The Order of Business is No. 1, Finance Bill 2014 - Committee Stage, to be taken at 11.45 p.m. and to be adjourned no later than 3 p.m. if not previously concluded; No. 2, statements on sustainable farming and the dairy pricing outlook, to be taken at 3.30 p.m. with the contributions of all Senators not to exceed five minutes and the Minister to be called on to reply no later than 4.50 p.m.; and motion No. 56(13), Private Members' business to be taken at 5 p.m. with the time allocated to the debate not to exceed two hours.
Order of Business
I am sure I speak for everyone who would like to express their disgust and dismay on the scenes we saw last night with regard to Áras Attracta in Swinford. Obviously, it will take some time for the Government to respond. I see the HSE has made a comment already, but there is a wider issue here. The Leas Cross situation was in my own area ten years ago, which people will remember as quite similar to this but for more elderly people also. While the regulations have changed and improved and we hope that in most areas they are observed, situations like the one we saw last night are obviously unacceptable. We must do everything in our power to address it.
The people who perpetrated these acts are fully qualified. People can talk about management and resources but this involved a one-to-one patient to staff ratio. It was not about underfunding or lack of resources from what I could see. It was about the type of people and the lack of respect and dignity they afforded our most vulnerable people who need to be cared for. It is absolutely disgraceful. At the appropriate time, I am sure we will have a proper and meaningful debate on the matter. Perhaps, we can get the Minister in to see how we can ensure that these things do not happen in future. As I said, it is ten years since Leas Cross, but we are back here again.
I put colleagues on notice that Aer Lingus is holding its EGM at the airport in Swords at 2 p.m. today. The shareholders will vote today on the restructuring of the Irish aviation services scheme, which is, in effect, the airport pension scheme. This will affect all members of the scheme, including retired, active and deferred members. We have debated this up and down and I thank colleagues who have been supportive of my position and the pensioners. I remind Members that pensioners, some of whom are into their 90s, will lose six weeks' pay if the vote is passed at the EGM today. They will also carry the full risk of the pension scheme into the future and pay a levy of 2.53% per annum on top of that. Many of the deferred pensioners who have not yet retired will lose up to 60% of their benefits and existing staff will also take a cut.
We have pleaded and debated up and down with the Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport, Deputy Paschal Donohoe, his predecessor, Deputy Leo Varadkar, and the Minister for Social Protection, Deputy Joan Burton, on this but all to no avail. I have tabled amendments to the Social Welfare Bill next week and ask colleagues to look at them very carefully as they could have the effect of reversing some of these measures. The problem is that this is all being choreographed. In my view, it is a massive stitch up. Today, these companies and the Government will write off €500 million just like that with a vote. The irony is that the only people who will have a vote today are the shareholders of Aer Lingus, not the members of the pension scheme, including those who have retired and those who worked for 30 or 40 years in the companies. The Government and the Irish people have a stake in Aer Lingus of 25%. I would like to know what the Government's position will be at the EGM today. Will the Government vote for the restructuring of a scheme to reduce the benefits for the 15,000 people across these classes of scheme members or will it use the opportunity to oppose the restructuring?
I propose an amendment to the Order of Business for today to provide that the Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport, Deputy Paschal Donohoe, comes to the House for just 30 minutes before 2 p.m. to answer questions as to how the Government will vote on the restructuring of the pension scheme. Why I say this is a stitch up is that all of the amendments we tabled - and which the Government was aware of - were ruled out of order in the Dáil. I have retabled them in the Seanad but, unfortunately, the EGM is today. Aer Lingus called the EGM the day after the changes to the scheme were passed. We have one last opportunity to do the right thing here. Can the Leader confirm how the Government is voting at the EGM this afternoon and respond to my proposal to amend the Order of Business?
