Adjournment Matters

Turbary Rights

Senator Kathryn Reilly

This matter relates to the need for the Minister for Arts, Heritage and the Gaeltacht to discuss the progress made to date to establish a panel to hear and determine appeals on turf cutting and harvesting rights, the timeframe for its establishment, when it will begin its work and appeals will be heard. Under the provisions of the Wildlife (Amendment) Act 2000, the carrying out of certain works in national heritage areas, including the extraction of turf, cannot take place without the consent of the Minister. The Department is in contact with the General Council of the Bar of Ireland and the Law Society of Ireland about establishing a panel to draw upon in hearing and determining appeals in that regard.

Under section 19 of the Wildlife (Amendment) Act, people are eligible to appeal the Minister's decision to an independent arbitrator. I am anxious to establish what progress has been made to date in establishing the panel. A number of people have approached me about this issue. They made appeals one year ago, but they have not received any word about when the appeals will be heard because the panel has not yet been established. Will the Minister report on progress to date with the General Council of the Bar of Ireland and the Law Society of Ireland in establishing a panel and indicate when they will start work on the appeals made? It is particularly pertinent because there are many impatient people who are anxious to harvest turf. Given the seasonal nature of turf cutting, it must happen as soon as possible. They made their appeals over one year ago, but they have not heard anything about them since. Will the Minister update the House on the issue?

Minister for Arts, Heritage and the Gaeltacht (Deputy Jimmy Deenihan)

I thank the Senator for raising this matter and I am glad to have the opportunity to bring her up to date on the establishment of the appeals board and the timeline for it.

Ireland has a particular responsibility to look after its peatland heritage. Our raised bogs are rare ecosystems and a high proportion of the remaining raised bogs in western Europe are to be found in Ireland. We also have extensive areas of blanket bog along the western seaboard and on all our uplands which are a defining feature of the Irish landscape. Further to its obligations under the EU habitats directive, Ireland has designated a total of 53 raised bog special areas of conservation, SACs. We have also designated 75 raised bogs as natural heritage areas under the Wildlife Acts. Many of our best blanket bogs are also designated as special areas of conservation or natural heritage areas.

Raised bogs are particularly sensitive to drainage and turf cutting, which is why we have had to take steps to end cutting on our raised bog SACs. Blanket bogs are more robust and can withstand extraction where properly managed. However, they can also be adversely affected by cutting where it is carried out in the wrong place, on a large scale or using inappropriate equipment such as "sausage machines". For these reasons, both the Wildlife (Amendment) Act 2000 and the European Communities (Birds and Natural Habitats) Regulations 2011 require my consent for specified operations or activities within the designated sites, unless otherwise consented to, for example, under planning permission. The extraction of turf is one such activity requiring consent. Where I believe an activity might have an adverse effect on the natural habitat of a designated site, I am generally required to refuse consent. In these cases, the applicant is entitled to appeal the decision.

In the case of a natural heritage area, the Wildlife (Amendment Act) 2000 requires that I appoint a person "who shall be a barrister or solicitor of not less than 7 years standing, for the purpose of determining an appeal...". In the case of a special area of conservation, the Birds and Natural Habitats Regulations 2011 require that I appoint "a person or persons with appropriate knowledge and experience to consider appeals...". To date, no appeals have been heard relating to a refusal of consent in natural heritage areas or special areas of conservation. My Department has been in contact with the General Council of the Bar of Ireland and the Law Society of Ireland about establishing a panel to be drawn upon in hearing and determining such appeals. I expect to be in a position to establish the panel within the next two weeks and any appeals will then be heard at the earliest possible date. I also intend to add persons with ecological expertise to the panel as soon as possible. That will be good news for the Senator. There is a commitment on the part of the Department to establish the panel in the next two weeks.

Senator Kathryn Reilly

I thank the Minister. Perhaps he might keep me up to date when the panel has been set up.

Schools Building Projects

Senator Brian Ó Domhnaill

I apologise for being late. I was at a meeting with a charity group and it ran over time a little. I am glad to see my friend and colleague, Deputy Jimmy Deenihan, looking so fit despite holding ministerial office. He still keeps in shape and is looking fresh and fit.

The subject of this debate is two primary schools in my constituency, Scoil Náisiúnta Gort a Choirce in my village and St. Mary's national school in Stranorlar, County Donegal. Scoil Náisiúnta Gort a Choirce has been the subject of much debate since approximately 2001 when the board of management sought a new school building. After much campaigning, approval was given in 2006-07 to proceed through the architectural planning stages and design to site acquisition and so forth. Unfortunately, however, the process of site acquisition ran into problems due to planning issues. Subsequently, the board of management sent a further recommendation to the Minister for Education and Skills, Deputy Ruairí Quinn, but, unfortunately, that recommendation did not receive favourable consideration and the school is not included in the five year capital programme to 2017.

