Dáil Éireann debate -
Tuesday, 3 Oct 2023

Vol. 1043 No. 2

School Transport 2023-2024: Statements

Minister for Education (Deputy Norma Foley)

I thank the Leas-Cheann Comhairle for the opportunity to make a statement to update the House on school transport provision for the current school year. Coming from a rural background, I know, understand, and appreciate the importance of school transport to parents and families around the country. I know there are lot of moms, dads, and guardians relying on the scheme to bring their children to and from school.

To give a sense of the scale of the scheme, in the 2022-23 school year, more than 154,000 young people, including more than 18,000 children with special educational needs, SEN, were transported on a daily basis to primary and post-primary schools throughout the country. The total cost of the scheme in 2022 was €338.9 million. This includes direct transport services, and grant payments. It also includes funding to schools for the employment of escorts to accompany children with special educational needs whose care and safety needs require this particular type of support.

The scheme is managed by Bus Éireann on behalf of the Department of Education. For the 2023-24 school year, reduced charges of €50 per pupil at primary level and €75 per student at post-primary level apply, with a cap per family of €125. This means that ticket holders will save up to €50 at primary and €275 at post-primary, with an overall reduction in the family maximum contribution of €525 compared to the fees for the 2021-22 school year.

There has been an overall increase in both applications and tickets issued for the 2023-24 school year in comparison to the 2022-23 school year. With regard to SEN transport services, to date, more than 5,000 new applications have been received for SEN transport for the 2023-24 school year, with 1,400 of these being received since July alone. This compares to 3,670 new applications received at this time last year. To date, transport has been provided for more than 3,000 new applicants for the 2023-24 school year, with transport being provided for in excess of 19,000 pupils in the current school year. The Department continues to receive applications all year round for the SEN transport service.

As with most, if not all, Government schemes, there are criteria governing the operation of the scheme. Pupils at primary level are eligible where they live not less than 3.2 km from and are attending their nearest primary school. At post-primary level, students who live not less than 4.8 km from and are attending their nearest post-primary school or education centre are deemed eligible. Any pupils or students who do not meet these criteria are deemed not eligible, or otherwise known as concessionary applicants, and are allocated a ticket based on the availability of a seat when all eligible children have been catered for.

In addition, pending completion of the outcome of the full review of the school transport scheme, temporary alleviation measures at post-primary level will be continued for the current school year. Under these measures, which were initially introduced in 2019, transport will be provided where it is in operation and where capacity exists for concessionary post-primary pupils who are eligible for transport to their nearest school and are attending their second nearest school and who applied and paid on time.

I now want to address specific issues that have arisen this year where a small number of contractors handed back contracts at the last minute or continue to do so. Consequently, there are a small number of families who have been issued with tickets in good faith and who do not yet have transport in place. These families are being regularly updated by Bus Éireann as to the current status of their service. Bus Éireann has confirmed that no service has been cancelled but, as I said, there are particular issues with resource availability in terms of drivers or contractors, a number of contractors continuing to hand back contracts or zero bids for contracts in certain areas. This is against a backdrop of significant shortages of drivers in the labour market overall and competing demands for drivers to deliver additional public transport initiatives such as Connecting Ireland, and Bus Connects and Local Link services.

Bus Éireann is continuing to prioritise sourcing vehicles and drivers. While I understand the significant difficulty that even a single disruption to service can cause for families, I note that Bus Éireann has confirmed that services are in operation for 99% of pupils on a daily basis. I reiterate that where the service is not operating for a single parent or guardian and children, I understand the difficulties that can cause. Bus Éireann continues to engage directly with families affected with regular communications updating them on the position with their transport service.

The Department has established an exceptional no service interim grant to assist with the cost of the private transport arrangements families may have to put in place until their service begins. The Department has contacted families directly regarding this payment.

In regard to transport for children with special educational needs, the Department and Bus Éireann are very conscious of the challenges faced by parents awaiting transport for students with special educational needs. Families of children who are eligible for these services but who experience a delay with accessing them may, therefore, apply for the special transport grant. This is a once off payment, paid retrospectively to families, to assist with the cost of the private transport arrangements the family had to put in place until services are finalised.

Where a new service is sanctioned, this means a procurement or vetting process is required while, in many instances, the school is also sanctioned to employ a transport escort and this necessarily takes time to put in place. It is necessary that these measures are put in place. By accepting applications year-round, the Department can ensure that children with special educational needs receive the transport they require. To ensure the efficient delivery of services for children on special educations needs school transport, Bus Éireann assesses each application to assess the options available. Where children can be facilitated on an existing service, applications are processed immediately and arrangements put in place with families involved.

The Department is engaging with the NTA on areas where transport is not yet in place. The authority has also indicated there are challenges sourcing contractors and drivers for Local Link services, for example. Bus Éireann has put in place a dedicated customer care call centre to assist families specifically with school transport queries during the busy summer period. Families that have queries can contact the call centre between 9 a.m. and 5 p.m. Monday to Thursday, with extended opening hours currently on Friday when the helpline stays open until 8 p.m. Families can also contact Bus Éireann by submitting a query via a link on its website. These queries are monitored and responded to on a daily basis.

As Members will all be aware, a review of the school transport scheme is nearing completion. The review is being conducted with a view to examining the current scheme, its broader effectiveness and sustainability and to ensure that it serves students and their families adequately. This review is much-awaited, and I know that many are eager to hear its outcome. I too am eager to advance the review, because I recognise that improvements need to be made to the scheme and I know the importance of doing so. I expect to be in a position shortly to bring the review to Government, which will be the first step and, further to Government approval, the review will be published.

