I welcome the Minister of State, Deputy James Browne.
Nithe i dtosach suíonna - Commencement Matters
Legal Aid
I welcome the Minister of State. It is a sad day that outside every criminal court in Ireland, the barristers' profession is standing in protest against the unjust actions of our Government, which has been blind to a serious unfairness visited on them. From 2008 to 2011, there was a reduction in barristers' fees, in light of the economic crisis of the time, of between 28% and 69%. In real terms, there has been a reduction of 40% in legal aid fees for barristers since 2002. Nearly everybody else in any criminal court, be it the judge, the registrar, gardaí or State solicitors, has had their pay restored, but somebody in the Department of Public Expenditure, National Development Plan Delivery and Reform has taken a consistent view that barristers should be singled out for a punitive failure to implement the terms of the Haddington Road agreement and financial emergency measures in the public interest, FEMPI, which called for reviews of reductions.
Even though those reviews have been carried out pursuant to statute and a recommendation has been made that the pay rates for these people should be restored, nothing has been done. That is very sad.
I spoke in the Seanad in May of last year and I said on that occasion that this was a scandal. I wrote to the Minister for Public Expenditure, National Development Plan Delivery and Reform, Deputy Donohoe, and I pointed out to him that in July I had been present at a dinner where the Minister for Justice, Deputy McEntee, said:
I of course recognise the vital role played by barristers in undertaking criminal legal aid work. I see no good reason why those in the legal profession are left waiting for crisis-era reductions to be restored, while public and civil servants have had their pay restored. It is very much on my agenda for the upcoming budgetary process and my discussions with Minister Donohoe.
The time has now come for the Government to - I will not use a crudity - get off the fence and deliver justice to people who are working at rates that nobody else in these Houses would work for.
Cuirim fáilte roimh an Aire Stáit, an Teachta James Browne, go dtí an Seanad. Unprecedented action is taking place today where, country-wide, barristers and solicitors who represent clients who are accused of criminal offences are actually boycotting our court system. I think it is the first time in the history of the State that this has happened. It represents, as has been outlined by Senator McDowell, a crisis in their pay and remuneration to the extent that it is difficult for the Irish Criminal Bar to recruit graduates into this essential component of our justice system.
I listened very carefully to Seán Guerin SC on the radio during the week. He spoke about how this goes to the very heart of our confidence in the administration of justice in Ireland. When the Director of Public Prosecutions, DPP, brings forward charges against a citizen, that citizen will perhaps contemplate the loss of their liberty, and that is a very serious moment for them. The professional formation of our criminal barristers is absolutely essential to the administration of justice.
In the coming days prior to the budget, I ask the Minister of State to impress upon his colleagues at Cabinet the requirement to deal with this in the budget. As I said, it is unprecedented for people outside of our court system. These are two professional groups that would never have taken this action before. That underlines the crisis that they have professionally, but also the wider crisis in terms of confidence in the administration of justice in the State.
Before I call the Minister of State, I welcome St. Tiernan’s Community School from Dundrum to the Chamber. They are very welcome. I call the Minister of State.
I thank the Senators for raising this very important issue. I can assure the House that the Minister for Justice, Deputy McEntee, and I fully recognise the important role played by barristers in the administration of justice, both in the context of working to defend those accused and working with the DPP in respect of prosecutions.
We are engaged in discussions with the Department of Public Expenditure, National Development Plan Delivery and Reform, Deputy Donohoe, on the issue of criminal legal aid fees as part of the budgetary process. I also acknowledge and appreciate the ongoing co-operation and flexibility that is shown by barristers in working with the Government and the courts to improve efficiencies and create a more victim-centred system, including through a number of actions to give effect to the recommendations of Supporting A Victim's Journey: A Plan to Help Victims and Vulnerable Witnesses in Sexual Violence Cases.
