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Dáil Éireann debate -
Tuesday, 12 Jul 1960

Vol. 183 No. 10

Committee on Finance. - Vote 46—Agriculture.

I move:—

That a sum not exceeding £8,212,350 be granted to complete the sum necessary to defray the charge which will come in course of payment during the year ending on the 31st day of March, 1961, for the Salaries and Expenses of the Office of the Minister for Agriculture, including certain Services administered by that Office, and for payment of certain Subsidies and sundry Grants-in-Aid.

As in previous years, I have circulated to Deputies a memorandum giving a considerable amount of detailed factual information on the activities of my Department and on agricultural production, prices and trade.

The net Estimate for 1960/61 is £12,250,350, representing an increase of £878,348 over the original net Estimate for 1959/60 and a decrease of £1,255,152 on the original Estimate plus the Supplementary Estimate for that year. The main reason for the increase in the Estimate compared with the original Estimate for 1959/60 is the Bovine Tuberculosis Eradication Scheme, Subhead M.II. There is also an appreciable increase in the provision for An Foras Talúntais, subhead K.5, which is partly offset by savings on the provisions for services taken over by An Foras. The following services are provided for in the Estimate for the first time: Subheads F.4 and F.5—Grants to University College, Dublin, and Trinity College, Dublin, in respect of their Veterinary Faculties, and Subhead M. 13—Grants to Bacon Factories for certain works of modernisation in layout and plant.

In introducing last year's Estimate, I had occasion to comment on the extremely bad harvest of 1958 which was due to the persistently wet weather of that year. 1959 was a very different story. We had an exceptionally dry summer and a great deal of sunshine. The harvest was saved under ideal conditions, and the yield and quality of grain were excellent. There were also bumper crops of sugar beet and potatoes. Due to the prolonged drought, however, grass was short, and milk production fell appreciably. The drought also adversely affected the cattle and sheep trades, and a substantial number of stock was carried over to 1960.

Taking everything into account, 1959 was not a bad year: it was not as good as 1957 but was very much better than 1958. Gross agricultural output for 1959, including an increase in livestock numbers valued at £11 million, is estimated to be £187.5 million, that is, about £4.5 million above 1958. Net output on the same basis increased by about £5 million, or over 3 per cent.

Among the more important developments affecting our agriculture during the past year was the negotiation of a supplementary Trade Agreement with Britain. This has already been discussed by the House, and it is unnecessary, therefore, to expound it in detail. From the agricultural point of view, this Agreement is important for two main reasons: it reaffirms and strengthens the special trade relations between the two countries, and it provides for the application of the same guarantee payments to our attested store cattle as to British home-bred cattle. The House is aware of the special importance of our trade relations with Britain. The bulk of our exports is sold there and, in turn, we are a very important market for British industry.

Our sales of agricultural products in countries of the European Free Trade Association, other than Britain, are not appreciable. We have a small but useful market in, the countries of the European Economic Community where our sales of agricultural products amount to between £4 and £5 million a year. The future pattern of European trade generally is at present far from clear and the problems posed by the existence of the European Economic Community on the one hand and the European Free Trade Association on the other have not so far been resolved. As regards markets outside Europe, the American market has proved very satisfactory during the past year. Our agricultural exports to the U.S.A. in 1959—mainly frozen beef—amounted to £7.6 million compared with £5.1 million, in 1958.

A few months ago, I announced a number of price and other measures which the Government had decided upon in order to improve the incomes of farmers and keep them in reasonable relationship with those of other sections of the community who had obtained increases in wages and salaries over the past couple of years. These arrangements consisted partly of increases in the guaranteed prices for certain products and partly of measures to increase productivity by reducing costs of production. I believe that these price increases will encourage farmers to maintain and increase further their production of milk, cattle and pigs. Our milk prices are even now not very high by comparison with those of some other countries, but we must always keep in mind the difficulties of selling high cost dairy produce in well supplied markets.

It is obvious that in, the long run the most effective means of helping farmers is to try and reduce the cost of production and thereby increase productivity. The measures I announced a few months ago include a subsidy on potash fertiliser and a remission for twenty years of rates on, new farm buildings and on improvements to existing buildings. These forms of assistance were selected because, as already announced, the Government are particularly anxious that the benefits should apply to as large a number of producers as possible. There is evidence of increased use of fertilisers but there are still too many farmers not making full use of the facilities in this regard now placed at their disposal.

Since I introduced last year's Estimate, the Advisory Committee on Marketing has completed its work. Deputies will recall the White Paper published last December which sets out Government policy in relation to the recommendations made by the Advisory Committee for the improvement of the marketing of agricultural produce. Most of the Committee's main recommendations were accepted by the Government and it was decided:— (1) that an Irish Dairy Produce Board should be established to handle certain dairy produce exports; (2) That the export of bacon to Britain should be centralised in a reorganised Pigs and Bacon Commission; and (3) that the export of eggs should be centralised in Irish Eggs Limited.

The necessary legislation for the establishment of a Dairy Produce Board and the reorganisation of the Pigs and Bacon Commission is in course of preparation and will be introduced as soon as possible. As regards eggs, arrangements have been completed for the centralisation of exports in Irish Eggs Ltd. I should like to take this opportunity of thanking the Chairman and the members of the Marketing Committee for giving so much of their time to a difficult task.

I should now like to deal in some detail with some important aspects of our largest export industry—cattle. The number of cattle on farms as at January, 1960, was 4.3 million representing an increase of over 5 per cent. compared with a year earlier. The number of heifers in calf had increased by 17 per cent. and there were increases of 180,000 in cattle in the 1-3 year old group reflecting the lower rate of cattle exports in 1959. The year under review was, I regret to say, a rather disappointing one for the store cattle trade. Store prices in the early months of 1959 were very high but from May onwards a drop occurred which sharpened during the dry summer and autumn. In part at least due to the drought conditions exports of stores were appreciably lower than in the previous year. The number exported in 1959 was 403,000 compared with 595,000 in 1958.

This was, however, to some extent compensated for by an increase in exports of fat cattle and carcase beef. Exports of carcase beef in 1959 were valued at £10.5 million which represented an increase of £3.2 million over the previous year, while fat cattle exports at £5.2 million showed an increase of £1.7 million. The cattle trade has continued at a somewhat lower tempo this year and the prices of some classes of stock, particularly young cattle, have not been as strong in recent months as in the early part of 1959. The increases in exports of fat cattle and carcase beef have, however, been maintained in recent months.

After careful examination of the position, I do not agree with the view that has been expresed in some quarters, that the reduction in our store cattle exports in 1959 was due to any important extent to resistance by British farmers to our "once tested" cattle. We must recognise, however, that the value of the "once tested" concession is likely to have spent itself well before 1965 and this gives even greater urgency to our efforts to eliminate bovine tuberculosis. In my opinion, an important factor in the present situation is that housewives in Britain have been able to turn to plentiful supplies of lamb, mutton and broilers when beef prices reached high levels. Despite this, however, consumption of beef is expected to show a steady increase with rising living standards and should not be too seriously affected by the availability of other types of meat— although in the future I think we can expect that lower-priced alternative meat supplies will prevent beef prices from soaring too high. In my opinion, the position of the cattle trade is basically sound but the possibility of short-term fluctuations can never be ruled out.