The school transport scheme has been in operation for more than 55 years, since its establishment in 1967, and this review is one of the most extensive investigations that has been carried out into the scheme since its inception. Fundamentally, I want to ensure that the school transport scheme is updated to reflect the modern realities facing it and that it can continue to benefit children and families for decades to come. Among other elements, the review has analysed the evolution of the objectives of the scheme; the rationale for the scheme with reference to the public spending code; how the scheme fits with school planning policy; how the scheme fits with broader Government policy and programme for Government commitments; the value for money of the scheme to the Exchequer and parents and guardians; transport schemes in other jurisdictions and the learnings that can be gleaned from best practice and experiences from those jurisdictions; the stakeholder engagement process, where the opinions, views and experiences of those who are experts in the field are shared; and the fiscal sustainability of the scheme.

As part of the review, between February 2021 and June 2023, a total of 16 meetings were held with the technical working group and eight meetings were held with the steering group. Towards the end of phases 2 and 3 of the review, a series of meetings were also held with individual members of the technical working group and the steering group.

There has been extensive consultation with parents, students, providers and other key stakeholders as part of this engagement and we consulted with families who use the scheme and would like to use the scheme, and also with young people with special educational needs and mainstream students. It is very important that we have engaged with those who are not currently using the scheme but would like to use it. As I outlined, we heard from a broad range of people, including parents, guardians, young people, transport providers and other key stakeholders. The results from the stakeholder engagement with parents and children illustrated the importance of school transport to families, with most indicating it is a safe and reliable service that helps families to live and work, in particular in rural Ireland. Another important finding of the stakeholder engagement process was that the special educational needs transport scheme supports many young people in attending specialist school placements which they otherwise may not be able to attend.

An analysis of school transport schemes in other jurisdictions was also conducted as part of this stakeholder engagement and review process, including the EU, UK, US and Australia. A wide breadth of expertise was leaned upon and gleaned during the review. This research and analysis outlined the evidence in terms of the need for a school transport service in an Irish context compared to some comparative countries, as well as an analysis of the costs to users of school transport services in some other jurisdictions.

The Department developed a strategy for collaboration and communication with stakeholders. Overall, there were five separate stakeholder groups. Letters were issued to a number of stakeholders, including school management bodies, parent representative organisations, special education interest groups, EU member states and school principals, to seek their views on the school transport scheme. Parents, guardians and post primary students were invited to complete online surveys, more than 10,000 of which were done.

A series of bilateral engagements were completed with relevant Departments, agencies, bodies and organisations to discuss the review and seek views. Meetings have been held with the Department of Environment, Climate and Communications, Transport, Children, Equality, Disability, Integration and Youth, Rural and Community Development and Public Expenditure, National Development Plan Delivery and Reform, NTA, Ombudsman for Children, National Council for Special Education, school transport appeals board, National Council for Special Education, TUSLA, Bus Éireann and the Road Safety Authority.

As I said, more than 10,000 online surveys were completed by parents and students, which was phenomenal engagement, and more than 245 additional submissions were received from other stakeholders such as relevant Departments, interest groups and school principals. In analysing the information gathered in the survey and the submissions, it is clear that school transport is vital for families.

In undertaking this review, a number of member states were invited to complete a survey to assist with the analysis of transport schemes in other jurisdictions. A total of 12 complete or partially complete surveys were returned. In addition, a meeting was held with the Department of Education in Northern Ireland to discuss how the school transport scheme operates in that jurisdiction.

Ultimately, the review will make a series of recommendations on the future operations of the scheme. Additional staffing personnel have been put in place to facilitate this. The timeframe for completion of the review was first challenged by the onset of the Covid-19 crisis, which demanded significant additional work to ensure that transport services could operate fully and safely throughout the pandemic. Furthermore, as Deputies will be aware, the arrival of significant numbers of children from Ukraine has required additional resources to ensure that transport services are up and running for them to access, often under tight timeframes and with changing circumstances.

It is clear that a significant body of work has been undertaken by the Department, in terms of a wide-ranging, comprehensive and inclusive review. I once again thank the House for the invitation to join Members today and provide an update on the work under way to operationalise the existing scheme and review its operation. We review it with the intention of ensuring that it is fit for purpose now and in the future and will meet the needs of students and families for many years to come. An enormous and worthy body of work has been undertaken. I thank Members for their engagement on the review and all of those who participated so positively and proactively with the review. I again thank them for the invitation to be here today.

Deputy Sorca Clarke

These statements could not come at a more fitting time. The Minister has come to this House and detailed the review that is ongoing and the communication and conversations that have taken place. Two and a half years after that review started it is not the success the Minister seems to think it is and neither is trying to say that while routes have not been cancelled, children are not on the bus because that is all that parents actually care about. All they care about is that their child is on the bus for which they have paid and for which they have been approved. Under no circumstances should the Minister misconstrue that the provision of financial grants is the equivalent of providing a service when it simply is not.

In some places, school transport is in chaos. Parents are telling me that not only is it taking a toll on their mental health, it is beginning to take a toll on their physical health. It is causing unnecessary stress and it is becoming a financial burden at a time when families are least able to take on board another cost. Parents the length and breadth of the country are left with no choice but to take annual leave from work to bring their children to school. These are the same children who are now facing another invisible barrier to accessing education.

The shortage of school buses is a national issue and is clearly having a disproportionate effect on children with special educational needs. The Minister can imagine that the pressure parents of these children are under on a consistent and daily basis is only being compounded by the lack of transport to get their children to school.

The Minister referenced the communication and customer call service of Bus Éireann in her statement. Families are telling me that the engagement with Bus Éireann and the Department of Education is not only angering and frustrating them, but they fail to see any level of empathy or any willingness to move towards a potential solution. Most parents say they receive nothing more than a generic reply. This review needs to be finished and published and there then needs to be a comprehensive plan to implement a fit-for-purpose school transport system.

Before coming in here, I pulled out a couple of emails from today. One stated that:

Unfortunately I am back to you again as I have heard absolutely nothing from Bus Éireann despite lodging a formal complaint three weeks ago. I contacted the call line again this morning and the very helpful person on the other end could find no record of my child in the system despite me giving her the reference number that Bus Éireann gave me back in March. We are still taking time off work everyday to bring her to school while the coach is transporting just four children from her class.

