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Dáil Éireann debate -
Wednesday, 7 Apr 1976

Vol. 289 No. 8

Private Members' Business: Tourist Industry: Motion (Resumed).

The following motion was moved by Deputy Leonard on 6th April, 1976:
That Dáil Éireann deplores those actions of the Government which have reduced the competitiveness of the Irish tourist industry and recommends that subventions necessary to restore competitiveness be provided.
Debate resumed on the following amendment:
To delete all words after "Dáil Éireann" and substitute the following:
"recognises that the aim of the Government is to carry out a development programme for tourism to enable the industry to expand; and takes note of the Government's progress to date towards the achievement of that aim."
—(Minister for Transport and Power.)

Yesterday I was referring to Bord Fáilte plans for expansion of the tourist industry over the next five years. It was said that over this period it is intended to spend approximately £50 million on development proposals. Of this about £20.3 million is to be provided by Bord Fáilte and the regional organisations, the remainder to come from other public bodies and the private sector. In the very first year of operation of this scheme it is not likely that much money, if any, will be spent on it— a bad start to such a scheme.

Last night the Minister said that we appeared to be most competitive or at least as competitive as other countries in attracting tourists. Nothing could be further from the truth. We have priced ourselves out of the tourist market despite any figures the Minister may quote. Even though income from tourism is increasing, it is not increasing in real terms. Numerically, the figures are increasing also but this is happening in other countries where the figures are increasing far more than they are increasing here. This is because we are not competitive and this is due entirely to the mismanagement of our financial affairs by the Government. There is no real price control. The Government have failed to curb inflation. From meeting hoteliers throughout the country and particularly in Kerry, I know they are in a very serious position, worse now than ever, due to the fact that last November and December they quoted prices on bookings and these prices are now completely unrealistic as a result of the outrageous increase announced in the budget. These hoteliers are honourable people and will not write to customers telling them that due to recent budgetary measures charges must be increased. They will carry the load themselves rather than do that. This is the reality of the situation.

It can no longer be said that foreigners come here because they can get beer and cigarettes at the right price and because petrol is at the right price. We are not now competitive in this respect.

I believe car hire firms will be forced to increase their charges this season as a result of the colossal increase in the taxation element on petrol alone in the past six months and the unrealistic increase in motor taxation. Hotels that have already committed themselves to bookings at certain charges will, from now on, be forced to increase these charges substantially as a result of VAT increases and other measures of the present Government such as the substantial increase in the cost of the social welfare stamp which came into operation on 1st April. This increase will mean far higher expenditure for hoteliers and make them less competitive compared with other countries.

The Government should introduce some form of subsidy into the transport of tourists to this country. I have advocated on more than one occasion previously that the Government should seriously consider the possibility of providing an air and sea subsidy for transport to this country because transport costs between Ireland and Britain and between Ireland and the Continent must be the most expensive in the world.

If the tourist industry in general is in the strong position that the Minister indicated last night, why are so many hotels being downgraded by Bord Fáilte? The proprietors and the owners of these hotels cannot afford to bring them up to the standard and maintain them at the standard relevant to their grade before they were downgraded. This important question deserves a reply: if as the Minister states the hotels and guest houses are in such a strong position, why are they being downgraded? I believe it is because they have no resources to meet the cost of reaching the required standard.

Special, low interest loans should be introduced for hotels and for the tourist industry as a whole. I do not know why this cannot be done. Arrangements could be made by the Government to subsidise financial institutions so that special, low interest rates could be offered to the tourist industry. We know the importance of this industry to the economy both from the point of view of employment and income and as regards consumption of home grown produce. The Government by their negative policy or lack of policy, by their mismanagement of our financial affairs which led to the recent disastrous budget, are bringing the tourist industry into a catastrophic situation. It appears that the real reason we are not more competitive is lack of price control and the failure of the Government to curb inflation. This was made crystal clear yesterday when the British budget was announced. When one compares that budget with the one introduced by our Minister for Finance in January one can see that Britain is a more attractive place for the western tourist than Ireland. As a result of the British budget Bord Fáilte will have a more difficult task trying to attract more business here. The Government have failed to make this great industry more competitive and, consequently, to attract more tourists here.

I wonder what motivated the Opposition to put down such a motion. It is another example of their attitude and their lack of policies. Every week they seek additional money to spend on various schemes while at the same time they condemn the Government for borrowing and overspending. The Opposition cannot have it both ways. They should tell the people what they would do if they were in power. The Opposition are being totally dishonest and a motion of this type does them no credit. They are trying to undermine confidence in the tourist industry.

