Richard Boyd Barrett
Question:1. Deputy Richard Boyd Barrett asked the Taoiseach if he will report on the work of the economic policy unit of his Department. [48746/22]
Ceisteanna - Questions
Economic Policy
Paul Murphy
Question:2. Deputy Paul Murphy asked the Taoiseach if he will report on the work of the economic policy unit of his Department. [48747/22]
Mary Lou McDonald
Question:3. Deputy Mary Lou McDonald asked the Taoiseach if he will report on the work of the economic policy unit of his Department. [49697/22]
Ivana Bacik
Question:4. Deputy Ivana Bacik asked the Taoiseach if he will report on the work of the economic policy unit of his Department. [49899/22]
Richard Boyd Barrett
Question:5. Deputy Richard Boyd Barrett asked the Taoiseach if he will report on the work of the economic policy unit of his Department. [49963/22]
Paul Murphy
Question:6. Deputy Paul Murphy asked the Taoiseach if he will report on the work of the economic policy unit of his Department. [49966/22]
Peadar Tóibín
Question:7. Deputy Peadar Tóibín asked the Taoiseach if he will report on the work of the economic policy unit of his Department. [50010/22]
Mick Barry
Question:8. Deputy Mick Barry asked the Taoiseach if he will report on the work of the economic policy unit of his Department. [50014/22]
Mick Barry
Question:9. Deputy Mick Barry asked the Taoiseach if he will report on the work of the economic policy unit of his Department. [50364/22]
Gary Gannon
Question:10. Deputy Gary Gannon asked the Taoiseach if he will report on the work of the economic policy unit of his Department. [51652/22]
Brendan Smith
Question:11. Deputy Brendan Smith asked the Taoiseach if he will report on the work of the economic policy unit of his Department. [51688/22]
I propose to take Questions Nos. 1 to 11, inclusive, together.
The economic policy unit is part of the economic division of my Department. The unit supports me, as Taoiseach, in delivering sustainable and balanced economic growth and in advancing the Government's economic priorities. The unit also advises me on a broad range of economic policy areas and issues, and provides me with briefing and speech material on economic and related policy Issues. It supports the delivery of the Government's economic commitments as outlined in the programme for Government, especially where these are cross-cutting issues affecting multiple Departments. In particular, it supports the work of the Cabinet committee on economic recovery and investment, and a number of related senior officials' groups, as well as the Cabinet committee subgroup on insurance reform.
The unit is also responsible for co-ordinating Ireland's participation in the European semester process, the annual cycle of economic and fiscal policy co-ordination among EU member states. This includes preparing each year the national reform programme for submission to the European Commission. The national reform programme provides an overview of economic reforms and policy actions under way in Ireland, including in response to country-specific recommendations received. The unit is also responsible for liaison with the Central Statistics Office, CSO.
I am still trying to get an answer out of the Taoiseach on question relating to the eviction ban. I do not understand why he will not give a straight answer. Will he please tell me if people who have current notices to quit, prior to the legislation he is promising to bring in, will be protected from eviction over the winter?
I said they would.
Just so it is clear.
I will come back to the Deputy.
Will the Taoiseach clarify whether it is now policy, one that we have been asking for for two years, that the Government will purchase homes where families are threatened with being evicted into homelessness? The Government should go further and proactively purchase developer projects where new houses are coming on stream so that we can get more than 10% for social and affordable housing as well as purchase sites, which should never have been sold off by the National Asset Management Agency, NAMA, for the delivery of social and affordable housing, given that the Government's Housing for All targets are failing catastrophically. Will the protections for tenants generally apply to those above the housing income thresholds, which the Government has refused to raise?
It emerged in the Business Post that, in April, the Tánaiste reassured the big tech companies that the Government would continue to support additional data centres being connected to the Irish grid despite the fact that the data centres combined now use more electricity than all of the rural homes in Ireland and are on track to use approximately one third of our electricity by the end of this decade. Is that why the Government has agreed to give €10,000 per month of public money to data centres through the temporary business energy support scheme, TBESS? This means that people who are suffering from energy poverty are going to be paying to subsidise the enormous energy consumption of data centres owned by some of the richest corporations on the planet. Is it not obscene that the data centres, which have driven up electricity prices for ordinary families, are now going to be subsidised by the public by €10,000 per month to continue doing so? Does the Taoiseach not agree that the TBESS needs to be amended so that data centres are not able to get €10,000 per month, paid for by the public?
The Morgan McKinley quarterly employment monitor, which was published last week, found that employers were struggling to fill entry-level graduate positions because young people were emigrating due to the lack of housing and the cost-of-living crisis. A protracted and acute shortage of affordable and social homes continues to have a profound effect on Ireland's economy and society. For many, the social contract has been broken for some time, as the ability to keep secure roofs over their heads slips further out of their reach. A winter ban on evictions into homelessness is needed urgently. We do not have clarity on when the Government will do that. Can the Taoiseach reassure renters that the Minister will publish the legislation in the coming days and not December, as has been reported? A temporary ban on evictions is welcome, but we all agree that it will not in itself resolve the core problem. Social housing building output for this year is falling far short of the Government's target. At the end of June, just 1,765 of the 9,000 new builds for 2022 had been delivered.