Another email from a parent living in a small village whose child goes to the local community college, which is under ten minutes away, stated: "I am within the catchment area of this school, so my child is entitled to a full bus ticket". The email went on to state that "this is the 4th week where we have no Bus Service". The writer of the email stated that they work in the opposite direction to her home and is now relying on her 73-year-old mother to collect their child from school. The email stated that a minibus passes their door every day carrying children and that it led them to wonder why their child is being refused a seat on that bus.

Another email is very concerning. It involves a family that has come through homelessness and has finally managed to get somewhere it can call its own. This family is now facing a journey of 20 km twice a day five days a week because there is no mechanism for that child, who has been in homeless accommodation, to link in with a bus that passes 2 km from their house. Another email stated that the pupils of three schools will have to walk to a cark park through a greenway and the waste land beyond it - a 15 to 20 minute walk depending on the school. These families understand that school transport is not a door-to-door service. What they do not understand is the logic behind sending children down a dark alleyway out of the view of adults and teachers and into waste land surrounded by bushes and trees as the evenings are starting to darken. This parent has a first-year pupil at the school and in her opinion, this decision is at odds with the commitment given by Government under the climate action plan to reduce journeys and increase the use of public transport as it will force parents back into their cars. The Minister needs to come back into this House with a definitive date as to when this school transport review will be completed and when it will be published.

Deputy Pearse Doherty

What we have just heard from Deputy Clarke is example after example of families in crisis. That is what it is for those families. If you cannot get your children into school and you have to make alternative arrangements, in some cases, it is a crisis within the family. I spoke to a constituent last week who has written to many other elected representatives through tears, as she put it, talking about how she had to give up work for the past month just to be able to get her children to school because the school transport system is unable to cater for her needs and those of her family along with many others. For the Minister to talk about a review that has been ongoing for two and half years shows that this go-slow and do-nothing Government is out of touch with ordinary people and the hardships they face. The reality is that there are countless children and families in every constituency across the State who still do not have the school transport to which they are entitled.

I will focus on one part of my constituency, namely, the village of Creeslough, which was served by a private bus for many years. This week is leading up to the first-year anniversary of the awful disaster that befell the community of Creeslough, including children who come from some of the schools I will mention. I know the Minister is familiar with the area. She visited the schools and the area afterwards. The 2 p.m. service has been withdrawn from them. This cluster of schools has been provided with a service by a private operator that involves children being transported many miles to their primary school. Now they have no service, parents are forced to rely on childminders, grandmothers or grandfathers or in some cases they are forced to give up work to get their children to school. I understand Bus Éireann has submitted a report to the national office looking for a service to be provided. It will ultimately fall to the Minister and I ask her to make the right decision, make sure all of those families are able to get their children to school through public transport and authorise that without delay.

Deputy Claire Kerrane

It is incredible that in 2023 as another school term begins, we have the long list of issues we have every year. The same issues arise over and over again. Every year, during the summer months, the school transport circus begins. I cannot fathom how it cannot be resolved once and for all.

There is a long list of cases in my office coming through from the Roscommon side in Ballaghadereen and Ballinasloe in east Galway. Situations arise where in one family, a brother gets a ticket but a sister does not and has to cycle down the road to get on a bus because there are two buses. She used to be able to get on the bus with her brother outside her home but cannot do so now and the two buses are going to the same school. I have heard of several cases where children have been approved for a bus ticket and either the bus ticket is given to them and revoked or they get another email to say they will not actually get the ticket because there is no capacity. It is all well and good to promote getting out of your car and using school transport and public transport and lots of parents want that option but it beggars belief that we are still in the situation where a person eligible for a ticket has the ticket revoked or does not get a ticket because there is no room on the bus.

Regarding routes not being cancelled, the Minister will be familiar with the special school in Ballinasloe. It has had weeks of the principal going back and over with Bus Éireann. One of the school's routes has been cancelled. The principal was contacted by a parent last week who told her that the child had missed ten days of school and the mother is worried she will be contacted by Tusla about that if the number of days keeps going up. The special school is there. The route has been cancelled. Parents were not notified and only found out when they realised the bus was not turning up. The principal has been ringing for the past number of weeks trying to sort it out. There is no bus and so there is no service and these parents have been left high and dry. That is a special school for children with additional needs. School is important in that routine and yet they physically cannot get to and from school.

This is a real mess. The review has been awaited for a very long time. We still have not seen it. It needs to totally reform the school transport system as quickly as possible.

Deputy Matt Carthy

I welcome the opportunity to debate the issue of school transport but not the need to debate it in yet another autumn. The Minister will recall that when we raised this issue last year we were told to wait for a review of school transport, which at that stage had been ongoing for one and half years. It has now been ongoing for two and a half years and we still do not have it. All the while, we are hearing the stories of families who have been discommoded and put under enormous pressures because in some instances school buses are passing by their front doors and they have to put their children into a car and drive past those buses.

It is ironic that just last week, the House debated a Sinn Féin motion calling on the Government not to increase the cost of petrol and diesel. One of the arguments thrown back at us was that we should encourage people to take public transport. Yet, here we are with thousands of families and children throughout this State who are crying out for the opportunity to use public transport to get to school and that opportunity is being denied to them.

The review has to address how Bus Éireann deals with people who make inquiries of it. It is a State-owned company in receipt of millions of euro of taxpayers' money to provide the school transport scheme and the way it treats many parents and families is beyond disgraceful. We know that because we know how it treats elected representatives who make representations to it. In some cases, it simply does not reply for months on end. Last year, I spent virtually all year emailing Bus Éireann in respect of a school bus route that covers the parish of Inishkeen. Local parents requested a route change to ensure a safer route. There was no response whatsoever. All I requested was for an inspector to meet the families on-site and I am still making that request. This year, we are engaging with Bus Éireann in respect of children who take the bus from Carrickmacross to Inishkeen through to Dundalk. They relied on the 166 service and the time of that service was changed to 5.30 p.m. with no consultation whatsoever but guess what? A Local Link service leaves at 4.10 p.m and would be perfectly suitable for the school children. What happens? The Local Link service does not accept school transport scheme tickets. There are anomalies like that in virtually every parish in the State. If the Minister does not get a handle on them, this will be just another debacle and failure to be attributed to the Government. I urge her to make sure the review is published without delay and we see action so that every child who needs a place on a school bus to get to school has access to one.

