Dáil Éireann Debate, Wednesday - 24 June 2015
4. Deputy Willie O'Dea asked the Tánaiste and Minister for Social Protection if she will provide for each of the years 2011 to 2014, inclusive, and to date in 2015, the total overpayments made by her Department in each year, indicating the amount due to error by her Department, due to error by the applicant, and due to fraud; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [24851/15]
View answerI wish to stress that this is a statistical question. I have no brief for people who defraud the social welfare system. In fact, I believe they should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law.
A social welfare overpayment arises where a person has been in receipt of money to which he or she was not entitled. In such cases, the person concerned has a liability to repay the money. When deductions are being implemented from ongoing social welfare entitlements, the person is notified in writing of the proposed amount to be deducted and provided with the opportunity to detail any circumstances he or she feels may be relevant to the rate of recovery proposed. Any information received from the person is considered in deciding on the amount of the deduction.
The total amount of overpayments in 2011 was approximately €92 million. Of this, almost €35 million was due to fraud, around €40 million due to customer error, approximately €6 million related to departmental error and €11 million was in respect of estate cases. Estate cases arise where undisclosed assets of customers, usually pensioners, come to light after their deaths. The total value of overpayments in 2012 was €97 million, broken down as follows: almost €41 million was due to fraud, €36 million due to customer error, €8 million due to departmental error and €12 million was in respect of overpayments from estate cases. In 2013, total overpayments amounted to approximately €127 million. Of this, almost €62 million was due to fraud, over €43 million was due to customer error, approximately €7 million related to departmental error and €15 million was from estate cases.
It should be borne in mind that 95% of the value of social welfare overpayments are as a result of failure on the part of claimants to inform the Department of a change in circumstances or of their full circumstances . More than half of these are suspected to be fraudulent. Approximately 5% of the value of overpayments are due to departmental error. I am not in a position to provide details on overpayments in 2014 or 2015 as these figures form part of the statutory accounts of the Department and are currently being audited by the Office of the Comptroller and Auditor General.
I thank the Minister for providing those figures, which demonstrate what many of us have long since realised, namely, that the overwhelming majority of people in receipt of social welfare payments behave honestly and that fraud is a minority activity, accounting for less than 3% of the overall social welfare spend. How many prosecutions have taken place in the past few years? Has there been an increase in prosecutions? The special investigations unit was set up in 2012. Has the incidence of the recovery of social welfare overpayments resulting from fraud increased significantly as a result of the activities of the unit?
The majority of people who receive payments or income support from the Department of Social Protection get exactly what they are entitled to - no more and no less. However, in terms of the social contract, any level of overpayment, particularly one which arises from a conscious mis-statement of circumstances or fraud undermines the basic social welfare contract in that people at work who are paying PRSI do not want to see money which could be given to old age pensioners, people out of work or lone parents being misused by people who have no entitlement to it.
In recent times there have been quite a number of prosecutions. We have also introduced facial recognition technology in association with the new personal services cards, more than one million of which have been issued. We have identified a number of cases which have been prosecuted in the courts where people had multiple identities and were claiming multiple social welfare payments at different offices. This is one of the areas where the risk of fraud is greatest.
Regarding the figures for 2012 and 2013, how much of the money has been recovered or is in the process of being recovered? The Minister will be aware that the Social Welfare Bill 2012 enabled the Department to collect up to 15% of the principal payment to recoup moneys overpaid. Is the Minister aware that some departmental officials are of the view that "up to 15%" actually means 15% and that they are entitled to collect the maximum, regardless of the circumstances.
I introduced legislation in 2012 that allows a deduction of up to 15% of the weekly personal rate payable to a customer who has made an error or committed fraud. That means that if a person's basic rate is €188, up to 15% of that can be deducted. This does not affect payments issuing to the rest of the household or payments like child benefit. We can recover up to 15%, giving a deduction of around €25 per week, depending on individual circumstances. Prior to the introduction of that legislation the Department could only recover €2 per week from claimants. To be perfectly honest, some people who had been involved in fraud were basically giving two fingers to their neighbours who were going out to work and paying their PRSI, to the Department and to Irish society as a whole.
I will forward the detailed figures the Deputy has requested but the situation has improved significantly. I must also point out that we take individual circumstances into account in overpayment cases. Deputy O'Dea has raised a number of such cases with me and has said that the Department has been extremely considerate-----
Some people in the Department-----
-----in terms of the repayment arrangements being made.