I agree with Senator Darragh O'Brien that everyone will want to express their disgust and horror at the revelations on the "Prime Time" programme last night. While they were flagged in advance and we knew what would be in the programme, watching the scenes on the hidden camera was appalling. I refer in particular to the humiliation and degradation of residents by staff. I agree with Senator Darragh O'Brien entirely that this was not about resources, but involved experienced staff who had been there for some time. The treatment by some individuals of the residents of Áras Attracta was appalling. I am glad to see the HSE has apologised unreservedly. The HSE has already taken action and initiated a series of steps to prevent a recurrence of these unacceptable practices, which is very welcome. I note the Minister of State at the Department of Health, Deputy Kathleen Lynch, has welcomed the steps taken by the HSE, in particular the independent investigation it has initiated into the incidents at Áras Attracta. The real concern is that this sort of treatment of residents is happening in other institutions, which is something we will all be deeply concerned about.
I had the opportunity on Monday this week to spend quite some time at Mountjoy men's prison and the Dóchas centre for women. I visit the prisons on a regular basis. It is heartening to see the improvements to the conditions for prisoners there, in particular in the men's prison where the appalling practice of slopping out has been discontinued and all cells are single occupancy. The practice of doubling up has ceased. At the same time as we are making great improvements in our treatment of prisoners in custody, about which we have been the subject of international criticism for many decades, it is sad to see that we have not, apparently, made the same progress in the treatment of all citizens in institutions in the State. The Áras Attracta case, like Leas Cross ten years ago, should be a wake-up call for all of us. I congratulate the team of journalists who brought this to our attention and wish the HSE investigation team well. I hope we do not see any more of these depressing programmes. A colleague who has emigrated to Australia texted me this morning to say he despaired of humanity having watched the programme. We all share that view.
On a more optimistic note, I welcome the acceptance by the Government last night of the motion on recognition for the independent State of Palestine, following the lead of the Seanad. Recognition of the independent State of Palestine by different EU member states - and there seems to be a growing momentum around this - can only add impetus to efforts to secure peace in the Middle East, in particular between Israel and Palestine. It is a long-standing Labour Party policy and I am glad to see the Government moving on it.
Last night, I had the privilege to launch at the Mansion House the Dympna Meaney women's leadership development fund for Comhlámh, the organisation for returned development workers. This is a new bursary established for women leaders in the global south, in other words Central and South America, Asia and Africa. It seeks to empower women by providing them with opportunities to build skills and leadership, thereby empowering communities. I ask the Leader to arrange a debate in the new year on development strategies and organisations as there is a great deal of good work going on. We can be very proud of the fact that we send 2,000 volunteers from Ireland overseas every year to work in development. We do not highlight that enough in the Oireachtas and I would like to see us do so in the new year.
"We must rise up" said John Dolan in his interview on "Morning Ireland" today. He was not talking about water charges but about the documented casual nature of the abuse at Áras Attracta which played out for all to see on RTE last night. As Professor Gerard Quinn said in his interview, residents were being treated as objects to be managed rather than as subjects to be cherished.
On international human rights day 2014, I have a number of questions for the Leader. Perhaps some of them are rhetorical in the best sense, but they are questions that need to be asked nonetheless. On International Human Rights Day 2014, can the Leader confirm that the long-awaited gender recognition legislation will be published before Christmas? Dr. Lydia Foy, her advocates and all trans people, young and old, in Ireland want to know.
On International Human Rights Day 2014, will the Leader inform the House as to when the Department of Justice and Equality will publish the last head of the sexual offences (amendment) Bill? This head has to do with the oppressive, offensive and truly outdated legislation that criminalises sexual relations between people with an intellectual disability if they are not married. It is the law my right to love Bill - the Criminal Law (Sexual Offences) (Amendment) Bill 2014 - seeks to change. Will the Leader confirm that the sexual offences (amendment) Bill that will amend so many oppressive past laws, will be enacted before this Government concludes its work?
On International Human Rights Day 2014, will the Leader also confirm if the Government will put a referendum to the people so they can choose whether they want to incorporate Irish people’s fundamental economic, social and cultural rights within our most precious legal document, namely, the Constitution? Would it not be an incredible way for the Government to demonstrate its will to end long-term, medium-term and short-term homelessness?
On International Human Rights Day 2014, will the Leader give us an indication if the Minister for Justice and Equality and the Government will finally recognise the proud identity of our Irish Traveller community by recognising their ethnic identity, or will that community have to wait until the next Government assumes power? Tomorrow, I am meeting with a group of Travellers who want to speak to me about Seanad reform and if there is any possibility when all is said and done, the talking finished and one more report has been written, that we will get some genuine relevant reform that will be inclusive of their voice, so that one of their people can be in the Seanad to represent how they see the world, experience society and the economy. If I were offered a place on the Seanad reform group, I would gladly give it to one of the Travellers. I wonder how that would change the conversation and the recommendations.
