Dáil Éireann debate -
Thursday, 28 May 1925

Vol. 11 No. 22

COMMITTEE ON FINANCE. - VOTE 8—LOCAL LOANS.

Mr. BLYTHE

I move:—

Go ndeontar suim ná raghaidh thar £557,300 chun slánuithe na suime is gá chun íoctha an Mhuirir a thiocfidh chun bheith iníoctha i rith na bliana dar críoch an 31adh lá de Mhárta, 1926, chun capital do sholáthar do Chiste na nIasachtaí Aitiúla, agus chun aisíoc do dhéanamh le Rialtas na Breataine mar gheall ar iasachtaí áitiúla atá gan íoc.

That a sum not exceeding £557,300 be granted to complete the sum necessary to defray the Charge which will come in course of payment during the year ending on the 31st day of March, 1926, to provide capital for the Local Loans Fund and to make repayment to the British Government in respect of local loans outstanding.

The amount asked for under sub-head (a) this year is £50,000 as compared with £107,000 last year. The reason for the smaller amount being asked for is that only a small proportion—practically none—of the amount voted in 1924-25 was expended. It was intended to be given largely in loans for drainage to individual farmers, but the procedure is rather slow and very little was paid out before the end of the year. There was also before last year in the fund a sum of £20,000 approximately, so that there will be available, with the £50,000 asked for this year, a sum of £177,000 for the purpose of loans. That would be available in some such way as follows:—For loans to farmers for land improvement purposes, say £100,000; for drainage works in connection with the drainage maintenance and restoration schemes under the Act of 1924, and for some possible expenditure in connection with the Barrow, say £50,000; for other purposes, like advances to local authorities and public utility societies in respect of balances of certain housing loans, say £27,000.

Sub-head (b) represents payment to the British Government of sums due in respect of loans from the British Local Loans Fund outstanding from the Public Works Office at 1st April, 1922. About £500,000 is the approximate amount of instalments accruing in the year 1925-26. The balance of £80,000 is the amount expected to be received in respect of arrears of loan instalments.

Sub-head (c) is in respect of advances by the Land Commission under the Land Acts, 1881-1888, and outstanding at the date of the transfer of the Land Commission to the Saorstát.

Mr. T.J. O'CONNELL

In connection with some Estimate last year I asked a question as to the likelihood of the Government making again available loans for the purpose of building teachers' residences under the Teachers' Residences Act, 1875, and the Minister said that as they were setting aside a loan fund—I think this is the fund he mentioned—it was possible that he would consider with the Minister for Education the possibility of again making loans available. No such loans have been made available since 1914. In reply to a question put down by me some weeks ago the Minister, I think, definitely said that there were no negotiations going on between himself and the Minister for Education in connection with this matter. Indeed, I rather took it to mean that he had definitely made up his mind that no loans would be available for this purpose. I should like to know exactly what is the position with regard to this matter, whether there will be any further operations under the Act or what exactly is the intention of the Minister.

Mr. BLYTHE

The whole question of a somewhat generalre-opening of the Local Loans Fund is under consideration. I fancy some other question is involved in connection with the matter of teachers' residences. I think there is a general limitation of the amount that may be advanced.

Mr. O'CONNELL

Legislation would be necessary.

Mr. BLYTHE

That, of course, is a matter that I am not able to answer fully on, except to say that we do recognise the advisability of opening the Local Loans Fund for the purpose of making other advances than advances for land improvements, which we began to make available last year, and which we hope to make available to a considerable extent this year. Of course, to make loans available out of this fund on the scale at which they were available during the British regime would be a very considerable matter. Local authorities, for instance, might want loans for big amounts for housing, sewerage, or schemes of improvement. It is, no doubt, desirable that they should have them, as developments of the most desirable character are held back because money cannot be got on favourable terms from the banks —at any rate favourable from the point of view of the period of repayment. We are going into that matter, but I am not in a position yet to make an announcement, largely because the question is one of very considerable magnitude. There is no doubt if there was a general re-opening of the Local Loans Fund that large sums would be required.

Mr. JOHNSON

What is the position with regard to sub-head (b)? I understand that this is a repayment to the British Government of sums paid into the revenue in one way or another, whether by deductions or otherwise, in connection with money advanced to local authorities, in the main. £670,000 was voted last year. Can the Minister say how much of that was collected, and what is the expectation this year? Will he by that means tell us what is the actual amount paid out of the Exchequer, leaving out the collecting from the local authorities? I understand that, in fact, all this is due from borrowers in the past. Some of it is collected, but not all of it. That is to say, portion of this sum probably has to be paid out of the National Exchequer which has not been collected.

Mr. BLYTHE

No, we pay out the amount we collect.

Mr. JOHNSON

Is it only the amount that is collected you pay away?

Mr. BLYTHE

That is all.

Mr. JOHNSON

Will the Minister say under what heading on the revenue side would be found the payments from local authorities?

Mr. BLYTHE

I think they are under the miscellaneous heading of "Non-Taxed Revenue." I have not any returns of that, but there is a very considerable bulk item, some such figure as £1,200,000.

Vote put and agreed to.