Bertie Ahern
Question:1 Mr. B. Ahern asked the Taoiseach whether an agenda has been set for the Dublin European Council meeting in December 1996. [19414/96]
Ceisteanna—Questions. Oral Answers. - Dublin European Council.
Bertie Ahern
Question:2 Mr. B. Ahern asked the Taoiseach the areas in which he expects there will be final agreement at the Dublin European Council meeting. [19415/96]
I propose to take Questions Nos. 1 and 2 together.
The agenda for the European Council in Dublin on 13 and 14 December next has not yet been decided. As is customary, as President in Office of the European Council I will be writing to my colleagues on the European Council as to the agenda prior to the meeting. At this stage, I anticipate that the main items on the Council agenda will be the Intergovernmental Conference, Economic and Monetary Union, Employment Policy, the fight against Drug Trafficking and Organised Crime and the External Relations of the Union.
As the Deputy will appreciate I cannot preempt the outcome of the European Council. I am, however, very hopeful that the Council will record substantial progress on Economic and Monetary Union, the Intergovernmental Conference and the Europe wide fight against drugs and organised crime. I also intend to seek the agreement of the European Council to a declaration on employment which will chart the future direction of EU employment strategy.
Will the Intergovernmental Conference achieve a stated position on a comprehensive draft by the December summit? What is his view as President of the EU and his colleagues' view of the possibilities of completing the Intergovernmental Conference by the Amsterdam Summit? There is concern about the difficulties within the Intergovernmental Conference and where it is going.
What is the Taoiseach's position on the Swiss suggestion that there will be a financial crisis within the European Community if the European Monetary Union target system for non-EU countries is not resolved? This is a growing issue of discontent between EU and non-EU countries. We cannot achieve anything in European Monetary Union until the issue of the target system is resolved. Since the Taoiseach stated we will make major progress on European Monetary Union, what solutions or compromises is the Irish Presidency putting forward to resolve this?
We will present a draft treaty. I believe there will be a conclusion to the Intergovernmental Conference in time for the Amsterdam European Council in June. The remaining questions are more appropriate for the Minister for Finance to answer.
No they are not.
The Swiss have their own interests to pursue in this matter. They are not a member of the EU and not privy to the discussions taking place on European Monetary Union within the Union. A satisfactory outcome from the point of view of EU members will be reached on all these questions.
The Swiss are not the only ones concerned about European Monetary Union, which is a crucial part of moving forward in European integration. They have decisions, arguments and their national interest but there are also arguments within the EU. If the Taoiseach does not want to get into discussion on the Swiss, what is his view on the target system regarding the ins and the outs? Is the Irish Presidency developing an understanding on how the target system and financial mechanism will work under a single currency? What relationship will we have with the British and will it operate if they are outside European Monetary Union? Are we linking the British into the system in a way that would be satisfactory to our economy in the future?
The Irish Presidency is a glorious opportunity to influence the debate. I am not the only one predicting a financial crisis on this issue. The international financial press are also saying it. It is in the national interest to focus this debate on resolving the issues of our EU and non-EU partners. What are we doing to resolve this matter during the Irish Presidency?
The Irish Presidency is required to work on the relationship between the countries in the Euro zone and those EU members who remain outside. This matter is engaging substantial attention at the moment and is one on which progress was made at the informal meeting of Finance Ministers in Dublin. It is one of a number of European Monetary Union related issues, including the stability pact and the legal arrangements of the issuance of the new currency, and has not been finally resolved.
The term "financial crisis" is one that should not be used in this context. As we proceed towards the creation of a single European currency we will, by simplifying global currency relationships, reduce the risks of the type of mismatch that leads to crisis on the currency markets by a considerable degree. The Euro will be a major player on the world market. It will replace a number of competing and occasionally diverging currencies, simplify inter-currency relationships and render them more predictable. There will be transitional difficulties, as with all change. The overall effect in this instance will be to promote financial stability.
It is important that the creation of a zone of monetary stability in Europe now exists. It may not exist in the future and it did not exist in the past. It has been created due to the Maastricht Treaty, which was agreed without any exemption being sought for Ireland by my predecessor, Mr. Haughey. I agreed with this and gave him my full support at the time, publicly and privately. We should avoid any attempt to criticise, or adopt the criticisms of others, regarding this project, which will be a success.
In the next week or so will the Taoiseach, the Minister for Finance or some other member of Government set our policy on the single European payment system as every other country in Europe has done? We have been trying to find this out for four weeks.
Everyone is interested except the Taoiseach.
If we do not have a policy on the matter we should be told that. What are the Taoiseach's views on the proposals launched by the EU, and supported by the Commission, on an EU wide tax regime for all European Union countries? I assume we do not agree with it but I would like to hear his view on the matter. What is his view on the Franco-German proposals put forward in recent days for a multi-speed Europe allowing for enlargement to 27 countries and greater integration and allowing countries to join at different times and levels and progress in different ways? Does he believe it is helpful to launch such proposals weeks before we hope to finalise a fairly final draft? It is creating confusion. Lest the Taoiseach accuse me of criticising the Irish Presidency, Sarah Helm, one of the better known writers on the Intergovernmental Conference in European journalism, stated that privately, German officials predict that the Dublin summit in December, when an EU draft treaty is to be presented, will achieve virtually nothing.