As the Senators are no doubt aware, my Department administers the criminal legal aid system and is responsible for making payments under the scheme. During the financial crisis, counsel fees were indeed subjected to numerous reductions, which formed part of a broader Government agenda to reduce borrowing costs. In 2018, the then Department of Public Expenditure and Reform sanctioned a review process which was led by the Office of the Director of Public Prosecutions in conjunction with the Department of Justice. This review concluded that there was sufficient ongoing flexibility to justify these cuts being reversed. The Office of the Director of Public Prosecutions and my Department have engaged with the Department of Public Expenditure, National Development Plan Delivery and Reform in relation to the restoration of pay on behalf of both prosecution and defence counsel.
There are also valid concerns in criminal law practice about the difficulties in attracting new barristers to the criminal Bar and, indeed, difficulties in retaining those currently practising.
On the restoration of fees and the proposed withdrawal of services, I regret that it has come to this. The Minister for Justice, Deputy McEntee, and I have both met with representatives of the Bar Council on different occasions and explained that there are ongoing discussions with the Minister for Public Expenditure, National Development Plan Delivery, and Reform, Deputy Donohoe, in the context of the upcoming budgetary process. I assure the Senators, as I did the Bar Council, that this matter is, and remains, one that I hope can soon be resolved.
Briefly in reply, I welcome the Minister of State's remarks. Indeed, I welcomed the view taken by the Minister for Justice at the event I referred to earlier but it is not good enough that a Department of State, which is part of a collective Government, should leave us in a position whereby the Director of Public Prosecutions conducted a review, recommended the ending of these cutbacks but nothing has been done for more than ten years now. It simply is not good enough. It suggests that there is an agenda in the Department of Public Expenditure, National Development Plan Delivery, and Reform against barristers. It can only come down to some civil servants, and they must be senior, who have taken the view that barristers can take a hammering without knowing what it is like to be a junior barrister starting off in one's first year and being given €16 to €20 to attend a District Court to conduct a criminal case. One would not get anybody to visit one's house for that kind of money, except a tax collector. It is about time that whoever is responsible for driving this agenda in the Department of Public Expenditure, National Development Plan Delivery, and Reform looks in the mirror and does the decent thing. It is also about time that the Minister, Deputy Donohoe, to whom I wrote in July, faced up to his obligations.
Again, I thank the Senators for raising what is a very important matter. As I said already, the Minister for Justice and I are engaging with the Minister for Public Expenditure, National Development Plan Delivery, and Reform on the issue of criminal legal aid fees as part of the budgetary process. It is also worth mentioning that I am progressing legislation to modernise and improve the operation of the criminal legal aid scheme more generally. This proposed legislation will strengthen oversight and governance structures for the scheme, provide for automation of payments and for a comprehensive review of fees and the manner in which they are paid.
To conclude where I started, I recognise and appreciate the important role played by barristers in undertaking criminal legal aid work. I should declare that I was one of those barristers for many a year. This work is a fundamental part of our criminal justice system and ensures the administration of a fair system of justice.
Human Trafficking
The Minister of State is very welcome. I want to ask about the current state of play regarding the fight against human trafficking here in Ireland. There are many issues dealt with in these Houses and in Government Buildings which are pressing, obvious and apparent and which demand attention be given to them, as well as that attention being seen to be given to them. There are other issues that will never affect the vast majority of the people of this country, directly at least, but that for those they do affect have the most awful life-altering effects. Human trafficking and its associated exploitation falls into this category, but we are not doing enough to fight it.
In June the USA published its annual trafficking in persons report which ranks governments across the world on their efforts to acknowledged and combat human trafficking. Ireland was ranked in tier two which consists of countries that do not fully comply with minimum standards but which are making significant efforts to bring themselves into compliance. The report stated that the Irish Government did not meet the minimum standards in several areas, including a failure to convict any traffickers. There were also deficiencies in victim identification, referral and assistance and services for victims remained inadequate. I understand that such was the disquiet across the pond at our lack of progress in combatting trafficking that the continued operation of US pre-clearance in Dublin Airport was called into question.
Last year the Council of Europe's Group of Experts on Action against Trafficking in Human Beings, GRETA, stated:
Sexual exploitation [in Ireland] remains the primary form of exploitation, but the number of people trafficked for labour exploitation – in sectors including fishing, farming, construction, catering and domestic work – grew over the same period.
