Dáil Éireann debate -
Thursday, 25 Apr 1929

Vol. 29 No. 8

Ceisteanna—Questions. Oral Answers. - State Expenditure on Irish.

Mr. Cole

asked the Minister for Finance if he will state the estimated total annual cost to the taxpayers and the ratepayers of the steps which have been taken by the Government to make Saorstát Eireann an Irish-speaking State, including (a) the annual cost of teaching the Irish language in primary and secondary schools and universities; (b) the annual cost of translating and printing official documents in the Irish language; (c) the various annual grants in aid of the Irish language; and (d) other annual expenditures in the revival of the Irish language.

Minister for Finance (Mr. Blythe)

As the answer to this question is rather long, and contains two tabular statements, I propose to circulate it with the Official Report.

Following is the answer:—An estimated sum of £27,000, the proceeds of a special rate not exceeding 1d. in the £ under the Local Government (Temporary Provisions) Act, 1923, is devoted by county and borough councils for the provision of instruction in Irish under Committees of Technical Instruction. This is the only ascertainable figure of expenditure falling upon the ratepayers in respect of the service referred to in the question.

Provision has been included in the current Estimates for the following items, which appear clearly to come within the scope of the question:—

Vote.	Sub-head.	Service.	Amount.
			£
Oireachtas	E.	Translation Staff	3,509
Stationery and Printing	E.F.G.I.J.	Printing of official documents	1,800
	H.H.	Grants to newspapers, etc., printed in Irish	900
Universities and Colleges	B.	Grant to University College, Galway	7,200
	B.	Grants to University College, Cork	990
	A.		1,200
Office of the Minister for for Education	A.1	Salaries of two officers engaged exclusively in the production of texts and works in general literature in Irish	994
	B.1	Salary and expenses of Irish Inspector	600
Secondary Education	A.3	Grant for Irish and Bilingual Schools	5,000
	E.	Grant towards publication of Irish Text Books	4,000
Technical Instruction	B.	Bonus on Salaries of Irish Teachers	10,975
	C.	Attendance Grants on Irish Classes	8,900
	D.	Cost of teaching Irish in School of Domestic Economy	80
Science and Art	B.1	Publications in Irish	2,400
	B.2	An Comhar Dramiochta	1,000
General	—	Additional cost of such advertising as is carried out through the medium of Irish	250
		Total	£49,798

From the above there should be subtracted a growing sum in respect of the receipts from sales of Irish Text Books and Publications which in the current year are estimated to reach £750.

I might mention here that the Grant-in-Aid to the Royal Irish Academy amounting to £2,600 from the Miscellaneous Services Vote, and the Grant-in-Aid of phonetic records of Irish dialects of £500 from the Science and Art Vote, being purely for academic purposes quite apart from the spreading of the living language, are not regarded as coming within the scope of the question.

It should also, perhaps, be mentioned that by making Irish an essential subject in all entrance examinations for the Civil Service, it has been possible to recruit a staff capable of conducting any necessary business through the medium of Irish without any additional cost to the State.

The apportionment for the purposes of the Deputy's question of the expenditure incurred in connection with primary education under the Votes for Primary Education and Public Works and Buildings is a matter of the very greatest difficulty.

It may be stated at once that it has been attempted and found impossible to allocate to Irish as a subject in the curriculum a proportion of the total expenditure on teaching in the primary system generally. The extent to which Irish is taught and used as a medium of instruction varies from school to school, and whilst every attempted solution of the problem has proved vulnerable to criticism, it remains ultimately true to say that there would be no abatement in the cost of the teaching service generally if the revival of Irish were not, as it is at present, a conscious and growing feature in the system.

There is on the headquarters and inspectorial staff no person whose services are exclusively engaged on the Irish language, and the same difficulties of apportionment, as already indicated, arise.

I come finally to the cost of recruiting and training the primary teachers of the future. It is admitted that at the change of Government the old monitorial system had broken down and a revision was necessary. On educational grounds alone it was thought essential that candidates for the teaching profession should have had the advantage of a full secondary education, and that good material should not be excluded because of inability, on account of economic or other circumstances, to undergo such instruction. These considerations alone would have led to the establishment of residential secondary schools, or at least of a system of scholarships on a large scale equivalent to the present pupil teacher system, which proceeds side by side with the preparatory colleges. The colleges were established to meet this state of affairs, and with the additional object of giving the pupils a thorough training in the national language to make them as fit in future to teach in Irish as their predecessors had been in English.

The total capital cost of these 7 colleges, when completed, is estimated to amount approximately to £350,000, of which £212,000 will have been incurred by the end of the current year. Taking interest at 5¼ per cent., the construction of these schools may be said to cost the State at present £11,660 per annum and ultimately £19,250. The total annual cost may be set out as follows:—

	In current year.		When completed.
	£		£
Interest on capital at 5¼ p.c.	11,660		19,250
Premises, upkeep, rents., etc.	6,655		7,270
Rates	1,306		say 1,500
Staffing and running expenses	40,235		50,000
	£59,856		£78,020
Less Appropriations (fees, etc.)	5,550		7,500
Net Total	£54,306		£70,520

To get the total State expenditure on the recruitment of teachers prior to their actual training, there must be added to the foregoing the annual sum of £5,000 for the present Pupil Teacher Scheme, bringing the net totals respectively to £59,306 and £75,520.

Under the old regime, however, an annual sum of £21,000 was spent on the monitorial and pupil teacher systems, and this must be subtracted from the totals above if it is desired to arrive at the figures of the actual new expenditure undertaken by the Free State, namely, £33,306 and £49,520.

If interest on the capital expenditure were calculated on the basis of a yearly annuity payable over 60 years the interest charges would be £11,670 and £19,270, and the totals would therefore be altered, respectively, to £33,316 and £49,540.

For the reasons mentioned above it is clear that the apportionment of the cost of the preparatory colleges and the pupil teacher system is a controversial matter in which there is room for difference of views, but it is obvious that not more than a fraction of it should be set down to the Government's Gaelicising policy. My personal view is that two-fifths would be a fair proportion, and this would leave the final figures at £13,330 and £19,816 respectively.