In my view the tourist industry is reasonably healthy, particularly when one considers the problems Bord Fáilte must face in trying to attract tourists here. The biggest problem is the Northern situation. It is hard for foreigners to understand, when they hear of bombs exploding in Northern Ireland, that they have nothing to do with us. It is hard to get them to realise that those bombs are exploding in another jurisdiction. However, those who visit us realise that the Government are in control of the situation. While in America recently the Taoiseach, in a confident fashion, spelt out the state of the country and I believe that as a result of that visit we will have many more tourists from North America this year. The Americans have confidence in the Government's attitude to law and order. We should all bear in mind that Bord Fáilte are engaged in an uphill battle with regard to tourism.

The difficulties in relation to tourism are not confined to prices. The cost of petrol and the fact that this would have the effect of frightening tourists off was mentioned but petrol in European countries is as dear, and, in some cases, dearer, than here. In Belgium petrol costs 85p a gallon while in Denmark it is 90p. In France it is 85p; Germany, 75p; Italy, £1.05p; Holland, 85p and Spain, 93p. The cost of hiring a car here compares favourably with the hire cost on the Continent. Therefore, it is a weak point to say that the increase in the cost of petrol will affect our tourist industry. I do not believe that the allegedly wicked budget with which the Opposition are preoccupied will affect the tourist industry. People do not come here to "slosh" down pints or speed around in a motor car; they come to relax and for a change of scenery.

We have a lot to offer tourists and it would serve the Opposition better if they spoke about our amenities rather than denigrating the tourist industry. The Opposition should bear in mind that German tourists get good value here because of the sterling exchange rate. We must be positive in our approach to the tourist industry. I should like to see greater emphasis being placed by Bord Fáilte on attracting visitors from the Continent. Tourism is so highly competitive that it is necessary for an organisation such as Bord Fáilte to work extremely hard in their efforts to attract visitors. There is a lot of hard work to be done in this sphere. However, as we are a member of the EEC we should be in a position to attract more people from the Continent. In this regard I believe that our reputation was greatly enhanced during the six months our Minister for Foreign Affairs was President of the EEC Commission. The work done during that period will help our tourist drive tremendously. Those responsible for organising the summit conference in Dublin deserve great praise. It was a tremendous success and will benefit us in the future.

Last year was a good year from the tourism point of view in spite of the cloud that was hanging over us. It was not an economic cloud but a far more serious one. I believe we will have a successful year in 1976 also. Our hotels are very competitive and anybody who has stayed in an hotel on the Continent knows that. We have all the attractions necessary to cater for a big influx of tourists. It is possible for people to get away from the crowded industrial areas and relax in a calm atmosphere here. Possibly our hygiene standards should be looked at to ensure higher levels, and hoteliers and guesthouse owners should be very careful to achieve higher standards. It is because satisfactory standards have not been maintained that some of them have been downgraded by Bord Fáilte. I agree that if they do not measure up to the standards laid down they should be downgraded. If they achieve and maintain high standards it will benefit those in the tourist business as well as the national economy.

I should like to see better levels of public hygiene in our cities, particularly in the matter of litter and in the erection of hoardings. We have a lot to learn from continental cities in that respect. As a city, Dublin is very attractive. The older parts of the city have character and their people have much to offer to tourists. We particularly need to consider the position after buildings have been demolished to see that unattractive hoardings are not put up and that the sites are kept reasonably clean.

I repeat that I am sorry the Opposition put down this motion. It shows how bereft of ideas they are to waste the time of the House discussing nebulous motions of this kind. If they were sincere they would look at all the indicators, which show that the tourist business is healthy and that Bord Fáilte are doing a good job. I should like to see Bord Fáilte further developing the European market. The American market has dropped slightly because of world wide recession but I am sure we will see an increase in the number of visitors when the position improves. We have the name of being courteous and welcoming and that is what has made Ireland a good place from the point of view of tourists. Not only does this industry provide employment but it also helps us to improve our balance of payments.

Deputy O'Brien wondered why we put down this motion, why we should be wasting time on it. We did it as we do on all occasions because not alone are we ourselves worried about the future of tourism but those who are dependent on it are very worried. If Deputy O'Brien does not believe me he should ask the people in the industry, as we did recently. Some of his colleagues are genuinely worried about it.

It is of little use to be talking about us being a nice friendly people if we do not get tourists in, which is what the business is all about. Last night the Minister said that when he took office in March, 1973, there were gloom and depression in the industry and for that reason one of the points in their 14-point plan was to promote a new attitude to the industry. I cannot see the logic of that because the savage taxation imposed in the last budget on those in all sectors of tourism has caused more depression and gloom than the Minister spoke about in regard to 1973. I shall go back on the history of the industry.