Trafficking for labour exploitation is under-recognised and under-reported. Shockingly, there have been no convictions for trafficking for labour exploitation in this country despite the increasing numbers of identified suspected cases. Ireland is not immune to trafficking. What is being done by the Government to step up the efforts to combat trafficking? I stated in the Chamber before the summer recess that the mass movement of persons across the European Continent as a result of the Russian invasion of Ukraine has provided traffickers with the perfect smokescreen to carry out large-scale operations undetected and that we must be extra vigilant in this environment to ensure the vulnerabilities of people in flux will not be exploited for profit. That is what this Commencement matter is getting at.
The business of immigration consulting has exploded in recent years and is only going to get bigger, yet there is no legal framework, basis or oversight for accreditation of immigration consultants. I could leave this room, call myself an immigration consultant, charge people to see me and tell them God knows what. At the moment, any Joe Soap can simply slap a label of immigration consultant on himself and start to advise people on making what is a huge life change. That lack of oversight or accountability with regard to legal advice is very worrying and leaves open many doors that unscrupulous individuals may use to exploit vulnerable persons. Does the Government have plans to codify the role of immigration consultants via legislation, accreditation or oversight? If not, how does it plan to ensure all those thinking about coming to Ireland are receiving genuine guidance and being protected from exploitation?
I thank the Senator for raising the important issue of the necessity of regulating non-government immigration services and establishing legal criteria that must be met by those doing business as immigration consultants in order to limit and prevent exploitative immigration arrangements and aid the fight against human trafficking in Ireland. Legal services are heavily regulated. I recommend that a complaint be made to the Legal Services Regulatory Authority, LSRA, in respect of any person offering legal advice who is not a member of the Law Library or the Law Society or registered with the LSRA.
Human trafficking is an exploitative crime that preys on the most vulnerable people. The prevention, detection and prosecution of this abhorrent crime is a priority for the Government. Several significant measures have been taken to combat human trafficking, create a more victim-centred approach to identifying and supporting victims, raise awareness and provide training for those who need it. The most significant of these has been the development of the new national referral mechanism, NRM, framework, which will make it easier for victims of human trafficking to come forward to access supports and services by providing a role for a range of State bodies and non-governmental organisations in identifying victims of human trafficking and referring them to the NRM. The Criminal Law (Sexual Offences and Human Trafficking) Bill 2023, which will put the revised NRM on a statutory footing, was published last July and is a priority for this new term. Alongside this, officials in the Department of Justice are working on finalising a new national action plan on human trafficking, which will be published shortly. It will set out how the multi-agency work to combat this criminal activity and support victims will be taken forward.
People smuggling is the facilitated, irregular movement of persons across borders for financial or other benefit. It is distinct from human trafficking, in that smuggling occurs with the consent of the person while trafficking involves the recruitment, transportation and exploitation of a victim. Smuggling and trafficking are inevitably closely linked, however. Those smuggled are particularly vulnerable to exploitation, often placed in mortal danger and left owing debts to organised criminal groups. Any allegation or concern relating to human trafficking or other forms of exploitation should be reported to An Garda Síochána, which has the responsibility to investigate such matters.
As regards the matter of immigration consultants, while many individuals may be confident in dealing directly with immigration services, it is a matter for each person to decide to where he or she goes for guidance or assistance. In that context, it is open to such persons to avail of the services of an immigration consultant or other such third party if they so wish. Many individuals may seek the advice of friends, relatives or people in their community with experience in such matters. The services provided by such groups or individuals may cover a very broad spectrum, from the provision of general information or assistance with form filling to the provision of legal advice on complex legal matters.
Some third parties, such as members of the legal profession or established non-governmental organisations active in the area of immigration, may have established bona fides with the immigration services.
Others may not be known to the immigration services and some may not be located in the State. This encompasses what is potentially a very broad group of organisations and individuals, and there are currently no criteria or regulation required for a person to identify as an immigration consultant. Where an individual has indicated that they wish to be represented by a third party, for example, a regulated legal professional, and appropriate documentation has been provided to support that, it may be facilitated. It is important that an applicant is not put in a position of disadvantage simply because they have chosen a third party to represent their interests.
