Today's Order of Business is Nos. 1, 2 and 3. On No. 1, the contribution of each spokesperson on Second Stage shall not exceed 20 minutes and those of other Senators shall not exceed 15 minutes. Senators may share time. Report and Final Stages of No. 2, a Seanad Bill returning from the Dáil with amendments, are to be taken today. On No. 3, statements on the censorship laws in Ireland, spokespersons will have 20 minutes while all other Senators will have ten minutes. Senators may share time.
Order of Business.
I draw the attention of the House to crisis in the quality of river water and the threat this poses to the tourism industry. There is a Bill on the Order Paper developed by two of the finest minds in Fianna Fáil. They laboured hard to produce a solution to this problem. When I was Leader of the House, I made valuable time available to agree Second Stage of that Bill. We owe it to the then Senators who worked so hard on the problem to produce this Bill. It is a disgrace that it has been left to one side for two years. Will the Leader take immediate steps for the resumption of that Bill or will he start debate on the new Bill in the names of Senators O'Toole, Taylor-Quinn and O'Meara? The steps which the Leader outlined to the House earlier this year have had no effect.
Members of the House will be interested in the article by the Taoiseach in The Irish Times today in which he outlines the reasons Ireland should join Partnership for Peace. Apart from the fact that what he says is the opposite of what he said before the election, and the promise of a referendum has gone by the way, if the Taoiseach is making Partnership for Peace an issue in the European elections, the least this House can do is hold a full debate on the issue. People would like to know the reasons behind the volte face by Fianna Fáil on this issue. Senator O'Kennedy fulminated day after day from these benches against Partnership for Peace. Now there has been a conversion on the road to the polls. This debate should be held next week.
I thank Senator Manning for raising the Shannon River Council Bill. This has gone beyond a joke. There is absolute agreement about this on all sides of the House. The Bill should be re-entered by the Leader. We need to see movement on it.
Today the Taoiseach and Leader of Fianna Fáil made another statement about the question of ethics in public life and people standing for election. I would hope that there would be nothing in that which would conflict in any way with the views of the Houses on the Ethics in Public Office Act, 1995. I also hope that there is nothing in it which appears to give the impression that everybody in public life from any party is guilty of something before they start. This is a matter on which people must take a clear line. If there are things which are wrong, we should improve it but it should not begin from the basis that people in public office have something to explain. We need to have a sense of our position.
I draw the attention of the House to an issue which was raised here last week by my colleague, Senator Norris, following the "States of Fear" documentary. I have asked the Leader of the House time and again for a debate on mandatory reporting and related issues. I am appalled at the way Sr. Stanislaus Kennedy has been treated over the past two weeks. She is an innocent person who happened to be in a place where there was wrongdoing. We have dumped on her the sins of the past. Any 25 year old nun in a similar situation today would have no options to deal with such a situation either because there are no structures in place. It is a dumping ground. We can be all secure in looking at the whys and wherefores of 30 years while refusing to deal with the problems of today. There is still a problem of child abuse. Support is still lacking for victims, for people against whom allegations have been made and for professionals who become aware of or suspect child abuse or to whom disclosures are made.
A Chathaoirligh, I know I have gone outside my remit in dealing with that at this point. We need to have a debate which will find a proper balance to deal with this horrific cancer in society. If the Government issues a White Paper on mandatory reporting before it has been properly discussed and if they will be talked out of their pre-election position again, it will have a great deal for which to answer.
I agree with the previous speakers with regard to the re-introduction of the Shannon River Council Bill, which has been on the Order Paper for almost 18 months, having been introduced originally by the Government side when in Opposition. It is high time the House debated Second Stage. The River Shannon is the largest river in these isles. It is extremely important in the context of today's report on water quality that we should look at the quality of water in our major river.
I support Senator Manning's call for a debate on Partnership for Peace. I would not like to see the Government's decision to join PfP as simply a fait accompli considering their programme for Government clearly stated that there would be a referendum on it. The least we should expect from the Leader of the House is a debate in this House.
I ask the Leader to seek clarification on the question of the tender process for the issuing of welfare payments. New information seems to be emerging that the pass is already sold on this issue, that three months ago the Minister for Social, Community and Family Affairs placed an advertisement of the EU journals advertising for tenders for the £35 million contract and that it was placed under the financial rather than the social section. Is that true? Will the Leader seek clarification for this House that there was a Cabinet decision not to make a public announcement until after the elections? If that is the case, then the Government is making decisions by sleight of hand. It has implications, as we heard today, for 1,500 of the 1,900 post offices. That is a major issue for all sides of the House. The House is owed a clear statement on the matter before it is too late.
