asked the Taoiseach if he will make a report on his discussions on 18 May 1988 with representatives of the Irish Congress of Trade Unions regarding the implementation of the job creation commitments in the Programme for National Recovery; the number of additional jobs which have been created under the programme; if any new initiatives are planned following his talks with Congress; and if he will make a statement on the matter.
Ceisteanna — Questions. Oral Answers. - Job Creation Commitments.
6.
The Joint Government/ICTU statement that issued following on the meeting Ministers and I had with representatives of the Irish Congress of Trade Unions on 18 May summarises the discussions that took place. This statement is available in the Oireachtas Library. A detailed statement on the progress made under the Programme for National Recovery in achieving the targets for job creation and the major policy initiatives which the Government have taken since the programme was published is now being prepared in accordance with the agreement reached at the meeting. I will arrange that copies of this statement are made available in the Oireachtas Library when it is published in a few days.
In relation to the 20,000 jobs mentioned in the programme and in the statements before and after the meeting by Congress, can I take it that the 20,000 extra jobs means 20,000 jobs above job losses?
It is 20,000 new jobs. It is not and never has been stated to be a net increase of 20,000 jobs.
That is the point I wished to clarify, because the understanding was that "extra jobs" were different to "new jobs" and since 20,000 new jobs was not referred to but 20,000 extra jobs thought it meant over and above job losses. Is the Taoiseach saying there will be no net increase in jobs since January this year?
I am not saying that at all. What we are committed to and what we planned to achieve in the programme is the provision of 20,000 extra or new jobs this year in different sectors of the economy. If there are no job losses there will be a net increase of 20,000 jobs but if there are job losses they will have to be set off against the 20,000. The important thing is, and the ambition of the programme is, to bring about the creation of 20,000 new jobs this year.
When was the last time during which there were no job losses? It will not be difficult for the Taoiseach to estimate the number of job losses in any area, taking the last decade.
I am trying to illustrate to the Deputy exactly what was agreed in the programme with the social partners. What was agreed was that we would make our best endeavours to create 20,000 new job opportunities in this year, and that is what has been done. There will probably be job losses, but what the programme speaks about and seeks to attain is 20,000 extra new jobs this year.
Will the Taoiseach indicate whether any percentage of that 20,000 has so far been created? Have 1,000 or 5,000 jobs been created?
A considerable number have been created but the important thing from the Deputy's point of view is that the different agencies concerned, the IDA and so on, are confident that the 20,000 will be reached this year.
Question No. 7.
Will the Taoiseach——
A final supplementary, please.
——comment on the ESRI report that there were 25,000 fewer people in employment at a recent date compared to the same date last year, that there are 25,000 fewer people in employment than when the Taoiseach took office?
I do not accept that figure but that is not the point. As I have said, the programme concentrates on the provision of 20,000 new jobs identified in specific sectors this year and the Government agencies concerned are satisfied that these jobs will be created by the IDA in industry or in tourism.
Would the Taoiseach not agree——
Question No. 7.
May I ask one final supplementary question?
A very brief supplementary.
Would the Taoiseach not agree that it is unfair to create false expectations in talking about 20,000 new jobs being created when the reality is that the number of jobs is declining? A great number of young people and old people are looking for hope and it is unfair to them for the Taoiseach to talk about 20,000 new jobs being created which are not going to materialise——
The Deputy is making a statement rather than asking a question.
——and it should be made absolutely clear that there are going to be fewer jobs as a result of his policies.
It is fallacious to suggest that there are going to be fewer jobs. The programme from the beginning made it absolutely clear what its target was and that was to provide conditions and circumstances in which 20,000 new jobs would come on stream. Surely the Deputy cannot suggest that that is not desirable and if there are job losses at least they would be offset to the extent that these 20,000 new jobs would be created.
There are 25,000 fewer in employment now than last year.
A brief question from Deputy Mac Giolla.
I simply ask this question to seek clarification——
I trust the Deputy will not engage in repetition.
Could the Taoiseach tell us if it is correct to say that the agreement under the Programme for National Recovery would not be breached even if there was a net loss of 20,000 jobs this year providing that 20,000 new jobs were created?
The purpose of the programme is to create 20,000 new jobs and I am sure the Deputy should welcome our efforts in that regard.
How about protecting existing jobs?