Deputy Donnchadh Ó Laoghaire

The delay in publishing the review is not acceptable. The school transport system has been deeply problematic for a long time. Now that I am no longer the Sinn Féin spokesperson for education, I will speak from my experience in my constituency. The issue most often raised with me relates to special education, primarily the city services in my constituency. One of the big issues I see is the challenge of finding drivers when a route is sanctioned. This is a huge problem which needs to be examined. I am dealing with two cases at the moment, both involving mothers who do not drive. In one instance, the woman in question has serious mobility issues and is waiting on a knee replacement and getting injection. She has to travel across the city on two separate buses to get her child to a special class. Bus Éireann has tendered three times at this stage. We need to look at the tender process in that case. In a similar case, another mother who does not drive has a child she needs to get to a school and the journey is extremely challenging. She has had to ask her mother, friends and others to help her. It is a difficult system. The tendering process is too onerous for an awful lot of people. We are not attracting enough taxi drivers to do this kind of work. Many of them say it is not worth the trouble involved. We need to look at that because an awful lot of people are losing out.

There is scope for the Department to do more with Bus Éireann to provide services once or twice a day in urban areas where there are a number of schools. There may be a need for a service that runs twice a day and can be regularly timetabled outside of the school transport system. I am thinking of Douglas in my constituency in that regard.

With regard to my neighbouring constituencies, I have been asked to raise the fact that there are issues with school transport to Glenville, Upper Glanmire and Castlemagner. In the latter location, 27 children have traditionally travelled on a 45-seater bus to Ballyhass National School. There has been a shift in the population there in the past while. This year, some 60 children applied so 11 children lost out. There was a huge change in the area. The provision of additional buses for Ballyhass National School would be welcome.

Deputy Sean Sherlock

With the Chair's permission, I will share time with Deputies Nash and Smith.

In the few minutes available to me, for which I am grateful, I acknowledge that the issue in Rathcormack and Kildinan has now been sorted. That is in no small part due to the fact that much pressure was brought to bear by Opposition Deputies and also Government backbenchers. I note the presence of Deputy O'Sullivan in the Chamber as well. This was on the advice of the people in these two areas. I told them they needed to get on to their backbench Fianna Fáil and Fine Gael Deputies to apply pressure, and I think that was done. I, too, applied pressure and I am glad the issue was sorted out. What it has thrown up, however, is the fact that people in Rathcormack had to go through a struggle whereby 11 children did not have a school place for a long time. The closure of the Kildinan school in 1975 created an exception such that when the scheme was changed, children on concessionary tickets had to be taken off the bus. I acknowledge that a solution has been found and hope it will be a sustainable and long-term one.

This case raises a question about these anachronistic geographical rules. If, in the course of the review, the Minister could do away with those geographical rules, we will no longer have this debate year in, year out. If she is moving, as I believe she is, towards a more universal model, given that there seems to be a willingness by people to pay, I believe they will be glad to pay for school transport if there is a supply of buses and drivers available. The geographical rules underpinning the scheme are out of date, outmoded and do not reflect the society in which we now live. They are anachronistic and need to be done away with. They do not reflect the number of people who live in rural parts of our country. I ask the Minister to take that on board.

Again, I acknowledge that a solution has been found for Kildinan and Rathcormack but I refer to the level of stress people had to go through. Last year and this year, children with concessionary tickets had to move off buses to make way for children who adhered to the geographical rule. This approach creates exceptions and tensions within communities and among neighbours - between those who are eligible and those who are not and those who have concessionary tickets and those who do not. If the Minister can create a level playing pitch, and I hope she is moving in the direction of a universal model, it will negate and remove all these tensions which arise on an annual basis.

Deputy Ged Nash

We can set our watches and mark our calendars to predict this issue. It arises every July and August in my constituency. It is predictable but also solvable if the will is there to modernise, update and reform a system that owes more to the 1970s and 1980s that it does to a modern republic. Largely thanks to the work of one of the Minister's predecessors and our former colleague, Ruairí Quinn, families and young people now have a diversity of choice and a plurality of options with regard to the ethos of the school their children will attend. That is the right thing to do. We are, however, stuck with a system where pupils can only get a ticket to the school that is geographically closest to them. A case in point, and one that comes up practically every year, is Collon in County Louth. This is a village a few miles to the west of my home town of Drogheda. The vast majority of children in the area go to school either in Ardee or Drogheda, yet their local school, which is a fine school, is in Dunleer. A very significant number, if not the majority, of children in the area go to schools in Drogheda and in Ardee, yet every year they have to apply for concessionary tickets.

Part of the review has to deal with how Bus Éireann deals with people who make enquiries of them. It is a company which is State-owned but also one that is receipt of millions of euro of taxpayers' money to provide the school transport scheme and the way it treats many parents and families is beyond disgraceful. The way we know that is because we know how it treats even elected representatives who make representations to it and to which it simply does not reply in some cases for months on end. Last year, I spent virtually all year emailing Bus Éireann in respect of a school bus route that dealt with the parish of Inishkeen. There was a request by local parents for a route change in order to ensure the route was safer and no response whatsoever was given. All I requested was for an inspector to meet the families on-site and I still requesting that. This year, we are engaging with Bus Éireann in respect of children who take the bus from Carrickmacross to Inishkeen, through to Dundalk and who relied on the 166 service. The time of that service was changed to 5.30 p.m. with no consultation whatsoever. Guess what? There is a Local Link n

I understand that concessionary tickets do what they say on the tin - they are concessionary tickets - but that speaks to the heart of the problem, that is, that the choices people have at the moment are not being supported by the school transport policy. We have education policy and school provision policy pulling in one direction and school transport policy pulling in the other. It is high time the system was modernised and reformed. I cannot understand why it is taking so long to produce a report we had expected to see well before now.