I wish a happy International Human Rights Day 2014 to the Leader and Members.
We are all shocked by last night’s “Prime Time” programme. It will be very hard to consider anything else while that is clearly in our minds. It is a reminder of what responsibilities we have. Senator Zappone has just touched on the legislation that we pass here, whether it is to protect whistleblowers or stop the actions we saw on last night’s programme. We must consider the importance of this House and ensuring it represents the whole country. Senator Zappone is quite correct in stating there are areas in which we can make changes. Whatever happens in Seanad reform, that is one of the changes that should take place.
Another Bill passed comparatively recently amalgamated the Competition Authority and the National Consumer Agency to form the Competition and Consumer Protection Commission. It just issued an extensive report on how customer service is handled. It was interesting to note how bad we are at it. A large number of people have been let down in this regard with the estimated cost to consumers coming to €500 million a year. Will we have an opportunity to consider this report at some point? It does show that when we pass legislation, it gets things done, whether it is customer service. Ireland has an opportunity to establish a name for customer service worldwide.
On Senator Darragh O’Brien’s earlier reference to the pension challenge in Aer Lingus, I hope there is a recognition of the problem we had in Waterford Crystal, which has been resolved in the past several days. A large number of people have worked all their lives in Aer Lingus. It is disgraceful a decision may be made today which may take away part of their pensions for which they have worked and contributed to over the years. Since the Government and the people are the main shareholders in Aer Lingus, let us hope today’s meeting does the right thing.
Well said.
I also join with colleagues in expressing revulsion at the revelations in last night’s RTE programme about Áras Attracta. Yet again, we have an example of what can only be described as institutional abuse. Our history of abuse in institutional settings is a very depressing one, as is our record of incarcerating people with whom we seemingly find it difficult to deal. While I would go no further for fear of prejudicing the investigation at the centre, there really is no other way of preventing such incidents other than the introduction of CCTV and the possibility of undercover investigations.
I congratulate RTE on its very fine public service broadcasting last night. It is to be commended on its investigation. Will the Leader ask the Minister of State with special responsibility for primary and social care, Deputy Kathleen Lynch, to attend the House once the investigation has been completed to discuss the matter?
I want to lend my voice in condemning the appalling contents of the programme we saw last night. It indicates man’s inhumanity to his fellow man. It is hard to believe that after the debates we had for many years on the Leas Cross nursing home, something similar could happen again. It is a blight on our society and it is about basic human dignity.
I recall once going to a hospital to make a will for a woman who was terminally ill with cancer. Her husband had predeceased her and she had a special needs daughter. All that troubled that woman was who would care for her daughter. It was not an issue of money. It was about who would look after Anna. This morning other parents in such circumstances must be shaking, asking is this our society in 2014, one that cannot care for those who cannot care for themselves. It is a sad day for all of us as politicians and society in general. It puts the great march to be held outside today on Merrion Square into the ha’penny place. I had to turn off the last few minutes of last night’s programme because I could not bear to see actions I thought were past history, left behind us many decades ago. However, that is the reality in which we live.
Yesterday, I heard Conor Faughnan from the AA, Automobile Association, on the radio speaking about the three penalty points drivers without an NCT, national car test, can now get on their licence. Several weeks ago, a young man informed me he was five months waiting to get an NCT. I thought at the time it was carelessness on his part in failing to apply on time. My NCT is due at the end of February. On 1 December, three months before it, I rang up to apply for the test but the earliest date I could get was the middle of March. I said I would do the test on a Sunday morning or a Saturday night but was told I could not and the situation with appointments was dire. How many drivers will be faced with getting three points on their licence if their NCT is out of date through no fault of their own? Will the Leader bring this to the attention of the responsible Minister? It is appalling that anyone who has applied for an NCT can only get a test five months later through no fault of their own. It does not add up. More test centres or more manpower must be introduced to deal with this. Eight years ago, the maximum waiting time for a NCT was six weeks. Now the delay can be up to four or five months, which is appalling. These delays are not just one-offs either as they are widespread. It is not good enough for drivers.