The Deputy may not quote at Question Time.
I am not quoting. If I were to quote it would be to the effect that German officials stated they will try their best to conceal the fact that it will lead to nothing. What are the Taoiseach's views on this matter?
I compliment the Deputy on his industry. He obviously had to search far and wide to find any criticism of the Irish Presidency. I compliment him on finding criticism from persons who would not give their names. He referred to "private" criticism. Deputy Ahern and his research staff are to be complimented on finding this nugget of criticism.
Of truth.
Further comment on the matter is not required.
It was on the front page of one of today's newspapers.
I call Deputy Harney.
I asked the Taoiseach four questions which he did not answer.
I have no control over how the Taoiseach or Ministers answer questions.
The Taoiseach is a great proponent of forcing others to answer.
Now that we have completed two-thirds of our Presidency, what have we achieved?
We have achieved a great deal on the issue of drugs and crime. I am particularly pleased we have achieved the extension of EUROPOL's mandate to include crimes against children, which has been a major scandal in European society in recent times. I am pleased as a result of the work of the Minister for Justice, Deputy Owen, we have been able to extend EUROPOL's mandate in that area. I am also pleased at our progress in the fight against drug abuse, in particular the agreements emerging on higher penalties for those involved in trafficking drugs and more co-ordination between European authorities on detection of drug trafficking. Furthermore, a strong agenda has been set for Europe participating in an international arrangement with the United States, Japan and other major players in the fight against crime generally, including the abuse of the Internet and other benefits conferred on society by modern technology. Substantial progress has been made on agreeing the details necessary for the introduction of a single currency. This is not a comprehensive summary because, although I am not complaining, the Deputy asked the question without giving notice of it.
Surely the Taoiseach should not need notes to tell us what has been achieved.
We attach great importance to the good relationship between the United States and Europe during our Presidency. Whenever Ireland holds the Presidency of the European Union there usually exists an uncomplicated and supportive relationship between Ireland and the United States which we can use to the benefit of EU relations generally. While there were many inherited difficulties in that area, including Helms-Burton, D'Amato-Kennedy and other legislation, the work we are doing in that area will be particularly helpful to the long-term relationship between the EU and the United States. I look forward to meeting the President of the United States on behalf of the Presidency of the European Union.
While I accept EUROPOL's mandate has been extended to include the protection of children — European citizens would expect nothing less having regard to the recent cases in Belgium and around Europe — it has not been given a budget and, as the necessary legislation has not been dealt with in the parliaments throughout Europe, it has not been ratified as an institution. While this achievement is nice in theory, we have not had practical reality as far as action on EUROPOL is concerned. Those are nice words, but there has been no action.
As the Deputy is well aware, there have been many years of disagreement about the terms and competence of EUROPOL. I am pleased the establishment of EUROPOL was agreed finally at the Council in June. The way is now clear for the necessary legislation to ratify it. I am also pleased the Minister for Justice has worked with great effect on achieving agreement from all member governments and that the relevant legislation will be passed within a reasonably short timeframe so that EUROPOL can be effective.
I agree with the Deputy that crime is an international matter. As the capacity to import and export criminal activity is increasing exponentially, we must put in place sophisticated instruments at European and international levels, through EUROPOL and other such agencies, for dealing with international crime. The forces of law must have at least as good, if not substantially better, resources and competence than those they must combat.
The Taoiseach appears to believe it is unpatriotic to question the single currency deal. We want him as President of Europe to take the lead in ensuring there is a link between the UK currency and the new Euro. The matter was not on the agenda of the last Council meeting, but I am glad to note it is on the agenda for its next meeting. To avoid turbulence, will the Minister take a direct interest in ensuring there is a link between the two currencies? The Taoiseach has given the impression that the matter is being fixed up between Finance Ministers, but that is not the case. Deputy Ahern asked him when he will outline the financial payments system. Perhaps he will answer that question? This needs more discussion. Is the Taoiseach aware that in Kenmare last weekend 75 per cent of 120 Irish economists — and I am aware of the jokes about it — said the Government is making no preparation for the single currency. According to an opinion poll of those economists some 45 per cent said we should stay out of the currency unless Britain joins. I do not agree with that. The least the Taoiseach can do is to use the Irish Presidency to bring the UK on board. The UK should, at least, join the ERM. Has the Taoiseach asked the UK to rejoin the ERM? Has the Taoiseach put proposals on the table to get Britain on board in some band arrangement within the Ecu?
The Deputy's question is too long.
Otherwise Irish exports will be wiped out.
The Deputy should recollect that he was a member of a Government that signed the Maastricht Treaty without seeking any opt out.
I did not ask the Taoiseach to opt out.
My predecessor, Deputy Haughey, agreed to sign a treaty which included an opt-out from the single currency for the United Kingdom but not for Ireland.
Was the Taoiseach in favour?
In my view he was absolutely right to do so. The Deputy should recollect the historical facts.
We are proud of that. What is the Taoiseach doing about the single currency?
