Seanad Éireann debate -
Tuesday, 10 Feb 2009

Vol. 193 No. 12

Schools Building Projects.

Senator Pearse Doherty

Is ceist an-thábhachtach atá agam le chur os comhair an tSeanaid, ceist a leanann ar aghaidh as an díospóireacht a bhí againn níos luaithe leis an Aire Oideachais agus Eolaíochta, An Teachta Batt O'Keeffe, ar chúrsaí oideachais agus an faillí atá á dhéanamh ag an Rialtas ar chúrsaí oideachais sa Stát.

My matter deals with two school building projects, both of which are in my home parish. The first is a primary school, Bunbeg national school, or Scoil Chonaill Naofa, and the other school is Pobalscoil Gaoth Dobhair. I attended the national school in my youth and I also attended the secondary school, Pobalscoil Gaoth Dobhair, so I know both schools very well. I could probably stand here and ask similar questions about many other schools throughout County Donegal. I could talk about Glen Swilly which has been seeking an extension since 1992. The school changed its name since then and its official name is now Seeking an Extension since 1992. Another school has more prefabs than blocks and mortar. I could talk about Gortahork national school or Creeslough national school but I have focused on these two schools. Like many of the other schools I have mentioned and many more which I have not mentioned, they need and deserve the extensions and the ancillary facilities they have been demanding for many years. I have raised these cases numerous times in this House and the Minister of State is well familiar with the case that has been made by me and others for the need for the building works to go ahead.

The one point I will focus on is that the Government has committed to these two projects for many years. Pobalscoil Gaoth Dobhair is looking for PE facilities. It is one of the few, if not the only, Gaeltacht secondary school that does not have such a facility. It excels in sport but the pupils have to travel miles to facilities and this has its own effect on the funds available to the school to pay for buses which is more difficult with the cutbacks. This also has an effect on the school's carbon emissions and on the environment. In this day and age it is not good that this school has somehow been left behind even though as far back as the 1980s when Fine Gael was in power, a commitment was made for the works to proceed. What makes the situation worse is that in June 2006, the go-ahead was given for this project and further permission was given in May 2007. Funding has been committed by the Department of Education and Science and the Department of Community, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs, and the school has also collected its own portion of the money. In May 2007 the school received a letter saying the project would be on site no later than eight months from the date of the letter; this is long past.

The national school, Scoil Chonaill, Bunbeg, is one of the feeder schools for the secondary school. The Minister will know about this case in detail because he received a delegation from the school made up of the board of management, teachers and parents' representatives and I also attended. We thanked him for his attention to the need for the extension to that school. I will not go over the reasons but suffice to say the school is unsafe. I have produced electrical reports for the House which show that this is not a safe school. There is no trip switch, no fire alarms and the electrics have been condemned. I can tell the House about things that are happening and the dangerous condition of the school but I do not wish to make people fearful. The Minister knows how dangerous this school is and there needs to be a commitment to move this project on. What sets this school apart from many of the others is that the commitment was made by Government. I raised this point with the Minister when he met the deputation from the school and he was unaware of the commitment.

Just before I left my office to come to the Chamber, I printed out a page from the website of the Department of Education and Science which details the school building programme for 2006. It stated in March 2006 that 36 primary schools and four post-primary schools throughout the country with major building projects had been approved to proceed to tender and construction stage. Outlining details of the schools, the then Minister for Education and Science, Deputy Mary Hanafin, said:

These projects are in addition to the 15 major school building projects which I have already approved to progress to tender and construction earlier this year. The projects will go to tender and construction on a rolling basis over the next 12 to 15 months when the schools concerned and the design teams are in a position to advise the Department that the projects have advanced to the point where tenders can be sought.

Both these schools have received planning permission and letters. They are named on the Department's website today as being allowed to go to tender and construction. Both these schools are still denied that right.

I ask the Minister of State to come clean, to tell the people of Gweedore whether their primary school and their secondary school will be built. Will the pupils of that area get what they deserve? Are we going to put people back into work in those communities by building those schools? There have been too many letters, too many false promises and too many false dawns. I am encouraged that there might be movement here but I would like the Minister of State to say these vital projects will be allowed go ahead.

