Job Initiatives

Dáil Éireann Debate, Thursday - 28 November 2013

Thursday, 28 November 2013

Questions (2)

Aengus Ó Snodaigh

Question:

2. Deputy Aengus Ó Snodaigh asked the Minister for Social Protection the rationale underpinning her decision to prevent the disclosure of the names of companies which have used the JobBridge scheme in view of the significant benefits these companies derive from the work done by interns paid for by her Department; and if in the interests of deterring abuse of the scheme she will make a statement withdrawing the expectation of confidentiality that she has created for the companies involved. [50873/13]

Oral answers (35 contributions)

Deputy Aengus Ó Snodaigh

I am trying to get the Minister to indicate why she is refusing to disclose to the public the list of companies availing of the JobBridge internship scheme, which is a State-sponsored scheme. Will she end the expectation that these companies have confidentiality, which is an expectation that she and her Department have created?

Deputy Joan Burton

The JobBridge scheme has made good progress since it came into operation on 1 July 2011. Over 23,000 internship placements have commenced to date, and over 11,000 companies have participated in the scheme. There are currently over 6,400 jobseekers participating on the scheme and over 2,300 posts advertised on the JobBridge website. Independent research indicates that over 60% of interns who finish placements progress into paid employment. These progression outcomes are exceptionally positive and compare very favourably with European averages in this area.

The question of whether the names of host organisations should be published is a matter which has arisen from time to time. I have taken the view that as participation as a host organisation is voluntary and as host organisations receive no payment from the State for their participation in JobBridge, it is not necessary to publish their names and I have decided that their names should not be published. In coming to this view I am informed by the very high progression rates to employment under the JobBridge scheme and am concerned that nothing should be done which might discourage employers from voluntarily offering internship opportunities, and deprive people who are unfortunately unemployed to gain valuable experience and get on the road to becoming fully employed.

A feature of the JobBridge scheme is that the Department required host organisations to put in place a coaching and mentoring process for each intern and to submit a monthly compliance report to the Department. The Department monitors compliance with this requirement. It also conducts randomised site visits and over 3,876 such inspections have been performed. Given that there are 11,000 host organisations, that is a really high rate of onsite inspection, along with the desk-based monitoring that also takes place. As a consequence of these visits, 32 host organisations have been excluded from any further participation in JobBridge. It is important to highlight that the overwhelming majority of host organisations are abiding by the terms and conditions of the scheme.

Deputy Aengus Ó Snodaigh

In a letter she wrote to the Ceann Comhairle to justify her refusal to answer a similar question in the past, the Minister stated that host organisations participate in the scheme on a voluntary basis and receive no payment or other benefit from the State in respect of that participation: no benefit. What does she call 39 hours of work each week undertaken by the JobBridge participants at the expense of the Department of Social Protection? Given that JobBridge allows employers to put off recruiting paid staff for up to nine months, this amounts to a benefit of wage avoidance for those companies.

There is also no doubt that real job creation is being postponed in this very manner. According to the Minister's own Indecon report, which she often quotes, 29% of those companies which are honest enough to admit it, stated when surveyed that in the absence of JobBridge, they would have offered paid employment to their interns. That is just a level of displacement and wage avoidance. Is it not illogical for the Minister to state that she cannot publish the names of these companies, when in the first instance, they are published on the website when they are offering internships?

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle

Thank you Deputy.

Deputy Aengus Ó Snodaigh

This is a State subsidy, and in each case the public is entitled to know the companies that are benefiting.

Deputy Joan Burton

It is a pity that Sinn Féin is so hostile to jobs for people who are unemployed. I sometimes think Sinn Féin seems to have a vested interest in keeping the maximum amount of people parked on the live register without any opportunity to progress, be it in education, training or work experience. It is an unfortunately short-sighted view that the Deputy and his party have taken. It makes me wonder what plans, if any, Sinn Féin has ever brought forward for serious employment creation in this country.

I wish the Deputy had been with me a couple of weeks ago when I was at a function hosted by the Crafts Council of Ireland. It is a very reputable body and I am sure Sinn Féin would approve of it, and its aims are to foster crafts and creativity in this country. Its members are small-scale employers of people - often just one or two - who are craft workers and who produce very beautiful work in many cases.

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle

You are over time.

Deputy Joan Burton

I met two carpenters who had been working on lots of jobs at the height of the boom, just before the crash. They are now becoming craft workers in wood, and they are doing that through an opportunity via JobBridge to see if it works for them.

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle

Thank you Minister.

Deputy Joan Burton

What problem can Sinn Féin have with having that kind of opportunity opened to people who are on the live register?

Deputy Aengus Ó Snodaigh

The Minister did not answer the question as usual, and she distracted people by talking about Sinn Féin's position on jobs. I have been a proposer and a supporter of some of the proposals she has brought forward, such as JobsPlus. She cut the training allowance for CE schemes, but I supported an increase in the training allowance.

The Minister has created an expectation in these companies for confidentiality, even though there is no confidentiality since their names are published online in the first instance. Can she remove an expectation that she and her Department have created so the public will know what companies gain a subsidy from the Department in the form of interns?

Deputy Joan Burton

Perhaps the Deputy is more concentrated on the English social welfare system, which is highly directive. Maybe that is what he wants down here because that is what is available in the North. The JobBridge scheme is a voluntary scheme on the part of both parties. A company offers to host. I have promoted the scheme with companies, because when we came into government, we inherited a dreadful unemployment situation, which is slowly improving.

Deputy Aengus Ó Snodaigh

Is there any chance the Minister might answer the question?

Deputy Joan Burton

It is so important to take every step to help people-----

Deputy Aengus Ó Snodaigh

What about the question?

Deputy Joan Burton

-----who find themselves unfortunately out of work.

Deputy Aengus Ó Snodaigh

There are seven seconds left to answer the question.

Deputy Joan Burton

I think it makes enormous sense-----

Deputy Aengus Ó Snodaigh

This is ridiculous. She cannot answer the question.

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle

The Minister is in possession.

Deputy Joan Burton

-----to have host organisations offering valuable employment experience.

Deputy Aengus Ó Snodaigh

The Minister cannot answer it.

Deputy Joan Burton

Sixty percent of people then proceed to get employment.

Deputy Aengus Ó Snodaigh

The Minister cannot answer it. She should do so.

Deputy Joan Burton

I genuinely do not understand the Deputy's position.

Deputy Aengus Ó Snodaigh

If she listened to the question, she might understand.

Deputy Joan Burton

We monitor it extremely carefully because it is a voluntary scheme. It is not-----

Deputy Aengus Ó Snodaigh

If she listened to the question, she might understand and then be able to answer it.

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle

We cannot hear anything. I ask the Minister to conclude.

Deputy Joan Burton

As the Deputy said, all the information and data are available-----

Deputy Aengus Ó Snodaigh

Will the Minister provide it?

Deputy Joan Burton

-----on the website. Why does the Deputy not get some of his legions of researchers to look at the website?

Deputy Aengus Ó Snodaigh

I have asked the Deputy as she is the Minister.

Deputy Joan Burton

There is nothing hidden.

Deputy Aengus Ó Snodaigh

The Minister said there is confidentiality.