I will make two brief points in conclusion. I was getting phone calls a few weeks ago, the Friday before schools started back on the Monday, from an area called Harestown, County Louth, near Monasterboice, about a small rural school. The contractor there who usually undertakes the service, it seems, has not renewed the contract. The parents were told only on the Friday before school started on Monday. That is completely unacceptable.

Then, as other speakers have said, we have had issues with people having to take time off work and make arrangements with other family members to take children to school. That has been resolved but it speaks to the heart of the problem. I would appreciate it if the Minister would put on the record later what the problem is with tendering. Is it price? Is it cost? What is the issue? Why are people not coming forward to undertake the contracts?

Deputy Duncan Smith

Following on from my two colleagues, the anachronistic geographic rule fails on the fundamental law of common sense in many cases. One such case is Coláiste Ghlór na Mara, Balbriggan. It was given patronage based on the region. It was said that it would be the regional Gaelcholáiste for Fingal. Children in Swords, 12 in particular, are unable to get the bus service to Balbriggan, which is closer in terms of travel time. It is cleaner and greener to get there. The line on the map says the school in Glasnevin or the school in Kilbarrack, where there is no direct bus service either, by the way, is closer. This is even though there is a feeder school from Swords up to Balbriggan and it is quicker and cleaner to get there. There is a bus. It goes from Blake's Cross. It should start from Swords. There are 12 kids being left behind. I raised this on Questions on Policy or Legislation. I know that the Minister, Deputy Darragh O'Brien, has raised it as well. I ask that it be sorted out and that the bus service be extended.

Deputy Pádraig O'Sullivan

I commend the Minister and her officials on the work they have done over the past few months. It is a busy time of year for them every time this issue arises but I genuinely commend them on their work. Deputy Sherlock is exiting the Chamber. He mentioned that a lot of good work has been done in a lot of villages across Cork North-Central and Cork East on trying to supply additional buses. Once again, I commend the Minister on the fact that over 150,000 tickets, I think, have been issued at this stage. That is lost in the wider discussion when we get to talking about all the different anomalies that are there in all the different villages and hinterlands that service big towns and where the schools are located. I wanted to put that on the record initially.

As regards the wider issue, I would like to talk about how prescriptive Bus Éireann is in its interpretation and implementation of its guidelines. I raised this here on the floor with the Tánaiste last Thursday. I refer to the use of a measuring wheel on one particular route that concerned me. Going forward with the review, I hope, in respect of the type of prescriptive interpretation that is there, that a bit more flexibility might be given to Bus Éireann to use a bit more common sense, which I think was the phrase the Tánaiste used here last Thursday, insofar as we can try to get as many children onto buses as we can rather than disqualify them for minor reasons.

As regards my hope for the review, many Ministers here have spoken about bringing forward the school transport review for a number of years. To be fair, however, the Minister, Deputy Foley, has brought it forward and is working on it. I know that information will come out at a later date in that regard. I hope that an awful lot of the anomalies to which we refer in this Chamber can be dealt with when that review is published.

As an aside, if I may refer to the issue of school bus escorts, which I note Deputy Ó Laoghaire raised previously, we are finding it quite difficult at the moment to source a great many bus escorts for children with special educational needs, in particular, and it is quite concerning. I have talked to the bus escorts themselves and they tell me what they are being paid. It is mostly women in this case who have contacted me. They are paid I think about €12.40 an hour. They do not even necessarily know who their employer is in many cases. They do not know if they are section 38 or section 39. That in itself might require that the whole school bus escort system be reviewed as part of any review the Department is doing into the wider school transport issue.

I will finish on a positive note and commend the Minister and her officials, as I did earlier. When we have engaged with her office and Bus Éireann, I have found them very progressive to work with, and when issues can be resolved, they are. I remind people participating in this debate that 150,000 tickets have been issued. It is more than have ever been issued. Yes, many people and many families are still disappointed and a lot of work remains to be done, but we must not lose sight of that progressive step since Deputy Foley has become Minister for Education.

Deputy Brian Leddin

I find it remarkable in this day and age that we have a system whereby every year there is a scramble to find places on school buses and elected representatives of this House and on the local authorities across our country are contacted by concerned parents in their thousands, parents who are rightly worried about how their children will get to school in the upcoming year. It really is not a good system and it is flawed.

The fundamental flaw, in my view, is that responsibility for the system sits in the Department of Education rather than the Department of Transport. I agree with Deputy Nash, who spoke earlier, that the review must be published as soon as possible. The Minister made a point in her opening speech about how thorough, wide-ranging, comprehensive and inclusive the review of school transport has been. From listening to her opening remarks, however, there is a glaring blind spot there. She stresses how there has been consultation with people who would like to use the scheme. This really is not good enough. The bounds of the scheme should not be those who might like to use it. School transport must be considered in the wider realm of public transport. It is providing public transport for young people but it should not be exclusively so. The fact that we have a public transport system and a parallel school transport system run by two different Departments, whereby the users of one system cannot access the other, is not just inefficient but also is ripe for the kinds of anomalies and issues we have seen over the years. That the school transport system sits outside a multimodal system is nonsensical, not only in the context of other people who should be able to use the bus, train or shared services, including teachers, but also because services can continue on to serve hospitals and amenities. It is woefully inefficient. We will see what the review says but it really does not make sense that we have these two parallel systems. It is ripe for the kinds of issues that we have seen and continue to see and that are causing immense stress for parents across the country. Ever since the terms of the scheme were introduced in 2012, there have been problems. They have been rectified in a very ad hoc and reactionary basis. There is a need for a complete overhaul of the scheme. This is public transport and it should lie with the public transport authorities. The Department of Transport should be the lead Department, working, of course, with the Department of Education.