The eradication of bovine T.B. is now our greatest single problem and if I deal with the matter in some detail, it is to underline the importance which I attach to it. The eradication scheme commenced in 1954 in Sligo and Clare and by the middle of last year it had been extended to all parts of the country. Compulsory clearance measures were introduced in Sligo and Clare in October, 1957, in the other five western counties of Donegal, Leitrim, Mayo, Roscommon and Galway in March, 1958, in Cavan and Monaghan in July, 1959 and in Longford in March of this year. In the remaining 16 counties eradication measures are proceeding on a voluntary basis.

To date the gross expenditure on the scheme has amounted to £12½ million and receipts from the sale of reactor cattle to £5½ million; the net cost of the scheme to date is, therefore, £7 million of which £5 million was spent in 1959-60. For this outlay, the disease has practically been eliminated in the western clearance counties, while in the east and midlands, including Cavan and Monaghan the incidence is being steadily reduced and individually accredited herds are being established. In the south where the problem is more difficult a certain amount of progress has been made—a total of 74,500 reactor cows has been removed under compensation—but it is well to remember that the disease incidence to start with was high and this will make the completion of the task in the south more formidable than elsewhere in the country.

However, investigations which have been carried out by veterinary officers of my Department show that there has been a considerable drop in the incidence of tuberculosis in young stock in the South over the past twelve months and I have no doubt that the pasteurisation of skim milk at creameries which is now compulsory will be a great help in the clearance of that area.

During the past year, there has been a growing awareness amongst farmers throughout the country of the urgent need to complete the job of eradicating the disease and it seems safe to expect a considerable acceleration in the pace of eradication from now on. Much has already been accomplished but of course a great deal still remains to be done. An extra effort now by all concerned will make all the difference as regards the time by which the whole country can be declared free of the disease.

As regards the western clearance area, the rate of testing did not enable area accreditation to be achieved in 1959 as we had originally hoped. We are now confident, however, that the entire area west of the Shannon, comprising the counties of Leitrim, Sligo, Mayo, Roscommon, Galway, and Clare, as a single unit, can be given accredited status by the end of this year, provided that an all-out effort is made by all concerned in the months immediately ahead. In this connection I recently addressed meetings of farmers in the less advanced of these counties and I firmly believe that the required effort will be forthcoming. I repeatedly urged at these meetings not only the importance of accreditation to farmers in the clearance area but that the attainment of this goal in the West would be a tremendous encouragement and example to farmers in the rest of the country to push ahead with the job.

In the meantime, the blue card arrangement which enables our store cattle to be exported to Britain without further testing, as the equivalent of 14-day tested cattle, is being introduced in each of the western counties when the number of reactor herds has been reduced to manageable proportions. This arrangement cannot be brought into operation in a county until a high proportion of the herds there has passed two consecutive tests. The reactor herds in the meantime are placed under movement restrictions which mean that cattle may not be moved from them except under permit which normally would be granted only to enable the cattle to be moved outside the clearance area or to go for immediate slaughter.

This arrangement is already in operation in Sligo, Donegal and Mayo and is being extended almost immediately to Galway, and will be extended to the remaining three counties of Leitrim, Roscommon and Clare in a month or so. The blue card arrangement, valuable as it is, must, however, be regarded as no more than a prelude to full accreditation and as a useful means of accustoming farmers to the controls which will have to be complied with when accreditation is granted.

Co. Donegal is in a different position from the other western clearance counties in that the movement of cattle into the county can be controlled with relatively little difficulty. Marked progress in the county indicate that it past year and the results coming up from the round of testing now in progres in the county indicate that it should be possible to grant the county accredited status in advance of the rest of the western area provided wholehearted co-operation is forthcoming from all concerned.

Cavan and Monaghan were made clearance area counties in July, 1959, and the second round of clearance testing has commenced in both counties. On the completion of this round of testing the blue card arrangement will be introduced in the two counties as quickly as possible. Longford has been a clearance area county since March last and the first round of clearance testing is in progress there.

Testing on a county basis began about a year ago in the ten Leinster counties of Louth, Meath, Westmeath, Dublin, Kildare, Offaly, Leix, Carlow, Wicklow and Wexford and is being availed of by a very high proportion of the herdowners. Although the scheme is on a voluntary basis in these ten counties, over 70 per cent. of the cow reactors disclosed on the initial round of testing have been disposed of to the Department. In these counties it is possible to make rapid progress by the combination of general eradication measures and the establishment of individually accredited herds. When the position in those counties warrants it, and this should not be very long if the effort is made, clearance area measures will be introduced beginning with the counties which have made most progress.

Last October, a new scheme of incentives involving the payment of a headage grant of £15 on each cow reactor sold to a licensed cannery and a substantial bonus when the herd gets a clear test was introduced in the six southern dairying counties of Cork, Kerry, Kilkenny, Limerick, Tipperary and Waterford. This scheme has attracted considerable support from herd owners—about 70 per cent. of the total number have submitted applications—but unfortunately, quite a number of farmers in the area, while availing of the free testing of their herds, have done little to get rid of the disease by disposing of reactors.

At this stage of the eradication campaign, such an attitude could not be tolerated. Accordingly, the automatic annual free re-testing of herds in the south was suspended early this year. Free re-testing will be restored in that area during the present month but on the basis that the herd owner must have disposed of a stipulated minimum proportion of his reactor cows in order to earn it. In future a farmer in the south will not have to wait twelve months for further testing as at present. He can have further tests carried out at more regular intervals provided of course he has disposed of his quota of reactors. This process can be repeated until the herd is cleared. More frequent testing will be of considerable value to herd owners who are serious about ridding their cattle of T.B. and will greatly facilitate them in qualifying for the clear herd bonus available in the south.

For the next year or two, one of the biggest problems with which herd owners are likely to be faced will be the economic disposal of uncertified store cattle. Since March last, such cattle have been deprived of entry into herds in Great Britain or into the Six Counties. Uncertified cattle may, however, be exported for immediate slaughter. With a view to facilitating the disposal of such cattle by farmers, butchers here are being indemnified in full from the beginning of this month against loss in respect of any heifer or bullock beef rejected because of T.B., while from the same date an arrangement is being introduced whereby payments related to the British fat stock guarantee payments will be made on fat cattle and carcase beef exported from this country.

Since the beginning of this month, all cattle which fail a comparative test are being branded by means of a hole punched in the ear. This has already been the practice in the western clearance area for some time.

There has been a certain amount of pressure on the Department to have high-yielding reactor cows in the south treated in the same way as pedigree cows for the purpose of compensation, that is, to have them taken up by the Department at market value instead of disposing of them to a cannery under the £15 headage arrangement. The argument is that these high-yielding cows, while more valuable to the herd owner, often make less at the cannery than the lower-yielding beef-type animals. I have considered this matter carefully and have decided to increase the headage grant of £15 to £25 in the case of cows registered under the Department's scheme for the registration of non-pedigree dairy cows. I do not propose to give special treatment to any other categories of high-yielding cows, for example, "recorded" cows.

From early this month, therefore, the following provisions in regard to the eradication scheme have taken effect:

(i) resumption of free herd testing in the south on the basis of the prior disposal of a specified minimum proportion of reactor cows; (ii) guarantee payments in respect of fat cattle and carcase beef exported; (iii) indemnification of butchers against losses from condemnations of bullock and heifer beef because of tuberculosis; (iv) branding of all reactors to the comrartive parative tuberculin test; and (v) special compensation arrangements for registered non-pedigree dairy cows.