In 1950 it was reckoned to be the second largest industry with total annual earnings of £30 million. Per capita, we had the highest tourist earnings in western Europe. Successive Governments set out to improve our share of the tourist market by providing better promotional activities and by giving better services to tourists. We succeeded in no small way, but what was the position in the 1970s? Our position in regard to tourists dropped from 1.9 per cent of the world tourist market in 1960 to 1.3 per cent in 1966 and to 0.8 per cent of the same market in 1974. That means that even in the period from 1960 to 1974 our percentage of the world tourist market halved. Those are the figures that count when we praise ourselves on making a success of our tourist industry. Whatever Government may be in power or whatever bodies promote tourism, what matters is the percentage of the world tourist market we hold. There is no point in people blaming the troubles in the North for this. We did not have those troubles in the years 1960 to 1969.

With regard to the promotion, running and servicing of our tourist industry there are quite a number of organisations and Ministries involved, such as the Department of Transport and Power, Bord Fáilte, the regional tourist organisations, the tourist branch of the Shannon Free Airport Development Company, Aer Lingus, B & I, CIE, the National Tourist Council. We might add also two further Ministrives, the Department of Finance and the Department of the Gaeltacht, which have a function to play in this matter. In fact, we might also add the Department of Local Government. In addition to all of those there is the private sector working very hard on promotional and servicing activities. All of the bodies I have mentioned seemed to us to be operating more or less separately. If that is so—and we believe it to be so—we are continuously getting diminishing returns in this world tourist market.

The body principally responsible for the tourist industry and its promotion here is Bord Fáilte. Nobody here or anywhere else would disagree with their aims in that regard. However, we must ask ourselves how successful have they been in the achievement of their aims. They have had success— we do not deny that—but we must ask ourselves have they been as successful as they might over the years. In 1975 we had 1.688 million tourists from whom the carriers earned £35 million and the internal receipts were rated at £126 million, giving us a total of £161 million. In effect this meant a drop of 16 per cent in real terms from 1969.

We should now examine all of the different bodies involved to ascertain whether or not we can improve on the position, eliminate the overlapping which takes place and indeed, in some cases, the conflict of interest between them, sometimes involving duplication of expenditure. For instance, we should ask ourselves is it necessary to have four State bodies promoting tourism in North America, these being Bord Fáilte, CIE, Aer Lingus and to a lesser degree, the Shannon Free Airport Development Company. It would seem that Bord Fáilte carry the principal obligation. In fairness to Aer Lingus they have been by far the most successful promoter of tourism in North America over the years. CIE have had a measure of success. They are still endeavouring to sell their tours in North America. Whether or not they have been successful in recent years the sad fact is they were trying to sell their hotels there a few months ago; indeed they had practically closed the deal to get rid of some of those hotels. Therefore, we must assume they were not very successful in their tourist promotional activities on the other side of the Atlantic.

All these bodies attempt to sell the Irish tourist industry in North America. I have been to America only once—quite recently for two weeks— but from my observations they concentrate mainly on the same areas, in the main on the east coast and after that Chicago and its surrounding areas. If what I say is true, and I believe it is in the main correct, in the areas I have mentioned there is a very large number of Irish immigrants: Chicago and the east coast are where most of the Irish-born have emigrated. We do not appear to have gained any increase in tourist business in those areas.

Therefore, if we are to increase our tourist numbers from the North American Continent surely it is common sense to deduce that there is either something wrong with our selling capacity or that we are not expanding our market there. A large number of people who come from New York and such places would come anyway. But there are other parts of the United States, places where there are very few Irishborn people, such as the mid-western States, where there are very many people of second and third relation removed Irish who have never been to Ireland and who are a long distance from the east coast. From speaking to them one learns they are keen to come here but they ask how do they organise themselves, whom do they contact. One advises them of the different bodies involved but one tries to concentrate on one body. What is really needed is somebody to go out, get groups together, organise charter flights and so on, and get them moving.

There is therefore a further market in other parts of the United States if we but seek it. Anyone with whom I have discussed this matter—people who know something about America and have been in parts other than New York and Chicago—all agree that we have not made a proper attempt to muster this market because these are people proud of having an Irish grandfather or grandmother who would dearly love to come over and trace some relationship with someone in, say, Mayo, Clare or Cork. But they appear to have no access to anyone who might help them in this regard. I would recommend that Bord Fáilte take a hard look at these areas. While I was there I met one group capable of filling a charter flight themselves who want to come over for the next St. Patrick's Day parade in Dublin. They asked me how they would go about requesting an invitation and so on. I told them I was sure the Lord Mayor of Dublin next year, whoever he might be, would have no hesitation in sending them an invitation. They will pay the full bill themselves. I am glad to see that a Bord Fáilte man has already made contact with him.

That was a chance contact, but there are many more people out there that can be picked up and got into Ireland and increase our percentage of the North American market. At present the North American market supplies 15 per cent of our total tourism. That 15 per cent spends 33 per cent of the total tourist spendings in this country. There is obviously a very fine return from North American tourism, as indeed there is from tourism everywhere else. We should consider improving our tourist industry. We could seriously consider changing the school holidays and trying to stagger holidays for industrial workers. The reason for this would be to have our internal tourists going on holidays at some time other than the peak cost time, which is around July and August. It would be far easier for them to go at the end of the lower season if this could be made possible and it would be far less expensive.