The same can be said of St. Mary's national school in Stranorlar. The planning application for a school on a new site is going through the planning process in Donegal County Council. It is at the further information stage and that information is being gathered and due to be submitted to the council. I hope the application receives favourable consideration from it. However, it appears that even if it does receive permission, the project has effectively been dropped from the capital works programme, even though it was approved in the 2011 capital programme. It is not included in the 2012-16 programme. The expectation, therefore, is that both schools will be left out until at least 2017.

I am raising the matter in the hope there will be some clarity. I appreciate that the Minister is not responsible for the Department of Education and Skills, but I look forward to hearing the response provided by the Department.

Deputy Jimmy Deenihan

The Senator should know that I hope to resume our activities again in the near future. We have a long friendship as a result of our training for marathons and so forth. It is good to be in the Seanad, even if I might not be bringing the Senator the best of news.

Senator Brian Ó Domhnaill

Do not let me down. Be gentle.

Deputy Jimmy Deenihan

The Minister for Education and Skills, Deputy Ruairí Quinn, is unavoidably absent and sends his apologies. On his behalf, I thank the Senator for raising the matter as it provides an opportunity to clarify the current position on the application for new school buildings for Scoil Náisiúnta Gort a Choirce and St. Mary's national school, Stranorlar.

The Senator may find it helpful if I set out the context within which decisions relating to meeting the accommodation needs of schools must be considered in the coming years. He will be aware of the demographic challenge we are facing. Total enrolment is expected to grow by around 70,000 students between now and 2018 — by over 45,000 at primary level and 25,000 at post-primary level. Second level enrolment is expected to continue to rise until at least 2024. In view of the need to ensure every child has access to a school place, the delivery of major school projects to meet the demographic demands nationally will be the main focus of capital investment in schools in the coming years. The five year programme announced recently is focused on meeting these demographic needs.

For purposes of the five-year plan, new schools building projects, as well as major extensions, have been identified and prioritised on the basis of meeting future demographic needs in areas in which such needs have been identified. Owing to the financial constraints imposed by the need to prioritise the limited funding available for the provision of school accommodation to meet demographic requirements, it has not been possible to advance all applications for capital funding concurrently.

In the case of scoil náisiúnta Ghort a' Choirce, the brief for the project is to provide a new school building. While preliminary work to acquire a greenfield site was undertaken, planning permission has been refused in respect of this proposed site. Department officials have been in contact with the school authorities in this regard.

The Department is in the process of acquiring a site for St. Mary's national school, Stranorlar. Acquisition of the site is dependent on a grant of planning permission, an application for which has been submitted to the local authority. The Department is currently preparing a response to a request for further information from the local authority and has also, concurrently, commenced the tender process for the appointment of a design team.

However, in the context of the need to prioritise available funding for the provision of additional school accommodation, it is not possible to give an indicative timeframe for the progression to construction of these school projects at this time.

On behalf of the Minister for Education and Skills, I thank the Senator again for allowing me the opportunity to outline the position.

Senator Martin Conway

I apologise for being late. I welcome the Minister, Deputy Deenihan, for whom I have enormous respect and regard, to the House. It is great to see him in the House.

I tabled this matter down for discussion on the Adjournment because I attended one of these schools, Ennistymon CBS, in the early 1990s. At that time there was speculation that a community school would be built to facilitate the young people in the parish of Ennistymon and the surrounding areas and to provide the best possible services, facilities and education. Unfortunately, 20 years have elapsed since I was a pupil there and there are now three schools providing education, support and services to, at a maximum, 500 or 600 students.

The teaching quality in all three schools is particularly good but the students must go from one school to another to avail of an optimal choice of subjects. Children are going from one side of the town to another for history and geography classes, vice versa for science and to yet another part of the town for woodwork, mechanical drawing and so forth. This is in spite of inclement weather and involves the supervision of children crossing roads and so forth.

It is unacceptable that a community like Ennistymon would have three secondary schools, providing education to such a small number of pupils. The Minister for Education and Skills has asked for proposals for streamlining services, achieving the best bang for the buck and providing a cost effective education without compromising its quality.

Building this school is a no brainer. Not alone would it provide for the educational needs of the children of the area but it would also achieve economies of scale. Everything would be under one roof and the best science and computer facilities and good quality teaching could be provided. I hope the Minister will have some good news in that regard.

Deputy Jimmy Deenihan

I am taking this matter on behalf of the Minister for Education and Skills, Deputy Ruairí Quinn, who sends his apologies for not being present.