Deputy Seán Haughey

I am taking this adjournment on behalf of my colleague, Deputy Batt O'Keeffe, Minister for Education and Science. I thank the Senator for raising this matter as it provides me with the opportunity to outline to the Seanad the Government's strategy for capital investment in education projects and also to outline the current position regarding Scoil Chonaill, Bunbeg, County Donegal and Pobalscoil Gaoth Dobhair, County Donegal.

The modernisation of facilities in our existing building stock as well as the need to respond to emerging needs in areas of rapid population growth is a significant challenge. The Government has shown a consistent determination to improve the condition of our school buildings and to ensure the appropriate facilities are in place to enable the implementation of a broad and balanced curriculum.

All applications for capital funding are assessed in the modernisation and policy unit of my Department. The assessment process determines the extent and type of need presenting, based on the demographics of an area, proposed housing developments, condition of buildings, site capacity etc., leading ultimately to an appropriate accommodation solution.

As part of this process, a project is assigned a band rating under published prioritisation criteria for large-scale building projects. These criteria were devised following consultation with the education partners. Projects are selected for inclusion in the school building and modernisation programme on the basis of priority of need. This is reflected in the band rating assigned to a project. In other words, a proposed building project moves through the system commensurate with the band rating assigned to it.

There are four band ratings overall, of which band one is the highest and band four the lowest. Band one projects, for example, include the provision of buildings where none currently exists but where there is a high demand for pupil places, while a band four project makes provision for desirable but not necessarily urgent or essential facilities, such as a library or new sports hall.

In relation to Scoil Chonaill, Bunbeg, the brief for this extension-refurbishment project is to provide accommodation for a long-term projected staffing of a principal plus four mainstream class teachers plus ancillary staff.

The project, which has been assigned a band rating of 2.1, is at an advanced stage of architectural planning and planning permission has been received. The Minister, Deputy O'Keeffe, met with a deputation from Scoil Chonaill, Bunbeg in December 2008. A new cost-saving proposal for the decanting of pupils for the duration of the project was presented at the meeting and was welcomed by the Minister. However, it is not possible at this stage to be precise about when this project will go to construction.

In relation to Pobalscoil Ghaoth Dobhair, this project, which involves the provision of a new PE hall, is at an advanced stage of architectural planning. The project has a band rating of 4.1. While it is not possible at this stage to be precise about when this project will go to construction because of higher competing priorities — I refer in particular to the need to provide new schools in rapidly developing areas — I can say that the project will be considered for progression as the school building and modernisation programme is rolled out.

The progression of all large-scale building projects, including these projects, from initial design stage through to construction, is dependent on the prioritisation of competing demands on the funding available under my Department's capital budget. These projects will be considered in the context of my Department's multi-annual school building and modernisation programme.

The allocation for school buildings in 2009 is €581million. This represents a significant investment in the school building and modernisation programme. This level of funding for the building programme, at a time of great pressure on public finances, is a sign of the Government's commitment to investing in school infrastructure and will permit the continuation of progress in the overall improvement of school accommodation. Under the recovery plan, announced last week by the Taoiseach, a further €75 million has been allocated to the schools building programme for 2009.

I thank the Senator for giving me the opportunity to outline to the Seanad the position regarding the schools building projects for Scoil Chonaill, Bunbeg and Pobalscoil Ghaoth Dobhair.

Senator Pearse Doherty

I am tired of hearing the same response to the position of these two schools. To clear up this nonsense once and for all, will the Minister write to Scoil Chonaill, Bunbeg, informing it that what was on the departmental website in 2006 was a complete and utter lie? Will he inform the school there is no intention to allow it to go to construction and tender as stated on the departmental website? Will he also write to Pobalscoil Ghaoth Dobhair informing it that the letter sent to it in May 2006 is also a lie and the project will not be delivered in eight months because the time has come and gone? It is simply not good enough. The Government keeps telling us about investment in education, but it is not happening for those schools whose building projects were approved two years ago. It is just not acceptable.