Expanding the scheme would have a number of benefits. If we start to look at it in a holistic way, it is not just about considering those who might like to use it. Considering how many children are driven to school, perhaps quite happily, by their parents, we should target them for the school bus system, rather than having a situation whereby so many kilometres are being driven by parents, contributing immensely to the carbon emissions in the transport sector. We have to reduce those transport emissions by 50% based on 2018 levels. We therefore cannot just look at this as a system that is for those who have no alternative; we have to look at it as a system that is an alternative for children being driven to school. I am extremely concerned that the review has a blind spot towards that, and I ask the Minister to look at that carefully. If we maintain two parallel systems whereby users of one cannot use the other, we are failing.

Deputy James O'Connor

I thank the Minister for being here. This issue, as we all know, is hugely contentious in rural areas. I want to acknowledge the point that has been made by my colleague in Cork North-Central, Deputy Pádraig O'Sullivan, that this year has seen a huge increase in the number of people who are taking bus transport. Due to the work that is being done by the Department, difficulties have arisen. In my constituency of Cork East, in a number of areas, villages, towns and market towns where the secondary schools are located, difficulties have become apparent. I mention places like Killavullen and Glenville over the border in Cork North-Central, which affects Rathcormac in my constituency. I mention Kilcredan and other areas like Kildinan. We have seen issues erupt in these areas where people are located between the market towns of the constituency of Cork East and Cork North-Central.

I want to thank the Minister, Deputy Foley, for being there to assist with these cases. A point I want to make, which is pertinent, is that the Department of Public Expenditure, National Development Plan Delivery and Reform must come in and back up the Department of Education more coming into this budget, because the Department of Education needs funding to provide a better service. We have seen that more people are being provided with transport services this year and the review is ongoing but we must put our money where our mouths are when it comes to funding for the Department of Education in this respect. There is only so much that any Minister can do. I know that the Minister, with her experience from teaching in the east Cork area, has done everything she can to help me, within the boundaries of reason. However, she is dealing with Bus Éireann to try to provide that additional capacity. Bus Éireann has fought tooth and nail in so many cases in my constituency, as has happened in Cork North-Central, to almost prevent people who should be entitled to get public transport to get to and from their schools through concessionary bus places.

It is something that is so frustrating. The reason it is worth referencing why this is frustrating is as follows. There are so many working households and I mention the social fabric of Ireland. Even since I was a primary school child growing up in Ireland in the noughties and going into secondary school in 2010, which is not that long ago, I saw the fabric of households change. There are more single-income households and parents that form dual-income households where parents are both working now, when traditionally there would have been a stay-at-home parent in many households. The fabric of society has changed in this respect, which is for the better, where everybody who is in a position to work is potentially doing so, and we have fewer people voluntarily staying at home. However, that has created difficulty with capacity requirements for school transport, where there is no person to take people home in the afternoons. I remember my grandfather, Lord have mercy on him, who used to take me to and from primary school, and I was lucky enough to have him for so many years. Now, when people are under pressure to get to and from their places of work, their finishing times are 5 p.m. or 6 p.m. and that is why it is imperative that we provide more capacity.

It is worth referencing the fact that in the countryside there is a huge desire on behalf of people to take a greener option to get children to and from school and to have more sustainable options. However, all of that comes down to funding. I will fire one shot across the bow. Below in Portlaoise there is a bus depot with over 100 buses parked and they cannot operate because they are on hybrid charging infrastructure that has not been installed yet. Despite this, the buses were purchased and they are sitting there idle. That goes to show why the Department of Transport needs to be a little bit more creative in co-operating with other Departments, including the Department of Education, and we are lucky to have the Minister for Education with us. The Department of Transport must use its additional funding and resources to assist the Department of Education in providing that additional school bus transport capacity at post-primary and primary level. Hopefully next year we will see a further increase in the number of people using public transport to get to and from school. We appreciate the assistance of the Department.

Deputy Brian Stanley

There is a serious issue with the school transport system due to a lack of local knowledge and co-ordination by those people who are charged with running it. This year we have witnessed chaos in several areas of Laois and Offaly regarding the operation of the scheme. I have seen this problem reoccur every year and we need a solution to be put in place, which is what I want to focus on.

Parents who paid the fee for their children as far back as April were informed just two weeks before schools were due to be reopened that they had no ticket. These are people who were clearly within the catchment area. Families who had tickets last year are now without tickets. In some cases, buses are travelling with loads of vacant seats while parents drive behind them with their children to the nearest school. The matter of the nearest school to a family is a real issue and I have had to argue with Bus Éireann about what the nearest school is for a number of families. Bus Éireann said that a family was due to get concessionary tickets but the family was almost 4 km closer to the school they are sending their children to than the one determined by Bus Éireann. I questioned this and Bus Éireann said that the parents have to stick a pin on a map. I said the family gave Bus Éireann a post code. Some people are not good map readers. I am not too bad at it but putting a pin on a map is not an effective method. That family still does not have tickets for their bus. Other issues have come up over the years and I have seen it again this year. There are closed and unsuitable roads. The roads are clearly closed and Bus Éireann is saying the bus should go down them. There are also examples of roads that are 3 m wide with bushes hanging over them. You would not go up these roads in a small car or jeep, never mind a coach, as they are totally unsuitable and buses will not use them.

Local knowledge is key in this and I have received dozens of complaints about this issue. In particular this is causing problems for parents who are working full-time and for parents in a single-car household. It is clear that the absence of local co-ordination and knowledge is causing the chaos. Clear and timely information is essential for both parents and Bus Éireann. We need to have an identifiable co-ordinator in each county, who has the local knowledge and who would help to resolve much of this. As other people in this House have done, I have spent the last two months trying to resolve some of this but if there is a local co-ordinator in each county, similar to the Local Link bus service, that person would have direct contact with local schools and bus operators but they would also know the road network. This needs to be done and I am calling on the Minister to put this in place.