In so far as the Deputy was quoting with approval the 45 per cent of economists——
He did not.
——who believe that my predecessor, Deputy Haughey, was wrong to make this decision, I think the Deputy is using his anchorage with regard to the necessary relationship between reality and rhetoric that should apply in this House.
I did not say that. The Taoiseach should answer the question. I am in favour of the currency but the Taoiseach is doing nothing about getting Britain on board.
Do not upset them.
During the Irish Presidency substantial progress has been made on all issues necessary for preparing the introduction of the single currency on time.
The deal has been done. We must not upset the Europeans.
These preparations include arrangements for the relationship between those within the single currency and those outside it, possibly including Britain: the necessary requirements with regard to the stability pact to effectively manage the budgetary policy of those within the currency; and the legal arrangements.
The stability pact is a different matter.
As regards the policy that might be pursued on fiscal issues by EU states that are not within the single currency, my predecessor, Deputy Haughey, was prudent in insisting that countries inside and outside the currency must pursue the same fiscal policy criteria on borrowing and inflation.
Skip the lecture, will the Taoiseach support a currency link?
Deputy Brennan has asked questions, he ought to listen to the reply.
Therefore, I am pleased to be able to tell the Deputy that my predecessor made the necessary arrangements to ensure that under the treaty the obligations of maintaining fiscal stability, and therefore avoiding the force that sometimes causes currency instability, have already been provided for in the broader economic and monetary union which comprises all members, including those who have not moved to stage three.
That has nothing to do with it. That is not the question.
Given that the Taoiseach was the first Member of this House to suggest devaluation when we had a currency crisis in 1992——
He caused it.
——does he believe it is realistic for Ireland to go into the European Monetary Union if the British stay out?
The Deputy has no chance of getting an answer.
Yes.
The House must proceed to deal with other Priority Questions at 3.15 p.m.
What is the Taoiseach doing to promote human rights internationally and, in particular, to control the sale of arms from the EU to repressive regimes such as Indonesia and Nigeria? Does the Taoiseach accept the EU has much to answer for on the matter and that there is much hypocrisy concerning it? Is the Irish Presidency being used actively to promote human rights as Irish Governments have done successfully over the years? Has the Taoiseach any proposals concerning trade legislation to control arms sales and what kind of proposals has he in mind for the Dublin summit?
As the Deputy is aware, few jobs in Ireland are dependent on arms manufacture. This is not the case in a number of other European countries where substantial employment is generated by arms manufacture. Personally, I feel a sense of revulsion vis-à-vis the arms trade but, equally, I am realistic enough to know that some families in other EU countries derive their income from their involvement with arms manufacturing companies. We should understand the position of others and not simply be morally superior from the advantageous position that we may have. It is important to recognise that before we begin to discuss the subject but the Government will do everything it can to restrict the arms trade as well as restricting the forces that generate the arms trade. The efforts of the Tánaiste in attempting to bring peace to the Middle East are important in this regard.
The Taoiseach said earlier that he hoped to make a declaration on employment at the summit meeting. How does the Taoiseach explain that under his Presidency, President Santer's proposals for transnational jobs will not be implemented?
A number of EU countries have difficulty in qualifying for the single currency under the budgetary criteria which require them to reduce public spending. Therefore, they are unwilling either to commit their own funds or to see European funds that might otherwise be refunded to them to the benefit of their own budgets, used for the trans-European networks.
I was hoping to proceed to other questions. We have devoted almost half an hour to the first two questions. After a final question from Deputy Bertie Ahern, we will hopefully pass on to Question No. 3.
Will the Taoiseach explain his views on an area on which he has undertaken to make progress during the Irish Presidency, namely crimes against children including child pornography on the Internet? In a recently published discussion document on the matter the European Commission advocates co-operation on a European wide approach. This is what the Taoiseach said at the Strasbourg meeting. The Commission, however, also said that the issue of illegal content was one for member states. This is a hugely complex issue. If it is a matter for member states, has the Taoiseach considered how we will deal with it, for example, by amending our censorship laws? I welcome any efforts being made by the Government but it should use the opportunity of the Presidency to get our European colleagues to focus on the issue. We cannot do much about it on our own. What can the Taoiseach do to move this matter on during the Presidency? Will he set up a working group here including outside interests? The issue is so complex that Government agencies alone do not have the personnel to deal with it. The Taoiseach should establish a working body to involve people in an open debate to see how we can deal with it.
It is as a direct result of pressure from the Irish Presidency that the Commission's initiative came about concerning the abuse of modern technology and, in particular, the use of the Internet to disseminate pornography and other damaging material. The Deputy made a valid point concerning the different standards that apply in various countries as to what is or is not acceptable. At the founding of the European Union member states placed a reserve on their need to be able to make what may be described as moral judgments individually as nation states rather than have them made for them. That is something on which we have had occasion to rely upon in certain instances.
The difficulty the Deputy has highlighted is real and should not be underestimated by anyone who is looking for instant results in this area. I am glad the matter is being faced which is as a result of the initiative of the Irish Presidency. The Deputy has made a good suggestion about having this matter studied further not only by the Government but by others and I undertake to pursue that suggestion.