asked the Minister for Agriculture and Fisheries why the Malohiffe ED in County Kerry was not included in the disadvantaged areas scheme, having regard to the low incomes, the size of the holdings and the fact that the quality of the land in this area is less than the national level.
Ceisteanna—Questions. Oral Answers. - Disadvantaged Areas Scheme.
13.
As part of County Kerry, Molahiffe district electoral division is included among the areas designated as disadvantaged for the purposes of the EEC directive and farmers there will be eligible for special assistance in the form of extra investment aids. They will not, however, qualify for special livestock headage payments which are being confined to the most severely handicapped areas.
Would the Minister say why this electoral division and others in South Kerry which are among the high stone areas in the county were not included as severely handicapped areas? Who made the recommendation to the EEC to knock out these electoral divisions?
I think the Deputy knows that the same group of people made the decisions in Kerry and all over the country and that they used all available data to try to decide what were the disadvantaged areas. He also knows that there is continuing provision for review in any area where people feel they have been wrongly treated. It is not sufficient for part of an electoral division to be severely handicapped to have the whole division included. You are not allowed to include part of a division. It has to be the whole division and if a small part of it qualifies it cannot be included on that basis.
Is the Minister not now admitting that no proper examination was made in relation to this electoral division and other areas in the county? Is he now prepared to consult with the county committee of agriculture in regard to these districts and would he say why that committee was not consulted before the recommendation was made to the EEC?
A most careful and critical examination was made of every area in the country.
Codology—political decisions by the Government.
It is Deputies on the opposite side who make codology.
Political decisions.
Absolute nonsense, and the Deputy knows it.
We can prove it.
Surely the Minister knows there was no consultation at local level. I am not accusing him of political decisions but there was no consultation with the people who should know.
For a very good reason. Every county committee in Ireland would consider they had an obligation to give in to the local pressures to include their areas.
Who know the area but the local people?
(Interruptions.)
They did it by remote control.
There is a widening of this question which I cannot condone. It is a specific question in regard to a specific area. I will allow a final supplementary from Deputy O'Leary.
Would the Minister say if he is now prepared to consult with Kerry County Committee of Agriculture in regard to the districts which should be declared severely handicapped districts?
The Minister has repeatedly said that if there is a feeling in any area that it should be included and it is not included, it will be re-examined. That does not say it will be included.
Live horse and you will get grass.
Would the Minister consult the Kerry County Committee of Agriculture?
If there is a request from the county committee for consultation they will be consulted.
If you had done that at the beginning, you would not have the mess you have now.
14.
asked the Minister for Agriculture and Fisheries when payment of the headage grants for livestock will commence under the EEC disadvantaged areas scheme.
I have announced a scheme of headage payments on cattle in the severely handicapped areas and payments will commence as soon as inspections get under way.
Inspections of mountain sheep have already commenced and payments will begin shortly.
Would the Minister be more specific and say what "shortly" means in this regard?
I hope to get inspections started in September and to get all the payments made in the present year.
Did I understand the Minister to say that all payments would be made before the end of December?
That is my intention.
Could the Minister say if the other aspects of the disadvantaged areas scheme will be brought into operation this year?
I do not know to what the Deputy is referring in particular.
Aspects other than livestock.
I hope to bring in all of them this year.
Could the Minister give some information on the operation of the other aspects of this scheme as has been done in the case of cattle?
That is a separate matter.
15.
andMr. J. Gibbons asked the Minister for Agriculture and Fisheries the areas in Counties Wexford, Carlow and Kilkenny which will qualify for aid under the disadvantaged areas scheme.
In the case of counties outside the western region the EEC directive on disadvantaged areas will apply only to those zones which come under the mountain lamb subsidy scheme.
In the counties named, the designated areas associated with mountain sheep production are the Blackstairs Mountains in south east Carlow and north west Wexford and Annagh Hill in north Wexford.
Under the criteria laid down by the commission for disadvantaged areas there are many areas in Carlow, particularly in the foothills of the Blackstairs Mountains, which would seem to qualify and also you have the border areas between Carlow, Kilkenny and Laois where the land qualifies for grants. Why, therefore, did the Minister include only the areas he mentioned? This applies also to the border areas between Wicklow and Carlow—why were they not included?