Last week, I asked the Taoiseach if the Cabinet would consider increasing income thresholds for social housing eligibility. To be frank, the answer I received was underwhelming. There is an urgent need to increase the thresholds in areas where there are acute affordability issues, such as Dublin, Cork and my county of Limerick. We learned over the weekend that Fine Gael Ministers intend to push for income threshold increases for social housing eligibility. Will the Taoiseach confirm his party's support for such a measure?
Earlier today, I raised with the Taoiseach the plight of owners in the Carrickmines Green development. Returning to that subject, when is it planned to introduce the redress scheme for homeowners? I think the Taoiseach said it would be done before Christmas. Does this mean that we will not see provision being made for such a scheme in the Finance Bill, which is to be introduced on Thursday? He might clarify that. He might also clarify whether the scheme will include provision for retrospective tax relief on works already carried out to address defects. Many apartment owners have already spent large amounts of money on remedying defects that were in their homes through no fault of their own but due to a lack of regulation in the construction industry.
Will the Taoiseach confirm whether the concrete products levy will now be reduced and delayed beyond the date originally envisaged by the Government? Was any consideration given to Labour's alternative proposal of levying a tax on the profits of construction companies rather than on concrete products? This would have been a much more effective way of ensuring that the construction industry would bear some of the cost of remedying defects without seeing the direct cost passed on to those seeking to build their own homes and first-time buyers.
Today, there was a school bus protest in Ballivor, County Meath. I joined students and parents who walked 15 km on winding, foggy country roads to the schools in Trim. They were forced to do so by the broken promise of the Minister for Education, Deputy Foley. Three months ago, she promised with much fanfare that, due to the cost-of-living crisis and the climate crisis, free school bus places would be available to students across the country who needed them. Yet three months later, this has not been resolved. A pattern is emerging of Ministers making promises to loud fanfare about delivering services without doing the necessary work to put the capacity in place, with people still struggling months later as a result. Given the severity of this issue for the families in question, will the Taoiseach get his office to engage with the Department of Education and find a solution for these students and parents in Ballivor?
I have a question on the eviction ban. Let us say that a woman is faced with a choice between not paying some of her family's rent or having her children go cold or hungry this winter. Is she covered by the ban? Can she be evicted? The Tánaiste says that people who do not pay their rent can be evicted. Other Deputies say that people who wilfully do not pay their rent can be evicted. This needs to be clarified and I would like the Taoiseach's view on this question.
Last week, we saw the largest cost-of-living protest so far in the course of this crisis. Approximately 20,000 students walked out of classes last Thursday at 11.11 a.m. to protest the lack of decent student accommodation and the inadequate action being taken by the Government to counter the financial pressures bearing down on them. Will the Taoiseach instruct the Ministers, Deputies Harris and Darragh O'Brien, to meet the students' representatives and consider their demands to make changes or will he decide not to engage in this way and increase the likelihood of a second round before Christmas?
As the Taoiseach is well aware, the economy of Cavan-Monaghan and the wider Border region is heavily dependent on SMEs. These enterprises are concerned about the increasing costs facing businesses. When such enterprises commence, their first export markets are Northern Ireland and Britain, but there are additional costs due to Brexit. There have also been supply chain difficulties in sourcing products for manufacture or addition to manufacturing and for export.
In my recent engagements with SMEs, particularly over the weekend, they were very concerned by the increase in energy costs. They are appealing for very strong Government support to assist them through these particularly difficult months. Many of them fear that their businesses will not be viable if current energy costs remain. In his recent visit to Cavan, the Taoiseach engaged with other public representatives and me. He will recall that we raised SME concerns in this regard and the need for support through these difficult times, particularly with costs.
Last week, I asked the Taoiseach about the possibility of the TBESS or some bespoke scheme for the likes of Frontline Energy, which buys gas for communal heating systems like the one at Carlinn Hall in Dundalk. We would need to ensure that the benefits of such a scheme were passed on to residents, but it is something that we must consider as soon as possible.
I thank the Deputies for raising these issues. First, the strategy that Deputy Boyd Barrett deploys every now and again is to say "Please give me a straight answer", immediately raising the prospect of the answer he got not being a straight answer when it was.
I wonder why.
The Bill has to be published and enacted before any of its measures can take place. Deputy Boyd Barrett knows that. Therefore, the Bill will defer certain notices of termination served on tenants for the period from the day after the date of the passing of the Act. Irrespective of whether a notice to quit is in process, once the legislation comes into play, no one can be evicted the day after that unless he or she has not paid rent and has not fulfilled obligations in respect of good behaviour and stuff like that, for example, not wrecking the place and so on. I do not think anyone can object to that. Those are the measures.
The full details of this will be published in the Bill in the next day or two. The sooner we can get that through the House, the greater the protection we can give to many people who could be in jeopardy of being evicted.
In respect of purchasing homes as a matter of policy, I already made the point today that up to 650 houses are in the process of being purchased or have been purchased-----
Were the tenants in situ?