Well said.
I second Senator Darragh O’Brien’s amendment to the Order of Business.
I add my voice in condemning the appalling and disgusting behaviour towards and treatment of residents at Áras Attracta. It is only a year and a half ago that the Seanad discussed similar abuse in child care facilities. It is terrible that we have to hear what is going on in our facilities through the media.
We must also be very careful not to tar every single care facility with the same brush. I know there are some superb long-stay care facilities for the elderly and people with disabilities up and down the length and breadth of the country.
Throughout the length and breadth of this country, there are some superb long-stay and care facilities for the elderly and for people with disabilities. I know that because I worked in one before going into politics. The most important people in those care facilities were not the people coming in or the staff, but the residents. We were never allowed to call them patients or anything other than residents and they were always treated with dignity and kindness. No amount of training will teach people care, decency, respect and love. If one does not have those fundamental qualities, one should not be in the position of caring for our sick, our elderly or our children. We must ensure that people going into these jobs have those qualities.
What can we do here as a Government and as elected representatives? As has already been pointed out, today is International Human Rights Day. We must make progress. The Assisted Decision-Making (Capacity) Bill was supposed to be the final step before we ratified the UN Convention on the Rights of People with Disabilities. We can do that. We can listen to the people if they come to us with complaints about treatment in long-care facilities, or in any facility. It is our duty as elected representatives to pass on those complaints to the powers that be and insist that they listen to us.
As the Leader will know, Right2Water is organising a national rally today outside Leinster House. Preparations are being made for it, as any of us who came into the building from either entrance this morning have seen. A big crowd is expected. People are travelling from every village, community, town and city in the State. In the Leader's own city and county of Waterford, buses are travelling from Dungarvan, Portlaw, Tramore, Waterford city and Ferrybank. The same is the case in Cork, Kerry, Limerick, Galway and all the counties across the State. There will be a big mobilisation.
They are not protesting because of any of the so-called concessions that were made by the Government a few weeks ago, they are protesting because they do not like to pay for water a second time. They believe, as I do and as the campaign does, that water is a human right, which should not be delivered on the basis of how much money somebody has in their pocket. It should be provided through progressive taxation, as all basic human rights should. I ask the Leader to listen to what the protesters today have to say, especially those travelling up from Waterford, and to act appropriately, because what people want is the abolition of water charges. That is the clear demand being made by the people who, again, will come out on the streets in significant numbers today. I look forward to hearing from all the speakers, including those from Detroit and other places outside Ireland. We will have a number of international speakers, who will talk about their experience of what happened when water changed from a precious human right to a commodity and when the provision of such a basic service was commercialised. The Leader must act this time. The Government must genuinely listen and scrap the water charges, not cap them.
I welcome the announcement by the Minister for Agriculture, Food and the Marine that €20 million will be spent on the agri-food research and forestry industries. This is very important. Up to 300,000 people are employed at the moment in the agri-food industry and this will create more jobs, especially for young people who are coming out of third-level education to go into research. Research into the forestry industry is also important. We have a serious problem with ash die-back, which started in my own county of Leitrim. There is now an opportunity to research this fully and to see whether there is any way of stopping this terrible problem. There are facilities in Leitrim for more research to be carried out on this problem. This comes on top of the €200 million in the area of farm safety that was announced a few months ago. It is very positive news for the agriculture sector.
I do not know where to start in discussing last night. On a personal note, because I have a son who often uses respite services in a residential unit, I felt it very deeply, as did many of the parents who contacted me last night. It is sickening to think that our most vulnerable people could be treated like that, left 15 hours without food, force-fed, physically hit, and mentally abused, with staff refusing to clean them and denying them their basic human rights. I was sickened last night and ashamed that even today we are paying lip service to this issue.
I have thought long and hard about this all night and I am tabling an amendment to the Order of Business that we have the Minister for Health, Deputy Leo Varadkar, come to the House today to discuss what has happened. This is far too serious to sweep it under the carpet and just say that we will have an inquiry into it. We need a totally independent inquiry, free from all those who are involved in social care. We cannot leave this until after Christmas. We cannot wait another month to discuss it again. This must be discussed today.
