Vol. 404 No. 9
5 Mr. J. Higgins asked the Minister for Education her views on the aspect of the report of the Primary Education Review Body which estimates that there will be 3,031 fewer primary teachers in the system by the year 1999-2000; and if she will make a statement on the matter.
Before I reply I would like to give the Fine Gael spokesperson on Education, Deputy Jim Higgins, all my best wishes. I know that if I wish him many happy years in that position he will accuse me of being provocative so I will just wish us happy times together.
The statistics quoted by the Deputy are projections based on the expectation that there will be a decline of 93,400 pupils in the enrolments in national schools between the 1992-93 and 1999-2000 school year and on the assumption that there would be no improvement in the current schedule for primary schools. That report came out at the beginning of December. Since then we have had the Programme for Economic and Social Progress. Agreement has been reached between the Government and the social partners for a reduction in the pupil-teacher ratio to 25:1 by September 1992. This will be achieved by retaining all existing posts in 1991 and 1992 and by creating 250 new posts in September 1991, and the balance to achieve the 25:1 ratio in September 1922. The position is to be reviewed at end 1993.
The implementation of these improvements in the pupil-teacher ratio will mean that the estimates referred to in the appendix at the back of the primary review and in the question are no longer relevant.
I thank the Minister for her good wishes. Why was the review document which came out in December first circulated to Fianna Fáil Deputies whereas Opposition Deputies simply got the Minister's speech yesterday and only this morning got the review proper? Apart from entitlement, there is a matter of courtesy here.
The Deputy is mistaken. Official spokespersons on Education at that time, and the Deputy was not such then, received the document with an accompanying letter from me stating that it was for dissemination among the parties. The official spokespersons received the initial document the day after it was released.
While not wishing to prolong this argument, I checked the matter with Deputy Bruton who assures me that he got neither the letter nor the document. In view of the fact that the report contains such frightening statistical evidence in relation to the stripping of our most vital national asset and in view of the fact that the Minister's Programme for Economic and Social Progress allocation of 250 additional jobs in primary schools from September 1991 and an additional 250 next year is only putting a minor hole in the 1,000 jobs she removed from the primary school sector as a result of Circular 87/20, does the Minister not acknowledge that there is an obligation on her to allow the existing number of teachers in the system in order to compensate for the huge number of people who simply cannot cope with existing primary school——
The Chair appeals for brevity, especially in dealing with Priority Questions for the obvious reason I have outlined so often.
The reference with regard to Deputy Bruton is incorrect. In relation to additional posts the Deputy has omitted an important factor which is that the number of school children is reducing. Therefore, under the current ratio there would fall due 250 posts and there will be 250 extra posts: that makes 500 posts. The same number of teachers were reallocated and allocated last year.
Therefore the Deputy's figure of 1,000 is not relevant in the light of declining enrolements which have occurred since that time.
May I ask one brief supplementary? Regarding the Minister's very noble intention of reducing the pupil-teacher ratio to 25:1, will she give a clear commitment that we are talking about a class maximum size of 25:1 in every class hall here?
The Deputy knows that is not correct. He is a teacher and knows that what he has put forward is quite fallacious. Since the Department of Education began many years ago the pupil-teacher ratio has been obtained by dividing the number of teachers into the number of pupils.