When the above provisions have been implemented, I would hope that the pattern of the eradication scheme will have been set for the future. The incentives are fairly generous and the need to complete the job should be obvious to everybody.

I would like to make a special appeal to all herd-owners, veterinary practitioners and others engaged in the cattle trade to give their earnest co-operation in bringing to completion this vital task of eradicating bovine tuberculosis. The campaign has cost a great deal of money so far and looks like costing a lot more, but without the active support of everyone concerned the most lavish expenditure will be of no avail. The fact is simply that if our cattle export trade is to be maintained we have to get rid of this disease. If we were so unfortunate as to have an outbreak of foot-and-mouth disease everyone would give of his best to overcome it as quickly as possible because he would realise that our cattle industry was in jeopardy. The problem of bovine tuberculosis demands a similar approach and for the same reason.

There are two other developments affecting cattle which I should mention; these relate to progeny testing and milk recording.

Steps were taken in 1959 to improve the arrangements for the progeny testing of bulls of the dairy breeds— Shorthorn and Friesian—at the A.I. stations. Additional progeny testing units were established, the objective being to have four such units operating in the area of each A.I. station, and the Department has contributed about half the cost of operating the units. Each of five A.I. stations has now all four units operating and the remaining four stations have already gone part of the way. There are about 20 herds per unit and in each of these herds there are two or more heifers in milk, including A.I. progeny. The milk yields of the A.I. heifers are compared with the yields of the other heifers in the herd and the worth of the sires of the A. I. heifers is assessed on the basis of the comparative yields. A number of A.I. heifers are recorded in cow testing associations and records from the associations, where available with contemporary comparisons, have also been used for the progeny testing of A.I. bulls.

Recently the question of integrating the different milk recording schemes so as to avoid overlapping and make for more efficient operation has been receiving active consideration. Associated with this is the desirability of securing more records for progeny testing and of providing more convenient milk recording facilities for farmers than are available to them under the present cow testing scheme. The Department communicated with cow testing associations, the A.I. stations and the Pedigree Cattle Breeders' Council in this matter and has had discussions with a number of interests concerned. Whilst the precise lines of a new scheme have not yet been agreed, I am hopeful that it will be possible fairly soon to secure some integration and provide improved milk recording facilities.

Last year was not favourable for milk production, due largely to the exceptionally dry summer. Towards the end of July, it became apparent that only a limited quantity of butter would be available for export and, consequently, the levy of 17/- a cwt. on butter, which had been imposed in the previous year to meet the industry's share of the export losses, was suspended.

The rate of delivery of milk to creameries as compared with the previous year improved from December onwards. This improvement has been maintained and supplies are running at about 8 per cent. above the 1959 figure but are at present still about 10 per cent. below the 1958 figure. On the assumption that this trend will continue it seems than an export market will have to be found for a substantial quantity of butter and other dairy products. Market prospects are to say the least, not promising but the increase in production is an encouraging sign and the position on the export market for dairy products of all types is being kept under review.

As announced on 12th April last, the price at which the Butter Marketing Committee purchases butter has been increased by 28/- a cwt. This increase permits an average increase of 1.3d. a gallon in the price paid to farmers for milk. The minimum price of milk for liquid consumption in the Dublin and Cork Milk Board areas has also been increased by 1d. per gallon. As indicated by the Minister for Finance in his Financial Statement on 27th April last, in view of the increase in the price of milk, provision has been made in the Budget for an increase of £550,000 on the original estimate of £250,000 for subsidies on dairy produce to cover the possible Exchequer liability in respect of creamery butter and also a liability — assumed provisionally pending the establishment of the Dairy Produce Board—in respect of exports of certain other dairy products.

Pig production during the last year has been somewhat lower than the year before, but the census for January, 1960, shows a distinct upward trend as compared with the January 1959, census. In January, 1960, pigs numbered 875,000, that is more than 10 per cent. higher than last year. The increase in sows was 17 per cent. and in pigs under three months 16 per cent. This should be reflected in higher output during the remainder of 1960. The recent introduction of the new Grade A Special for bacon pigs, for which the minimum price is 245/- per cwt. deadweight as compared with 230/- for ordinary grade A, should afford a further incentive to farmers to aim at quality improvement.

I may mention that at this early stage an average of about 17 per cent. of pigs of at least Grade A standard qualify for the A Special Grade. The initial exports of bacon from these Grade A Special pigs have been well received on the export market, and it is hoped that we are now on the road to securing a much better place in that market. On the production side, reports have been published during the past year on the four pig progeny tests already completed at the Cork station and these will be a valuable guide to breeders. On the processing side, there is a new provision under Sub-Head M.13 of the present Estimate for the payment of grants to bacon factories in respect of modernisation in layout and plant. This State assistance to bacon factories was adumbrated in the White Paper on the Government's Programme for Economic Expansion.

The January, 1960 census indicates a continuing expansion of sheep production. Sheep numbered 3.2 million and were 4 per cent. higher than in the previous year. Ewes for breeding had increased by 5 per cent. The export market situation in the Autumn of 1959, influenced largely by drought conditions in Britain, was very unfavourable, but the market improved later in the year and for the past few months prices have been up to and sometimes above last year's levels. There was also a substantial increase in the number of store sheep exported in 1959, and these of course qualified for British Fatstock Guarantee Scheme payments after fattening in Britain or the Six Counties. Given reasonably normal conditions this year, we should not have cause for undue worry about the situation. The trend of supplies abroad is, however, generally upward rather than the reverse.

In regard to the poultry industry, the January census figures do not indicate any significant change in numbers. I may mention that development work for the purpose of stock improvement, especially in the case of turkeys and broilers, is being expanded and increased facilities have been provided during the past year for breeding and propagation work at the Department's institutions concerned. The increased facilities will permit of effective breeding programmes for the general distribution of stock of the best strains procurable. Improvement in the quality of turkeys to meet the now very keen competition on the export market is urgently required and this is being promoted by assistance towards the formation and development of more supply farms and breeder hatcheries and by encouraging turkey breeders who have not yet purchased poults from commercial or breeder hatcheries to avail themselves of the facilities obtainable from those sources. The area under wheat fell substantially in 1959 but the crop was a very good one and the quantity sold to the flour millers was approximately 270,000 tons dried or 30,000 tons less than the target. Growers received the maximum or near maximum price for all the wheat sold.

A very welcome feature of last year's harvest was the increase in production of feeding barley. The acreage under the crop was the highest on record. Prior to the harvest various proposals were made to me as to how the crop should be marketed. After full consideration of all the problems involved and with a view to ensuring, firstly, that the growers would receive at least the floor price previously announced, and secondly that barley would be made available to feeders at the lowest price possible, I decided to leave the marketing of the crop to the trade interests concerned. At that time the indications were that our full requirements of coarse grain would be met from the home crop. In those circumstances and in view of the fact that some maize is required for special foods, I agreed at the harvest time to the export of barley against the imports of a limited quantity of maize on a ton for ton basis.