I thank the Senator for raising the matter as it provides me with the opportunity to outline to the House the Government's strategy for capital investment in education projects and to clarify the current position on the application for major capital funding for a proposed community school in Ennistymon. As the Senator is aware and as he will have heard in my previous reply to Senator Ó Domhnaill, the Department of Education and Skills is forecasting an increase of over 25,000 post-primary pupils by the start of the 2018 school year. This will continue to grow up to at least 2024 at post-primary level. In order to meet the needs of our growing population of schoolgoing children, the Department must establish new schools, as well as extending or replacing a number of existing schools in areas where demographic growth has been identified. The delivery of these new schools, together with extension projects to meet future demand, will be the main focus of the Department's budget for the coming years.

The five-year programme announced in March will provide over 100,000 permanent school places, of which over 80,000 will be new school places. The remainder will be the replacement of temporary or unsatisfactory accommodation. In view of the need to ensure that every child has access to a school place, the delivery of major school projects to meet the demographic demands nationally will be the main focus for capital investment in schools in the coming years. The five-year programme is focused on meeting those demographic needs. In that context, it was not possible to advance all applications for capital funding concurrently.

In the case of the three post-primary schools referred to by the Senator, they have agreed to amalgamate to form a new community school. The amalgamation will proceed when a new school building has been provided. The project requires a suitable site in order to progress. The transfer of a property to the Department is at contract stage and being progressed on the Department's behalf by the Chief State Solicitor's office. When the site for the proposed school is secured the building project will be considered for progression in the context of the available funding. However, in light of current competing demands on the Department's capital budget, it is not possible at this time to give an indicative timeframe for the progression to construction of the project. In view of the need to ensure that every child has access to a school place, the delivery of major school projects to meet the demographic demands nationally will be the main focus for capital investment in schools in the coming years.

I thank the Senator for giving me the opportunity to outline, on behalf of the Minister for Education and Skills, the current position on the request for funding towards a building project for a proposed community school in Ennistymon. I am disappointed that the news is not more positive. At least it brings the Senator up to date on the present position.

Senator Martin Conway

I thank the Minister for his reply. It is, at least, honest. Previous announcements, going back to the early 2000s, gave commitments to build the school within three years and then within five years. I prefer to deal with the facts honestly. At some stage, maybe in the lifetime of the Government, I hope we will see some movement forward. I thank the Minister for his reply.

An Leas-Chathaoirleach

It will not be for want of trying on the Senator's part.

Deputy Jimmy Deenihan

There is not an envelope of money at present. If there is growth in the country in the next three years the arithmetic may change. If there is a sale of State assets, for example, some of that money could be ring-fenced for schools. There are possibilities if the economy grows. My advice to the Senator is to ensure that all the technical work is done and that the project is ready, if money becomes available.

I taught in an amalgamated comprehensive school. Such a school certainly provides more equal opportunities in circumstances such as the Senator described. An amalgamated school provides a broad curriculum where students have a range and choice of subjects and better opportunities to reach further education and to choose the career of their choice, because they are exposed to such a wide variety of subjects. The case for Ennistymon is clear in that respect.

Army Barracks

Senator Denis Landy

I welcome the Minister to the Seanad. I followed the Minister's career on the playing pitch. It was always good to note that Kerry people, generally, supported Tipperary hurling and Tipperary people supported Kerry football. Long may that continue.

I raise the issue of the closure of four Army barracks in Castlebar, Clonmel, Mullingar and Cavan and the commitments given by the Minister for Defence, Deputy Shatter, regarding the provision of services required in those locations by the Reserve Defence Force. There are approximately 5,200 Reserve personnel. While their role may not be as great as it once was, as a former member of the FCA in the late 1970s and early 1980s, I know we had a big role to play within the country. Members of the Reserve were called up because many Army personnel were on Border duty, while others were in the Lebanon. I was a part-time soldier for a short period in Clonmel Barracks.

Some 500 Defence Forces personnel have been displaced as a result of the closure of four barracks. Much as I was saddened by the closure of Clonmel Barracks in my constituency, much work was done by the Department to ensure personnel were relocated and had their expenses paid. I understand from my colleague, Senator Diarmuid Wilson, who was involved in this issue with me, that premises have been found in Cavan for the Reserve Defence Force. The outstanding issues concern the availability of premises in Mullingar and Clonmel. The Minister proceeded with advertisements seeking suitable premises which I understand were found in both places. Engineering reports were sought on the suitability of handling live ammunition and weapons in these premises and they have been sent to the Department, but I strongly suspect it is a case of it not tidying up in this last piece of work, rather than the Minister not being vigilant in the matter. The Minister gave strong commitments to Deputy Tom Hayes and me at a meeting in his office with representatives from Clonmel. He said this was one of the issues that would be dealt with. I hope he will have good news for me.