It was said last night that under the HIQA report less than 2% of centres concerned actually complied with regulations. That is abysmal. It was reported that 3,000 people were in residential care. There are more like 8,000 people, if one takes into account the people who are in and out of those, or who are living in smaller community settings. That could have happened anywhere. I asked last week that we have a debate on this immediately after "Prime Time" last night, because I knew what was coming from what I was dealing with, from people contacting me with complaints who have nowhere else to go. HIQA will not deal with individual reports. We must examine this issue seriously. I asked yesterday again that this action be taken. I have thought long and hard about this. This is not a rash move. I came into the Seanad-----
Can Senator Moran clarify the amendment?
I call for the Minister for Health, Deputy Varadkar, to come to the House to discuss the "Prime Time" programme last night, to tell us what will happen and to have an independent inquiry into what happened. I came to the Seanad three years ago-----
The Senator is over time.
-----saying that I would do something for disability. I could not walk out of here today and say I was doing the job if I was not calling for this today.
It is important that the facts of the report last night are fully investigated. One of the things the report highlights is the lack of checks and balances. That is what we need in every system. It appears not only that the facility is falling down in the provision of services and how it treats the people it is appointed to care for, but also that the checks and balances are not working. That is a very serious issue. Why was this not flagged from a medical point of view? How come it did not show up in the HIQA inspection? Why are the checks and balances not working? That is one of the things that a report or an investigation into this matter must identify. What checks and balances need to be put in place? I agree with Senator O'Donovan when he speaks about acting as a solicitor. I have come across some very similar cases. It is a huge concern. I came across people who would have looked after their own child for 50 or 60 years and can no longer deal with it. Their big worry is who will look after that child with a disability once they are gone. It is a huge concern for parents and it is important that we can give reassurance that there are proper facilities, that all the care they require is there, but also that the checks and balances are there.
I also support Senator O'Donovan's point about the NCT test and the delays. I too received texts yesterday from Cork, where there is a huge delay in providing inspections and reports. It is something that must be dealt with. There is no point in implementing legislation and then finding that people cannot comply with it because the people offering the service to carry out these tests are not able to give that service within a reasonable period.
I agree with him that this problem needs to be resolved before the legislation is put in place. Otherwise, it will impose penalties on people who have no control over it which is wrong. This is something we need to look at.
Like so many of my colleagues here today I want to express my absolute horror at what happened at Áras Attracta in County Mayo. I am shocked, horrified and embarrassed at what I watched on "Prime Time" last night. I commend Paul Maguire and his investigation team from "Prime Time" on exposing this most shocking of human rights abuses of elderly and vulnerable people. I fully expect that legal prosecutions will follow for those staff members who physically assaulted, verbally threatened, punched, dragged, kicked and beat the service users in Áras Attracta. The buck should not stop there. It is incumbent on State agencies to provide a safe environment for people who need protection over and above the norm. Last night's programme highlighted the gaping hole in legislation to protect the elderly and most vulnerable in society. There is no doubt these people require extra protection and we must now act to provide it.
Perpetrators of the kind of abuse that we witnessed on "Prime Time" last night act from a position of control and power because they know full well that the service users in Áras Attracta are incapable of climbing into a witness box in a court which means they cannot give evidence about their own maltreatment. The people who mistreated the residents of Áras Attracta know they will never be prosecuted for their actions, omissions and behaviour because there is no third party whistleblower. It is very clear that we need to immediately move to address this issue. I propose the establishment of a cross-party emergency committee to examine the treatment of the elderly and vulnerable residents in all homes in Ireland. We should also discuss increasing penalties for anyone who abuses, hurts or maims the people we should be protecting. At the very least our vulnerable and elderly are entitled to protection and if we do not do this, then what kind of a democracy are we left with?
I hope Senator Higgins is wrong when she says that nobody can be prosecuted as a result of what we saw on television last night. The people who ill treated the residents and perpetrated the type of crimes we saw last night should face the full rigour of the law.