I thank the Minister of State. It was reported in the UK press last year that migrants across the UK are being preyed upon by immigration advisers and solicitors who are taking advantage of the lack of protections for advice seekers. These rogue practitioners are charging extortionate fees for free application forms and are putting in spurious applications and appeals that have no chance of success. These criminals and confidence tricksters exploit vulnerable persons by extorting large sums of money from them, often under threat of deportation if they fail to pay up. One charity found that of the clients it provided support for in 2021, 41% had been scammed by a rogue solicitor or by someone posing as an immigration adviser. We would be fools to think that this is not happening here. Even the Minister of State's response says that regulations are required. There are no regulations and no criteria under which persons can identify as an immigration consultant, and therein lies the problem. What does the Minister of State think our Government's response should be to that? Do we need to have some sort of a licensing arrangement or agreement in place for immigration consultants in this country?
Solicitors in this country are very heavily regulated and anyone who has any concerns about the actions of any solicitor should report them to the LSRA. On the position of immigration consultants, as I said, this encompasses a very broad spectrum of people, from family members or friends giving legal advice, to some who are offering services. I ask that people make sure that whoever they are dealing with engages with their background to see whether they have the skillset that they are holding themselves out with. The Department of Justice immigration service will generally only engage with individuals or groups such as solicitors, NGOs or other bodies whose bona fides have been established. Finally, I remind the Senator that detailed communications regarding all immigration schemes and programmes, including relevant application forms, are available on the immigration service delivery website, irishimmigration.ie.
Small and Medium Enterprises
I want to thank the Cathaoirleach for selecting this issue, and the Minister of State at the Department of Enterprise, Trade and Employment, Neale Richmond, for coming along here today. I want to discuss an issue of utmost importance, and that is the economy of south Kildare. I totally understand that within the Minister of State's brief, the economy of every county and constituency in Ireland is very important to him but he will forgive me for being parochial on what I am going to talk about. As we all know, a thriving economy is the backbone of any community, in terms of employment and investment in shops, employment and people having the opportunity to shop locally in their own town and community. It is essential that we all work together to foster growth and prosperity within our communities.
Kildare South holds tremendous potential for economic development. It is a very strategic location that has well-connected transport links and a very skilled workforce. In order to harness all of those advantages it is important that we prioritise key areas in building a robust and sustainable economy. It is important that we look at foreign direct investment, FDI, and how we can attract businesses. For example, we have 39 IDA Ireland companies employing 12,174 people in Kildare, and employment among IDA Ireland clients has improved and increased by around 30% in the past five years, which is very significant.
Some 9,270 people were employed in Enterprise Ireland-supported companies in 2022. However, I will speak in the main about the small and medium-sized businesses. It is vital that we support and nurture our existing businesses, small, medium and large. Local enterprises are the very lifeblood of our economy in providing jobs and services to our community. At the moment, the SME sector represents about 86% of ratepayers in Kildare. Some people think of Kildare as the place that has the very large IDA companies but the fact that 86% of our rates come from the SME sector is very important.
With my colleague, the Minister for Finance, Deputy Michael McGrath, I recently hosted a pre-budget breakfast for local business people from around Kildare. They were rightly impressed by the Minister's depth of knowledge and clear grasp of all the issues within his portfolio. However, there are many more day-to-day concerns that fall under the Minister of State's remit and that of the Department of Enterprise Trade and Employment. A recent survey showed that almost one third of business owners in Kildare noted recruitment and retention as their number one challenge and concern while one in six noted the cost of energy and raw materials. Rising interest rates and access to capital are other issues of concern. I thank Kildare Chamber of Commerce for sharing these figures with me.
From speaking to local business owners, I know that they are very worried about the relative uncertainty with the economy at present, whether it is in regard to staffing, costs, the impact of inflation and interest rates or the many other daily worries and concerns business owners in South Kildare face. We are very lucky to have a well diversified economy in Kildare. I know only too well the entrepreneurship skills that exist. It is vital the Department protects our local businesses.
I am asking the Minister of State what his Department can do to help support our local businesses with the concerns we have in the uncertain world in which we live.