Obviously I join the Leader of the Opposition and others who mentioned that 30 per cent of rivers are polluted. There is in place through the local authority system a joint approach to monitoring the River Shannon and its tributaries. It is on account of that that we received this vital information. Whatever the merits of the Bill—
It is a good Bill.
—to which the Senators referred, what has happened at that level is to be welcomed.
It is still a good Bill.
The initiative which was shown by the county councils along the River Shannon has proven to be effective and far-sighted.
Last week I called for a debate on genetically modified foods. I raise the matter again in light of new information which has been brought to the attention of the public that it has been proven that genetically modified corn has an effect on insect life. What assurances can be given that genetically modified foods are safe for humans? It is time to call a halt on this. The House would do well to debate the matter. There are many views on this and I know the public feel uncertain about it. The House should give its views and many professional people here who would have strong views on the matter. As somebody who worked in the health field for many years, I would have great reservations. I ask the Leader to afford us the opportunity to debate this pressing issue during this session.
I ask the Leader to suggest some way in which the House can play a positive role in the Drumcree situation, whether by having a debate or some other means. I have tried to use this forum to address people from my cultural background in the North and I would suggest that perhaps people from a different cultural background, particularly the Nationalist side, should use the means at their disposal to talk to people on their side. It is not just about one side. There is a fair amount of political constipation on the Nationalist side also, as anyone will know who listened today to the aggressive whinge of Breandán Mac Cionnaith on the radio. If the people of Drumcree on both sides can be encouraged by their people here to do something, they may help to unlock the peace process.
I support Senator Manning, in particular, and others who called for a debate on Partnership for Peace. There is peace-keeping in Kosovo now, in which we would be enmeshed if we had gone along the line suggested, I am sorry to say, by the Joint Committee on Foreign Affairs under the chairmanship of Deputy O'Malley. What is peace-keeping in Kosovo? NATO has bombed a hospital in the past 24 hours, they bombed the Chinese Embassy, they bombed the Swedish Embassy and they bombed civilian targets. They have used cluster bombs which attract children. These are aggressive weapons against civilians. They are using nuclear-tipped weapons which will affect generations of unborn children. We must have a debate on this, as we were promised. We were promised a referendum by the Taoiseach also. We may need another referendum because I understood – I came up against it in a court case – that the Constitution specifically invokes Christianity. If the Government will not allow that to affect their foreign policy in some way, then it ought to remove it from the Constitution. Let us have a referendum to remove the word Christian from the Constitution, if we are serious about joining the partnership for the kind of peace-keeping operations which are taking place in Kosovo.
In the light of the fact that the House has frequently passed legislation which included amendments covering the rights of travellers, the House should note – I know we cannot ask for a vote of sympathy – the passing of Mr. Victor Bewley, who took up this subject when it was unpopular.
I ask the Leader to arrange a debate on the yesterday's report on emigrants in Britain. We have discussed this matter on many occasions but yesterday's report relates specifically to emigrants from the 1950s. The report, which makes very sad reading, shows that of all the ethnic groups in Britain at the moment, the people who emigrated from Ireland in the 1950s are now the most deprived. These are our forgotten people. Whether we like it or not, the report is an indictment of us as a people. It is very important to remember that when those people left Ireland in the 1950s, they did so out of sheer necessity in order that those who remained at home would have a greater share of the national cake and a better quality of life. They continued to send money back to Ireland out of their hard earned wages. We would not be celebrating the Celtic tiger phenomenon today were it not for the suffering of those emigrants. I hope the Seanad will take a leading role on this urgent matter and I urge the Leader to consider having a debate on it.
I join with Senator Costello's comments on An Post. If problems are experienced with the contract, they will result in the further devastation of rural Ireland. The number of stamps sold in rural post offices is minuscule but the post offices are social centres where the elderly congregate to collect their pensions. We should seek clarification on the matter.
The Oireachtas Joint Committee on Health and Children has issued a report on attention deficit disorder carried out by the research institute. The report has been circulated to Oireachtas Members and reveals the lack of services and the enormous stress and strain experienced by ADD sufferers and their families. The report is a very good one which we should debate in the House before the summer recess and whose recommendations we should urge the Minister for Health and Children to implement.