-----with tenants in situ. The vast majority of tenants were in situ. This was done with a view to ensuring they are not evicted. The Minister, Deputy Darragh O'Brien, has conveyed this policy to the local authorities that they may do this. In every given situation local authorities must have some discretion. The dramatic change since July has seen a significant increase in the activity levels and purchasing of houses where tenants in situ were on the cusp of being evicted. This has happened as a result of the Minister's initiative, and this should be acknowledged.
We were calling for it for a long time and the Government ignored it.
It was not ignored. The Minister has implemented it.
It is not happening in my area.
We are building substantially more social homes through approved social housing bodies and local authorities. We are doing everything we can to increase the number of social homes, primarily through house building, with some through acquisitions and some through leasing in respect of immediate urgency around homelessness, which we want to prevent. The State is the biggest actor in housing now. Go through all the schemes and it will be seen that the Government is bridging the viability gap. This is why Croí Cónaithe schemes are in place for towns and cities and brownfield developments. The State is involved in the first home scheme for first-time buyers, which has a shared equity dimension to it. There is also the help-to-buy scheme, cost rental, etc. These are all new developments and have been brought about by the Minister through the legislation he has put in place. He has been very active during the last two years. He has also brought in many protections for tenants.
I remind the Taoiseach of the time.
Have we time to go through the questions from Deputy Paul Murphy and others, with the agreement of the House? There are two or three others.
Yes, the Deputies deserve answers.
On data centres and TBESS, we must have a general scheme that catches as many people as we possibly can because we do not want to lose jobs.
There are no jobs in data centres.
On another day, we can debate whether we think we should get rid of all data centres or if there is a function or a role for data centres in a digitalised economy. I would like and appreciate hearing the Deputy's perspective on that. Nevertheless, TBESS is an emergency scheme being brought in as a temporary state aid framework under the auspices of the EU to ensure companies do not go to the wall and we can protect jobs. That is the motivation behind it.
Deputy Quinlivan raised the matter of the income thresholds review. It is under way and the Minister has indicated he will act on that review once he gets it.
As I said to Deputy Bacik, it will be before the end of the year before the scheme itself would be designed. It is unlikely, therefore, that it will be in the Finance Bill, although we have to go through Committee and Report Stages and amendments can be made to it. It is a stand-alone scheme for apartment defects and is not necessarily dependent on the Finance Bill.
To respond to Deputy Tóibín, the Minister for Education has dramatically reduced costs for thousands of people through the initiative she took on free school transport. This is €650 per family that she saved and an extra 21,000 people, above the 100,000, availed of the scheme. The increased demand then, unfortunately, led to some people not being able to avail of it. The option would have been not to do anything but, in fairness, this initiative has had a major beneficial impact on thousands of families. The Minister is working flat out with CIÉ and others to ensure we can get everybody covered and get more buses in place to cover anybody who has not so far been covered by the concessionary scheme.
Deputy Barry also raised the eviction ban and I have given the answer to that in terms of who is covered. Deputy Brendan Smith-----
The Taoiseach has not answered my question.
I have.
The Taoiseach has not.
I said that where there is systemic non-payment of rent, people can still be evicted. In situations where people are in difficulty or trouble, a whole range of measures is in place to intervene to prevent people from being evicted, in terms of additional needs-----
That woman will not be evicted.
I do not know the detail of the individual case the Deputy has brought to my attention.
Exceptional needs.
There are other mechanisms that can be used as well.
The Taoiseach needs to clarify that, Chair.
To respond to Deputy Brendan Smith, the economy is dependent on SMEs. The Deputy is correct in saying that many companies depend on the Northern Ireland or British market in terms of initial exports of goods leaving Ireland and going into the UK market. This is why it is important to us that the UK economy is strong. If the UK's economy is strong, Ireland's economy is strong. Energy costs are significant and that is why we have brought in the TBESS. We have also brought in a range of other guaranteed loan schemes to try to help, right down to the micro company level, and to see if we can ensure that we keep companies operating. We will keep the situation under review because the nature of the costs is significant and severe. Regarding the TBESS and how it applies in the case of Dundalk, I ask the Deputy to send in the details in this regard. I do not know whether he has spoken to the Minister, Deputy Eamon Ryan, about this issue, but he is looking at similar interventions in respect of other anomalies that have arisen. I think he will be anxious to help in any genuine situation like that.
I appreciate that.
Social Dialogue
Mary Lou McDonald
Question:12. Deputy Mary Lou McDonald asked the Taoiseach if he will report on the work of the social dialogue co-ordination unit in his Department. [48039/22]
Ivana Bacik
Question:13. Deputy Ivana Bacik asked the Taoiseach if he will report on the work of the social dialogue co-ordination unit of his Department. [49904/22]
Richard Boyd Barrett
Question:14. Deputy Richard Boyd Barrett asked the Taoiseach if he will report on the work of the social dialogue unit of his Department. [50102/22]
Paul Murphy
Question:15. Deputy Paul Murphy asked the Taoiseach if he will report on the work of the social dialogue unit of his Department. [50105/22]
Mick Barry
Question:16. Deputy Mick Barry asked the Taoiseach if he will report on the work of the social dialogue co-ordination unit in his Department. [50365/22]
Gary Gannon
Question:17. Deputy Gary Gannon asked the Taoiseach if he will report on the work of the social dialogue co-ordination unit in his Department. [51653/22]
I propose to take Questions Nos. 12 to 17, inclusive, together.
