Dáil Éireann Debate, Tuesday - 17 February 2015
135. Deputy Maureen O'Sullivan asked the Minister for Agriculture, Food and the Marine in view of a recent hunting report (details supplied), which reveals that a fox was hunted by 37 hounds for over 13 miles, if he will acknowledge the cruelty involved and remove the exemption for fox hunting from the Animal Health and Welfare Act 2013; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [6665/15]
View answerMy question relates to a report on a fox hunt which I sent to the Minister and which acknowledges that a fox was chased by 37 hounds for over 13 miles. It is time we decided that this is extremely cruel, that it is not sport and that we remove the exemption for fox hunting from the Animal Health and Welfare Act.
I will answer the Deputy directly rather than reading out a long answer. I read the report the Deputy sent me, which described a hunt that took place in which a fox was chased by a pack of hounds and a hunt club across 13.6 miles. The fox went to ground and that was the end of the hunt, as far as I know. We have discussed these issues many times and I know and respect the Deputy's views on fox hunting. However, I made the decision, with others, when we discussed the Animal Health and Welfare Act, that instead of banning what is termed "field sports" we would consider regulation and put codes of conduct in place. My Department is making contact with hunt clubs to ensure the voluntary codes of conduct are put into a formal code that the Department would be involved in putting together and negotiating. This is part of what we are required to do under the Animal Health and Welfare Act.
I am not going to get into a debate on whether or not we should have fox hunting in Ireland. We have made our decision in the Animal Health and Welfare Act, which includes specific exemptions for fishing and hunting in the clear statement that lawful hunting of an animal may take place unless the animal is released in an injured, mutilated or exhausted condition. There are tighter regulations and rules on hunting than ever because of this legislation. We are going to add to them by putting in place codes of conduct. While the Deputy seeks an outright ban, it will reassure many of those who are comfortable with hunting as long as there are certain parameters within which people must operate and this will be the basis for the new codes of conduct which we are putting in place.
Let us consider what is involved in fox hunting. First, in the marking to ground, the pack of hounds will chase the fox into the drain or earth. Then, the terrier man sends a terrier down the hole to attack or corner the fox.
After that people start to dig away the clay and the fox is exposed. We know that this is an extremely cruel practice, but there are people who are so dedicated to hunting that they will find a way around all of the regulations in the world. It is cruel; it is not a sport. This does not concern only the isolated incident about which I wrote to the Minister. We have other examples. I came across this advertisement:
What can be better than a day's fox hunting in Ireland? The cry of the hounds, the sound of the hunting horn, the thrill of jumping over natural fences, and the sheer style of this equestrian sport is available to everyone at ... Why not join us for the fox hunting holiday of a lifetime? ... There are over 80 hunting clubs in Ireland and we will be delighted to arrange your fox hunting vacation in Ireland ... and join in the craic ... in the pub afterwards.
We are facilitating people to come to this country for fox hunting, a practice which is banned in many other countries and we call it sport.
I do not want to get into the debate we had on the legislation about which we talked earlier. I do not know whether there was any digging out involved in the hunt the Deputy described to me. There is no mention of it one way or the other. We have made it very clear during the debate on these issues that we will also consider making sure there will be certain conditions required to be met when an animal is dug out. I recall having many meetings on this issue with representative bodies of working terrier groups, as well as non-governmental organisations. We tried to strike the best balance we could in the legislation.
In response to the advertisement the Deputy read, many people enjoy hunting. They enjoy riding across the countryside on horseback. There are many successful drag hunts in Ireland, as well as full fox hunts. My obligation as Minister and a legislator is to put rules and regulations in place to make sure this is done in as acceptable a way as possible from an animal welfare point of view. That is what we are trying to do.
There was a time when we were hunters and gatherers and had to hunt animals for food, but we do not have to do this anymore. It is a shame on us as a nation that we tolerate barbarity and cruelty to animals in the name of what is supposed to be a sport. It is hard to believe we continue barbaric practices. Everybody acknowledges how far the Bill went, but it did not go far enough. The Minister and I know that the hunting clubs are finding loopholes. We saw this happen recently during a stag hunt in County Meath, when a loophole allowed the hunt to continue because it had caught the scent of the stag. Why can we not actively support drag hunting and leave the pursuit of live animals that usually end up being pulled apart by whatever animal is chasing them to bygone days where it belongs?
I am not sure it is true to say an animal is usually pulled apart. In my experience of hunting, the fox normally escapes, not that I have huge experience of it, but when I have hunted, I have never seen a fox being pulled apart. I am sure, however, that it happens and I am not saying it does not. Our policy decisions try to strike a balance for those who derive great enjoyment from hunting and farmers who want foxes to be hunted off their land. If the Deputy were to see a field of lambs being killed by a fox, she would see a gruesome sight of an animal being pulled apart where the fox was the predator.
That is a different point.
Foxes are wild animals and can be vicious at times and do significant damage to farm animals, poultry and so on, although I know that is not the point the Deputy is raising. I am not willing to go as far as she would like, but we are doing what we can to ensure we put parameters, rules and codes of conduct in place to make sure fox hunting will be as acceptable as possible from an animal welfare perspective.