Will the Leader ask the Minister for Health and Children to outline to the House the procedures which are currently in place in regard to the inspection of adult and child institutions in Ireland? We like to think that sexual abuse and neglect no longer occur but what procedures are in place for the inspection of residential units for people with special needs and for the inspection of psychiatric institutions? I am led to believe that institutions are forewarned if inspections are due to take place. That is not right. I would like the Leader to bring the matter to the Minister's attention. Perhaps we can prevent the recurrence of the types of cases which occurred 20 years ago.
On the proposed contract for social welfare payments, I agree with the sentiments expressed in regard to the rural population and the need to preserve the community facility offered by local post offices. In the outer urban areas of our cities in which there is a high level of dependence on social welfare payments, one sees unseemly queues every Thursday morning for up to an hour in some cases. There is merit in the card payment system but perhaps we could combine the two payment methods and offer people a choice. We should not let one system take over completely. Plastic is being pushed on us all the time and, while it suits many people, it may not suit others. We should adopt a more comprehensive approach to the manner in which services are delivered.
Aontaím go hiomlán leis an méid atá ráite ag an Seanadóir Ó Murchú and I support his call for the Seanad to play a pivotal role in addressing the problems experienced by Irish emigrants. Our emigrants made a tremendous contribution to the development of Ireland when we could not sustain such development ourselves. The Seanad offers a good forum through which the issue could be addressed. When we debate this matter, I would like the discussion to extend to those who have emigrated in recent times, often without the necessary support services or back-up information to equip them for life abroad.
I also support the call for a debate on rural post offices and any impact a decision on the distribution of social welfare payments might have. Post offices are part of the social fabric and economic life of rural communities. I welcome the Minister's commitment on this matter and the fact that An Post has committed itself to taking part in a tendering process should that be necessary. Any debate on this issue should take account of the fact that the cost of administering social welfare payments through the post offices is of the order of 70p or 80p per unit whereas cheques cost approximately 50p. E-commerce, which will surely be the future method of payment as we enter the new millennium, costs between 3p and 7p per unit. A decision on this matter must be cost effective as well as supporting the fabric of rural communities.
I join in the comments on the franchise for social welfare payments, 90 per cent or more of which is currently held by An Post. I propose that the Minister for Social, Community and Family Affairs come into the House next week to explain the situation to us. There are echoes here of what occurred eight years ago when the then Minister for Communications, Deputy Séamus Brennan, prepared a strategic plan.
Almost a year has passed since the agreement to set up a permanent International Criminal Court was signed in Rome. We have raised the matter with the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform on a number of occasions and he indicated that legislation would be introduced to allow Ireland to ratify the agreement. A conference is due to be held in Trinidad in July to review progress on the issue. It is regrettable that Ireland has made very little progress. Will the Leader ask the Minister to introduce legislation on this matter as soon as possible? As we have only a few weeks to go before the summer recess, perhaps the legislation could be dealt with when the House reconvenes in autumn.
I raised the issue of rural post offices yesterday and called on the Leader to ask the Minister to come into the House to explain the situation. This issue needs to be fully explored to ascertain all the facts. No amount of press releases will deal with the issue which is very important for rural communities.
I want to refer to a point raised by Senator Norris. I did not hear this morning's interview with Mr. Mac Cionnaith but Senator Norris should not concentrate on the way a person conveys his or her point. Mr. Mac Cionnaith is not the only person whingeing. The reality is that only one side has been blocking the situation in and around Drumcree and Portadown. The Orange Order has tried to bully its way down the Garvaghy Road and Mr. Mac Cionnaith, regardless of his personality, is voicing the views of the people he represents.
I support Senator O'Toole's comments on Sr. Stanislaus Kennedy with whom I grew up and who was a neighbour of mine. The allegations about the deeds that were supposed to have been done under the jurisdiction are false. She is a good and kind person and I support the call by Senator O'Toole that the media and others who are persecuting her should refrain from doing so.
I support the comments made about rural post offices and I would like a debate on the issue. Many post offices in rural villages have closed and nobody in those villages applied to operate them because they would receive the same salary now that was paid 60 years ago. It is time An Post paid adequately postmasters and postmistresses operating in rural areas. We should make a stand in this House to ensure the people who give an excellent postal and social service to rural communities are recognised and paid properly for their premises and the work they do. An Post should be ashamed of the miserly amount it pays rural post offices for both rent and services.