The social dialogue unit co-ordinates and supports the Government’s overall approach to social dialogue through a variety of mechanisms, including the Labour Employer Economic Forum, LEEF, which engages with representatives of employers and trade unions on economic and employment issues insofar as they affect the labour market and which are of mutual concern. The most recent plenary meeting, which I chaired, took place on 7 September. This was an opportunity to look at current challenges, in particular in the areas of energy and the cost of living. Under the auspices of LEEF, there has been significant progress on issues such as the introduction of statutory sick pay, workplace safety during Covid-19 and the report of the high-level review of collective bargaining.
The social dialogue unit also supports my engagements with representatives from the environmental pillar, the community and voluntary pillar and the farming and agriculture pillar. This includes meetings I held in recent weeks with the community and voluntary pillar and the environmental pillar to discuss how social dialogue can be further strengthened, as well as issues of concern to the sectors. Social dialogue and engagement between Government, the trade unions and other representative groups also takes place through structures like the national economic dialogue, the National Economic and Social Council, the national dialogue on climate action, the National Competitiveness and Productivity Council, and through many sectoral groups and with Ministers and Departments directly. Another model for broad-based social dialogue are citizens' assemblies, including the current assemblies on biodiversity loss and on a directly-elected mayor for Dublin. Next month will also see the first civic forum which will support dialogue between the community and voluntary sector and local and central government. The unit will continue to support me and the Government as we look forward to enhanced social dialogue, given the many challenges we face as a country in the period ahead.
In recent weeks, the Joint Committee on Enterprise, Trade and Employment met representatives from a number of trade unions and others to discuss the recent minimum wage increase and the Low Pay Commission's recommendations on a living wage. As representatives of the Irish Congress of trade Unions, ICTU, pointed out at the joint committee last week, while much is made of Ireland having one of the highest minimum wage rates in the EU, when the purchasing power of the minimum wage workers is considered this drops the minimum wage rate from second to seventh place among our EU peers. Dr. Bambrick from ICTU also noted that the increases in the minimum wage have not kept pace with wage growth in the wider economy in the last two decades. The current hourly rate is now just 52% of median earnings, delivering salaries below the 60% poverty line and the 66% official low pay threshold.
When first introduced, the minimum wage was approximately equivalent to two thirds of the median hourly wage. Surely the Taoiseach accepts that this straw man proposal falls far short of delivering what is an appropriate income for workers in a modern 21st-century economy. It is worth noting that in preparation for the EU directive on adequate minimum wages, Germany has already increased its minimum wage to 60% of median income. As there is no substantive evidence that its introduction will impact on employment and statutory protections are already in place for employers, will the Taoiseach explain why he continues to take such a regressive approach to the introduction of a living wage?
Last week, the Dáil debated the Work Life Balance and Miscellaneous Provisions Bill 2022. It is welcome that it will be amended to provide for domestic violence leave, but the Labour Party is asking that it also be amended to provide for reproductive health-related leave. We introduced a Bill in the Seanad last year which would provide for paid leave of up to 20 days for women who suffer an early miscarriage and for up to ten days for those employees who need time off work to access treatments such as IVF. The Government did not oppose our Bill, but we want to see some urgency in the implementation of its measures. We are launching a campaign today calling on the Government to amend its Work Life Balance and Miscellaneous Provisions Bill 2022 to include our proposals, which would a have a huge impact for so many women and men across Ireland.
We have been contacted every week, by women in particular, asking when our Bill might become law and seeking to achieve more compassionate workplaces. I should give credit to Councillor Alison Gilliland, who led on this campaign through the INTO and the Teachers Union of Ireland, TUI. The TUI has done research showing how necessary it is to have this sort of provision whereby employees would have access to paid leave when they suffer an early miscarriage or need limited time off work to access reproductive health treatments like IVF.
On the question of people who are paying multiple tariffs on gas and energy and are on district heating systems compared with those who are being massively ripped off on conventional contracts with energy companies, what will the Government do? For example, I met tenants from the new and much-trumpeted cost-rental development on Enniskerry Road. They were delighted to get cost-rental apartments, only to be shocked to discover that they are paying a tariff that is about four times what everybody else is paying and, as we know, everybody else is being ripped off on energy prices. People are looking at bills of €600 that are unpayable and they are also on pay-as-you-go contracts. This is a real concern for them. What will the Government do to make sure that people who are on district heating systems will not be paying tariffs that are multiples of the rip-off prices everybody else is already paying?
The Minister for the Environment, Climate and Communications, Deputy Eamon Ryan, said yesterday that people granted refugee status who are still living in direct provision accommodation should have to pay rent. I am sure the Taoiseach has visited direct provision centres and I am sure he will agree that we are not talking about luxury penthouse suites, detached houses, nice apartments or anything like that. We are talking about cramped and shared rooms with limited and often horrifying food supplies. These are very difficult living conditions for people. Around 40 people have been living for over ten weeks in a tent in Tralee, with the wind shaking the tent around them as they try to sleep. There is a total of around 300 people in direct provision living in tents as we speak. We regularly hear the horror stories of direct provision centres run by large corporations like Aramark that squeeze all the profit they can out of people seeking asylum. It seems utterly monstrous that the Government would try to imitate those companies and squeeze people who have nowhere left to turn during this cost-of-living and housing crisis by threatening them with homelessness if they do not cough up the money. I ask the Taoiseach to pledge that nobody in direct provision or any emergency homeless accommodation should have to pay to live in such deplorable conditions.
