Seanad Éireann debate -
Wednesday, 5 Feb 1997

Vol. 149 No. 20

Adjournment Matters. - Review of Councillors' Allowances.

Mr. Mooney

I thank you, a Chathaoirligh, for having chosen this matter for discussion on the Adjournment from the huge number of such matters that come before you.

There was a popular song in the 1970s called "The Poor, Poor Farmer", at which everybody laughed because they did not think farmers were poor. If we recycled that song for the 1990s and called it "The poor, poor, councillor" we would get a similar reaction from a cynical public claiming that councillors are not poor. The reality, however, is well known to everybody.

Before outlining the reasons for raising this matter, I would seek the permission of the House to share my time with Senator Burke.

An Cathaoirleach

Is that agreed? Agreed.

Mr. Mooney

The case for improved allowances and expenses for county councillors has been so well made at this stage that it would be a waste of the House's and the Minister of State's time if I were to begin detailing the reasons. To get to the core of the matter, the last Administration introduced a system of allowances and expenses for county councillors which was long overdue. On the one hand it was widely accepted by councillors who felt they were at last being acknowledged but, on the other hand there was controversy over the manner in which the travel element of the allowance was being implemented. It meant not only that certain restrictions would be placed on the travel expenses councillors could claim, but also on the number of meetings for which they could claim those expenses throughout the year. The system was introduced as a reform measure but the reality was — and still is, in certain counties — that it has not been universally accepted.

The element on which I wish to concentrate concerns postage and telephone expenses which, I understand, comprise a figure of £1,000 per year made up of postage and telephone costs. This figure was introduced at the same time as the reform of the expenses allocations in 1994. Within a year the then Minister for the Environment, Deputy Michael Smith, promised a review of the expenses. The current Minister for the Environment, Deputy Howlin, expressed his interest in monitoring the workings of the new system on an ongoing basis. However, three years later there has been no review of the system despite the fact that Deputies and Senators have benefited through increases in some allowances and in the consolidation of others, most recently with the legislation passed before Christmas.

There is an old cliché which says that nothing concentrates the mind better than a hanging. Nothing concentrates the minds of politicians like an election. Perhaps people will say that Senator Mooney and other Senators will support increases because it is a good idea especially in an election year. However, I do not want the debate to be interpreted in that way. The files in the Department of the Environment will show that I and several other Members have made repeated requests to Minister Howlin and his predecessor to institute a review which would encapsulate the increased living expenses incurred by county councillors in pursuit of their duties.

I am asking for either an increase in the £1,000 allowance or a 5 per cent index linked cost of living increase to that allowance. The standard increase which insurance companies and others use is 5 per cent when inflation is below 5 per cent. Why should councillors be discriminated against? This House has the power to improve the pay and conditions of Members, which we do without apology, and rightly so. We should make this modest acknowledgement of our elected representatives around the country who are giving of their service in a voluntary capacity.

Mr. Burke

I thank Senator Mooney for sharing his time and I support his call for a review of councillors' expenses. As he said, there would be no need for this discussion if, like other organisations, councillors' expenses were index linked.

Councillors carry out a very valuable service at enormous expense to themselves and their families. This Government — like the last Government — has given more powers to local authorities and in the context of reform of local government, now is the time to introduce this increase. I also agree with Senator Mooney that the systems of allowances introduced three years ago should be index linked.

Minister of State at the Department of Education (Mr. Allen)

I welcome the opportunity of placing on the record of the House the Government's commitment to ensuring that councillors have a clear and equitable system of expenses and other support measures.

The system of expenses for councillors which we inherited when we came into office was, basically, a good one. Notwithstanding that, we have introduced a number of improvements as well as providing councillors with other support measures. Last month the Minister for the Environment published Better Local Government — A Programme for Change, the most comprehensive reform programme ever, which seeks as one of its core principles to strengthen the role of councillors.

It was the former Minister for the Environment, Deputy Smith, who in 1994 introduced a new and modern expenses system for councillors based on a composite annual allowance. The allowance comprises three elements to meet general representational expenses, subsistence costs and travel expenses, based on the member's home location relative to council headquarters. The allowance is not intended to constitute a salary or remuneration which would be liable for tax, but rather to meet expenses actually incurred under these headings. Expenses for attendance at conferences, seminars and certain other events continue to be paid on a separate ad hoc basis for each event.

On coming into office the Minister for the Environment, Deputy Brendan Howlin, carried out an indepth review of the expenses system which at that stage had been in operation for only about a year. The review took account of submissions received, expenditure data supplied by local authorities and all other relevant factors. As a result a number of favourable improvements were notified to local authorities in August 1995. A key change was the automatic linkage of travel and subsistence rate alterations to those for senior officers. This will increase subsistence rates from 1996 onwards, which will be notified to councillors shortly. Another significant change in response to representations was a relaxation in the threshold for attendance at meetings in order to qualify for the full annual allowance. It is, of course, a matter for councillors themselves to organise their meetings so as to maximise efficiency and effectiveness of operation. The councillors' expenses system is but one area in which the position of councillors has been improved since we took office. In the case of the regional authorities, an allowance for the cathaoirleach has been introduced thereby giving due recognition to the important role of this office. The local authority associations — the General Council of County Councils, the Association of Municipal Authorities of Ireland and the Local Authority Members' Association — now have an independent source of funding based on contributions from local authorities.

In 1997 the local authorities will contribute around £450,000 under these arrangements which is, inter alia, used to meet the expenses of councillors for meetings of the associations and their committees. The Minister has also arranged significant ongoing logistic and administrative support for councillors who are members of the Committee of the Regions. Increased expenditure under the new councillors' expenses system speaks for itself. Data derived from local authority estimates shows expenditure on councillors' expenses in respect of home and foreign travel and including allowances for cathaoirligh at around £6m for 1996, an increase of 16 per cent on 1994.

It is clear that the Government is committed to ensuring that councillors continue to have proper recognition for their enormous contribution to the local government system and that is how it should be. The current expenses system works well. However, as indicated in Better Local Government — A Programme for Change, the expenses system will be adjusted where necessary in the context of the implementation of the various measures outlined in the programme. It is in that context that I will pass on to the Minister the comments made regarding postage and telephone expenses. The programme seeks to reposition the councillor within the local government system with the introduction of strategic policy committees supported by a programme manager, more support for councillors, better information and training, linkage with other public bodies — all moves designed to enable him or her to better fulfil the democratic mandate earned through the electoral process.

Mr. Mooney

I want to acknowledge the important information outlined by the Minister, the improvements that have taken place since 1994 and the reforming attitude that has been adopted by both the Minister and the Minister of State in this regard. I am grateful that the Minister of State will convey the remarks made by Senator Burke and myself about index linking postage and travel expenses. I am also grateful on behalf of members of LAMA that the Minister of State has acknowledged their concerns. With regard to expenditure on foreign travel and seminars, not every councillor is afforded the opportunity, or can afford the opportunity, to travel. The system should apply across the board and not just to cathaoirligh and other people who may be able to travel. I am grateful to the Minister of State. Perhaps he will return with better news when the review is completed.