Dáil Éireann debate -
Wednesday, 2 Apr 2003

Vol. 564 No. 2

Ceisteanna – Questions (Resumed). Priority Questions. - Ministerial Air Transport Service.

Joe Sherlock

Question:

57 Mr. Sherlock asked the Minister for Defence the Government's plans to acquire new aircraft for the ministerial air transport service; the number and specification of the aircraft being sought; if they will be purchased or leased; the estimated cost of the planned acquisition; the proportion this represents of the total budget for the acquisition of new aircraft for the Air Corps in 2003; when it is expected that the new aircraft will be in service; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [9056/03]

Dinny McGinley

Question:

59 Mr. McGinley asked the Minister for Defence the position regarding the Government's plans to purchase a new Government jet; if a leasing arrangement is being considered; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [9040/03]

Mr. M. Smith

I propose to take Questions Nos. 57 and 59 together.

The Government has decided to replace the Gulfstream IV and the Beechcraft King Air in the ministerial air transport role. The decision was necessary to meet the ever increasing demands of Government business, not least in the context of a significantly enlarged European Union.

The tender process for the acquisition of the aircraft is now in train with the preparation of tender documentation in my Department. This work is nearing completion and it is expected that the requisite notices in relation to the tender competitions will issue to the Official Journal of the European Communities later this week. A separate competition is being held for the two aircraft, both of which should be available for operational service by 1 October 2003.

The replacement for the Gulfstream IV will have the capacity to operate in the long range executive transport role. The aircraft must be capable of operation from a 6,000 foot runway carrying at least 25 passengers and five crew to a destination of not less than 3,500 nautical miles non stop. It must also have the capacity to fly in excess of 5,000 nautical miles non stop. The replacement for the Beechcraft King Air must be capable of operation from a 4,800 foot runway carrying seven passengers to a destination of not less than 1,500 nautical miles non stop.

The tender competition for both aircraft will allow for the submission of both new and pre-owned aircraft. All options, such as outright purchase, lease, lease purchase and other alternatives, will be considered. The highly competitive nature of the aviation market at present should result in competitive packages being offered.

In tandem with proposals for the supply of the aircraft, tenderers may also outline offers for the Gulfstream IV aircraft as at the proposed date of hand-over of the tendered aircraft or in mid-July 2004 following the EU Presidency. Offers for the Beechcraft King Air will also be considered in tandem with proposals for its replacement.

The acquisition of aircraft will be the subject of detailed cost benefit analysis, including value for money and comparison with costs associated with alternative arrangements. The responses to the tender process will determine the most advantageous system of payment.

The actual cost of the acquisition of the aircraft can only be defined after the tender competition, particularly in view of the fact that pre-owned aircraft are a consideration. There is no provision in the 2003 Defence Vote for the acquisition of the aircraft. Additional funding for the proposed aircraft will have to be identified.

Mr. Sherlock

I understand the proposed figure is around €63 million. Does the Minister accept it reflects a strange sense of priorities to spend this kind of public money on the acquisition of aircraft for the convenience of Ministers at a time when an elderly woman lay on a hospital trolley for 16 days, children with a disability are being deprived of hot meals and people are being deprived of the home help service? Does he accept that the decision is a slap in the face to members of the Air Corps who were told only last year – I understand the Minister made this point – that there was no money to acquire long promised medium lift helicopters which are urgently required for air rescue service operations? Is it intended to bring forward a Supplementary Estimate for the provision of this jet?

Mr. M. Smith

Let me scotch the notion that there is a set figure for the purchase of these aircraft. It would be very injudicious in the context of tendering that that should be the position. In the event of the purchase of second-hand aircraft or of leasing or lease purchase over a five or ten year period, the type of money about which one would be talking would be infinitesimal compared to the amount the Deputy contends it might be. In regard to the impact that would have on the services about which the Deputy spoke, there is no provision this year. It could be very late this year before any aircraft is acquired and there may be very few funds to be provided this year, so we should not jump to conclusions or make a comparison in the way the Deputy has done.

