-framed. That construction has become very popular. I might well take the Deputy up on his offer to visit Kilgarvan.
I thank the Minister of State.
If the officials are available during the Tralee races week, we might just go. I am jesting. Timber-frame houses are to be seen not only in Kilgarvan. They are big business. An in-depth study of that business was carried out some months ago. I believe it has been sent to the trade and submissions on it are being received. Timber-frame houses are normal in other countries, although they might seem strange to us. We will lay down standards in the area.
Senator Brady talked about inner city regeneration. We are spending €168 million this year on regeneration and remedial works, which will include projects like the Ballymun houses and the fantastic work done in the inner city. One can see the effect of it. Other areas have been regenerated by the voluntary bodies, including apartment blocks in the Senator's area which were problematic for years. There is much other work done under the heading of remedial works and refurbishment in inner-city flats. Windows were replaced and central heating installed. Many local authorities concentrate on installing central heating for elderly people.
There are 105,000 local authority houses. For the past ten or 12 years, any local authority houses built, or refurbished or which involved remedial work have had central heating installed. There remain 45,000 local authority houses without central heating. The overall cost of installing it is estimated at about €300 million. Any local authority house built in the past ten years has had some kind of heating system installed. Houses which were the subject of remedial works or major refurbishment have also had heating systems put in. Some local authorities have borrowed money or used spare capital for some of this work. We are starting on a programme for which we will provide €12 million this year. We are working on the basis that local authorities will produce 20% of the money from their own revenue receipts and we will provide 80%. The work will not be done in one year. Even if the budget were €30 million annually it would probably take six or seven years. We hope to formally announce this scheme before the end of this month.
We have not merely tried to build more houses but also to upgrade the houses we have and give the people in them a better standard of living. There are many vulnerable people in local authority housing. Some might not know much about acquiring central heating, for example. We hope that, at the same time, house insulation will be improved and that mains smoke alarms will be installed.
The LINK system is up and running. The majority of service providers are now on it and the data is feeding through. Up to recent times however we had very poor information on individual homeless people because many were going to a hostel for one night, sleeping rough the following night, going somewhere else for two or three nights and then disappearing without trace for another few weeks. Many such people are sometimes homeless, sometimes not and make their own arrangements which means no one is able to track them down. To solve such a problem one needs data. This is now being provided by LINK.
The draft action plans which will guide us over the next five years have been submitted by local authorities. We need to discuss and agree these over the next few months. Deputy Cregan mentioned single people. I would like local authorities to provide some accommodation for single people as part of their plans. However, many of the voluntary bodies can better achieve this. These voluntary bodies are comprised of the larger housing associations as well as traditional local associations. Voluntary body output is approximately 1,700 units per year. This is broadly divided 50-50 between larger and local associations.
Responsibility for people in receipt of rent allowance over a long period is being transferred to the local authorities. The Private Residential Tenancies Bill will give these people increased tenancy rights. They will not be messed around by landlords as they were before. There will be different options by which we can——
St. Vincent de Paul, as a non-profit-making organisation, provides accommodation for single males in a voluntary housing scheme. The rent is very affordable for them.
It is. The Deputy mentioned the difficulty in selling affordable housing units in Youghal and Fermoy. All of them have been sold. I am not rubbishing local authorities. They are great and they build affordable houses. However when they built local authority houses in the past, they used a list to allocate them and they thought their job was done. Local authorities now build affordable houses and act more like estate agents. It is no longer a case of building houses and then pulling names out of a hat. That might work in a high demand area. However, they must act like estate agents by marketing and selling houses. They must be proactive. They are selling something. Some local authorities have been more successful than others. It is not enough to build houses and then notice two weeks later that they are not sold. The authorities need to inform people that houses are being built and are available. They must let people know that these houses are for sale. It possibly goes against the grain of how local authorities traditionally operated. However, in instances where people are aware houses are available, there is a huge response.
Affordable housing is not for everyone. It is targeted at people within the new income limits which have increased from €32,000 to €36,800. The maximum loan has increased from €130,000 to €165,000, although some local authorities may wish to move up to that limit in degrees. These increases will assist people in that bracket who want to buy their own home. The State needs to give them some small help in achieving this.
I welcome the Minister of State's remarks with regard to the provision of grant aid for central heating in local authority homes. It is something that Limerick County Council, my former council, has already examined. We took part in a window replacement programme which borrowed money to replace every window in every local authority house and we then repaid the money. When that was completed, the old council agreed to proceed with the provision of central heating. We were prepared to borrow the money ourselves. I welcome that the Minister of State is prepared to grant aid that programme and I hope he recognises the local authorities that have already taken the lead to ensure they can be grant aided. Heating is no longer a luxury, it is a necessity. The elderly and the young require heating. It is a requirement of which we previously fell short. I welcome the Minister of State's impending announcement on the matter. I hope the efforts to provide this will be grant-aided.
I thank the Deputy for his comments. The situation will be similar to the DPGs in that the Department will provide 80% of the money, and the local authority will provide 20%.
I thought the Deputy was going to tell me that a county council which borrowed money five years ago wants it back. The answer would be no.
No.
Any county council which did such work before——
I am sure the local authorities contribution will increase from 20% to 30%.
The Deputy should tell them to make their submissions and we will approve them quickly. We hope to provide €12 million which, with the 20% from local authorities, adds up to €15 million. That figure merely scratches the surface.
It is a start.
If we could keep it going for six or seven years, we would make headway with the 45,000 local authority houses.
The Minister of State is very good.
That concludes our discussion. I thank the Minister of State and his officials for attending the meeting, for their presentation and for answering questions. I am sure members found the meeting interesting.
Very interesting.
We will decide at a later stage as to how we should proceed.
I propose the committee requests the Minister of State to make available to it the consultant's report on land-holding in the Dublin area. I presume that is unanimous.
To be fair to the Minister of State, he has already explained the reasons he cannot do this.
The reasons are not good enough. The report has been given to the National Economic and Social Council. The Dáil was promised last October that the report would be available in December.
I would prefer to see the overall picture. Such reports provide an overall picture and it is wise to wait for them.
The decision has been made that it is part of the process at present and that it will be made public.
At what stage will the report be made public?
Possibly not until October. The Deputy is his party's spokesman on thematter and I acknowledge his view. However, I cannot meet his request at this time.
I remind members that the joint committee will meet next Wednesday, 21 July, at its usual time of 2 p.m.
Some members might be less angry.
The joint committee adjourned at 1.55 p.m. until 2 p.m. on Wednesday, 21 July 2004.