It is particularly sad that we, as a people, do not seem to have learned from the lessons of Leas Cross and other cases of institutional abuse that we have seen over the years. Today is international human rights day and I hope that last night's programme will act as a wake-up call for us to ensure what happened in Áras Attracta will never be allowed to happen here again. It is worrying that we cannot give an assurance to people who have vulnerable relatives in various care homes and institutions in this State that such abuse does not happen in other places. A thorough investigation is required to ensure that proper procedures and proper care is administered. The programme called into question the management of the Áras Attracta facility and its recruitment process needs to be look at as well. How could the people, who behaved in the way we saw on television last night, have gotten through a recruitment process and be deemed suitable to work in a care institution that looks after the most vulnerable people?
Finally, I wish to comment on the NCT situation that has been raised by Senators O'Donovan and Colm Burke. There is a simple solution to the problem. If somebody has applied for an NCT and received written confirmation of a date for a test, however far forward it might be, then it should be deemed evidence that they are in the process of having their NCT carried out and that it is not their fault that the certificate is not on display. This is an administrative matter which could be simply resolved and thus would avoid people incurring penalty points, as has been outlined in the House.
The vast majority of Members who have spoken this morning have spoken on the Áras Attracta case which we saw on our television screens last evening. Everybody who saw the programme was shocked. It is totally unacceptable that vulnerable people should be treated in such a cruel and insensitive way. There is an ongoing inquiry and due process must apply. However, I hope that appropriate sanctions are put in place that reflect the seriousness of the situation and what we saw and witnessed on our screens last evening.
An amendment to the Order of Business has been tabled which calls for the relevant Minister to attend. The Minister of State at the Department of Health, Deputy Lynch, is the appropriate Minister to deal with this matter. I will try to have her attend. I hope that she will be in a position to confirm that she will be here today from 7 p.m. to 7.30 p.m. I cannot amend the Order of Business until such time as she confirms a specific time.
I wish to make a point of order and apologise for interrupting the Leader. Was the proposed amendment to the Order of Business seconded?
No.
I do not know whether the Leader can accept the amendment. I seek guidance from the Cathaoirleach on the matter as I tabled the amendment.
The amendment is not in order.
That is fine. We will try to have the Minister of State, Deputy Lynch, attend at another time, in early course, because it is necessary that we have clarification on what is happening now.
Senator Darragh O'Brien has proposed an amendment to the Order of Business which relates to the Aer Lingus AGM. The Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport has attended here previously to respond to an amendment to the Order of Business.
The Minister, Deputy Donohoe, came here and gave a very comprehensive reply.
I do not agree with the Leader's claim.
The Minister is quite willing to come here again. I accept the amendment to the Order of Business which means we will have statements on the Government's stance at the Aer Lingus AGM from 3 p.m. to 3.30 p.m. today. I accede to the Senator's request and thank the Minister again.
I am grateful to the Leader. I wish to clarify that the EGM starts at 2 p.m.
I cannot debate the matter any sooner than I have outlined and we have ordered the business accordingly.
I am not disputing that fact. The Government could have voted by the time we take statements.
The Leader, please, without interruption.
I am trying to assist the House.
I appreciate that but I am trying to discuss the timing of statements.
We can talk. We have tabled a discussion of the Finance Bill. The 3 p.m. to 3.30 p.m. slot is free and I have asked the Minister to attend. He is willing to come in to explain the matter. Does the Senator want to amend the Order of Business or not?
I do. I am trying to help matters by stating that the EGM will start at 2 o'clock so the Government could have voted. I gratefully accept the adoption of my amendment and thank the Leader.
I amend the Order of Business to indicate that we will have the Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport here at 3 o'clock.
Senator Bacik, and indeed all Senators, have made very good contributions and outlined their personal, family and other circumstances in regard to the programme on Áras Attracta. The contributions were very touching. We will try to arrange a debate on the matter as soon as possible.
Senator Bacik also called for a debate on development strategies and development organisation. We will try to facilitate it in the new year.
Senator Zappone inquired about the gender recognition Bill. It is at quality assurance stage in the Office of the Attorney General and we are fairly positive that it will be published before Christmas.
The criminal law (sexual offences) Bill is a complicated piece of legislation to draft. Further heads need to be added to make it as robust as possible in order for it to achieve its aim of protecting vulnerable persons against sexual exploitation and abuse. I am not in a position to say when we will have the heads in that regard.