There are a number of yardsticks; the criteria are not confined to the quality of land, but are also concerned with the comparative level of income and the population, whether it is rising or falling and whether there is a likelihood that the area will be left without population. These are criteria which are taken into account as well as the quality of the land.
Will the Minister be prepared to bring those areas into the disadvantaged areas scheme if representations are made by the various committees of agriculture?
The Deputy knows I am not free to do this.
The Minister can do it.
There must be agreement in Brussels about the areas. We have had people from the Commission over here in connection with this matter. There is no desire on my part to eliminate an area.
If it can be proved that these areas will qualify under the criteria laid down by the Commission, will the Minister designate them as disadvantaged areas?
Of course.
It is no good just to designate them as disadvantaged areas. The Minister said that all the western counties——
The Deputy is broadening the scope of the question. That is not in order. I am calling Question No. 16.
16.
asked the Minister for Agriculture and Fisheries if, in relation to the EEC disadvantaged areas scheme announced on 16th July, 1975 and in which it was stated that £15 million is to be provided for farming aid in poorer areas, he will state whether landowners in the areas of Laois-Offaly which are recognised disadvantaged areas will benefit from the scheme; if so, under which headings; and if, in view of the fact that this area was not referred to in his announcement he will make a statement on the matter.
The area of Laois-Offaly designated under the EEC disadvantaged areas directive will benefit from the increased headage payments for mountain sheep announced on 4th July last.
Surely the Minister is aware that the number of sheep in Laois-Offaly must be very small. There is a great deal of marginal land associated with the bogs in the central plain of Ireland where the level of farming income is much lower than it should be. Obviously Deputy Flanagan is aware of this and I am sorry he is not present to bear out what I say. Having regard to these facts, the smaller farmers in Laois and Offaly would conform to the criteria laid down by the Commission in Brussels for inclusion as disadvantaged farms. Will the Minister consider their inclusion now?
The Minister has said repeatedly that where a case can be made he is prepared to have it examined. It is an ongoing process. However, it must finally be agreed with the Commission in Brussels.
If the committees of agriculture in Laois and Offaly make representations to the Minister for inclusion, will they be accepted?
I do not want to get applications from all over the place unless they are well founded. I do not want staff to examine——
The Minister should have all the areas examined.
I could get an area of bogland in County Meath that should qualify.
Will the Minister inform the House when the review of the disadvantaged areas will take place?
That is a separate question.
17.
Mr. Kitt
asked the Minister for Agriculture and Fisheries if the extensive soil survey compiled by An Foras Talúntais was taken into consideration in determining the EEC disadvantaged areas scheme; and if he will state the other criteria used.
The soil survey and other studies by An Foras Talúntais as well as such factors as the potential stocking capacity of the land, the proportion of "rough grazing", average rateable valuation of land, levels of income and levels and trend in population were among the indicators taken into consideration in the examination of the areas by reference to the criteria laid down in the EEC directive.
Mr. Kitt
Did the Minister say the stocking rate for each county was taken into consideration?
Yes. That was one of the factors in the assessment.
Mr. Kitt
Will the Minister explain why such a small area of County Galway will benefit from the scheme?
It was estimated that it did not have the degree of handicap necessary to qualify.
Mr. Kitt
Will the Minister consult with the County Galway Committee of Agriculture with regard to this scheme?
If I were to agree to all the requests, I would have every county committee in Ireland rediscussing the scheme.
Mr. Kitt
Will the Minister please give me a straight answer to my question?
If the County Galway Committee of Agriculture submit a request to discuss with the officials the areas that were included and excluded I will be glad to arrange it.
In North Galway in Deputy Kitt's constituency there is a place called Gurteen. The Minister does not know this and other areas in North Galway. If he did they would not be excluded.
I cannot accept Deputy Callanan's estimation regarding the degree of handicap.
What I am saying is true.
I am calling Question No. 18.