Deputy Imelda Munster

As sure as there will be an overcrowding and trolley crisis in our hospitals this winter, which will unfortunately be the same as it is every year, there was a school bus capacity crisis this year, which is the same every year. It is not a new issue; it is a Government issue. The Government and the Minister know this but still they allow these problems to persist. Now and as always, the Government has failed to plan for the new school year properly, and this is despite repeated commitments from Ministers, past and present, that the issues would be rectified in time for the following year. There are households with both parents often working and households with one or no car that have no way of getting their children to school.

The reality of rural Ireland is that many children cannot walk or cycle to school and I want to highlight one particular case, which is one of many, regarding 16 secondary school students travelling from Collon to Ardee in Louth, who were all denied places. I made several representations on their behalves to Bus Éireann and its responses were not positive. I then contacted the Minister's office and my email was acknowledged but there was no follow-up from her office. I then contacted the Minister’s office again, prior to school resuming, to highlight the stress and anxiety parents were suffering the closer they got to the new school year starting, with the lack of viable alternative options open to them. The response I got was on how the scheme is run, ignoring all of the points made in my correspondence, and most importantly, offering nothing to those parents or their children. It was a head-in-the-sand response from a head-in-the-sand Government. You cannot just add more money and say everything is sorted; you need to attract new drivers, retain drivers and allow drivers who are 70 or over and who are medically cleared to continue to drive.

I want to concur the statement of my colleague, Deputy Stanley, about the need for local knowledge and co-ordination, with an identifiable person having direct contact with local school and bus operators to bridge the information gap which is behind most of the chaos every year. It needs to be managed correctly and you cannot say it is managed correctly when the same problems reoccur year after year. The fact that the review of school transport has been dragged on for two and a half years speaks volumes about the Government's lack of oversight, sense of emergency and tact in this issue.

Deputy Gary Gannon

Statements on school transport do not do justice to what we are being asked to speak to. More than school transport, I am being asked by parents who have contacted me on this issue to give voice to the fact that their children, often children with acute vulnerabilities and additional needs, are being excluded from their basic right to an education.

I do not doubt for a second that organising school transport on scale is a logistical challenge, but nor do I feel for a second that it is one that should be considered insurmountable. It cannot be considered so.

This enormous failure is being felt in the homes of families the length and breadth of the country. Compounding this failure is that not only does it occur annually but it seems to be getting worse. In 2021 the Minister's office commenced a review of the post-primary transport scheme. It is now approaching two-and-a-half years later. Where are the findings of the review? How has nothing been published in the years that have passed? Does the Minister find this administrative lethargy on an issue of such importance to be acceptable? I appreciate the Minister referenced the review in her opening remarks and I had prepared my remarks prior to hearing her contribution. The Minister's opening remarks did not give any sense it will be forthcoming soon. We need to see the review. It is unacceptable.

In the absence of logic on the issue I want to paint a picture of a particular child in my constituency whose family contacts me every week and sometimes twice a week to give voice to their situation with school transport. Tristan is a young lad in my constituency who was excited to begin secondary school in Coolock Community College where he was able to attain a place in one of its new ASD units. He has been availing of school transport since the age of five. In May his mother was relieved to receive an email from Bus Éireann informing the family that Tristan would be eligible for school transport throughout his time in secondary school. Needless to say, that transport offer has yet to materialise. Tristan's family are stretched to the bone trying to compensate for this atrociously poor service while keeping some degree of normality in Tristan's educational experience. His mother is an SNA in my constituency. She has had to miss days of work. She has extracted all of her resources in family and friends to try to get her son to school. Her mother, who is 73 years of age, has had to take up driving again to ensure Tristan gets to school in Coolock. Half an hour before she drops Tristan to his school she drops his sister at a different school. She has to be dropped off in the school yard 45 minutes before school begins so that Tristan is not late for the school he is in, which is 5 km or 6 km up the road. This is the pressure being placed on families throughout the country.

Deputy Catherine Murphy has asked me to give voice to the fact that in her constituency in Kildare pupils who do not get a place in their first choice of school, which they sometimes assess based on public transport, will get a place in their second or third choice of school. Because this second or third choice school is further away there is no place on the bus to get the children there. Large school campuses, such as those in Maynooth where two schools with more than 1,000 pupils are on the same campus, or Piper's Hill in Naas, draw students from a large catchment area. However, little thought is give to how pupils will get to these schools. Dozens of pupils, such as those in Straffan who must get to Maynooth, are experiencing the same problems again this year as were identified last year. This cannot be seen as acceptable. It piles stress and cost on parents. It also means that traffic congestion becomes inevitable in such scenarios. This goes against the Government's policies on reducing traffic. It adds a cost for families of between €750 and €800 per pupil.

Deputy Jennifer Whitmore

It is more than five weeks since parents in Wicklow were told the school bus service for which they had applied and paid, and on which they relied, was no longer available for their children to get them to school. Parents were left in the lurch. Very little information was given to them. No reason was given as to why this happened or when it would be resolved. Many parents, unfortunately, had to give up work. Ironically childcare workers and even a teacher have had to take leave and are considering giving up work because of the difficulties this is causing for them and their families. Many parents had to take annual leave or use unpaid parental leave to ensure their children were getting to school. The burden of this is falling primarily on mothers in the county and in the country. Often it is mothers who are left to ensure their children get to school. It is putting great pressure on families.

When I raised this issue in the Dáil two weeks ago, I specifically asked for information on Wicklow. Unfortunately, I did not receive it at the time. I had hoped I would have received it by now but I have not received any information from the Department on services in Wicklow. When I raised the issue in the Dáil, I was told the services were not cancelled but that these people were without a service. Today I have found out that a number of routes in Wicklow have been reactivated. I ask the Minister to please stop playing word games with this issue. Be clear and upfront with parents. Tell them exactly what will happen if these services are not provided for them, how they will be supported or when they can expect a service to be reinstated. It is causing great stress for parents, students and the schools themselves because in recent weeks they have seen an increase in students not making it into class.

