Allocation of Time: Motion.

Mr. Lanigan

I move:

That notwithstanding anything in Standing Orders the following arrangements shall apply in the debate on the motion relating to the 1988 Estimates and on any amendments thereto:——

(a) the time allowed for the debate on the motion shall not exceed six and a half hours:

(b) the Leader of the House (or some other Senator nominated by him) in moving the motion may reserve his right to speak until a later stage in the debate;

(d) the debate shall conclude with a final speaker being called from each side of the House in the order of (i) Senator from Fine Gael group and (ii) Government, the speech in each case not to exceed 30 minutes.

Mr. Ferris

I want to thank the Leader of the House for allowing a debate on this issue. We have been asking him for some weeks to do it. Just for the record, it is the first time the Estimates have been discussed in the Seanad when they were published. It is also the first time the Estimates are so drastic that we have to discuss them, but that is beside the point.

Mr. Mooney

That is the point.

Mr. Ferris

I thank the Leader of the House for allowing a debate. In view of the regulation he has laid down there — which is the point Senator O'Toole referred to — if we look at the context of the amendments themselves — apart from the one from the Labour Party and the one from the Independent group — the other is not really an amendment, it is just a changing of the words which is accepting the Estimates——

An Leas-Chathaoirleach

We are discussing item No. 1. There is only one amendment to item No. 1 — an amendment to be proposed by Senator Manning.

Mr. Ferris

There are paragraphs (a), (b), (c) and (d). I am speaking on the Leader's proposal of paragraphs (a), (b), (c) and (d). I want clarification on paragraph (d), to know why it had been chosen in that way, particularly having regard to the content of the amendments. Following that question, has the leader an idea on how the actual amendments proper to the Government motion will be taken? Will they be taken in the order in which they were received in the House — the time at which they were lodged — or at what stage, in other words, can I propose and speak to the Labour Party amendment in the order of debate? It is not outlined in paragraphs (a), (b), (c) and (d). This regulates the length of time people can speak, which I accept and which is agreed. It regulates the time in which people will respond, but it does not regulate how the amendments will actually be put. I consider the amendment I have lodged is the only real amendment apart from a shortened version by Senator O'Toole. The Leader of the House might respond to me in that regard.

Mr. Lanigan

There was a demand for weeks in this House to have a debate on the Estimates. Let us get on with the debate. Let us not go into a rigmarole about procedure. There is an agreed 20 minutes per speaker. The sooner we get into the debate on the Estimates the sooner that people will have the chance to debate what is in the Estimates and criticise or praise what is in the Estimates. I ask the indulgence of the House to get on with the business of the day rather than get into semantics about what we should and should not do and what procedure.

Mr. Manning

I move amendment No. 1:

In paragraph (c) to delete "(other than the final speaker)" and to delete paragraph (d) and substitute the following:

(d) the debate shall conclude with a final speaker being called in the following order:

(i) Labour Group: (ii) Independent Group; (iii) Fine Gael Group and (iv) Government.

I suggest we leave the time at 20 minutes.

Amendment agreed to.

Motion, as amended, agreed to.

Seanad Éireann debate - Thursday, 29 Oct 1987