I thank the Acting Chair and Senator O'Loughlin. It is always great to spend time with them and in the Seanad more generally. I was going to list out some of the Enterprise Ireland and IDA numbers for Kildare but the Senator has already jumped the gun on that so I will not repeat them. However, it is worth noting how sizeable and important they are first and foremost for the local economy but also for Ireland Inc. as a whole. The Senator rightly mentioned our small and medium-sized enterprises and our new enterprises. I want to mention the work of the local enterprise office in Kildare. I hope to visit there soon when industrial action allows.
In 2002, the local enterprise office in Kildare supported 256 businesses providing 1,297 jobs and a net growth of 148 new jobs. This was done through the mentorship of almost 500 business people and financial supports to the tune of €900,000. These small enterprises are the new ones that have been created in the last year or so. They are the ones that are able to access the grants and the ones with fewer than 15 employees that can make the most of the opportunity being provided to address the very clear challenges that counties like Kildare face.
On the whole, it is right to say that businesses in Kildare are doing really well. Thanks to these businesses, the county has seen a decrease in those on the live register of 52% since 2016. This is really huge progress and it should be celebrated. I fully acknowledge the Senator's concern and that of those business people who she met recently, along with the Minister for Finance, Deputy McGrath.
I will try to provide some insight into what is being done, what can be done and what hopefully might be done additionally after the budget next week. The first area is directly under my remit not only in the Department of Enterprise, Trade and Employment but as the line of Minister of State with responsibility for employment affairs. I refer to the skills shortage and the lack of available staff. This issue is impacting every single sector of the economy and every business of every size, but in particular the smaller businesses that need to be more agile when it comes to rostering, hours and shift work. The proposed solution to this is to take a two-pronged approach. This is a whole-of-government approach that starts in my Department but feeds into the work of other Departments such as the Department of Further and Higher Education, Research, Innovation and Science, the Department of Education, the Department of Health, the Department of Agriculture, Food and the Marine and the Department of the Environment, Climate and Communications. It feeds into everything basically.
The approach tries to ensure upskilling and continuous learning opportunities for our workers to ensure they are equipped to thrive in what is very clearly a changing work environment.
The advent of artificial intelligence, technological changes and changes to the workplace all involve retraining and upskilling, and every Department is involved in ensuring our workers have access to courses and skills required throughout their careers.
Apprenticeships will play a key role. We do not have enough tradespeople in Ireland. Apprenticeships can be taken in insurance and retail and in many more trades than the traditional craft trades that people associate them with. This will help to ensure we have the necessary skills for businesses in the future.
To help businesses in the here and now, we have our work permit system. Last year, my Department issued 40,000 work permits to workers from outside the EEA, which includes the EU countries, Iceland and Liechtenstein, and from Switzerland. Some 4,500 people came from the United Kingdom and about 30,000 people came from the EU to work to fill the skills gaps. We know that many businesses rely on the work permit system and inward migration, so we are currently undertaking a review of the occupations eligible for a permit to ensure the system is truly working for businesses. This is the short-term measure. Last year, 40,000 people came from the EEA. This year, we expect the number to be about 38,000. In 2021, it was 19,000. Therefore, we can see a systematic jump as we come out of the pandemic and crisis. That is the key area we look to address.
With regard to labour shortages, the Deputy mentioned energy bills, interest rates, insurance rates and much else besides. I will use my time for supplementary questions to address these because the Senator will have further questions on them and I have already eaten up the time.
I should have added that the Minister of State is very welcome to the House. There is always a positive engagement when he is here.
I thank the Minister of State for his very comprehensive reply. I acknowledge the work of the staff of the local enterprise offices, LEOs, including Ms Jacqui McNabb. Ms McNabb is absolutely inspirational and her team do really incredible work mentoring and supporting new businesses. However, with regard to existing businesses, I believe that apart from addressing the obvious shortage of skilled labour mentioned by the Minister of State, providing access to capital is really important.
I also want to give a shout out to Mr. Allan Shine and his team in County Kildare Chamber because they work very well with the LEO and Kildare County Council in attracting employers and supporting employers within Kildare.