FÁS Training Programmes.

Senator Jerry Buttimer

Cuirim fáilte roimh an Aire Stáit go dtí an Teach. I thank the Cathaoirleach for allowing me to raise this matter. Much has been said today about retraining and upskilling in this economic climate but the plight of redundant apprentices is as important. Many Members of both Houses have been approached by apprentices who are concerned their training programmes are in jeopardy.

Approximately 3,600 apprentices are redundant. The number of new apprentices entering the workforce is down 39%, with construction related apprenticeships down 54%. The fall in apprentice registrations has occurred in tandem with a rise in youth unemployment, the under 25 age group, which is staggering and frightening.

In September the Tánaiste and Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment announced the employer-based redundant apprentice rotation scheme, but it only covers a proportion of apprentices. Deputy Leo Varadkar, the Fine Gael enterprise, trade and employment spokesman, suggested the scheme seven months before the Tánaiste when he realised the number of apprentices on the live register between January and July 2007 had trebled. What will happen to the plan when it runs out at the end of 2009? With the number of apprentices being made redundant in the past 12 months, is the plan sufficient to cater for the majority of them? The Government often speaks of upskilling the workforce and developing a knowledge-based economy. What plans are in place for apprentices?

I welcome the ESB's announcement today that it will take on 400 redundant apprentices, a great move by it in a week when it was lambasted for allowing a pay rise. The company's chief executive, Pádraig McManus, was correct when he stated that without full qualifications, apprentices would not be able to work as electricians. If we are serious about upskilling and educational qualifications, we need to allow young people who have signed up for a trade to finish their training. In Cork city, up to 6,000 people have lost their jobs in the past year, a 75% increase in a year, and many of them were apprentices. Up to 3,600 apprentices across the country are unable to complete their training and earn their qualifications. In December, a scheme was announced to allow 500 of them to conclude their training. Having these apprentices out of work does not assist their practical training. What other initiatives will be introduced to allow FÁS apprentices to finish their training and to be employable when the economic upturn occurs?

Deputy Seán Haughey

Since the beginning of last year a significant contraction has occurred in activity in the construction sector. Consequently, as a result of this contraction, we have witnessed a substantial reduction in the numbers of people employed in the construction sector in the past 12 months. This has had a severe impact on the individuals undertaking an apprenticeship.

The scale of the downturn in the construction sector is clear when it is considered that at the end of last month the apprenticeship population was 22,561. Last year, the apprenticeship population was 28,252, a 20% reduction in 12 months. In addition to this decrease, by the end of last month FÁS had been notified of 3,695 apprentices being made redundant. The high level of redundant apprentices is of particular concern given the structure of the apprenticeship system. It is a demand-driven educational and training programme for employed people aimed at developing the skills of the apprentice to meet the needs of industry and the labour market. It consists of seven phases divided into four on-the-job and three off-the-job phases.

An apprentice is required to be employed to complete the necessary on-the-job training. The on-the-job training is designed to enable the apprentice to develop the skill, knowledge and competence to reach the required level of mastery in his or her trade. This implies that apprentices who have been made redundant are, therefore, not in a position to complete their apprenticeship. The Government is aware of the difficult situation in which redundant apprentices find themselves. It is committed to assisting redundant apprentices to gain employment as soon as possible in Ireland or abroad to complete their apprentices.

The Tánaiste and Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment, the Department of Enterprise, Trade and Employment and the Department of Education and Science have been working closely with FÁS, the institutes of technology, the Higher Education Authority and the social partners in introducing measures to address the problems confronting redundant apprentices.

The measures introduced to date comprise the Department of Social and Family Affairs immediately referring redundant apprentices to FÁS for assistance. Following this immediate referral, the FÁS employment services and FÁS services to business divisions work in collaboration to assist the apprentice source a new approved employer to allow completion of the apprenticeship as soon as possible. To date, FÁS has succeeded in securing alternative employment for 1,081 apprentices made redundant.