It subsequently transpired that additional quantities of coarse grain would be needed to supplement home supplies up to next harvest and the barley exports were used as a basis for allowing the additional imports. With the co-operation of all the interests concerned I am glad to say that the arrangements made worked satisfactorily this year; there was no difficulty in marketing the barley and, generally speaking, feeding stuffs were available at reasonable prices throughout the year.

I may mention that the prices of compound feeding stuffs for pigs are now £1 to £1 10.0. a ton cheaper than they were at this time last year. Another point worthy of mention is the fact that growers of feeding barley retained more than half the crop for feeding to their own stock. Not only is it in the interests of the growers themselves to hold the greater proportion of their production of feeding barley but by doing this they ease considerably the overall marketing problem.

In addition to the exports of feeding barley there were also limited exports of seed barley, malting barley and malt during the year. We are all anxious to see this type of export expanded and every encouragement will be given to the exporters concerned in this regard.

In the case of oats the area sown in 1959 was slightly higher than in 1958. No official control was exercised over the marketing of the crop. With the exception, of a limited quantity of seed oats imports of oats were not permitted when the home produced oats became available.

As regards the current year, it was announced in December last year that the price for wheat would be unchanged; that the levy arrangement would be continued for this year; that the question of a quota system had not been dropped but that legislation would be needed if it were to be introduced.

On the basis of present information it seems that there has been a substantial increase in the wheat acreage as compared with last year and that a levy will be necessary, but before the rate of the levy can be determined I shall have to consult with An Bord Gráin as required by the Act.

It appears that there may be some reduction in the feeding barley acreage this year. If this forecast is borne out the fall in acreage is a matter for regret, particularly with a surplus of wheat in prospect. Increased production of feeding barley for use wherever possible on the farm where grown must remain one of the keystones in our livestock production policy. It is, however, difficult to make a firm estimate at this stage as the quantity of seed retained by growers for their own use is not known. As I have indicated already, the arrangements made for the marketing of last year's barley crop worked satisfactorily. I am proposing to make arrangements on somewhat similar lines this year. It is unlikely that there will be much change in the oats situation and it may be taken that, except for limited quantities of seed, imports will not be permitted so long as requirements can be met from home sources.

The number of applications received under the Land Project in the year 1959/60 was 26,900, an increase of more than 3,000 over the previous year. There is quite a considerable backlog of applications awaiting attention, representing roughly twelve months' work on the average. I am concerned to reduce to the minimum the time that elapses between the date a farmer makes his application and the date on which the application is investigated and to this end I have, during the past year, called the local officers together and personally impressed on them the need for speeding up the work of the project. In addition, I have initiated measures designed to cut out unnecessary office procedures in order to make more time available for the actual preparation of schemes. I am happy to say that during the past six months this has begun to show results as the number of approvals issued has been in excess of the number of applications received, which, of course, means that inroads have begun to be made on the backlog. Since I periodically supply Deputies with statistics indicating the progress made with land reclamation, it is not necessary now to go into the matter in more detail.

Under the Fertilisers Section of the Project 9,000 applications have from the outset been received of which over 8,600 have been dealt with involving a total area of 355,000 acres. Delivery and spreading of lime and fertilisers to the value of over £900,000 have been effected or arranged for on 171,000 acres on 4,330 holdings. This response is disappointing. The acreage covered is not large having regard to the length of time the scheme has been in operation, the total area of agricultural land in the country and the great need for fertilisers. We have taken account of the farmer's point of view by amending the scheme so that he can now take on the work by instalments.

As regards education, research and advisory work, the following developments may be mentioned. During the last financial year the process of the handing over of veterinary education to the Universities, in accordance with arrangements approved by the two Universities, the Veterinary Council of Ireland and the Royal College of Veterinary Surgeons in London was completed. Under these agreed arrangements, the Universities appoint the teaching staffs, and my Department administers the Veterinary College and appoints the non-teaching staff there. Both Universities utilise the Veterinary College for the training of their students, in accordance with arrangements agreed between the parties concerned. It is because of these arrangements that a decrease is shown in the provision under Subhead F. 3 for the Veterinary College. This decrease is more than counterbalanced by the grants to the two Universities under Subheads F. 4 and F. 5 in respect of veterinary education.

A sum of £400,000 is being provided in the Estimate for An Foras Talúntais. Grange Farm, the Peatland Experimental Station at Glenamoy, the peatland experimental centres at Derrybrennan and Clonsast, and Johnstown Castle Agricultural College have been transferred to the Institute from my Department. The Institute is engaging in an extensive programme of research which I hope will throw light on many of the problems which confront our agriculture.

During the past year the advisory services have been strengthened, the number of Agricultural Instructors actually employed at 31st March last having increased to 212 as compared with 194 a year earlier and I understand that further posts for which there are vacancies are in the process of being filled. I am glad to know that Committees of Agriculture are generally showing a progressive outlook towards educational matters and I look forward to an additional increase in the force of instructors in the year that lies ahead.

A new scheme of winter farm schools was introduced during the past year after consultations between my Department and the Department of Education. Under this scheme committees of agriculture and vocational education committees pool their resources in teaching personnel, accommodation and equipment so as to provide a comprehensive educational course to fit young people for life on the land. While the courses are varied to suit local needs and conditions they generally include agriculture and horticulture as well as instruction in a variety of other matters such as building construction, economics, account keeping and social affairs. I am glad to be able to say that the new scheme has got off to a good start, 37 schools having been conducted in the first year with a total attendance of over 800 and generally the students are reported to have displayed very keen interest in the subjects taught. I am hopeful that committees of agriculture and vocational education committees will continue to co-operate in this way and that the scheme will be considerably extended in the future.

The winter farm schools are intended primarily to cater for young people who live at home and who do not find it possible to attend one of the residential agricultural colleges. As the House is aware, the residential colleges provide a very fine blend of practical and theoretical education for those who have to make a living on the land and it is in the national interest that they should be fully utilised. I am happy to be able to say that many improvements have been carried out in the agricultural colleges in recent years and generally there is a keen demand for admission to these institutions.

There is one further matter which does not arise directly on the Estimate but which I should like to mention for the information of Deputies and of the public generally. The Food and Agriculture Organisation's world-wide Freedom-from-Hunger Campaign was launched on 1st July. The campaign, which will be carried on over a period of five years, is designed to deal with a situation which may be summarised as follows:

A large part of the world's population still does not have enough to eat, and an even larger part does not get enough of the right kinds of food.

The increase in food production only barely exceeds population growth.

The increase in food production per capita is least marked in the less developed parts of the world.

Food production in developed countries is being held back by limited marketing possibilities abroad.

The campaign is planned on the basis of world-wide concerted action with the Food and Agriculture Organisation acting as co-ordinator. It will be financed from a Campaign Trust Fund which will be fed by voluntary contributions from Governments, international non-governmental organisations, religious groups, private organisations and individuals. An urgent appeal has been made by the Director-General of FAO for support for the campaign and for funds urgently needed to get it under way. The Government have decided that we should lend every possible support to the campaign and that in token of such support we should make an official contribution of $10,000, that is about £3,570, to the Campaign Trust Fund. Because of the urgent need for funds in the early stages of the campaign the contribution is being paid immediately and the covering authority of the Dáil will be sought by way of Supplementary Estimate later in the year.

I move:

That the Estimate be referred back for reconsideration.