There are many other things that we could look at and do something about in order to help avoid the trouble of high costings that now exist within the industry. The recent tax changes have had a very serious effect on the tourist industry. We have been told this by the people involved. We are convinced that the tourist industry is in dire trouble. Even though we had so many more people in the country last year than the previous year we are still losing our percentage in the total world tourist market. The tax changes, VAT, petrol taxation and increases in social welfare have had a very serious effect on the percentage. There is no point in saying that we should add it on to the consumer market or the tourist. That cannot be done because tourists come in by way of package tours with long-term planning up to 12 or 18 months before. There is no way an increased price can be demanded from the people who have arranged to come.

In western Europe to increase prices an operator is obliged to give 120 days' notice. The Minister for Finance has dealt a very severe, savage blow to the tourist industry, as he has to many other industries by his budget. There are other things that are causing serious extra costs to the industry which it is unable to bear—the necessity for stamping cards for casuals, the pay liability for seasonal student workers. These are matters that they are worried about. We should consider erecting a convention centre outside of Dublin. There is a fairly expensive market in this field for the running of world conventions. The increase in the price of drink is another problem which affects the tourist industry. The Minister said that Britain should be our best tourist market but we are away ahead of them with regard to the price of drink, and for very many tourists their beer is part and parcel of the holiday. The extra energy costs to the hoteliers and guesthouse owners are very formidable also. This is not all because of the Arabs or Saudi Arabians; our own Minister for Finance, by taxation, is one of the main causes. A very important part of our tourist industry is the car rental service. Cars are a necessity for our tourist industry. Our petrol is now 11p dearer than it is on the other side of the Border. The Minister cannot expect to improve his balance of payments while this position exists. In December, 1974, when he put 15p extra taxation on petrol, he justified it by saying that all our petrol was going to go over the Border, and that it was bad for our balance of payments. The petrol station owners along this side of the Border are closing up rapidly because they cannot sell petrol and cannot survive because we are 11p dearer. It is certainly not going to help our balance of payments in any way.

The car is an essential part of our tourist industry because of our rural structure and because of the inaccessibility of many parts of the west of Ireland where there is no public transport. In the Gealtacht and all along the west coast a car has to be part of the tourist industry if people are really to enjoy Ireland. Many people are promoting all the capital cities for tourism purposes but they do not concentrate on the parts the people really enjoy. We are not begrudging tourism to Dublin, but we believe that if people only come to Dublin they will miss out on our real value as a tourist nation.

The Minister mentioned that when he came to power in 1973 he found the morale of Bord Fáilte and the carriers very low and he found people working in the field promoting tourism to this country unsure of what the future held and half afraid to say they were Irish and selling Ireland. These were the well paid people of Bord Fáilte and semi-State bodies who were half afraid in North America and other countries to say they were Irish. If the Minister finds any such highly paid promoter of tourism in any of those countries who admitted to being half afraid to go out and sell his country he has the remedy in his hands: sack him on the spot and find people who are not half afraid who will go out and do it. That is a dreadful thing to say. If it is true then such people should not be there and we should have seen to it that they were back home where they consider themselves safe. I have no recollection of any tourist ever being injured or killed or maimed in any way as a result of the troubles in Ireland. It is the duty of people who are paid to do so in other countries to ensure that there are no potential tourists afraid to come here. They have been there for a few years now and if they have not succeeded in impressing on potential tourists that they are quite safe in coming here, they are doing a mighty bad job. I am not accusing them. It was the Minister who said they were half afraid to go out and sell Ireland and say they were Irish. That is a dreadful thing if it is true.

On the UK figures and the figures we get from Bord Fáilte, last year the figure was 818,000 tourists from Britain. I would like to know how Bord Fáilte calculate these figures. Some of us have occasion to go over to Britain during the year and I presume we are counted as tourists when we return home. Even if we had 818,000 tourists from Britain last year, it is a fact that 96 per cent of that 818,000 did not use hotels, farm guesthouses or town guesthouses so in the main they must have been people like ourselves who have occasion to journey over and back and people who come over here and stay with relatives. This is the experience of the catering industry. They had a very small return from this number of tourists.

To revert to the Minister's statement that people are afraid to go out and sell Ireland in other countries. Bord Fáilte should long since have been able to dispel this idea from the minds of potential tourists. We look forward to a successful tourist season and we tabled this motion to highlight the difficulties facing the industry—hotels, guesthouses and those who get the spill off benefits, be they publicans or farmers or anything else. It is important that we should safeguard the industry. It requires no imported raw materials. It is worth while saving it and we believe the taxation imposed in the budget has dealt a drastic blow to the industry.