About 25 minutes ago, the Taoiseach told Deputy O'Reilly that the Government was anxious to defend the employment regulation order in the security industry. This ERO would have ensured a minimum rate of pay for security workers of a mere €12.50 per hour but there is an injunction out against it. Is the Taoiseach aware that the Department of Transport recently gave the contract for security work at its head office in Dublin to the company that took out that injunction? Does he believe that a company that went to such extraordinary lengths to maintain poverty pay in the security industry is deserving of contracts? Will he ask the Minister to ask this company to drop this injunction and pay its workers, at the very least, the minimum rate ordered by the courts and make very clear to it that the contract will not be renewed unless there is action taken on these issues?
We are on the precipice of collapse in childcare and the early childhood care and education, ECCE, sector. I cannot overstate the severity and seriousness of this problem. It is not happening by accident. There were 77 net closures in 2019, 70 net closures in 2020, 62 net closures in 2021 and in this year so far there have been 80 net closures. It is estimated there will be 226 net closures next year. The Government is closing these businesses down, especially with the new core funding model. I have said this over and over to the Minister for Children, Equality, Disability, Integration and Youth, Deputy O'Gorman, and he seems completely oblivious to what is happening. The failure to provide enough funds for these businesses to cope is forcing them to close, mainly in rural areas. We are doing damage to businesses and deleting options for parents in childcare in their areas. In November, there will be rolling strikes in childcare and ECCE services across the State. These protests will impact on parents and children. Will the Taoiseach step in and make sure these businesses have enough to survive?
I thank the Taoiseach and I will pass on the information provided. As has been said, we need a bespoke solution in the short term for communal or district heating systems, particularly those that are powered by gas, which will not work in the long term. The solution is to change to biomass or geothermal energy and that has to be facilitated.
A company in County Louth contacted me pointing out that ESB Networks had passed on an increase to all electricity providers. For this company, which is already facing huge increases, the increase is an extra €22,239 per year on top of what it is already paying. This issue needs to be addressed.
Deputy Quinlivan asked about the minimum wage. We have an independent Low Pay Commission that deals with the minimum wage. That was agreed in the House.
I was talking about the living wage, which is different and would enable workers to have a decent standard-----
The Deputy talked about the minimum wage as well.
Yes, but my question was on the living wage.
The Deputy talked about the minimum wage as well.
Yes, but-----
I want to make the point that the minimum wage is determined by an independent commission, which also then-----
The Government can accept that recommendation or not accept it.
I know but the value of the independent-----
The question was on the living wage.
The reason we set up an independent commission was to avoid, every single year, having partisan perspectives on it. We wanted it professionally done and well researched with a balance of considerations taken into account. That commission also assisted the Tánaiste and did some work on a living wage. The Tánaiste has published the details of that and has given a timeline for us to achieve a living wage by 2025. It is a good initiative and it represents substantial and significant progress on where we were. It is reasonable and balanced and it is subject to review over the coming years on an ongoing basis.
On Deputy Bacik's point, I will speak to the Minister about where that legislation is. I have sympathy with what the Deputy is saying about early miscarriage and the need for some parental or paid leave. I will come back to her on where that is in terms of the legislation and IVF treatments.
Deputy Boyd Barrett raised the issue of multiple tariffs on domestic heating and referenced Enniskerry Road and the cost-rental scheme there. That is a very good scheme, which the Minister deserves credit for introducing and giving a bit of momentum to. We hope we will see far more cost-rental housing. I will talk to the Minister on the issue of tariffs. I do not have the details so I ask the Deputy to submit them to us. On a broader basis, domestic heating and district heating systems need to be examined in the context of the energy crisis and what supports we can give to protect tenants, in particular, from exorbitant energy costs.
Deputy Paul Murphy raised direct provision centres and the comments by the Minister, Deputy Eamon Ryan, yesterday. Where someone is fully employed, is a citizen of the State, may have been in a position for two or three years to leave direct provision but has chosen not to do so and is on a good salary, as with anyone in social housing or any rental situation, some contribution should be made. It does not have to be a market rent and no one is suggesting that but making a contribution, given the enormity of the challenges the State is facing, is not unreasonable.
Those proposals have not yet come before the Government. There will be further meetings in respect of all of these issues so that we have equity across the board in the treatment of people in different contexts and different situations. Any contribution would have to take into account the conditions that people are living in. There are now substantial numbers of people who have been in a position to leave direct provision for quite some time but have chosen not to do so. This was before the current crisis and it was prior to last year.
There is no housing.
More than two years ago, there were up to 1,000 people who were in direct provision and could have left but decided to stay.
That is because they have no homes.
The number is probably higher now. I am speaking in particular about people in employment.
