asked the Minister for the Public Service the steps he proposes to take to ensure that any person who so wishes may conduct his or her business in Irish with any Government Department.
Ceisteanna—Questions. Oral Answers. - Business in Irish.
66.
Faoin gcóras nua beidh marcanna breise le fáil ag iarrthóirí ar phoist sa Státseirbhís le Gaeilge agus le Béarla. Tá súil agam go mbeidh cumas sa Ghaeilge ag formhór na ndaoine a cheapfar amach anseo. Cabhróidh Gaeleagras na Státseirbhíse le hoifigigh chun feabhas a chur ar a gcuid Gaeilge. Cuirfear eolas ar an nGaeilge san áireamh, freisin, le haghaidh ardú céime. Ní bheidh aon easba Gaeilge, mar sin, sa Státseirbhís agus beidh fonn níos láidre chun feidhm a bhaint aisti toisc deireadh an éigeantais.
Fuair mé a lán gearán nach mbíodh sé éasca gnó a dhéanamh trí Ghaeilge le Ranna Rialtas faoin sean-chóras. Iarradh, mar sin, ar gach Aire féachaint chuige ina Roinn féin nach mbeadh an chuis ghearáin seo ann feasta. Tá mé cinnte go mbeidh feabhas mór ar an scéal de bharr a bhfuil déanta ag an Rialtas.
Arising out of the Minister's reply, may I ask him to reply to the question put to him? What proposals has he to ensure—not to be hopeful about or anything else but to ensure—that people who wish to do their business in Irish with any Government Department will be able to do so, having regard to the fact that the regulations he has announced will certainly produce a situation in which Government Departments may be staffed entirely by people unable to do business through Irish?
The principal complaint I received from a multitude of individuals and organisations was that the old system, which we abolished, had failed to produce a situation in which Irish speakers could do their business in Irish with people in the Public Service. I had quite a long session with representatives of different organisations who vehemently condemned the Public Service for their failure under the old system to carry on business with them in Irish. We are now satisfied that by replacing the compulsion which did so much damage to the Irish language over the past half century with enthusiasm for the language, we will have people more readily disposed to use Irish. It is of interest that in this House itself more Irish has been used since March, 1973, than was used in the previous decade.
Because we are putting down the questions instead of you.
Because the element of compulsion is gone out of Irish now——
Come off it.
——people are better disposed to use it. There are more people going to the Gaeltacht now to master Irish and to refresh their Irish.
For cheap holidays.
There are people going to the Gaeltacht who do not get any grants.
From London for cheap holidays.
Does the Minister accept the obligation to ensure that people can do their business in Irish with any Government Department?
I accept that every citizen who wants to conduct his business with a public Department in either of the official languages has that right and I will see to it that that right is respected. It will certainly be better respected in the future than it was in the past under a policy which failed totally to please anybody.
May I suggest that, since the Minister does accept that right, it follows that he has an obligation to ensure that that right can be exercised. The point of the question which the Minister has purported to answer but has not yet answered is this. How does the Minister propose to ensure that all our citizens can exercise the right which he acknowledges they have if he does not ensure that there are available in every Government Department officials who can do business in Irish? How can he ensure that, if he enforces the regulations he has announced?
I will ensure it.
How? That is the question.
I will ensure——
Tell us how. Do not mind the propaganda.
Deputy Colley said earlier that you could not have a civil servant in the Department of Finance who knew no English, that he would not be able to discuss his work. I do not accept that that is so. If it is so, more shame on you for maintaining a policy which brought about that situation.
Is the Minister seriously suggesting to this House and to the country that you could staff the Department of Finance with people who did not know English and that they could effectively carry out their work in the circumstances obtaining in this country? Is that what the Minister is suggesting?
The Minister did not say that.
What is he saying?
We are entering into argument now. Question No. 67.
The question Deputy Colley put to me was, would it be possible for a person without English to work in the Department of Finance and I said: "Yes, it would", and that he could go on to the highest position. If the Deputy contradicts that——
Without a knowledge of English?
Yes.
Will the Minister answer Question No. 67?
May I submit that the Minister is showing his contempt and that of his colleagues for the intelligence of the people, and a total lack of regard for reality? The reality of the situation is that the vast majority of our people speak English. Quite a number of people use Irish in their own homes. The Minister has admitted the right of citizens to carry out their business in Irish. I have asked him to tell us how he proposes to ensure that that right can be exercised. The Minister has now demonstrated clearly that he does not propose to ensure it.
The Deputy is asserting that a person who is an Irish speaker and does not know English has not got the same intellectual capacity——
Nonsense.
I do not accept that.
Question No. 67.
May I ask the Minister to dispel the fears I might have by saying to me that it is his intention and the intention of the Government to restore the Irish language as a vernacular?
Sin ceist eile.
Ní ceist eile ar fad í. Baineann sí leis na ceisteanna.
B'fhéidir go mbaineann sí leis na ceisteanna ach is ceist eile í.
Baineann sí go díreach leis' na ceisteanna. Will they encourage the restoration of the language?
Perhaps the Deputy did not understand my reply.
Táimid ag dul i bhfad taobh amuigh de na ceisteanna atá ar an gclár anseo.
The Deputy understands the Minister too well. That is why I am asking the question.
I pointed out that a person who has Irish as well as English may get marks for displaying skills in two languages. A person with only one language will receive fewer marks.
Is it intended to restore the language? No.