I am pleased to support the Minister's amendment. I listened with some interest to the speeches of Deputy Barrett, Deputy O'Leary and Deputy O'Brien. Deputy O'Leary suggested that Britain was a more attractive country to visit at the present time than this country is. Of course, the pint is cheaper in Britain. So is petrol. It is much too facile, however, to suggest these are the sole reasons why people go on holidays. The attractions this country has for the tourist are in an entirely different area from those of Britain.

Deputy O'Leary referred to the necessity for restoring competitiveness. Having travelled quite a bit in the last year, it is my considered judgment that this country is extremely competitive. There are particular reasons why it is competitive. The £ is now purchasing more for visitors. Petroleum is a fuel used by aerlines and bringing people to sunny climes is costly now because of surcharges. That makes this country even more competitive and Irish people thinking of going abroad are having to think again. Of course, we have inflation and, of course, we have rising costs. Those who stress this fail to recognise that the same factors have been ravaging the economies of other countries in western Europe and these countries are extremely expensive. When talking about the tourist industry here, it is important to examine the position in other countries. The price of petrol in Italy is round about £1.10 per gallon. In Denmark it is 90 pence. In France it is 85 pence. In Holland it is 85 pence. In Spain it is 93 pence. In Belgium it is 85 pence. When talking about motorists coming in here, one must think of the motorist driving across continental Europe to the Riviera and down into Italy and Spain. The motorist who brings his car in here and drives down to the west and back again and does 300 miles holiday motoring does a total of roughly 620 miles. At 30 miles to the gallon that would cost a family an extra £2 having regard to the rise in petrol. If you divide that £2 among four people, it works out at about 50 pence each. It is a lot of damn nonsense to pretend that petrol is a critical factor which will make people decide this country is not a suitable place in which to have a holiday.

Nobody need tell me that visitors come here to drink our pints. They come for other reasons and hopefully will enjoy their pints, but this is not in any sense a critical factor. We should relate the prices of some of these commodities to the prices in other countries. Britain is not the only country in Europe with which we want to make comparisons. Some years ago there were ten or 11 German marks to the Irish £; now there are five or six. That is an extremely expensive country. There were 17 or 18 French francs to the £ a few years ago, now there are 8½. In Norway a few years ago there were 15 or 16 kroner to the £; and 20 kroner to the £ ten years ago, now there are 11. The popular drink there is draught lager and in any bar or hotel the pint costs £1. If we want to talk about competitiveness, let us look around other countries in Europe, at the recent revaluation of the dollar against the £ and the prices in reasonable resorts in the United States.

There is a much too facile comparison between costs here and costs in other countries, such as Spain, to which people traditionally go for holidays. In many cases we are not comparing like with like. There is a tendency to compare the price of a fortnight's holiday in one of our best hotels with a fortnight's holiday in Spain. Very often sufficient emphasis is not put on the fact that the holiday in Spain is a bargain holiday in a hotel which is not in any sense competitive with our hotels. People who want to indulge in comparisons should compare like with like and compare their holidays in Spain, France, Germany or Italy with hotels of an equal standard. They will begin to realise the essential competitiveness of this country in the tourist industry.

Deputy Barrett suggested that we were over-stating the question of whether Ireland was a safe country in which to holiday. I do not think we are over-stressing it. The wonder is that today—when we have an economic depression compounded within this country by the Northern situation—we have not only managed to maintain but to increase tourist traffic. Various agencies outside this country, Bord Fáilte, Aer Lingus, CIE and the embassies, are doing their best but their promotional funds are limited. Let us look at North America.

The Bord Fáilte budget for promotional activities is limited. When one takes into account the vast amount of material on the media—television, newspapers and so on—about the problems that affect this island, and the fact that people at that distance do not fully appreciate as we obviously do the distinctions that exist between the north-east and the south, one realises that they have been doing a very good job in difficult circumstances.

The Government's attitude in the area of security is important and is under-pinning the stability of the free movement of people between Ireland and other countries. The Government have been doing a good job in getting this message across. The Minister has been involved in the promotion of tourism. In the last two or three years he spent a considerable amount of time abroad engaging in personal promotion of tourism and, particularly in America, this has generated a great deal of satisfactory publicity which has been very helpful.

While the Government's attitude to tourism is very important, there are other areas at which we should have a look. In this industry, more than in any other sector, the attitudes that prevail are vital to whether we will generate increases in our tourist industry. Irrespective of the Government of the day, the attitudes prevailing among hoteliers, local authorities and restaurants to service, cleanliness and good food, are all important. It is essential that we are training the right people, that they are getting the opportunity to develop their businesses, that they are going after business and are running their businesses the way they should be. These are critical factors which will make or break the tourist industry.