I never moved this motion with more profound regret than I do this year having listened to the dismal tale the Minister has had to tell us. The introduction of the Agriculture Estimate used to be an occasion of inspiration, almost excitement, some story of development, some story of expansion and some story of a new departure. This dreary recital is indicative of the state of the agricultural industry today.

I think it fair to say that the best test of any policy is the results. When I see what is going on in rural Ireland it makes me sick. The income of the farmers was £150.6 million in 1957. In 1959, the last complete year, it was £133.2 million, £17.4 million less than it was in 1957. I take the income of the farmers to represent the net value of agricultural output excluding turf and excluding changes in livestock. I do not know how anybody estimates how much turf the farmers cut. It is one of those figures that is plucked out of the air and put into statistics. No one knows whence, no one knows how, but in any case it is not agricultural output or income.

I think it is perfectly true that changes in livestock are a valid, genuine statistic, properly included in agricultural statistics, but they are not income for the farmer. There is nothing more depressing for a farmer to have on hand than a stock of cattle, the value of which is melting away before his eyes. I have seen the price of a calf drop from £20 to £10 in the past 12 months. But the income—the actual receipts to the farmers—has dropped from £155,000,000 in 1957 to £133,000,000 in 1959. If I were the Minister for Agriculture, with that tale to tell, I should be ashamed to appear in Dáil Éireann. I should be especially ashamed to appear in Dáil Éireann, bearing in mind that I had got where I was, as is the case with the Minister, by the fradulent pretence that I was going to raise the farmer's income, at least in respect of his cereal crops, by a substantial addition to the guaranteed prices current in 1957.

I remember Deputies in the Fianna Fáil Party, and their leaders, stumping this country in 1957, telling the farmers how their hearts were bleeding for them because the price of wheat had been reduced and because the price of feeding barley was no better than 40/- per barrel. I remember Deputy Corry, the poor man, coming in here on 26th March, 1957, fresh from the campaign, clearly recollecting the undertakings he had been sent to give to the people in East Cork by those who duped and fooled him. He rushed into this House in the first week in which the new Dáil met after the general election and put down a question at Column 43 of Volume 161 of the Official Report to ask:—

the Minister for Agriculture if, in view of the absolute necessity for increasing the wheat acreage this year, and in view of the endorsement of the wheat policy by the people, he will state what steps he intends to take to secure by financial inducement an increased wheat acreage this season; and if, in view of the lateness of the season, he will make an immediate statement on the matter.

I remember so well his getting the ‘dusty' answer "No" from Deputy Aiken, the Minister for Agriculture— that man of many parts—"No alteration in the price of wheat in these last days of March could appreciably affect the acreage of wheat this year." And the reply went on to say:—

I can, however, assure Deputy Corry that the necessity for securing an adequate acreage of wheat is fully realised by the Government, and that an announcement regarding wheat prices will be made in good time to enable farmers to prepare for the autumn sowing season.

Deputy Aiken, Minister for Agriculture at the time, had forgotten by then the cruel injustice of which he had spoken so eloquently, the robberies done upon the farmer by the fixation of the price of wheat by the Government in which I was Minister for Agriculture; but he assured Deputy Corry that "the necessity for securing an adequate acreage of wheat is fully realised by the Government". Poor Deputy Corry went off chewing on that. There was no "jam today" for Deputy Corry or his dupes. I think Deputies will agree with me that it was not an unreasonable interpretation of these words that there would be "jam to-morrow" when Deputy Aiken, as Minister for Agriculture, had had time to examine further into the matter and consult with his colleagues in the Government.

That is what poor Deputy Corry thought. So he returned again to the charge on 27th November at Column 1009 of Volume 164 of the Official Report.

Mr. Corry asked the Minister for Agriculture if he is now in a position to announce the guaranteed prices for homegrown wheat and feeding barley of the 1958 crop.

Mr. Aiken: With the permission of the Ceann Comhairle.... As the matter is still under consideration I am not yet in a position to make a statement in regard to prices of wheat or feeding barley of the 1958 crop.

Mr. Corry: Is the Minister aware that very early last year he assured me that the prices for the 1958 wheat crop would be published early in the autumn so that we could do autumn sowing in the knowledge of them? This does not look a bit like it.

Mr. Aiken: I think as a general practice it would be good.

Mr. Corry: It is nearly Christmas now.

That is all the satisfaction poor Deputy Corry got. But when the price came to be fixed, Deputy Corry discovered, as did his dupes on the land of Ireland, that what Fianna Fáil meant when they said they were going to provide 82/6d. a barrel was, in fact, that they were going to take the price fixed by the inter-Party Government of 78/6d. per barrel and reduce it by the imposition of a levy, and all because they were dealing with the farmer.

In the meantime—this is something a great many people have forgotten— the same Government have required the farmers to pay more for bread—5d. on the loaf, 3/7d. on the stone of flour, 10d. now on the lb. of butter, an increase in the price of tobacco, an increase in the price of beer, increased rates on their land, increased transport charges on themselves and all they buy and sell, and the increased prices are on the things they have to buy as a result of the increased costs pushed upon the producers of this country. Over the period in which all those increased costs were thrust upon the farmers all they received from the Fianna Fáil Government, the Government who had promised them so much, was a levy on the price of wheat fixed by their predecessors, not an increase as was promised from 40/- to 48/- a barrel for feeding barley but a reduction to 37/-, now adjusted, I think, to 38/- per barrel. As a result of the price of livestock and livestock products, they received a total reduction in their income from £150,000,000 in 1957 to £133,000,000 in 1959.

There is no other section of the community who have been asked to accept a lower monetary income over the same period. What this Government have forgotten is that they have pushed the farmers now very near to the position in which they were in 1947. But we came into office then and changed the picture. The Fianna Fáil Government are once more pushing the farmers back into that position. They believe that the farmers can be forced into a course of tightening their belts, lowering their standard of living, into the position of being hewers of wood and drawers of water the position Fianna Fáil thinks suitable for them; but Fianna Fáil are wrong. What is happening is—the Minister knows it and all the Fianna Fáil Party know it —that the small farmers are clearing out. The big farmers in the east and south-east are still able to hang on, but their income is dwindling and the repercussions are being felt in the towns and villages throughout the country.

That is bad from the point of view of the economy of Ireland but what is infinitely worse from the point of view of the very existence of the Republic is that the people who constitute its main stability, the landowning farmers of the country, are leaving it. There is not a townland west of the Shannon from which at least one family has not gone and there is not a village west of the Shannon from which, in the last two years, several young people have not left; but the grimmest development in my lifetime is to see seven adjoining houses on the borders of County Mayo and Roscommon evacuated by their entire families in the last two years where, to my knowledge, children were reared as long as I remember, and where there is nothing now on seven holdings—no trace of human occupation and no production other than the few thin store beasts that are fighting a losing battle with the rushes which are moving in.

This Government has gone mad. They have simply made up their minds to let the land go. There are 12,000,000 acres of arable land and it is simply being abandoned by the Fianna Fáil Government. In their heart of hearts I believe they have made up their minds to let it go, that the future of this country is to be based on the Shannon entrepreneur system and enterprises of that character, that the land is beyond the redemption of the people who are on it, and that the sooner they are shifted off it the better. They are mad; they are stark, staring mad, because after that asset is suffered to wither and die our people cannot survive as an independent people for one generation. We shall simply become the serfs of any exploiting power that wants to march in and control us. The sheet anchor of our independence and sovereignty has been our security in the land and that is being jettisoned by the Fianna Fáil Government.