Senators Manning, O'Toole, Costello, Finneran and Bonner expressed concern about the quality of fresh water sources and called for Second Stage of the Shannon River Council Bill to be taken. As I have told the House on previous occasions, work is ongoing in that regard. I understand it is because of the ongoing work in Senator Finneran's own county of Roscommon and County Clare that this information has been made public. I have no difficulty discussing this matter with the leaders of the various groups to see how we can progress this excellent proposed legislation, which was introduced in the House by two eminent former Ministers who were excellent contributors in the previous Seanad and who were, rightly, returned to the Dáil in the last election.
That is why we are so enthusiastic about it.
I agree with Senator Manning in his respect for Deputy Daly and Deputy O'Kennedy and I will do everything I can in this regard, as someone who lives in a county which adjoins the Shannon and recognises that the river is a wonderful asset for the country.
I thank the Leader for his comments.
In response to Senators Manning, Costello, Norris and O'Toole, I have no difficulty allocating time for a debate on Partnership for Peace. It is timely and I will see what I can do in that regard.
Senators O'Toole, Tom Fitzgerald and others referred to the issue of mandatory reporting of child abuse and expressed concern about Sister Stanislaus Kennedy. I will allow time for a debate on this matter also.
Senators Costello, Jackman, Ridge, Walsh, Bonner, Connor and Finneran expressed concern about the need for a debate on the post office issue and the proposed new contract. I read a statement in the House yesterday, which I received from the Department, to try to clarify this matter. I have a further statement which I understand Senators received yesterday. I have no difficulty in having a debate on post offices. The position is straightforward. Rural Ireland needs the post office system and, as pointed out by Senator Walsh and other Senators, it is part of the way of life. As a former employee of the post office, I understand the difficulties being experienced by many people employed in the postal service who are poorly paid. These people provide a necessary service in rural areas and I have no difficulty asking the Minister to come to the House for a wide-ranging debate on the future of our post offices, possibly before the local elections if the time can be found.
I do not envisage the House will sit in the week of the local elections. The elections will be held on a Friday and it is not customary for the House to sit on the day following a Bank Holiday Monday. The only possibility, therefore, is to sit on the Wednesday of that week but as many Members are seeking election to local authorities, it is only fair that time be allocated for this – perhaps a four hour debate – but that is not possible before the elections. Perhaps the leader of the main Opposition party can find time to facilitate the requests of his Senators. Private Members' time is available to him next Wednesday and I can extend that time with the agreement of the House under Standing Orders, if he wishes to have a debate on the matter. I am trying to facilitate all Senators who are anxious that all post offices, rural or otherwise, remain open.
Senator Finneran called for a debate on genetically modified foods. I can make time for such a debate.
Senator Norris asked if there was some way the serious issue of Drumcree could be addressed. I will discuss with the Minister the possibility of having a debate on Northern Ireland. The Northern peace talks are facing the greatest difficulty since the Good Friday Agreement was reached. I would like to facilitate Senator Norris in his request and the many requests made by other Senators over the past number of weeks. I do not want to over-state the case but it is my belief, and I am sure most people will agree, that these are the most serious times for the Good Friday Agreement. I will provide time for a debate on Northern Ireland if it is the view of the Minister that such a debate would be timely.
Senators Ó Murchú and Walsh called for a debate on the report on Irish emigrants in the UK which was published yesterday. People who grew up in the 1950s – that includes most of us in this House – have friends who had to take the boat to England when they left school because they could not get employment here. Many of them are still there. They may not be in good shape physically or financially and our hearts go out to them because they did not get the opportunities young people get today, including an excellent education system and a choice of employment. Over 70 per cent of the people who left school in the 1950s were 14 years of age. We should have a debate in this House as a mark of solidarity with the generation who grew up in the 1950s and as an indication of our understanding of what it was like to have to leave one's country because of lack of opportunity.
I will pass on the views expressed by Senator Leonard. I agree that prior notice should not be given of inspections of institutions. Her suggestion is worthwhile and we will have time to debate this issue in the future. I will consider how to progress Senator Connor's proposal to the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform on the forthcoming legislation and I will give him a timeframe in that regard.
Order of Business agreed to.