Senator Zappone has drawn attention to the fact that today is International Human Rights Day. She also mentioned that there is a need for the Government to recognise the Traveller ethnic identity, a recommendation which came from the Oireachtas Joint Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality.
I will try to find out the position as regards advancing that also.
Senator Quinn spoke about the report of the Competition and Consumer Protection Commission and the importance of customer service, and called for a debate on that matter. I will try to get the Minister to come to the House in the new year for a debate on that important report.
Senator Naughton, and other Senators, congratulated RTE on its investigative work as shown on the "Prime Time" programme and called for a debate with the Minister of State, Deputy Lynch.
Senators Denis O'Donovan, Colm Burke and Michael Mullins raised the issue of delays with the national car test. Senator O'Donovan mentioned that the earliest date he could get was mid-March. Senator Mullins made the important point that people who applied and have been given a date should be exempt from penalties. I do not know whether that is the position but the Minister, Deputy Donohoe, will be in the House next week for a road traffic Bill. That will be the appropriate time to raise those points with the Minister, and I am sure he will take them on board.
Senator Moloney rightly emphasised that we have many excellent care staff and facilities throughout the country, and that we must not lose sight of that. She stated also, and I agree with her, that we cannot train people to have compassion. That comes by nature in many cases.
Senator Cullinane spoke about the right to protest about water charges. I can assure the Deputy that the Government has listened, and will continue to listen, in that regard.
Senator Comiskey spoke about the extra funding for farming and agricultural matters, and the need to combat ash dieback disease on which we had a comprehensive and informative debate in this House last year.
Senator Moran raised the need for an independent inquiry into Áras Attracta and for the Minister of State, Deputy Lynch, to come into the House. As has been pointed out, the amendment to the Order of Business was not seconded but I will amend the Order of Business now that the Minister of State, Deputy Lynch, would come to the House for statements on that programme from 7 p.m. to 7.30 p.m. to allow us express our views, and the Minister of State has agreed to do that. I am proposing that amendment as I mentioned at the outset.
I think I have covered most of the items Members have raised and apologies if I have not answered some people.
Senator Darragh O'Brien has proposed an amendment to the Order of Business, "That a debate with the Minister for Transport, Tourism and Sport to establish how the Government will vote on the pension restructuring at the annual general meeting of Aer Lingus today be taken today." Is that agreed? Agreed.
I thank the Leader for that.
The Leader has indicated that he is prepared to accept the amendment and that 30 minutes will be provided for the statements. Is it agreed that the statements will be taken from 3 p.m. to 3.30 p.m.? Agreed?
Senator Mary Moran moved an amendment to the Order of Business, "That a debate with the Minister for Health on the need for an independent inquiry into the standard of care in residential care homes be taken today." There was no seconder for that amendment. The Leader has proposed an amendment to the Order of Business that a debate would take place with the Minister of State, Deputy Kathleen Lynch, from 7 p.m. to 7.30 p.m. on the subject of last night's programme on RTE. Is that agreed? Agreed.
On a point of order, I want to express my disappointment that nobody would second the amendment to have people in for this debate.
Senator, resume your seat please.
I find it abhorrent that nobody would second the amendment-----
Senator, resume your seat.
-----that would have allowed a debate on the cruelty and inhumanity that went on last night.
Senator, you are completely out of order.
No. I find that abhorrent. We are all great at coming in here and making our points but when it comes to actually putting one's money where one's mouth is-----
Senator, resume your seat.
-----nobody would second the amendment. That debate should go ahead today if we are worth anything in this House.
Senator, resume your seat.
It is going ahead.
Not with the Minister for Health present.
We could not second it. The Senator's own colleagues did not second it.
You give out about everything but you would not even support a non-political amendment such as that. It is appalling.
Senator Moran, will you resume your seat please?
We had spoken already and the Senator's own colleagues were up next.
I have.
You are completely out of order.
Her own colleagues did not second it. We could not. We had spoken already.
Order of Business, as amended, agreed to.
Sitting suspended at 11.27 a.m. and resumed at 11.45 a.m.