However, more than 3,600 apprentices remain redundant. In the absence of options for workplace experience, FÁS has put in place an interim measure whereby apprentices who are made redundant can progress to the next off-the-job training phase in the education sector. This means the apprentice does not need to do the on-the-job phase and can go directly to the next off-the-job phase, in line with the current scheduling criteria. At the end of last year, a total of 439 redundant apprentices were attending an off-the-job phase — phases 2, 4 and 6 — under this interim measure. A further 505 redundant apprentices are scheduled to attend one of these phases in the coming months.

FÁS is also examining what advantages can be offered by EU-sponsored programmes that facilitate mobility for workers and apprentices. For example, in October of last year, it was successful in responding to a national call for mobility projects under the Leonardo da Vinci programme, the EU's vocational educational training programme. As a result, approximately 25 redundant apprentices will complete a period of on-the-job training in suitable European companies, thereby facilitating the completion of their apprenticeships.

In addition to these measures, at the end of last year the Tánaiste announced the launch of a new FÁS initiative — the employer-based redundant apprentice rotation scheme — aimed at providing the necessary on-the-job experience for redundant apprentices. The purpose of the scheme in question is to give up to 500 redundant apprentices the opportunity to complete the on-the-job phase of their apprenticeships to gain the required knowledge, skill and competence to progress successfully to the next off-the-job phase or to complete their apprenticeships. Employers with a past record of providing consistent systematic training are being asked to provide redundant apprentices with an opportunity to complete their on-the-job phase in the following five trades: carpentry and joinery, electrical, plastering, plumbing and bricklaying.

The scheme works on the basis that FÁS will place redundant apprentices with an eligible employer. These individuals will replace any existing apprentices who have been released to attend scheduled off-the-job phase of their apprenticeships. The employers in question will provide the necessary workplace training and assessment to the redundant apprentices. The scheme will support redundant apprentices on-the-job training relating to phases 3, 5 and 7. Employers participating in the scheme are required to pay apprentices the agreed industry rates for the specific apprenticeship trades they are pursuing and FÁS will make a contribution of €340 per week — based on a 39-hour working week — towards employment costs incurred. The total cost of the scheme will be in the order of €4 million and this will support the provision of training for up to 500 redundant apprentices. FÁS is in the process of recruiting employers and redundant apprentices to the scheme and it expects that approximately 85 redundant apprentices will commence their on-the-job experience under the scheme in the coming weeks.

I am pleased that the ESB announced earlier today a programme under which it will begin training a total of 400 redundant electrical apprentices. This represents 50% of the estimated total of 800 electrical apprentices who have lost their jobs. Under the programme, which was agreed with FÁS, ESB Networks will provide the necessary on-the-job training opportunities for redundant apprentices from next month. This vital programme will assist these 400 redundant electrical apprentices to complete their apprenticeships. I congratulate all parties involved in organising this important initiative.

In light of the wide variety and comprehensive nature of the measures I have outlined, it is clear the Government is responding quickly to the pressing issue of redundant apprentices. The significant steps the Government has taken are aimed specifically at assisting redundant apprentices to progress and complete their apprenticeships. The measures I have outlined will lead to approximately 1,900 redundant apprentices being given the opportunity to progress their apprenticeships in the coming months.

The Government remains committed to assisting redundant apprentices in this particularly difficult period. We will, in conjunction with the appropriate agencies and social partners, continue to explore what further positive options might be available to assist our redundant apprentices in the short to medium term.

Senator Jerry Buttimer

I thank the Minister of State for his reply and I welcome the initiatives that have been put in place. However, there are a number of people who will not be able to conclude their training. What is planned in respect of these individuals? In light of the situation with regard to apprenticeships, what does the Government intend to do to entice people to become apprentices and to attract sponsors for them? The Government has not outlined a clear vision or plan in this regard.

Deputy Seán Haughey

This matter is being examined on an ongoing basis and as developments arise. I outlined what we have done to date but the situation obviously is being kept under constant review.

Senator Jerry Buttimer

There is no plan for the 1,700 who will not be able to conclude their training.

The Seanad adjourned at 7.45 p.m. until 10.30 a.m. on Wednesday, 11 February 2009.