asked the Minister for Posts and Telegraphs whether the contract recently awarded for the printing of the telephone directory for 1977 to 1981 includes a guarantee that all the work involved will be carried out in the State.
19.
Ceisteanna—Questions. Oral Answers. - Telephone Directory.
18.
asked the Minister for Posts and Telegraphs whether the placing of the contract for the printing of the telephone directory for 1977 to 1981 with a firm other than that previously employed will result in any loss of jobs; and, if so, the number.
With the permission of the Ceann Comhairle, I propose to take Questions Nos. 18 and 19 together.
It is a condition of the contract in question that all the work involved will be carried out in the State. The contract was placed in accordance with the standard procedure which has governed the award of State contracts for many years and which does not permit of any preference being given as between Irish firms. Employment content was not, therefore, a factor in the award of the contract and I am not in a position to say what will be the effect on employment of the transfer of the work in question from one Irish firm to another.
Would the Minister agree that the fact that he is not aware of and not concerned with the effect on employment in the award of this contract is symptomatic of the approach of himself and his colleagues to the whole problem of unemployment and that the concern which should be expressed in reality in regard to this problem on day to day affairs by the Minister and his colleagues would make a considerable difference to the unemployment problem if they concerned themselves with it instead of talking about it?
The Deputy's speech in the form of a question is grossly unfair and demagogic. I have set out the position and the Deputy, as a former Minister for Finance, should well understand it. The Government are not in a position to discriminate as between Irish firms which submit tenders for contracts. It chooses the lowest of the available tenders and that would have been so under the Minister and well he knows it. One of these firms will presumably be employing more people, the other presumably fewer, but the efficiency of the companies concerned is a matter which, of course, affects the process of tender and contracts and it ill-befits a former Minister for Finance to make the kind of point he has just made.
May I ask the Minister if he would accept that the question put to him did not ask him to discriminate between one Irish firm and another but did ask him to have regard to the amount of employment provided as a result of the printing of the Telephone Directory for a period of five years? I suggest that the problems of unemployment at this time are so enormous that the position is not at all comparable with that obtaining when I was Minister for Finance and that the Minister for Posts and Telegraphs——
We must proceed by way of question and answer.
——would do well to pay attention to the areas in which he can ensure that there is not a drop in employment.
I do not know what the Deputy is suggesting here. I am satisfied that the proper procedures were fully complied with here. The Deputy knows that proper compliance with contract procedure is basic to the action of a Government department. Is he suggesting that because of a conjecture about possible effects on employment my Department should have discriminated against the firm which submitted the lower tender——
Of course not and I said I was not doing so.
What is the Deputy doing if not that?
Why does the Minister persist in trying to allege that I want to discriminate between one Irish firm and another——
I do not know why the Deputy wants to do it.
Why did the Minister not concern himself with the employment content no matter which firm was given the contract?
This is leading to argument and debate.
May I point out that the persons likely to be affected in this matter are some hundreds of workers employed in a factory in East Wall and I have a direct concern as well as a national concern in this matter?
I am calling the next question.
The Deputy's direct concern may be more than his national concern.
This is becoming a debate. I am calling the next question.
The Deputy's lack of concern for the employment of workers is now obvious.
That performance does the Deputy and his party very little credit indeed, if it is argued that this Government and my Department should discriminate against one Irish firm as against another because the other firm happens to be in East Wall. Is that the Deputy's argument?
Order.
The Minister should see that employment is not lost as a result of a contract placed by his Department.
I cannot know that it will have such a result——
Of course you can.
——when you have two Irish firms competing against each other and well the Deputy knows that. This performance is a shameful one.
This argument must cease. Question No. 20.