In the past we were a little indiscriminate in giving hotel grants. As the Minister said in his speech, there was a tendency to be a little indiscriminate in giving grants to certain kinds of people in the hotel industry and, in certain instances, about the location of hotels. It was unfortunate that we did not encourage more the building of hotels by people trained in the hotel industry. Many of these people trained in the Shannon hotel school or abroad, had the ability and the knowledge of what the market needed, but in some cases did not have the money to do it themselves. It might have been better policy in earlier years to have taken more risks by funding such people in the form of grants and loans, rather than some cases we have seen where people without any knowledge of that sector have gone into the business and some of whom have done a less than good job.

There is a great deal of scope in the tourist industry, scope that does not require a great deal of investment. There is scope in improving our standards. There seems to be great scope in family operations, guesthouses and smaller hotels where overheads are held at a lower level. There is scope for improvement in cooking, the area of presentation and in the area of cleanliness. Bord Fáilte are right to stress how very important standards are if we want to be competitive in an international context. There are areas we need to look to and standards must be raised if our competitiveness is to be enhanced.

Deputy O'Leary referred to downgrading by Bord Fáilte. In my experience if they are finding it necessary to adopt a tough attitude that is in the national interest, regardless of how much it may hurt. In general, many of the things we need to do will not need much investment, but merely require higher standards. This is where the scope lies. When we speak about promotion abroad and the sums spent in the United States, Britain and Europe, we must realise that the best promotion is the good name a guesthouse gets for the style in which it presents breakfast and the standards of cleanliness in the bedrooms. This is one of the greatest generators of future business. The industry should look to itself to see what it can do. Deputy O'Leary quoted the chairman of Córas Tráchtála, Mr. Colm Barnes, who suggested that the Government would need to look to their political convictions to help business, that there was no future in this country and that the Government were hostile to business. That is a lot of nonsense. There is scope in this country, especially in the areas of export manufacturing, where there are CTT grants, credit facilities, and tax-free incentives which are greater than those which exist in any other European country today.

One point I do not understand in relation to Deputy Leonard's speech is the confusion that apparently exists over figures. Deputy Leonard suggested that Bord Fáilte's promotional budgets had shrunk steadily over the past three years. This seems to be entirely at variance with the facts. The statistics which I have had extracted suggest that the total amounts issued—this covers more than promotion—to Bord Fáilte in each of the last four years, together with the current year's allocation, are as follows: 1972, £7.45 million; 1973, £7.5 million; 1974, for nine months, £5.3 million and 1975, £9.03 million and in the budget for 1976, £10.45 million. This is at variance with the suggestions made by Deputy Leonard. If one wants to get a picture of promotional expenditure in isolation, if we take account only of subhead F11, of the Vote for Transport and Power, from which Bord Fáilte promotional expenditure comes, rather than what the total Bord Fáilte allocations are, we get a clearer picture. The amounts issued from this source over the same four years, together with the 1976 allocation are as follows: 1972, £4.25 million; 1973, £5.45 million; 1974, for nine months, £4 million; 1975, £7.1 million and 1976, £7.75 million. In other words, the 1976 allocations are over 80 per cent higher than the amounts in 1972. This has more than kept pace with inflation during that period.

The tourist earnings in the last four years are as follows: 1972, £91.4 million, a decrease from that of the previous year; 1973, £110 million; 1974, £130 million, and 1975, £161 million. Against a very depressed economic background—there was depression in agriculture because of the problems of the cattle industry the previous winter—tourism, which people had not expected to be so buoyant, was very alive and was a very substantial factor in the Irish economy last year.

I welcome the new Bill concerning Bord Fáilte which the Minister introduced a few months ago. I am glad to note the emphasis on water sports in their national plan report. I want to mention one or two local matters concerning the Clew Bay area because there has been tremendous development there in regard to the provision of hotels, guesthouses, restaurants, a championship golf course and sea angling activities. The bay which has about 300 islands is probably the most sheltered water on the entire west coast and offers great scope for water sports, particularly sailing in which French interests have recently become involved in the purchase of part of one of the islands. A sailing club was formed there recently. I would very much like to see Bord Fáilte take a special interest in this type of promotion because I believe it has tremendous scope especially for those who carry small boats, such as dinghies in trailers behind their cars.

It was interesting to listen to the contribution of the Minister and also that of Deputy O'Brien who took exception to this party even suggesting that we discuss a motion on tourism. He seemed to imply that he would even stifle discussion on a motion such as the one we put forward because we were worried by the actions of the Government in the budget and since which are curbing the competitiveness of the industry. Last night the Minister spoke about the various sections of the tourist industry putting on the poor mouth. I thought it was strange for a member of a Government, who are always putting on the poor mouth, to say something like that. They are like a wail of banshees. They are always complaining. They complain about things being ill-used by others, about the EEC, about the Northern Ireland troubles. They complain that they are not getting a fair deal and that the world is deliberately bringing on an economic crisis for them. They have complaints about vets, the banks and about the Fianna Fáil Party. They seemingly do not accept that it is my party's job to point out the mistakes made by them. It is also our job to help to protect the people from those mistakes.

