asked the Minister for Education the action he has taken to implement the commitments in the national understanding on education.
Ceisteanna—Questions. Oral Answers. - National Understanding Education Commitments.
19.
Work on the White Paper on Education is well advanced and it is expected to have it published at an early date.
Additional financial resources of the order of £45 million more were made available by way of a supplementary estimate in 1979 to make additional provision for expenditure on different sectors of the educational system.
An amount of £1.175 million has been provided in connection with the introduction in the academic year 1979-80 of additional technological courses in third-level educational institutions in areas of shortage as identified by the Manpower Consultative Committee.
Arrangements are in train for the establishment of a committee to make a study of the value of educational broadcasting. The introduction of the scheme for the appointment of 50 adult education advisers has been generally welcomed. Particular attention has been given to improving the pupil-teacher ratio in primary schools and to the appointment of remedial teachers in areas of greater need.
Arising out of the Minister's reply, is he aware that the recent education estimates, in the view of the Irish National Teachers Organisation, represent a flagrant breach of the undertakings of the national understanding? Does he agree with this assessment of the situation?
I do not agree with that assessment. Comparing like with like the book of Estimates at this time last year contained the figure of £399 million; this year it contains the figure £5 million on top of half of £1 billion, or £505 million, for education. There is no point in being selective about it. That is the amount of money available for expenditure in education. I do not accept that that is an insignificant figure.
Is the Minister saying that the INTO have it wrong.
I am saying that, in so far as the figures as published fall short of expectations aroused by the national understanding they are wrong.
If the Minister disagrees with the INTO contention that the Estimates represent a flagrant breach of the national understanding, what other kind of breach would he prefer to describe it as, a modest breach perhaps?
The Deputy hardly expects to catch me with an infantile, fatuous question like that. The amount of money made available by the Government for this year is a very substantial sum—£505 million. Any fair-minded commentator will say that it is a significant sum and a significant proportion of total Government expenditure.
Is the Minister saying that the INTO are not being fair-minded?
When one takes expenditure on wages and salaries from the amount in the Estimate, is the Minister satisfied that the increase for the Department is substantial, even in the context of the undertaking given in the national understanding?
I wish to make two comments on what the Deputy has said. First, when I took office in 1977 there was available to me under the Estimates for capital expenditure a sum of £27 million. This year £49.3 million is available. Secondly, I think it is particularly puerile to maintain that money spent on the salaries of teachers at various levels is money badly spent or misplaced. There was an old Irish quatrain which talked about wooden priests and golden chalices in place of golden priests and wooden chalices. There was a time in this country when we did not have buildings to put teachers into but the light of learning was kept alive by the teachers. That is where I would like to see the emphasis going. I do not think anyone should run down an Estimate because the largest percentage of it goes on teachers' salaries.
I shall ignore the trap set by the Minister. In relation to capital expenditure, he has said that the amount provided this year is £49 million, Is he aware that last year the sum involved was £53 million?
I am so aware. I spent it.
That is all right. As long as the Minister is aware of the fact——
The Minister is aware that the amount has almost doubled since 1977. As far as the gap is concerned, a couple of schools is all that it means. I am getting very good tenders at the moment and I may get as good value for the £49 million as I got for the £53 million.
Is the Minister aware that not only is he going downhill in financial terms but that in real terms he is at the bottom of the hill?
I do not think the Deputy listened to the latter part of my statement.
20.
asked the Minister for Education the outcome of his recent talks with representatives of the Irish Congress of Trade Unions on the implementation of the educational section of the national understanding.
The Deputy would appear to be referring to meetings between members of the Irish Congress of Trade Unions, senior officers of my Department, the Department of Finance and the Department of Labour. The meetings form part of a series of on-going discussions.