Deputy Barry spoke about an employment regulation order. The Government has to act within the law. People are entitled to take out an injunction, whether or not we agree with them. In this case we do not agree with them but they are still entitled to take out an injunction. We do not say people will not get a contract if they take out an injunction against the State. That would be almost tantamount to the State entering into an abusive relationship with the people to whom it issues contracts.
These are people who are trying to maintain poverty pay.
That would be a real slippery slope if it were to be applied in other situations and people could only get a contract from the State if they had to do what the State tells them in other areas.
It involves public procurement.
That might be the authoritarian way of the-----
That is a decent public procurement process.
That is the kind of stuff the Kremlin gets involved in and other regimes.
It is poverty pay.
I would not accuse the Deputy of being a fan of Stalin but that was the old collectivisation stuff of people doing as they were told. I do not agree with people taking out injunctions against the order in any event.
Challenge the injunction.
We do not support the injunction. We are against it.
You have not challenged it.
To respond to Deputy Tóibín, huge funding has gone into childcare in the past two years. The idea it is on the precipice of collapse given the huge funding going in does not add up. There may be issues between providers and the State.
It is not viable for the small businesses.
I will raise the matter with the Minister, Deputy O'Gorman, and ask him to engage with Deputy Tóibín.
To respond to Deputy Ó Murchú, we agree on bespoke models in respect of domestic heating. We are keeping the wider issue of supports for businesses and the protection of jobs under review.
I asked a question about ESB Networks.
I did not get that question.
We will not put it again.
I did not hear it. I apologise.
Cabinet Committees
Mary Lou McDonald
Question:18. Deputy Mary Lou McDonald asked the Taoiseach when the Cabinet committee on Brexit and Northern Ireland will next meet. [45437/22]
Neale Richmond
Question:19. Deputy Neale Richmond asked the Taoiseach when the Cabinet committee on Brexit will next meet. [49696/22]
Seán Haughey
Question:20. Deputy Seán Haughey asked the Taoiseach when the Cabinet committee on Brexit and Northern Ireland will next meet. [49949/22]
Brendan Smith
Question:21. Deputy Brendan Smith asked the Taoiseach when the Cabinet committee on Brexit and Northern Ireland will next meet. [49952/22]
Ivana Bacik
Question:22. Deputy Ivana Bacik asked the Taoiseach when the Cabinet committee on Brexit and Northern Ireland will next meet. [49903/22]
Peadar Tóibín
Question:23. Deputy Peadar Tóibín asked the Taoiseach when the Cabinet committee on Brexit and Northern Ireland will next meet. [51564/22]
Gary Gannon
Question:24. Deputy Gary Gannon asked the Taoiseach when the Cabinet committee on Brexit and Northern Ireland will next meet. [51654/22]
Mick Barry
Question:25. Deputy Mick Barry asked the Taoiseach when the Cabinet committee on Brexit and Northern Ireland will next meet. [51691/22]
I propose to take Questions Nos. 18 to 25 together.
The Cabinet committee on Brexit and Northern Ireland operates in accordance with established guidelines for Cabinet committees and, where appropriate, substantive issues are referred to Government for discussion and approval.
The Cabinet committee oversees implementation of relevant programme for Government commitments in the area of Brexit and Northern Ireland and ongoing relevant developments. The committee was formally established by the Government on 6 July 2020 and had its first meeting on 29 October 2020. The Cabinet committee last met on 27 June 2022. A date for the next meeting remains under review.
In addition to meetings of the Cabinet committee on Brexit and Northern Ireland, relevant matters are also discussed at meetings of the full Cabinet. Further, yesterday I travelled to Belfast for a programme of engagement with the leaders of the five main political parties in Northern Ireland in advance of the 28 October deadline for the nomination of the First and deputy First Minister and the formation of the Executive. I had separate discussions with the deputy leader of Sinn Féin, Michelle O'Neill, the leader of the DUP, Jeffrey Donaldson, the leader of the Alliance Party, Naomi Long, the leader of the UUP, Doug Beattie, and the leader of the SDLP, Colum Eastwood. I also met the community relations in schools initiative and had an invigorating, stimulating and enjoyable session with it. This group deals with building relationships at the interface, from preschool children and their parents right up to second level. The work it does was quite a revelation.
The resounding message from the Taoiseach following his trip to Belfast and his meetings with the North's political leaders yesterday was that Stormont must be restored. This echoes the call made by the majority of parties in the North, including mine. The MLAs simply want to get back to work. People in the North need their Ministers around the table working together to tackle the cost-of-living crisis in a meaningful way.
As Michelle O'Neill outlined yesterday, we need to see an agreed way forward with the framework of the protocol and we need to find ways to make it work. This work can be done in parallel with restored institutions that honour the election results from earlier. The British and Irish Governments also have a responsibility to work together in prioritising the restoration of power-sharing and the political institutions of the Good Friday Agreement. What progress has been made by the Taoiseach and his officials in this regard with the British Government?
Recently in the Dáil, the Taoiseach said with regard to negotiations between the EU and UK on the implementation of the Northern Ireland protocol that the parties must now be given the space to do their work. The Minister for Foreign Affairs more or less said the same thing during Question Time earlier this month and suggested that the less said publicly on these matters in the Dáil at this time, the better.