The Minister of State mentioned apprenticeships. He is absolutely right that we need more. One area of concern is north-west Kildare, with which I know the Minister of State will be familiar. It is on the border with Offaly. We do not really have any apprenticeship programmes there. I am referring to the area between Rathangan, Allenwood and Carbury and also to some very small areas. I mentioned this before to a former chief executive of the Kildare and Wicklow Education and Training Board, ETB, in respect of providing a building.
We are lucky that plenty of houses are being built in Kildare but there is still concern about the cost. For those who may have to access jobs that are not that highly paid, there is an issue around the affordability element.
I thank the Senator and Acting Chairperson for their very warm welcome.
I am more familiar with the southern end of the Senator's county because my late father was employed by an Athy-based company for 35 years. The southern end is much closer to the Senator's own home but I will take on board what she said about the area around Rathangan and Carbury, leading into the Offaly area.
And Edenderry.
And, of course, Edenderry, where my mother-in-law is from. How could I forget that?
I will raise the matter with Kildare and Wicklow ETB and do so also when talking to the LEOs, Enterprise Ireland and indeed IDA Ireland about the opportunities for investment in the area.
Capital is an issue that comes up in every engagement I have with businesses of all sizes that wish to scale up. We certainly believe the new abilities given by the Minister of State at the Department of Finance, Deputy Carroll MacNeill, to the credit union sector represent an opportunity to bridge the gap and provide finance that may not be coming from the pillar banks or investors of another scale.
On housing, the Senator is correct that a massive amount of construction is ongoing in Kildare. It is really welcome. Supply is the key to addressing all issues, but this means the supply of all types of homes. I am referring not just to the private three-bedroom and four-bedroom dwellings but also to those associated with the cost-rental and social and affordable housing schemes and to apartments and duplexes. The more of these we see, the more we will address the key accommodation problems faced by those on lower salaries or starting off in their careers.
All in all, I know what an amazing advocate the Senator is for her entire county, particularly the southern part.
This is a good and frank exchange. I am due to visit Kildare officially with the LEOs and the County Kildare Chamber, facilitated by Ms Sinéad Ronan, when I get an opportunity to do so. I look forward to the Senator joining me when I visit Kildare.
The Minister of State, Deputy Noonan, is welcome to the House.
Social Welfare Benefits
I thank the Minister of State for coming here to discuss this all-important topic. He is taking it on behalf of the Minister for Social Protection, Deputy Humphreys. My question relates to people who are in receipt of disability allowance and who want to re-enter the workplace or go out volunteering. Not everybody ends up availing of the disability allowance for the same reason and one size does not fit all. People end up availing of the disability allowance for various reasons. Some of them have debilitating illnesses which mean they are well for a couple of weeks but may then be unwell for a period. Just because people are physically unable to do things does not mean they are mentally unable to do things. Many people need to be able to go to work to keep their brains going. They have much to give to the workplace but the biggest issue is that they are in fear of losing their welfare allowances. We need to work with people who have disabilities and encourage them to come into the workplace, especially when their health is good.
Many people cannot work for various reasons but love to volunteer with organisations and bring their skill sets to bear. However, there is a lot of red tape involved to allow people to volunteer because it is considered a form of work. I would like to see the Department of Social Protection working with people with such skills sets and who want to go out there and make a contribution to their communities or to different organisations. I would like something to happen for these people. We must ensure that at the same time, they do not lose their welfare payments.
I thank the Senator for raising the issue. I will be responding on behalf of the Minister, Deputy Humphreys. I agree wholeheartedly with the Senator. As far as I am aware, we have the lowest rate in Europe for the employment of people with disabilities in the workplace. There are a number of significant barriers for people with disabilities that we must address.
The Department of Social Protection provides a wide range of income and employment-related supports for people with disabilities. Recruitment and retention incentives are also provided for employers seeking to employ a jobseeker with a disability or supporting an employee who has a disability.
Disability allowance is structured to support recipients to avail of work opportunities, be that self-employment or insurable employment. A person can earn up to €495.10 per week and still retain some of their disability allowance. Changes made in the three most recent budgets have sought to support disabled people into employment.
