On the question of privilege, I ask the permission of the Seanad to move a resolution. It is more or less public knowledge that I had handed in a resolution for the purpose of debate by this House. That resolution, according to certain parties, has apparently been withdrawn by me. I did hand in a notice of motion but it has not been withdrawn by me. It has been ruled out of order by the Cathaoirleach, and that is the sole reason why it does not appear on the Orders of the Day. I think that the matter with which I was to deal was a matter of public urgency and I would ask the permission of the Seanad to be allowed to move a motion which I think is essential to the privileges and liberties of Senators. I would ask the permission of the Seanad to move it now. In this course I am assisted by a number of fellow Senators who believe that on that particular matter some concrete action is essential and who feel that if a resolution were here and now adopted it would on any future occasion safeguard the Senate from any course of action which might in any way be injurious to it. I think for that purpose it would be necessary that a resolution be addressed to the Standing Orders Committee for the purpose of doing a certain thing which, in my opinion, and in the opinion of others, would be safeguarding the liberties of members of this House. I allude to a matter concerning certain articles of the Constitution of the Saorstát. Apparently, as the matter stands at present, the Cathaoirleach can rule out of order any matter which he suggests is a violation of the Constitution. According to our Standing Orders he is the sole judge of whether a matter is or is not a violation of the Constitution.
QUESTION OF PRIVILEGE.
AN CATHAOIRLEACH
Before you discuss it any further, I must ask you to state what it is you propose.
I propose a resolution of this nature: "That in future it shall not be the duty of the Cathaoirleach to rule whether appeals or motions before the Seanad are an infringement of the Constitution, and that the Standing Orders Committee be requested to propose such alterations in, or additions to, the Standing Orders as will give effect to this resolution."
AN CATHAOIRLEACH
I could not possibly allow that to be debated to-day, Senator, and I do think you might have been a little more fair to me in your statement as to what you suggest happened to your original motion. It is right that I should now tell the House what did happen. On Wednesday last the Clerks were handed a motion of an entirely different character to this but dealing with the same subject-matter. It apparently had originally been in the name of Senator Colonel Moore, but his name was scratched out.
My name was put on it by mistake.
AN CATHAOIRLEACH
That is what I say. Senator Colonel Moore's name was on it, but that name was scratched out and the name of Senator Gogarty was substituted. Senator Gogarty, on the same day, Wednesday, withdrew that motion and nothing further was heard of it until the next day, when it was again handed in, this time in the name of Senator Bennett. But on the following day Senator Bennett withdrew it and handed in a new motion, and that motion is not that which he is moving now, because the motion he is moving now is in a different form. He handed in on the Friday an alternative form of motion. I got that on Friday evening. I sat down and wrote to the Senator, pointing out to him that the motion was not in order, but that I quite appreciated the matter he wanted to bring before the Seanad, and that I would be very glad indeed if he would accept my assistance in framing a motion in such a way that it would be in order and could come up before the Seanad. That he has not done, and I could not possibly allow a discussion to-day on a notice of motion which has not been tabled and of which the House knows nothing.
The genesis of the case is reasonably accurate, but my notice of motion never, to my knowledge, was really officially handed in for the purpose of consideration by An Cathaoirleach—
AN CATHAOIRLEACH
I do not exactly know what the Senator means.
I will explain if you will allow me.
AN CATHAOIRLEACH
One second. Did you not hand it in on Friday to the Clerk?
Yes.
AN CATHAOIRLEACH
The Clerk transmitted it to me and I have not up to now heard of its withdrawal.
Oh, no. I tried to explain, and I really thought I did explain, that I handed in a notice of motion on Friday dealing with what I believed were the privileges of Senators. That motion was ruled out of order by An Cathaoirleach and consequently it does not appear on the Order Paper for the day. I believe that that was a matter of public importance infringing some of our privileges, and to ensure that anything of a like nature should not occur again I asked permission, as a matter of urgency, to inform Senators of the motion which I have read. The original notice of motion, if the Seanad desires to hear it, was: "That no subject proposed for discussion in this House shall be ruled out of order by An Cathaoirleach of the Seanad because in his opinion such subject is in violation of the Constitution of An Saorstát." My contention is that a decision on matters of constitutional authority or on the Constitution are for the High Court and not for the Seanad.
AN CATHAOIRLEACH
You are now going into the merits of your motion, and I cannot allow that. I will accept this notice of motion from you and it will appear in due course. You have to give two clear days' notice of it. A motion of this kind could not possibly be moved straight away and, if you hand it in now, I will take care that it appears on the Order Paper at the very earliest opportunity. I cannot do more than that.
I hand in the notice of motion formally, then.
AN CATHAOIRLEACH
Certainly. And if you had done that, as I wrote to you, I would have accepted it.
You might, A Chathaoirligh, or might not. You might have had a long constitutional argument that I could not cope with.
AN CATHAOIRLEACH
On the contrary, I told you in my letter that it would be only my duty, as well as my pleasure, to help you to put your resolution in a form that would comply with the Standing Orders.