I move that the Dáil sit later than 9 o'clock, and that the motion for the adjournment be taken not later than 10.30. We hope to be able to complete the Liquor Bill to-day and propose to take after that the Committee Stage of the Land Bill. If that be not concluded at 9.30 I propose to take Deputy Connor Hogan's motion at that hour. On to-morrow I propose to take the Vote on Account. It will be understood that the Central Fund Bill would have to pass in this House in time to allow for its consideration by the Seanad. It is not proposed to discuss the Estimates in this Session. We propose to take the Budget after the Easter adjournment and to have the Finance Bill passed into law. The Order of Business, therefore, would be to take the Budget after the Easter adjournment and the Estimates after the General Election. I propose to announce at the end of each week the programme for the ensuing week until the dissolution.
ORDER OF BUSINESS.
I cannot accept the President's proposal to appropriate my time. Under Standing Orders private Deputies are given one and a half hours on Wednesday evenings, but now the President proposes to curtail me to one hour. I am not prepared to give a second off the time to which I am entitled, and I must have the full hour and a half or nothing.
I desire to support Deputy Connor Hogan. It is unfair to private Deputies to have their motions continually postponed, and then to give them time with an "if" tacked on to it. I think that some definite time should be fixed for the taking of the Deputy's motion. What I would suggest is that it be taken after the tea adjournment this evening.
I think the Deputy must have misunderstood me. What I said was that we would take Deputy Connor Hogan's motion at 9.30.
Even so, that reduces the Deputy's time by half an hour. He is entitled to one and a half hours under Standing Orders. I think that an earlier hour should be fixed for the taking of the motion. The President stated that it was not proposed to discuss the Estimates until after the General Election. Of course that will not interfere with the right of any Deputy to raise on the Vote on Account any matter in connection with the Estimates which appears urgent and necessary to him. The Estimates may not be discussed, but the Vote on Account gives the opportunity to discuss certain matters which it may seem necessary to discuss in connection with the Estimates.
It is scarcely necessary for me to answer the Deputy's last point. That has been the practice. What I said was that it was not proposed to take the Estimates after the Easter adjournment, but to leave the consideration of them over until after the General Election. I hope I shall not be misunderstood when I say that private Deputies in this House have greater consideration than in any other assembly in the world——
Agreed.
—and they are certainly not going to dominate the Government here. As far as being entitled is concerned, let us understand what is meant by that. It is laid down in the Standing Orders that time is allowed for private Deputies, but that the Government may take that time.
By the leave of the House.
I am not proposing to take time without leave. The question is, whether Government business is more important than that of private Deputies. Every possible consideration has been shown to private Deputies in this House, much more than that shown to private members in any other assembly in the world. The Deputy can look up the records of other assemblies and see if I am wrong in that.
That is because we are a smaller House.
We just happen to be a little more considerate towards private Deputies, and the consequence is that they have exalted opinions of themselves—certain of them. I have made every effort at all times to meet private Deputies. Yesterday when a Deputy in one Party was giving his opinion to the House on the Government programme a Minister was asking me on behalf of the Chairman of that Party to suit the Chairman's convenience with regard to some measure.
But he did not get it.
It is impossible for me to do things like that on short notice. When I get proper notice I make every effort possible to meet reasonable requests put up to me.
Can the President say on what date the Budget will be introduced? He is probably aware that the date for Great Britain has already been fixed.
I hope to take it within a day or two of the resumption following the Easter adjournment. Perhaps the day after the resumption, and certainly within two days.
Can the President say when the dissolution will take place?
I hope to be able to make an early announcement on that, but it may have to be deferred until after the Easter adjournment.
The President has spoken of the courtesy that has always been extended to private Deputies. I wonder were any steps taken to consult Deputy Connor Hogan with regard to the taking of his motion, and was he informed that it was only proposed to give him an hour for its consideration?
I had my Parliamentary Secretary looking for the Deputy from early this morning until shortly before the House met, and he could not find him.