I want to say to Deputy O'Brien that we make no apology for tabling motions which we believe may bring ideas to the Government. We are bringing ideas from a party who were never afraid to tackle problems, who did not whine and groan when there was a crisis. They solved many difficult problems. The tourist industry does not consist of people making a poor mouth. They are only asking the Government for fair play. They have pointed out that if the industry does not remain competitive the whole economy will suffer. The Minister certainly knows that there is evidence for that case.

The Minister said last night that the promoters were half afraid of selling Ireland. I join with my colleague in saying that men who are half afraid to sell Ireland should not be commissioned for that job. He also referred to my contribution when I said that there was a reduction in the amount available. I qualified that by saying "in real terms". Those few words are the real crux of the situation. Deputy Staunton trotted out a lot of figures but if he were to relate those figures to the inflation which has occurred over the period he mentioned he would find there was no increase in real terms.

The Minister also said: "I do not want this country developed into a cheap tourist market. I do not want to see tourists flocking here because every place is cheaper, the places are crowded and you cannot drive your car on the road." There is very little chance of this country becoming a cheap tourist country with the high prices and the increased taxes imposed by the budget and the VAT increases since then.

The Minister seems to have given little thought to the social and economic roots from which our tourists come. For example, of the tourists coming to Ireland from Britain, a very high percentage is of ethnic origin. The vast majority come from the C1 and C2 socio-economic groups. In the booklet "Tourist plan 1975 to 1978," Table 32B states in relation to the well-off category that 16.4 per cent of the ethnic traffic coming here were in that grouping. In the lower two grades, C1 and C2, the figures were 27 per cent and 36.6 per cent. This seems to indicate that our tourists from Britain are not millionaires. It shows that the majority of them are ordinary wage and salary earners. If the Minister wants an industry based on the wealthy only he should purchase an island in the West Indies. I challenge the Minister to say if even one group in the tourist industry has made the case that prices should be kept high. If the Minister thinks that those who are in the industry want the prices to be high he is mistaken. It is essential that we keep our prices competitive. In one breath the Minister is saying he favours good value for money but in the next breath he tells us he does not want to see tourists coming here because the place is cheaper. He wants a small number of people who will pay high prices but I should like to see a large number of people paying reasonable prices. Well-satisfied visitors are the best possible advertisement we could have.

The high cost of transport has posed a major problem for the tourist industry. Transport costs form the major part of the total cost of a holiday and the competitiveness of our industry will be seriously affected if the costs get out of hand. Many of our visitors arrive with their own transport and others hire cars. Anything that affects motoring and makes it more costly has a serious effect on tourism. There is also the secondary effect where the prices of food, goods, materials and services required for the tourist industry are increased.

The Minister for Finance ensured that motoring costs were blown sky-high as a result of his budget. No consideration was given to the bad effects it would have on one of our major industries. It appears the Minister for Finance wishes to wipe the motorist and the tourist off the map. During the budget debate the Leader of our party put forward a proposal for a voucher scheme for petrol for tourists. We had in mind permitting the purchase of a limited amount of petrol at reduced rates and that this would be put into operation at various points of entry. A number of European countries that are well established in the tourist industry have similar schemes. However, the Minister could not see his way to accept our proposal. Now that he has had time to reflect on the matter, when he has seen how other budget proposals have misfired, perhaps he will review the situation before the coming tourist season.

Deputy O'Brien was critical of our mentioning the word "subvention". We think the extra tourists who would come here and the revenue that would be obtained would offset the cost of introducing the voucher scheme. On 4th December, 1974, we discussed the increase of 15p on the price of a gallon of petrol. At column 977 of the Official Report of that date, the Minister for Finance stated:

Moreover, as I have told the House previously, we now have the cheapest petrol in western Europe. In Italy petrol costs nearly 88p a gallon, in France over 74p, in Austria, Belgium, Denmark, the Netherlands and Germany the price ranges from 69p to 74p a gallon. Even in oil-rich Norway it is 76p. In Northern Ireland and Britain the price of premium petrol is 63½p per gallon. The existence of such a large difference as nearly 13p on a gallon of petrol between the Republic and the North has obvious disadvantages for our economy. It would stimulate considerable petrol purchases in the Republic by motorists from the North. This "leakage" across the Border would result in a worsening of our balance of payments as additional oil was imported to supply the cross-Border demand.

We must remember that a large number of our tourists can buy petrol at a rate that is 11p per gallon cheaper than in this country. It will be interesting to see if the Minister for Finance follows his statement to its logical conclusion. That would mean there would be a reduction in the price of petrol here, not only for the tourists but for the general public.

