Vol. 287 No. 5
asked the Minister for Agriculture and Fisheries when he intends to announce the designated areas under the disadvantaged areas scheme for 1976; and if he will include the 12 western counties as they are recognised by the EEC as disadvantaged areas.
35.
asked the Minister for Agriculture and Fisheries if he will state the marginal areas under study for inclusion under the livestock headage payment scheme.
With the permission of the Ceann Comhairle, I propose to take Questions Nos. 34 and 35 together.
What have come to be known as the "12 western counties" have already been scheduled as disadvantaged areas and recognised as such by the EEC Commission. The relevant directive authorises the Government to apply in such areas a special system of aids to farmers. These may consist of compensatory payments on livestock in the most severely handicapped parts of these areas; special assistance for development farmers by way of extra grants for land improvement, for buildings et cetera and assistance for joint investment schemes for fodder production and for improvement works and equipment needed on pasture land and hill grazing areas farmed jointly. The scheme of compensatory payments on livestock is already in operation in the most severely handicapped parts of the disadvantaged areas. The other aids envisaged in the directive are being discussed with the EEC Commission and will be announced as soon as possible.
Representations have been received from local interests and groups throughout the country to have their areas included in the disadvantaged areas and from similar groups within the disadvantaged areas to have their areas included with those that are most severely handicapped and in which livestock headage payments are made. The principal areas which have sought to be brought within the disadvantaged areas are west Limerick, east Limerick/ north Tipperary and certain parts of west Cork, west Offaly, north Westmeath and north Meath. Representations were also received in relation to districts in Counties Wexford, Waterford, Laois, Kilkenny and South Tipperary. The claims of these areas have been examined by my Department, but Deputies will appreciate that there is no possibility whatever of all or many of them meeting the strict criteria laid down in the directive and that such adjustments as may eventually be made in the boundaries will be of a purely marginal nature.
Within the disadvantaged areas there is pressure from practically all areas which have been excluded from cattle headage payments, including east Galway, south Roscommon and most of Cavan and Monaghan, to have these payments extended to them. This, of course, would be impracticable from the point of view of cost and in any event would be contrary to the terms of the directive. My Department have been examining boundary areas in parts of north Kerry, west Cork, Galway, Clare and Longford but are of opinion that in general the existing boundaries are broadly correct.
Discussions are currently being initiated with the EEC Commission on the operation of the disadvantaged areas scheme and its areas of application and when these have been concluded the necessary decisions will be taken by the Government.
Would the Minister not agree that since, as a result of the budget, social welfare is now being cut to anyone with a £50 valuation, these people will become very disadvantaged, and does that not mean a stronger case for including all 12 western counties in the designated areas within the disadvantaged areas?
I do not think social welfare payments were included in the calculations.
The fact is that since there has been this fantastic reduction this could make a stronger case for their inclusion in the designated areas within the disadvantaged areas. Unless they are developing farmers they gain nothing. Will the Minister give special consideration to this?
Deputy Callanan will have to accept that it is not my decision what to include or exclude. We put the criteria through the Commission and if we get their agreement, we accept it. So far we have failed to get agreement that they are suffering the degree of handicap that would entitle us to pay them headage payments.
This is news to me. I understood that the decision was made by the Department of Agriculture and Fisheries in co-operation with the EEC. The Department cannot get away from their responsibility that they have a vital say in what are designated areas.
The Department are not trying to get away with anything. They are trying to present the case as it really is and, if possible, to get the EEC to agree. The people in the EEC dealing with this are very familiar with Irish conditions, as the Deputy knows.
This is a very important subject, particularly now when so many thousands of pounds have been taken out of the west by this reduction. As a result it will be more disadvantaged than ever.
The Deputy has already made that point on two occasions.
I disagree entirely that many thousands of pounds have been taken out of the really handicapped areas of the west. They have not. In my view anybody with a valuation over £15 is not handicapped.
Is the Minister saying that——
We cannot debate this matter today. We must pass on to the next question.
Does the Minister think that a man with a valuation between £15 and £20 is all right?
He is not in the very low income group.
And he is not disadvantaged?
This is leading to argument. Order.
As the Minister is aware, there are serious problems in some parts of excluded electoral districts at present. I am sure the Minister will agree that some parts of the excluded areas are severely disadvantaged while other parts of the townlands or parishes may be reasonably all right. Could we assume that the Department will be recommending to the EEC the extension of those areas, perhaps on a different type of divide, to include those disadvantaged townlands?
Any area that seems to have a possibility of being accepted by the Commission is being put forward.
Does that mean that the division of electoral districts will be recommended?
No, the Commission will not accept that. There must be recognised boundaries; a district electoral division cannot be split.
Who specified the electoral divisions as being the boundaries, our Government or the EEC?
We had to get recognised boundaries. We would like new recognised boundaries, but none of us can say how that can be done and how we can divide them into smaller areas.
Will the Minister agree——
We must get on to the next question.
Is the Minister aware that in some of the remote rural areas there are very scattered electoral districts and it would be advisable and necessary that some of the townlands now excluded should be included because——
The Deputy is repeating himself.
Agreed, but I want to impress the importance of a real look at the boundaries which exist at present.
There are disadvantaged areas in County Meath but they will not be accepted in the EEC.
I accept that.
When will the marginal areas be included?
When we get agreement from the EEC. We have submitted data to the EEC and this has been under discussion. We have had two or three meetings with them already and I cannot say when conclusions will be reached.
Are investigations still going on?
Did the Minister not tell the House during the last session that these areas would be included as soon as possible?
No, I said it would be done as soon as we could get agreement with the Commission. I cannot decide the date.
One final supplementary——
Deputy Callanan, do not impose on the Chair. I have given a great deal of latitude on this question. I am calling Question No. 36.