In reply to the President who said that he is entitled to claim that greater facilities have been afforded to private Deputies in this House than elsewhere, I would point out that that is because we are a much smaller assembly. We have not the overwhelming amount of business that there is to be attended to in Great Britain, and while they have a House composed of 600 members we have only a membership of about 100. On Wednesday last, when the President mentioned this matter, I said that I was quite willing to afford private Deputies' time for the convenience of the Government. I was approached by the Parliamentary Secretary and readily accommodated him. I was not so disposed to give up Friday, but on second thoughts I decided that I would not make a protest. On Friday evening I did convey to the President, in a most emphatic manner, that I wanted my full time to discuss the motion to-day. The motion deals with a most important matter to my constituents, and I claim that we should have full time to discuss it. I think that an hour and a half would be little enough for its discussion. I protest against the imperious way in which the President has appropriated my time without consulting me. It was only when I came into the House this afternoon that word was conveyed to me by the Parliamentary Secretary that I was only being given an hour for the discussion of my motion. I was not even asked if I were willing to agree to that.
The Deputy will agree that "elsewhere" includes other places than Great Britain.
I suggest to the President that the motion to be moved by Deputy Hogan is one deserving of much longer consideration than the President appears to be willing to give it this evening. The matter is one that has behind it a large volume of public opinion, and it is desirable to have it settled definitely. The Government has one opinion on the matter, while a large section of the public holds quite other opinions. It is only right that an opportunity should be given for a full discussion. I would ask the President to extend the time that he has offered for a discussion on the motion so that Deputy Hogan and others anxious to speak on it may have a full opportunity of doing so.
I would suggest to the President that it would be just as well to give the half hour now, because otherwise the time will be taken up in discussing this, whether it is given or not.
On the question of private Deputies, if one were to take a census of the number of them in the House you would probably get the figure of 90. It is probable that about 90 meetings of the Dáil are held during the year, so that if we were to give to every private Deputy the rights which are so imperiously demanded by Deputy Hogan it would mean that every private Deputy would be entitled to one hour on every day that the Dáil sits.
Imperiously taken by the President.
I agree with the President that our Standing Orders do give private Deputies greater facilities than they have elsewhere. I do say, however, that these rights have not been abused by private Deputies by attempting to obstruct Government business or by putting down frivolous motions. Private Deputies have tried to play the game, and I think the Government should play the game by them.
Perhaps I might say a word on this, as the business that appears to be moving out Deputy Hogan's motion is the Land Bill. The Land Bill has been before the Dáil for three months. It was debated here on Second Reading and sent to a Select Committee. It then came back to the Dáil, and the position was that we had two Second Reading debates. Then there was a suggestion to refer it to a Special Committee. Generally speaking, there was an amount of obstruction in connection with the Land Bill, which later went to a Special Committee. Before the Special Committee the Bill was again debated. Between 70 and 80 amendments were discussed before that Special Committee, and at length 40 or 50 were agreed to. Now we are coming again with the Land Bill to the Dáil, having had two Second Readings on it, and after 60 or 70 amendments in connection with it have been debated before the Special Committee. That is really the reason for taking Deputy Hogan's time. I say that we have not got the amount of co-operation that we were told would be forthcoming when the plea was being made to allow the Bill to go before the Special Committee.
The first question to be settled is: Is there general agreement that the Dáil should sit later than 9 o'clock, and that the motion for the adjournment should be taken not later than 10.30?
Agreed.
The second question is: That consideration of the Committee Stage of the Land Bill be not interrupted at 9 o'clock for the purpose of taking private Deputies' business.
With regard to the Minister's statement that there has been deliberate obstruction in connection with the Land Bill, I want to say that is absolutely untrue. In that connection the Minister himself is not without fault. The Bill, as drafted originally, did not meet all the requirements of the situation, and it was very much improved as a result of the Select Committee. As far as this Party is concerned, if there has been any deliberate obstruction, it was not in accordance with our intentions.
Question—"That consideration of the Land Bill be not interrupted at 9 o'clock this evening for the taking of private Deputies' business"—put.