Budget 2023 was the third successive budget in which the Government increased earnings disregards, which ensures that people with disabilities retain more of their payments while in employment. The earnings disregard for recipients of disability allowance has increased by almost 38% over these budgets from €120 to €165 currently. In addition, recipients of disability allowance can have up to €50,000 in savings and still receive the full rate of payment. This is compared with €20,000 for most social welfare payments.
The Department of Social Protection has also introduced a number of measures to support the transition into employment. A benefit of work estimator has been provided for persons with a disability and it helps people calculate the net benefit of entering or returning to work. The free travel pass may be retained for five years by people with a long-term disability in receipt of the disability allowance who take up employment.
When a person exits a disability payment to enter employment, he or she can be fast-tracked back into the payment if the person needs it, to revert within 12 months.
The Department has recently published a review of the reasonable accommodation fund and the disability awareness support scheme. The review made a number of recommendations including that they be amalgamated into a single flexible scheme. Work on implementation of these recommendations is under way and it is hoped to launch a reformed scheme in the first quarter of 2024.
Recently, the Minister published the Green Paper on Disability Reform and launched the associated public consultation. I would like to emphasise that the Green Paper is not a final design and no changes will be made to the current payments at this time. The Green Paper is a proposal on what the future of long-term disability payments could look like. It does not claim to be the best way or the only way to change the structure of our payments. The proposals in the Green Paper represent a starting point for a structured discussion.
Given that it has been well documented that Ireland’s employment rate for people with disabilities is below the EU average, do we keep doing what we are doing and expect a different result, or do we actually try to improve the system for people with disabilities? I believe we know the answer to that question.
There has been no reform to disability payments for decades. There are different rules and regulations across our scheme and there can often be anomalies. The Minister and the Government want to simplify the system and make it work better for people with disabilities. This is about recognising that not all disabilities are the same and that people may need extra help. I want to assure the Senator that the intention is to try to simplify the social welfare system and make it work better for people with disabilities. There are no proposals to reduce anybody's payment. Rather the proposals in the Green Paper are about providing additional support to those who need it most.
The Minister has already met with the various disability organisations to brief them on the Green Paper. The Minister wants to ensure we get a strong response to this public consultation. I would like to very much encourage all those with an interest to express their views as part of the public consultation process. Full details on how to make a submission as part of the public consultation are available at gov.ie
I will make further comments in my closing remarks but I would like to thank the Senator for raising this issue. This is an issue which is close to my heart. We can all agree that the current situation, with the high cost of disability, high poverty risks and low employment for people with disabilities, cannot continue. It is important that we work together to try to address these matters.
I thank the Minister of State for his reply and for his positive response. I encourage people with disabilities to make a submission because it is very important. I also encourage people I know to do so. I have been working with people who have disabilities to make submissions. I am glad that the Minister of State, on behalf of the Department, acknowledges that much has been done and there is more to do. This is very important. The fact that not everybody's disability is the same and that no one size fits all is the best description of this issue. It is positive that something is happening in the Department and that it is conscious that it does not want to leave some people in poverty because of their disability when they want to make a contribution. It is very encouraging to think that the Department is looking at how it can facilitate and work with people. I thank the Minister of State and I appreciate his response.
I thank Senator Byrne again for raising this issue. I agree wholeheartedly with her. As I outlined in my opening statement, the Government has made significant strides forward but we realise we have much more to do to address the issues of underemployment of people with disabilities. I met recently with residents in RehabCare in Kilkenny. Again, there is a great deal of frustration out there among people with disabilities who are trying to access the workplace. They often find themselves getting work experience which goes on for indefinite periods of time when they are not getting paid. It is critically important that we have an infrastructure here, as we are a country with full employment. These people who have so much to offer in the workplace and often add to the diversity of it. It is vitally important that we try to address this.
I believe the commitment of the Minister is unwavering with regard to the public consultation on the Green Paper. It is very important and I urge all disability organisations to engage with this process in a positive way.
Cuireadh an Seanad ar fionraí ar 1.44 p.m. agus cuireadh tús leis arís ar 2 p.m.
Sitting suspended at 1.44 p.m. and resumed at 2 p.m.