I rejoice to think that at last the people who live on the land are awakening to the measure of the catastrophe that is overtaking them, and I do not conceal the fact that the result of the Carlow-Kilkenny by-election was a gratifying surprise to me. I did not realise the strength of the ground swell against Fianna Fáil in a constituency like Carlow-Kilkenny and I rejoice in it because, without that reaction, the prospects of this country would be truly appalling. I only hope and pray that reaction will wax and grow so that again we may attempt in 1961 what we put our hands to in 1948. However, there is no use concealing the fact that the situation which will confront us in 1961 will be far more difficult than the problems with which we had to struggle in 1947 because in the meantime two shameless confidence tricks have been successfully played on the people by the Fianna Fáil Party, and I do not blame our people if they now trust no one in the public life of the country.

It may be unjust that we should suffer for the fraud of Fianna Fáil but the fact is that we do. A great part of the electorate of the country, particularly in rural Ireland, would now not believe the Gospel from a public platform and the blame for that rests squarely on the Deputies who went down to tell them their hearts bled for them in regard to the prices obtaining for wheat in 1957, and that they were straining at the leash to get control so that, as poor Deputy Corry inquired in March, 1957: "When are we going to do what we promised that we would do?" The present Minister for External Affairs, Deputy Aiken, gave him his dusty answer: "Wait and see, Deputy."

Then, when the cold blast of winter blew him in here to repeat his inquiry, he was told again: "Wait and see." He finally got his answer and I pitied him the day he got up, under the spur of criticism, thumped the table and said: "I came in here as a member of the Fianna Fáil Party and I will stay that as long as I am here, whatever they do." I admired his loyalty but I pitied his confession of public humiliation. I asked him to be here today so that we could discuss together that grim record of his public humiliation. He at least, I believe, was in good faith but he typifies the disillusionment of those who accepted the undertakings of the Fianna Fáil Party.

I only hope that, in his humble prostration now, he does not represent truly the reaction of the people of the country to the fact that they have been asked to lower their standard of living, and to accept the position that their proper place is on the lowest run of the social structure of this country. I do not accept it and I do not believe any self-respecting section of our people should accept it, but I confidently prophesy that, if the policy based on such a detestable proposition is pursued, this country will collapse because the land will cease to produce and, without the output of the land, Ireland can neither be sovereign nor free.

I do not believe that it behoves me to undertake the formulation of policy for the present administration. There is only one remedy for the present situation and that is to expedite the process which has already begun. Fianna Fáil is on its way out and the faster it goes the better prospect there is of this country surviving.

If the people asked me tomorrow what is the remedy for the present situation the only remedy I can propose to them is: "Get the rascals out." So long as they are there, the agricultural community is headed back to the position in which we found them in 1947, with the distinction that this time the people are going and still continue to go and, having gone, they will not come back.

It is not my job to formulate policy for the present Government and I do not propose to try to do so. It is right that I should recall the details of the figures to which I have referred. Dramatic though these global figures are, it is no harm to put once more upon the record the relevant facts as set out in Economic Statistics prior to the Budget of 1960, compiled by the Central Statistics Office, on page 8 of which occurs the following words:

In 1959, as compared with 1958, the output of cattle declined by 72,000 or by about £5 million in value. The value of total milk output fell by £2.2 million and the output of pigs fell by £1.7 million. A fall of £l.4 million in the output of sheep and lambs was offset to some extent by a rise of £.7 million in wool. Lower prices for turkeys caused a drop of £600,000 and egg production declined by £1.1 million. The aggregate output of livestock and livestock products fell by £11.7 million from £141.5 million in 1958 to £129.8 million in 1950.

These are grim figures. They are figures of which this country must take urgent heed if the whole west of Ireland is not quickly to be depopulated——

And they are not Fine Gael figures.

——and if the young people are to be persuaded that there is still some future on the land. It causes me no little concern, over and above seeing the land abandoned in the West, to hear amongst the young people from whom we ought to be drawing the next and succeeding generation of farmers their growing conviction that there is no future for anybody on the land. If that impression continues to spread, I do not know where the income from the land will be got but, without that income, this country cannot survive. That is the urgent problem with which this Oireachtas and our people are at present confronted.

In the course of the Minister's statement I see that as a result of the White Paper published in regard to the recommendations of the advisory committee he now proposes that the export of eggs should be centralised in Irish Eggs, Limited. I cannot but remember when his predecessor, the late Deputy T. Walsh, solemnly, and at great expense, wound up Eggsports which was then handling the egg exports of this country very successfully. Having wound it up, scattered its personnel, wrecked its organisation, five years later the present Minister has another brain wave that he will create it again. We are all meant to stand up and give three ringing cheers for this revolutionary discovery of the present Minister for Agriculture that this is the solution of all the problems of our egg trade—to stick together the pieces of what his predecessor tore up and discarded as of no value.

It is like living in Bedlam to try to keep track of the gyrations of successive Fianna Fáil Ministers for Agriculture. It is a wise thing that there should be centralised marketing of whatever remnants of the egg trade now survive, and they are not much. If they suddenly discover that this is the solution of all our problems, I am wholly at a loss to understand, why they did not leave Eggsports in existence when they had it, with all the contacts and organisation it then had.

The Minister very succinctly tells us that the exports of bacon to Britain would be centralised in a reorganised Pigs and Bacon Commission. It is gratifying to hear that he has bent his powerful intellect to the solution of this problem. In the meantime, he overlooks the fact that the Danes have moved in and usurped our preferential position in the British market and, what is more, as far as I can read the signs though I have not inside information requisite to make a proper judgment, they seem successfully to have stuck their finger in our eye.

I have been reading of a whole series of consultations designed to regulate supplies of bacon to the British market from the various traditional suppliers. The net result is that we have moved out and the Danes have moved in. The Danes have stepped up consistently and regularly their exports of bacon to the British market. They obviously have shown their readiness to accept any price the market are prepared to give them, with resulting repercussions on our position in that market which, as far as I can see, closely approximates to catastrophe.

I do not know what the centralisation of our exports to Great Britain by the reorganisation of the Pigs and Bacon Commission may produce. I wish it well. I take it the Minister has carefully considered all the relevant considerations. There are the trade connections that exist, all of which a centralised marketing organisation must rupture and abandon. It is not enough to tear up all these existing trade relations and then hand it to the centralised marketing organisation unless a vigorous marketing policy is pursued.

One of our difficulties is that we have not the bacon at present with which to conduct an effective marketing operation in Great Britain. We are in the dilemma at the moment that if we seek to develop the market we will not have the bacon to supply it and if we do not develop the market we will have nowhere to sell our bacon. I imagine the wisest course to pursue will be to concentrate our exports at least temporarily on certain restricted areas in Great Britain which we have some prospect of adequately and steadily supplying but if we do we must establish in those areas an organisation equal or superior to the existing Danish marketing system which is extremely powerful and well-organised.