Tá
- Earnán de Blaghd.
- Thomas Bolger.
- Séamus Breathnach.
- Seoirse de Bhulbh.
- Séamus de Burca.
- Sir James Craig.
- James Dwyer.
- Michael Egan.
- Patrick J. Egan.
- Osmond Grattan Esmonde.
- Desmond Fitzgerald.
- John Good.
- John Hennigan.
- Patrick Leonard.
- Liam Mac Cosgair.
- Pádraig Mac Fadáin.
- Patrick McGilligan.
- Seoirse Mac Niocaill.
- Liam Mac Sioghaird.
- Pádraig Mag Ualghairg.
- Martin M. Nally.
- Michael K. Noonan.
- Peadar O hAodha.
- Seán O Bruadair.
- Risteárd O Conaill.
- Conchubhar O Conghaile.
- Séamus O Cruadhlaoich.
- Eoghan O Dochartaigh.
- Séamus O Dóláin.
- Peadar O Dubhghaill.
- Eamon O Dúgáin.
- Fionán O Loingsigh.
- Séamus O Murchadha.
- Pádraig O hOgáin (Gaillimh).
- Máirtín O Rodaigh.
- Andrew O Shaughnessy.
- Caoimhghín O hUigín.
- Patrick W. Shaw.
- Liam Thrift.
Níl
- Earnán Altún.
- Pádraig Baxter.
- Daniel Breen.
- Bryan R. Cooper.
- Louis J. D'Alton.
- Connor Hogan.
- Séamus Mac Cosgair.
- Eamon O Dubhghaill.
- Mícheál O hIfearnáin.
- Seán O Laidhin.
- Pádraig O Máille.
- Tadhg O Murchadha.
- Tomás de Nógla.
- Ailfrid O Broin.
- Criostóir O Broin.
- Tomás O Conaill.
- Aodh O Cúlacháin.
- Liam O Daimhín.
- Tadhg O Donnabháin.
- Pádraig O hOgáin (An Clár).
- Pádraig O hOgáin (Luimneach).
- William A. Redmond.
- Nicholas Wall.
When the President was dealing with the question of the public business for the remainder of the session yesterday he indicated that it was his wish that the House should meet on Monday at 5 o'clock. Speaking to-day he indicated he is going to make a week-to-week statement regarding Government measures to be brought forward until the Dissolution. I can assure the President, on behalf of the Deputies on this side of the House, that if he is anxious to take such steps as will lead him towards an appeal to the country at an early date, we will not do anything to prevent him taking such a decision. We are quite ready whenever he is willing. It is, however, the duty of the President to let us know now, so far as he can, what the Government's programme is, rather than let us know it from week to week. Are we to meet next Monday evening at 5 o'clock? No definite decision was taken on that matter.
The intention is to meet on Monday, Tuesday and Wednesday of next week and to meet every week up to Easter, with the exception of Holy Week. I do not mean that we should meet on Monday every week, but on Tuesdays, Wednesdays and Thursdays of each week.
The Dáil is to meet not only on next Monday, but on every Monday until Easter?
That is not the intention. I propose that we sit on Wednesday next at 11 o'clock in the morning and adjourn at 4 so as to enable Deputies who have to undertake long journeys to get home in time for St. Patrick's Day.
The President might be equally considerate with Deputies from the country districts who cannot possibly attend, except at extreme inconvenience, on Monday. There will be general opposition to that proposal unless it can be shown that there is absolute and extreme urgency.
I thought I explained that I hoped to be able to take the Vote on Account (Central Fund Bill) next Monday. If the Vote on Account be not finished this week we propose to continue it on Monday.
Has the President considered that Deputies going to and coming from Cork, say, could not get back to the House very conveniently before Monday evening?
I do not know that there are any Parties in the House in which there are Deputies who could not equally make the points that any such Deputies desired to make.
Are we being asked to decide upon a Monday sitting now?
We are not.
Then the matter will arise again?
It must arise again; there must be an Order of the House.