In the context of the work of Ministers in Europe and elsewhere, critical decisions are taken about this country in Europe and the service this transport provides and the capacity it gives to a Government to represent this country and to do what needs to be done to protect its interests is very valuable. The Gulfstream IV has, by any standards, earned its cost over and over in terms of the facilities it has provided to successive Governments. We were able to purchase that aircraft at a time when 16% to 17% of the people were unemployed. We now have a 4.7% unemployment rate. We have one of the strongest economies in Europe and a major factor in that has been the advances we have made in the European Union and the way we have been able to negotiate funds for a wide range of services for this country which have dramatically improved and helped to develop our economy.

Mr. McGinley

I draw the Minister's attention to another aspect of the Government jet and the running of the service. Is he familiar with the information which became available at the weekend in regard to the high cost of providing sustenance and creature comforts to those travelling on the Government jet? We were led to believe it cost in excess of €100,000 for one year to provide gourmet meals, vintage wines, handmade chocolates and scents and perfumes of the designer kind. It is reminiscent of the one of the chapters of the dying days of the Roman Empire or of an Ottoman sultan's court. Can this be justified? When the rest of us are tightening our belts – Deputy Sherlock mentioned some of the cuts – members of the Government are loosening their belts at the expense of the taxpayer. Who is responsible for the purchase of these provisions? Are any accounting procedures adhered to? What financial controls are in place? Are fair tendering processes engaged in? Will the Minister confirm or deny these reports we read at the weekend about the bill for food and drink on the Government jet being sky high?

Mr. M. Smith

As the Deputy knows, the Government jet has been in service for 12 years. Before I came into the House, I checked the record to see whether the rainbow Government Ministers had complained about the services of the Gulfstream IV during their term in office only to find that they praised the Air Corps for its professionalism, dedication and commitment. It is important to note that the service provided is business class. Wine and other products are purchased in a normal, commercial manner.

Having said that, I have travelled on the jet on a number of occasions and have experienced no excesses. I stand over the work of the Air Corps which provides for a significantly higher number of hours than stated in the press article to which the Deputy refers – I think the article mentions 386 hours.

Mr. McGinley

That is correct.

Mr. M. Smith

The figure should be 513 hours. The jet catered for 1,600 passengers, including the crew. I have tried since I became Minister for Defence to achieve value for money wherever possible. The record will show that the Department of Defence faced up to the challenges before it, whether it was the sale of surplus property, hearing impairment claims or otherwise. Purchases must sometimes be made in other countries but I will work to ensure that we obtain the most economic provisions and that there are no excesses. The Government led by Deputy McGinley's party was very happy with the services provided.

Mr. Sherlock

Does the Minister accept that the morale of the Air Corps has been damaged by this proposal in view of the promise to provide medium lift helicopters? If such progress is being made in getting the deal together, will the Government require a Supplementary Estimate?

Mr. McGinley

In response to the Minister's reply, I recently travelled business class on Aer Lingus and was given only a bun in a poke. Some sort of meal used to be provided but one now gets a bun in a poke between Dublin and Brussels, which is quite adequate for my needs. At a time of economic retrenchment when there have been cutbacks with regard to carers, housing and education, and people are being treated on hospital trolleys, we could legitimately expect Government economy in this area also.

Mr. M. Smith

That is how I want to operate. I want to be fair to everybody but, at the same time, be in a position to provide a decent business class service within the range of finances we can afford, no more or less.

In reply to Deputy Sherlock, the question of a Supplementary Estimate does not arise at this stage. That will depend on how the tender process develops, what resources are required this year and what other arrangements are made.

The morale of the Air Corps has never been higher. If the Deputy drives to Baldonnel, he will see a beautiful new hangar which cost £4 million. When I became Minister for Defence, there was only an old prefab for the helicopter unit, which was a scandal, and I swore we would get rid of that. A fantastic new building is now in its place. Some €6 million has been spent on improving the runway and the Air Corps has a €60 million contract for flying aircraft. The Air Corps has never been better looked after. I would welcome a visit from Deputy Sherlock to meet Air Corps members and to satisfy him about what I have said.