The Minister might have given some further explanation of what he means by saying that the export of bacon to Great Britain should be centralised in a Pigs and Bacon Commission. He says that legislation for the establishment and reorganisation of the Pigs and Bacon Commission is in course of preparation and will be introduced as soon as possible. We must await the publication of that legislation whenever it may come, to find out the details he has in mind. A great deal requires to be done if we are ever to recover the position we once had in the British market for bacon and if we are ever to recover the ground we have lost to Denmark in that market while we were exerting ourselves to determine whether proportional representation should be retained or abolished in our electoral system.

I said here recently that one of the urgent necessities for the effective prosecution of the bovine tuberculosis eradication scheme was that the Minister should tell us what he wanted us to do. I must say that it had the eminently desirable result of producing large advertisements in the newspapers succinctly telling farmers in the different parts of the country what he wanted them to do. I do not quite understand the Minister's reference to compulsory clearance measures being introduced into the five counties of Donegal, Leitrim, Galway, Mayo and Roscommon in March, 1958.

What is compulsory about them? I am not yet aware that there is any compulsion to undertake clearance operations in these five counties. I was rather inclined to think long ago that the time was overdue when compulsory measures would be legitimate. I would be obliged if the Minister would tell me what he means by compulsory clearance measures in Donegal, Leitrim, Galway, Mayo and Roscommon. I confess that if there are such compulsory measures I never heard of them. If the Minister explained the matter to me, I would perhaps recognise something I have not so far recognised. If the Minister wants my opinion as to whether the time is ripe for compulsory measures, I think the time is ripe. If some action along those lines is not taken pretty soon, we shall not get where we want to get in the time still available to us.

On page 10 of the Minister's statement he says:

Steps were taken in 1959 to improve the arrangements for the progeny testing of bulls of the dairy breeds—Shorthorn and Friesian— at the A.I. stations.

To my certain knowledge, there were steps taken to that end at the Sligo A.I. centre in 1956. I would be glad to know from the Minister whether any results have emerged. Some results ought to be available from the progeny testing stations which have been at work for four years. Have any outstanding bulls been discovered or any recorded? Does anybody know anything about them? I can tell the Minister—perhaps, he may make a note of this—that I discovered a bull recently in the Sligo A.I. centre, with a very distinguished Aberdeen Angus pedigree which was, in fact, producing horned calves. I understand it has been moved on. I got a couple with horns on them. They were not full-grown horns but they were quite sufficient to persuade anybody who looked that they had a drop of Kerry blood in them. In fact, the calf's sire had an Aberdeen Angus pedigree a mile long wherever he got it.

I can assure the Minister, and in this I sympathise with him, that there was more talk about the calves with horns on them from the A.I. station than there was about all the excellent calves born through A.I. from that same station. That is the nature of people. It may have been nobody's fault but it was a very strange thing to happen. I have been trying to explain it to a good many of my neighbours with very little success. I may say that such accidents do happen. There are a number of sceptical people who are inclined to say: "There, I told you so. There was nothing like the old scrub bull."

I see that the Minister refers on page 12 to the progeny testing station for pigs. I was largely instrumental in setting up that station in Cork. Does any Deputy sympathise with me in my situation when, having read four reports, beautifully produced, from the pig progeny testing station, I ask myself where do we go from there? There was only one boar referred to in all these reports whose owner I knew and I thought I would hurry off and make that boar's acquaintance when I got such a high testimonial from the A.I. station. When I called on the boar, I was told that he was dead and buried before the report came out. What I should like to find out is, when you get down to tin tacks, how are we to benefit from and use the reports of the pig progeny testing station?

I thought at some stage that people who wanted to buy a sow would be recommended to go to a certain place where sows of progeny tested stock were available. I did not think it was impossible that at some stage the Pigs and Bacon Commission would hold themselves out as being in a position to supply sows from progeny tested stock. I think the time is overdue when the Department of Agriculture should make known to the pig breeding community at large how they are to avail of the information collected at the pig progeny testing station. If necessary, the Department should, in consultation with the Pigs and Bacon Marketing Commission, make available breeding sows of proven strains because I know of no machinery whereby these can be acquired at the present time by the average farmer.

I notice that, when the Minister was referring to the increase in the number of sheep, he made no reference to wool. I used to fight a considerable running battle with the Department of Industry and Commerce who always sought to establish that wool is an industrial product in this country. I understand that the exports of wool last year were in the order of £5,000,000. That represents to my mind no small part of the value of the increasing numbers of sheep on the land of Ireland. I think that the Minister has a duty to keep before the mind of the people the substantial additional income which is derived from wool in addition to the export of sheep, lamb and mutton which are customarily regarded as the main output of the sheep industry in this country.

On page 13, the Minister says that development work for the purpose of stock improvement, especially in the case of turkeys and broilers, was being extended and increased facilities were provided during the past year for breeding and propagation work at the Department's institutions concerned. I certainly would be interested to hear something further in this particular matter. We brought in the best broad breasted white turkeys from the United States of America. We brought in two separate breeds of American broiler chickens. We established at considerable expense at Athenry a turkey propagation station amidst, I remember, the howls of derision of a good many Fianna Fáil Deputies at the time. It was lucky we did so. If we had not then brought in the new strains of white turkey, we would be well on our way to losing irrevocably a very substantial British market for turkey meat. I should be glad to know from the Minister how far the Athenry station is in a position to supply all the demands made upon it; whether it still confines its supplies to people who maintain turkey stations in rural Ireland, or whether anybody can apply to Athenry for supplies of pedigree white turkeys, and is it now the policy of the Department—as I think it ought to be—to replace the American Bronze as expeditiously as possible with the broad-breasted Empire White, and if so, what progress has been made to that end?

I see that the Minister on page 14 of his statement believes that:

As regards the current year, it was announced in December last year that the price for wheat would be unchanged; that the levy arrangement would be continued for this year; that the question of a quota system had not been dropped but that legislation would be needed if it were to be introduced.

On the basis of present information it seems that there has been a substantial increase in the wheat acreage as compared with last year and that a levy will be necessary, but before the rate of the levy can be determined I shall have to consult with An Bord Gráin as required by the Act.

Has the Minister no idea of what the dimensions of the levy are likely to be? Will it be more or less than 5/- a barrel? Even prior to consultation with An Bord Gráin, he might pay Dáil Éireann the compliment of informing us approximately what the figure is likely to be, before we adjourn for the Summer Recess. This body to which we belong is, after all, representative of all the people and the ultimate authority on matters of this kind, and I think it is entitled to hear what the prospects are.

I am glad to see that the Minister is proceeding with the Land Project. God be with the days when Fianna Fáil used to be warning the farmers not to touch the Land Project as it was a dark and sinister scheme to increase the valuation of their land. Is it true that the Minister is catching up on the arrears? I have been told authoritatively that the arrears were never worse and if there is any temporary staff required for any temporary job, the staff of the Land Project are promptly transferred. Is it true that the staff of the Land Project are in part diverted to valuing cattle for the purpose of acquisition under the bovine tuberculosis eradication scheme? It is true that the staff of the land project are being substantially reduced? My information down the country is that the delays in getting approval for works proposed have never been greater than they are now.

I see that the Minister is disappointed with the fertiliser section of the project. So am I. When that scheme was inaugurated, we provided under it that a man should get his whole farm done at the same time and there were complaints about that condition being insisted on. Finally, my successor, the late Senator Moylan, waived that condition and prophesied that as a result there would be a very much larger number of applications for the scheme. It does not seem to have had that effect. I offer this advice to the Minister: what that scheme requires is more publicity. I do not believe that one one-fiftieth part of the people to whom it should be of interest know of the existence of that scheme.