Last night the Minister for Transport and Power objected to hotels moaning about prices and he would not accept our statement that the hotel industry was in serious trouble. In the Irish Hotel Industry Manual for Inter-Hotel Comparisons, in the Cork-Kerry area which the Minister represents, it was stated that the hotels had a loss equal to 2 per cent of their total turnover. Politicians have close contact with hotels because they hold clinics in them and they also attend functions and, consequently, I cannot understand how the Minister could stand over the statement that there was no criticism from hoteliers with regard to the problems they were facing.

What year is the Deputy referring to?

It was for 1974.

Has the Deputy got the 1975 figures?

I take it they are not available yet.

The prices were increased by 25 per cent in the autumn.

The Minister must realise that many of the hotels in the Cork-Kerry area are subsidised by local organisations, by bingo and by dinner dances.

Amendment put.
The Dáil divided: Tá, 61; Níl, 58.

  • Barry, Peter.
  • Barry, Richard.
  • Begley, Michael.
  • Belton, Luke.
  • Belton, Paddy.
  • Bermingham, Joseph.
  • Bruton, John.
  • Burke, Dick.
  • Burke, Joan T.
  • Burke, Liam.
  • Byrne, Hugh.
  • Clinton, Mark A.
  • Cluskey, Frank.
  • Conlan, John F.
  • Coogan, Fintan.
  • Cooney, Patrick M.
  • Corish, Brendan.
  • Cosgrave, Liam.
  • Coughlan, Stephen.
  • Crotty, Kieran.
  • Cruise-O'Brien, Conor.
  • Desmond, Barry.
  • Desmond, Eileen.
  • Dockrell, Henry P.
  • Dockrell, Maurice.
  • Donnellan, John.
  • Enright, Thomas.
  • Esmonde, John G.
  • Finn, Martin.
  • FitzGerald, Garret.
  • Fitzpatrick, Tom (Cavan).
  • Flanagan, Oliver J.
  • Gilhawley, Eugene.
  • Governey, Desmond.
  • Griffin, Brendan.
  • Harte, Patrick D.
  • Hegarty, Patrick.
  • Hogan O'Higgins, Brigid.
  • Jones, Denis F.
  • Kenny, Enda.
  • Kyne, Thomas A.
  • Lynch, Gerard.
  • McLaughlin, Joseph.
  • McMahon, Larry.
  • Malone, Patrick.
  • Murphy, Michael P.
  • O'Brien, Fergus.
  • O'Connell, John.
  • O'Donnell, Tom.
  • O'Leary, Michael.
  • Pattison, Seamus.
  • Reynolds, Patrick J.
  • Ryan, John J.
  • Ryan, Richie.
  • Spring, Dan.
  • Staunton, Myles.
  • Taylor, Frank.
  • Timmins, Godfrey.
  • Toal, Brendan.
  • Tully, James.
  • White, James.

Níl

  • Allen, Lorcan.
  • Andrews, David.
  • Barrett, Sylvester.
  • Blaney, Neil T.
  • Brady, Philip A.
  • Brennan, Joseph.
  • Callanan, John.
  • Calleary, Seán.
  • Carter, Frank.
  • Colley, George.
  • Collins, Gerard.
  • Connolly, Gerard.
  • Crinion, Brendan.
  • Crowley, Flor.
  • Daly, Brendan.
  • Davern, Noel.
  • de Valera, Vivion.
  • Dowling, Joe.
  • Fahey, Jackie.
  • Faulkner, Pádraig.
  • Fitzgerald, Gene.
  • Flanagan, Seán.
  • French, Seán.
  • Gallagher, Denis.
  • Geoghegan-Quinn, Máire.
  • Gibbons, Hugh.
  • Gogan, Richard P.
  • Healy, Augustine A.
  • Hussey, Thomas.
  • Breslin, Cormac.
  • Briscoe, Ben.
  • Brosnan, Seán.
  • Browne, Seán.
  • Brugha, Ruairí.
  • Burke, Raphael P.
  • Kenneally, William.
  • Kitt, Michael P.
  • Leonard, James.
  • Loughnane, William.
  • Lynch, Celia.
  • McEllistrim, Thomas.
  • MacSharry, Ray.
  • Meaney, Tom.
  • Molloy, Robert.
  • Moore, Seán.
  • Murphy, Ciarán.
  • Noonan, Michael.
  • O'Connor, Timothy.
  • O'Kennedy, Michael.
  • O'Leary, John.
  • O'Malley, Desmond.
  • Power, Patrick.
  • Smith, Patrick.
  • Timmons, Eugene.
  • Tunney, Jim.
  • Walsh, Seán.
  • Wilson, John P.
  • Wyse, Pearse.
Tellers: Tá, Deputies Begley and Pattison; Níl, Deputies Browne and Healy.
Amendment declared carried.
Motion, as amended, put and agreed to.
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