The Taoiseach met the parties in Northern Ireland yesterday, as he said. He stated afterwards that restoring Stormont is vital. He is reported as describing these meetings as useful and constructive. As we know, the DUP will not agree to the restoration of the Northern Ireland Executive until a comprehensive deal on the protocol is agreed. Will the Taoiseach update the House on his talks yesterday and on the prospect of restoring the power-sharing Executive, having regard to the looming 28 October deadline?
I welcome the Taoiseach's visit and meetings with the political party representatives in Stormont yesterday. It is irresponsible that we do not have a fully functional assembly and Executive in Northern Ireland. Other Members have referred to the cost of living and the huge pressures on families and businesses in practically all sectors of society. The last thing we need is ongoing difficulty with the protocol. The European Union to its credit has shown flexibility. The Commissioner responsible for these areas of negotiations and talks has indicated that the proposals the European Union put to the British Government last October would meaningfully deal with many of the issues of concern to people in Northern Ireland. When I speak to my neighbours north of the Border and people in my constituency who trade with Northern Ireland they do not want obstacles put in the way of trade. They want free movement to continue. Whatever difficulties there are, they want them sorted out. They want the political institutions fully working on behalf of the people who elected Members to the Northern Ireland Assembly. They want an Executive working on behalf of all the people of Northern Ireland.
It is welcome to hear the Taoiseach had constructive meetings yesterday. At the recent Ireland's Future event, in which I was glad to participate, concern was expressed by all present about the vacuum in Northern Irish politics with the continued failure of restoration of the institutions of the Executive and the assembly and the looming deadline of 28 October set by the British Government. Will the Taoiseach update the House further on whether the Irish Government has taken a position on this looming deadline? Does the fact of the deadline, if an election were to proceed after 28 October, amount to granting the DUP a veto over the assembly on the issue of the protocol? Does conflating restoration of the assembly with resolving the issues with the protocol amount to rewarding those who have been holding the political system in Northern Ireland hostage? Do the Taoiseach and Government have concerns that this will be the case if an election is called because nothing can be done to resolve the deadlock between now and the imminent deadline of 28 October?
It has been announced today that elections will take place on 15 December in the North of Ireland if the October deadline is not met. Ten days before Christmas, the people of the North will be going to the polls again.
Who announced that?
It was announced today by the electoral commission in the North of Ireland I understand. If the deadline is not met in October, this will be the election day. This is what I understand has been announced.
It has not been announced by the British Government.
This is the information that has come through from the electoral commission. I am open to correction if it is not the case. The election will be a sham if we do not have reform of the processes by which the elections and the assembly function.
If the DUP comes back and blocks the Executive from running again, we will be in the same stalemate we are in today, which is an expensive and costly stalemate. Right now, people in the North of Ireland are suffering significantly from the biggest cost-of-living crisis they have ever experienced, and they are getting no help from Stormont. MLAs are getting millions of euros in salary and not doing their job for the people. Aontú welcomes that the Taoiseach, during previous questions, said he would be supportive of reform of the institutions sometime in the future. We also welcome that the Alliance Party has now agreed with our view that there needs to be reform of it, but will the Taoiseach fast-track reform of the institutions so the DUP cannot hold us to ransom anymore?
I want to voice solidarity with Royal Mail postal workers in Northern Ireland and in Britain. Their employer has announced 10,000 redundancies but plans to recruit new staff at 20% below the current rate, as well as plans to sell off the profitable parcel service. Royal Mail made a £758 million profit last year, paying out more than half of this to shareholders. The workers who are striking are fighting not just for decent pay and condition, but to defend the service. I see they have set up a strike fund, to which I intend to donate. I hope many sections of the labour movement here will likewise. All of this is downstream of the Tory Government's decision to privatise the postal service over the last decade. The Taoiseach's Government is aping Tory privatisation policy in the banking sector, bus services and local authority services. The Taoiseach may shake his head but it is a fact. Will he recognise this is not just bad news for workers but for services, and will he steer clear of such disastrous policies in future?
Two weeks ago, in response to me, the Taoiseach denied there is a hard border on this island for many non-EU migrants. I would like him to explain this. I do not understand how he does not accept that for many people from non-EU countries, such as those who are married to UK or Irish nationals, refugees with leave to remain or indefinite leave to remain, asylum seekers and migrant workers, there is a hard border. They are not able to cross the North-South Border to access education or services, to meet loved ones or to participate in cross-Border sporting activities. For many people there is a hard border on this island.
In the same response, the Taoiseach spoke about having met with the North West Migrants Forum. They dispute that and say that some of their activists had a brief discussion with him on 1 April 2022 when he committed to meet with them. Will he agree to meet with them and to schedule the meeting with the North West Migrants Forum?
Finally, in the same response, the Taoiseach stated, "Deeper analysis is required and we will undertake that." This was in relation to the many allegations of racial profiling at the Border. What is the plan to conduct such deeper analysis?
The British Government, as we have all seen lately, is dealing with the outworkings of Brexit and other issues and has difficulties. The mood music has improved but it must be made clear that the protocol is the only show in town. While all streamlining is welcome, we need to make sure the British Government passes that message onto political unionism. The only other show in town is making sure the institutions and the Executive are up and running and actually delivering for people.