If the Minister engaged in a little publicity informing people that anyone who wants to get his land fully fertilised on a long-term project had only to apply, he would find plenty of applicants, provided there was some prospect of the work being done reasonably soon after the application was filed. Nobody is going to avail of the scheme if he has to apply in January, 1960, and wait until June, 1961, to get the fertiliser. Unless he was daft altogether, he would not leave his land lie fallow for 18 months because the Department of Agriculture were using their staff for some purpose other than that for which they were employed, that is to say, taking them from the Land Project and employing them on other work while the Land Project fell into 12 or 18 months arrears.

I want to raise a specific matter which affects the problems of beet farmers who are supplying beet to the sugar factories, and also other products which are produced from Irish sugar, which is raw material produced in this country. In 1948, we negotiated a Trade Agreement, Article V of which reads as follows:

The Government of the United Kingdom undertake that where goods, the growth, produce or manufacture of Ireland, are dutiable at preferential rates of duty, they will not vary the existing preferential treatment of these goods in such a way as to put any class of goods, the growth, produce or manufacture of Ireland, at a disadvantage in relation to goods of that class from other sources enjoying preferential treatment.

Now, that is a pretty comprehensive Article and yet with that Article in existence, I understand that goods containing Irish sugar are being subjected to a very formidable levy, the proceeds of which are devoted to the subsidisation of goods of similar quality containing sugar derived from crown Colonies of the British Crown. I am told, I think, by some of the Minister's colleagues, that when Deputy Norton was Minister for Industry and Commerce, this matter arose and that he did not consider it desirable to press the interpretation of Article V which would give us the right to claim exemption from that levy.

I do not know what the position is in regard to that. I have no recollection of hearing the matter discussed when I was a member of the inter-Party Government, although it could have happened and passed out of my memory but I do not remember it and I have not discussed the matter with Deputy Norton. Whatever attitude was taken up, I should like to be told now because frankly I confess that as I see it now, it appears that that Article is wide enough and comprehensive enough to cover the present procedure under which I believe that goods which are the growth, produce or manufacture of Ireland are being put at a disadvantage in relation to goods of that class from other sources enjoying preferential treatment.

I am fully aware that the British Government, like any other Government, will seek to interpret any agreement which they have signed, in the most favourable possible light to themselves. That is their right and duty to their own people, but they will expect us to do as much, and claim from the agreement the maximum advantage to which its words and terms entitle us. I should be very interested to hear from the Minister whether he has asked our Minister for External Affairs or whoever deals with the matter to press that point of view in regard to sugar and its products and, if so, with what result.

I would view the future not only of agriculture but of this country with profound dismay, if the various Constitutions enacted since this State was founded did not have it in common that there should be a general election at least once every five years. The longest this Government can last is another 12 months. I hope and pray that their disappearance at the end of that term will not be too late but I have so profound a confidence and hope in the land of Ireland that I cannot persuade myself it will be too late. In any case, we shall try, I hope, successfully, 12 months from now, to reverse the trend that has brought the income of the farmers down by £17,000,000 a year since Fianna Fáil took office.

We shall try in so far as within us lies to see that the farmers are no worse off than any other section of the community. We want no privileged position for them. We want them to enjoy no superior advantage over the trade union workers, the businessmen or the professional workers in their own country, but we think they were never destined to be the hewers of wood and the drawers of water for everyone else. That is what they are being made now. They are being turned into the poor people of our community. I do not think they will stand for it and I do not think the country can afford to let them go.

They are going now every day, every month, every year in growing numbers, not because they want to go to better jobs, but because they cannot live in their own country. That is the kind of emigration I hate. We have seen both kinds in our day. I can remember many years ago one kind of emigration. I saw it disappear and be replaced by another kind of emigration of people who had no need to go but chose to go because they felt they could earn more and live a better and a different kind of life abroad. They were entitled to go if they chose, and some did choose to go. Some preferred to stay because they knew here in Ireland they could still get on the land a measure of security, dignity and peace that was not to be had in the industrial maelstroms of Birmingham or Pittsburg, London or New York.

Now whole families are going, not because they want to go, but because they can no longer live at home, and they are leaving behind them abandoned holdings which should be a red light of warning to any rational Government. I think Fianna Fáil do not provide our people with a rational Government. I do not think they chose for our people a Minister for Agriculture who really believes either in himself or in his portfolio. The only remedy I see for that is a change of Government. God speed that day.

The statement which the Minister gave us tonight was a very gloomy review of his inactivity during the past 12 months. He made very little reference to the Trade Agreement or to any efforts to improve the position between this country and Great Britain, so far as our agricultural exports are concerned. We expected that we would have heard from the Minister what the result of those efforts was. If it was a failure, we should have heard from the Minister that he would try again. Instead, he has avoided any reference to what appears to have been a fiasco, so far as agriculture is concerned.

We can understand the dismal tale which the Minister had to tell this evening after the verdict of the agricultural community recently in Kilkenny. We remember the victory of the Fianna Fáil Party of almost two to one in the Carlow-Kilkenny election when they were promising to increase the price of milk and the price of wheat same years ago. The agricultural community in Carlow-Kilkenny showed very clearly in the recent by-election that they have lost their faith in the policy of the Fianna Fáil Party and that they are anxious for a change of policy and a change of Government as soon as possible.

The Minister mentioned this evening that it was the intention to introduce legislation here again for the purpose of imposing a levy on this season's wheat crop. We might have expected from the Minister an undertaking that if he did introduce legislation of that kind, it would not bring about the results we saw some years ago when money was taken from the wheat growers to be used in respect of a surplus which did not result from the crop that year. Instead, the money was taken from them seemingly under false pretences because when it was collected, no surplus resulted and it was used for another purpose. The wheat growers expect an undertaking from the Minister on this occasion that if he takes a levy from them in order to deal with a surplus, the money will be used for that purpose only.

The Minister also mentioned the quota system which was very much in the minds of the wheat growers and agitated their minds when it was given an airing last year in order to see what their reaction to a proposal to have a wheat quota would be. One of the main difficulties confronting the agricultural community at the moment arises from the Minister's lack of interest in the tuberculosis eradication scheme. It is well known that the Minister has not his back behind that scheme and he certainly declared himself against that scheme a couple of years ago.

When? The Deputy should be fair. When?

I could tell the Minister that a Deputy of his own Party speaking in Wexford——

It is all right for the Deputy to say what he has said and——

——I do not mind what the Deputy says, but it is an appallingly inaccurate and untrue statement.

The Minister said many things and we did not interrupt him.

I only want to make sure that it will not go on the records of the House without immediate contradiction so far as I am concerned, because I never made that statement at any time, privately or publicly.

I would ask the Minister to consult a Deputy of his own Party—I think it was Deputy Browne from Wexford—who at a meeting of the county committee of agriculture declared himself to be very dissatisfied with the attitude of his own Minister towards this tuberculosis eradication scheme.

Progress reported: Committee to sit again.
The Dáil adjourned at 10.30 p.m. until 3 p.m. on Wednesday, 13th July, 1960.
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