asked the Minister for Industry and Commerce if he will state the total loss to date including interest payments, incurred by the State in disposing of the stocks of turf and coal which were accumulated in the Phoenix Park prior to 1948; and if he will give an estimate of further interest payments to be made.
Ceisteanna—Questions. Oral Answers. - Loss on Disposal of Fuel Stocks.
I am informed by Fuel Importers, Limited that the direct losses, excluding interest payments and other overheads and losses due to shrinkage which were incurred in disposing of these stocks, are estimated at £1,421,936. I am also advised that it would be very difficult to segregate the interest payments applicable to these particular stocks from those relating to the Company's other stocks, and that any assessment which might be made would be on a very arbitrary basis.
Could the Minister inform the House what percentage the cost of keeping these essential stocks for the Irish people would be of the cost of getting involved in the last war for the freedom of Hungary and Poland, that the O'Higgins's wanted?
Surely that does not arise?
Question No. 5.
Is it not a fact that these losses were incurred in supplying the Irish people with fuel during the period 1939 to 1948, when fuel was not otherwise available to keep the home fires burning, at below the cost of production?
All this business arose when the war was over.
Not at all.
The Deputy is out of it as usual.
Will the Tánaiste tell us when it was decided to build up these stocks?
That is an entirely separate question.
Well, another question will be put down.
In 1947.
That is untrue and the Tánaiste knows it.
The Deputy is a specialist in untruths and so he is a good judge.
Deputy MacEntee knows that when a Deputy says something is untrue and that he knows that it is untrue, that is tantamount to saying it is a lie.
Yesterday I was accused by the Taoiseach of telling lies and the Chair did not ask him to withdraw.
That is clearly a charge against the impartiality of the Chair. I did not hear the Taoiseach say anybody was telling lies and if I did I would have asked him to withdraw just as I am asking Deputy MacEntee to withdraw his statement in respect of the Tánaiste.
No, Sir.
Will the Deputy withdraw the statement that the Tánaiste is telling lies?
No, Sir.
The Deputy will withdraw it. There is no argument about it.
I am not going to withdraw anything except what I said and if——
The Deputy is not going to make a speech.
No, Sir.
Either the Deputy will have to obey the Chair or not obey the Chair. Deputy MacEntee said that the Tánaiste made statements which he knew were untrue and that is tantamount to calling the Tánaiste a liar. Either the Deputy withdraws that or not.
No, Sir, not until the Ceann Comhairle is seated. I cannot be on my feet when the Ceann Comhairle is on his feet. That is the rule of Order in the House. I am bound to my seat until I am free to rise.
If the Deputy rises, will he say whether he will withdraw or not?
If in the opinion of the Chair anything I have said is contrary to the Rules of Order in relation to the Tánaiste, I withdraw it.
I am willing to give the Deputy a fool's pardon.
Now, Sir, I wish to say this. Anything which I may have said is not a reflection on the impartiality of the Chair but an expression of regret that the Taoiseach's statement yesterday was so confusing that even the Chair could not follow the purport of it.
The Chair said that he did not hear the Taoiseach charge anybody with telling lies and, if the Chair had heard the Taoiseach so speak, the Chair would have asked him to withdraw just as the Chair now asks Deputy MacEntee to withdraw his statement.
I am quite certain of that.
The Taoiseach did not say the Deputy was telling lies. He said the Deputy was making noise.