On the broader issue of the Reserve Defence Force, to which I will return at a later stage, we need to examine its whole structure. Since 2009 only 400 have been recruited. The numbers have dropped by 2,000 since and currently stand at 5,200. The Department's policy on the force needs to be examined, but that is for another day.

The Minister started off well with positive news for Senator Kathryn Reilly, but his performance has dipped a little since. I hope he can finish on a high point and send me home happy to Tipperary tonight.

Deputy Jimmy Deenihan

There is an historic connection between County Tipperary and County Kerry — we both suffer from a superiority complex when it comes to hurling and football that is the envy of everybody.

I thank the Senator for raising this matter. Following the Government's decision to further consolidate Defence Forces personnel in fewer locations, four military barracks — Clonmel, Cavan, Mullingar and Castlebar — closed on 30 March. As a result, military personnel who were occupied in performing security and support functions within these installations were released for operational duties, leading to substantial efficiency gains. In addition, there are direct savings in terms of utilities, maintenance and security duty allowances in the four barracks.

When the Government took the decision to close a number of military barracks, my colleague, the Minister for Defence, asked his Department to enter into discussions with other Departments, local authorities, State agencies and community groups on the possible purchase of the properties to benefit the local community as a whole but with particular emphasis on job creation measures. To this end, officials from the Department of Defence have met officials from the various agencies and relevant local authorities and the discussions are ongoing. Every effort will be made to dispose of the barracks to maximise the benefits to the local community.

As a result of the closure of the four barracks, there is a need to provide alternative accommodation for the local Reserve Defence Force units. In this regard, the Department of Defence placed advertisements in relevant local newspapers seeking tenders for the provision of suitable accommodation. This is a normal arrangement for reserve units in other locations around the country. The Department has ten permanent rentals and 30 part-time rentals in place, including the part-time use of parish and community halls, as well as some commercial premises. The total annual cost for all 40 premises is less than €100,000. I am sure the House will agree that, based on what I have said, the renting locally of alternative accommodation for Reserve Defence Force units is the most appropriate course of action. There is no economic argument for keeping a full barracks open to cater for a reserve unit which may only train for a few hours once or twice a week when alternative rented accommodation can be provided for a small fraction of the cost.

Following receipt of the tenders, the Department and the military authorities undertook an examination of the proposals received. This process included, among other matters, an assessment of the accommodation offered, particularly its suitability to meet the needs of the local Reserve Defence Force units and compliance with health and safety requirements. In addition, discussions with the owners of the properties on terms and conditions and what alterations might be required were also undertaken. As a result, I am pleased to say suitable alternative accommodation has been identified in the various locations, including Clonmel and Mullingar. The necessary documentation, including tax clearance certificates, has been requested from the owners of the properties. The Department has been advised that it should be submitted in the next few days. When it is received, formal lease agreements will be entered into and the local reserve units can take possession of their new training accommodation.

I think the Senator has received positive news. I started on a positive note and end on one also. Perhaps I should come here more often and be the bearer of such good tidings.

Senator Denis Landy

I thank the Minister and I am pleased with his reply. I highlight the fact that all Reserve Defence Force members receive no pay; they do the work on a voluntary basis. We need these individuals and the work they do helps to build character in young men and women in the Reserve Defence Force. The Minister has given good news and I will be glad to relay it to those concerned. I hope, therefore, I will not have to raise the matter again. The people concerned want to be part of an important voluntary body in the service of the State. I am glad the process is nearly at an end. No less than in the 1970s when I watched him playing football for Kerry, the Minister always had a good finish.

Deputy Jimmy Deenihan

I thank the Senator for his comments. I served as Opposition spokesperson on defence for almost three years during which time I learned a lot about the Defence Forces. Owing to that experience, I grew to respect the important work done by the Defence Forces. The Reserve Defence Force also has a key role to play. Economic conditions were somewhat better in 2007 and 2008 when I raised such issues as Defence Forces numbers. The best training anyone can get is with the Reserve Defence Force as it is character building and there is great emphasis on physical fitness. It was no coincidence that, when the concept behind Operation Transformation was being developed, the organisers went to the Defence Forces for advice. There has been a proliferation of boot camps throughout the country which are mainly run by ex-Defence Forces instructors. The Defence Forces play a very important role. Luckily for us, their services are not required to the extent they were heretofore, which is welcome. Nonetheless, they are always required abroad. I can also see a role for the Reserve Defence Force abroad in certain capacities.

As regards the Senator's Adjournment matter, I hope what is being committed to will be provided for in the next few weeks.

The Seanad adjourned at 7.30 p.m. until 9.30 a.m. on Friday, 27 April 2012.

Seanad Éireann debate - Wednesday, 25 Apr 2012