On the issue raised by Deputy Quinlivan, of course the British and Irish Governments are key in underpinning the Good Friday Agreement. The Minister for Foreign Affairs has been working with the new Secretary of State and engaging with the political parties on this.
I met with political parties yesterday and I have met with the British Prime Minister about the restoration of the institutions. She was clear that there would be an election in line with the legislation as part of existing agreements. The political parties, including the DUP, know that is the position of the British Government.
I say this is in response to all Deputies: Deputy Haughey asked about an update on yesterday's talks, and I made it clear during those talks that four parties want to go back into the Executive and the DUP says it wants the protocol issue resolved prior to going back. I made the point that they should go back in. The people have voted and their mandate should be respected and the institutions should be upheld. People should be able to attend the Parliament, which is the normal thing that happens after an election. People go to the Parliament and form a government or, in this case, an executive. That is what should happen and I pressed that.
Deputy Tóibín raised the matter of subsequent reform. I do not think the Alliance Party would appreciate the Deputy taking credit for its members coming to the view that there should be reform.
We have been articulating this for the past two years.
The Alliance Party have been on this topic for about ten years, if not more.
Aontú was the first party to articulate it.
To be fair to the Alliance Party members, they are right in terms of how they are being treated in the new situation in which they have 17 seats. It is a demonstration that the existing structures do not work, but that said, the existing structures are there under the electoral framework for which people voted. Therefore, the results must be vindicated. I do not think we can do reform before this Executive is formed. It should be formed under the existing framework and that would be the fair thing to do. In the fullness of time, over the next five years, if people want to examine that - they should in my view - it should be examined for the next election.
But what if the next election is on 15 December?
There are serious issues here in that people voted in a certain way and you cannot change the will of the people. The people have voted and their votes should be reflected in the institutions. I would be very serious about that. What the Deputy is suggesting could have real implications that could be negative. Reforming systems is done best through proper engagement. The Deputy referred to a date that is not in anyone's-----
The electoral commission has written to political parties.
The Deputy was surmising through the electoral commission but he cannot make a declaration that the election will take place on 15 December. That may have been unintentional on his part but it might give the wrong impression to people.
Deputy Brendan Smith made an important point and he was correct. All parties still believe in access to the Single Market, which is an important point. No one is saying to me that we want to get rid of or end access to the Single Market, because access to it is working for manufacturing, the food industry and other sectors in Northern Ireland. In terms of consumer-facing goods, goods coming from the UK into supermarkets and not going anywhere else, there are issues that the European Commission is anxious to resolve with the British Government. Technical talks have begun and we should let those talks take their course.
Deputy Bacik again raised the issue of the election, which I have answered in the sense that this is all done by agreement. It was intended to prevent the stop-start nature of the Executive, because too often it was being pulled down. There was a period when Sinn Féin left for two or three years due to the heating issue. Going way back to my time as Minister for Foreign Affairs, the Executive was down for a year. We had discussions on devolution of justice and we were told that this would never happen again. The new agreement included mechanisms that would deter this and, lo and behold, we are back to where we were. All political parties should have a long-term commitment to the institutions, irrespective of what happens, to get issues resolved around the table. That is what should happen.
Deputy Barry raised the issue of Royal Mail workers. I understand where he is coming from in his support of workers, but to compare the situation in Ireland with Tory policy-making makes no sense. We have a national transport system. Our railways are nationalised. If one were to try to nationalise British rail, it would be considered far left.
Privatising the buses.
We have a State transport company.
A lower top tax rate.
I was honoured to be invited last week to address the National Bus and Rail Union annual conference, given that my father was a founding member of the union.
Did you listen to them opposing your privatisations?
Ireland has a different attitude to this. We have not nationalised water. Sorry - we have not privatised water.
You wanted to.
We have nationalised water, unlike the UK. We are in a far different situation here. I would argue the propaganda sound bite does not work in the comparison Deputy Barry made.
I happen to agree with some of what Deputy Ó Murchú said. We can modify and make changes.
Over time, people are becoming more comfortable with some aspects of how we monitor trade. If the EU gets the data, there is a lot more we can do to ease people's concerns. The bottom line is to get into talks. If we can get a talks process going between the European Union and the United Kingdom, these issues can be resolved. People have raised legitimate issues. All of the other parties accept there are issues to be raised around the protocol. Their attitude is, correctly, that it should go to the members of the Assembly while resolving them. The DUP has a different view. In my view, these matters can be resolved and we should work to resolve them.
I asked about migrants.
When I said "I met", I think we getting too literal about this. I met the people concerned in Derry. It was not a meeting around a table. We discussed the matter. I am not into nitpicking about the issues, nor should the Deputy be. Rather, we should approach these things in good faith and not try to create advantage.
The Taoiseach will meet them.
Subject to my schedule. My officials have met them. We are anxious to properly analyse these issues. When I said there should be no hard border, there is no one stopping anyone on the Border and saying they cannot come in because they are a migrant. That is a hard border.
Legally, people cannot cross it.
A hard border is someone stopping people, as is happening in many borders around Europe. That is the point I was making in responding to the Deputy.