Unfortunately the school transport service is not fit for purpose. I understand a review is taking place. I also understand it is complex. I know that in many parts of the country the scheme works well. Where the Minister says that a small number of families were issued with tickets and have not yet received transport, this is not the case in the constituency of Wicklow. I have received more than 200 emails from families in this situation. This is not a small number. The impact on these families is not limited. I ask that the Minister works urgently to resolve these issues and communicate what she is going to do for these parents.

Deputy Emer Higgins

As leaves turn yellow and Hallowe'en decorations begin to pop up, a chill fills the air. However, it is not just the cold many families grapple with. It is the cold reality of facing another morning struggling to get their children to school. The school transport scheme in our communities, including in Dublin Mid-West, has become a challenge for many families. We are still awaiting the publication of the review of the scheme. This review was initiated in February 2021. By June of that year only an interim report was brought to light.

We are seeing an increasing need for concessionary tickets, particularly for students attending schools such as Scoil Chrónáin. As of now, Bus Éireann has issued almost 130,000 tickets to eligible and concessionary students who applied on time. This is an increase of 22% on last year. This year alone, services have been extended to accommodate more than 5,400 children arriving from Ukraine, illustrating the resilience of the system. By introducing these tickets we are not just addressing a demand; we are making a profound difference in the lives of families and students.

In recent weeks the gaps in our school transport system have become very obvious. Issues including driver shortages have left many of our children stranded. I have suggested solutions, such as allowing drivers over the age of 70 to continue driving after an annual medical check, especially since drivers over 70 can continue to drive tour buses in the private sector. Our children need them.

While we recognise the need, there are practical challenges to address. I have had a number of conversations with parents from Newcastle, Rathcoole and Saggart in particular. They have shared their struggles and frustrations. Many children, especially those going to schools in Rathcoole, Naas or Celbridge, find it an uphill task to secure a seat on a school bus. The hurdles do not stop there. I have also spoken to parents of special education students who face unique transportation challenges. One constituent of mine has been waiting for school transport for more than a month, even though he has been sanctioned for it. His parents, despite their best efforts, have not received any meaningful response from the relevant authorities.

It is disheartening to hear of students who rely on a bus service being told in September they have no seat on the bus. This is not just a matter of buses or bus seats; it is about inclusivity, fairness, and our commitment as a community and as a Government to ensure every child has equal access to education. I appeal to the Minister for Education, the Minister for Transport, and the leaders in Bus Éireann to work together on this. It is time to release the report. It is time to devise a plan that truly serves our students and their families.

Deputy Alan Dillon

It is important to recognise the profound significance of the school transport scheme. For many it is not just a bus service; it is a vital lifeline for those who rely heavily on it. In the 2022-23 school year we saw more than 149,000 children in many of our primary and post-primary schools, including those with special educational needs, rely on the service. We have seen the positive impact the scheme has had on more than 5,400 children who recently arrived from Ukraine. There is a real financial commitment of more than €338 million from the Government in the scheme. This significant investment reflects the Government's dedication to supporting families and education and the right to an adequate service.

However, the matter we are debating is the pressing issues surrounding the scheme and ongoing frustration among many parents. Every August, as many Deputies have alluded to, we receive a surge of calls from parents living in areas such as Strade, Turlough, Ballyvary and Balla who require tickets for their children and cannot get them through no fault of their own. On some occasions, children have no tickets or seats on the bus and that situation is far from ideal. It is a pressing issue that demands immediate attention. Reform is needed. The immediate publication of the pending review without further delay is also needed. This review, which commenced back in February 2021, must see the light of day and address the unique challenges faced by many families. It is crucial that there should be reform of eligibility, cost and overall effectiveness. The delay in sharing these findings has caused significant frustration, as I have previously discussed.

An issue that always comes before us is the need for reform around concessionary ticket holders. Many children are being left without a ticket at a crucial stage at the last hour. We really need this to be reformed. We also need to see parents who have their school of choice made central to where concessionary eligibility is reformed.

In conclusion, we need to understand the positive impact the school transport scheme provides, but also acknowledge the need for urgent reform to modernise the system. The bureaucracy of eligibility should be discounted with regard to many families who rely on the school transport scheme, especially in rural areas where there are inadequate public transport systems. Measures have been taken. Temporary alleviation measures were introduced in response to the chaos in the free school transport system. It is disappointing in some areas where this was not implemented. The discrepancy between policy and implementation has left many families struggling. Once this review is published, we can have a frank debate on the recommendations.

Deputy Alan Farrell

I thank the Minister of State for her presence. It is very important that we have this discussion. There is absolutely no doubt that school transport provides a really pivotal role in the day-to-day life of many families right across the country, my constituency included. The population is growing, and the geography of our communities is expanding.

In the case of my constituency, which includes a large population in Swords, we must ensure that service is adequately provided to children relying on school transport to get to school every day. I urge the Minister of State, as others have done, to publish the review of phases 2 and 3 of the school transport system at the earliest opportunity, which will, of course, underpin our ability to build a sustainable transport scheme for children throughout the country.

I echo some of the comments of my colleagues, particularly Deputy Higgins, outlining the unique challenges of some students. A student with an additional need and physical disability was sanctioned for a service but no seat or bus was actually available. That really regrettable situation has, unfortunately, been replicated across the country. This leads me to the point I would like to make most strenuously, which is that we must ensure the tender process employed results in a reliable service. Adequate and demonstrable evidence must be given by providers to ensure they are in the position to deliver the service when it is needed, for example, having regard to driver shortages after the contract has been awarded, as has happened in my constituency, which I am sure the Minister of State and Members will accept is one of the most frustrating things to occur. People get over the hurdle of getting the ticket in the first place only to discover there is not a service available.

I also believe consideration should be given to how restrictions are placed on the distance to the school, particularly when it comes to gaelscoileanna and gaelcholaistí. In large population centres, the closest school might not have availability for a large number of children. In the case of a couple of children in Swords, their selected gaelcholáiste was Coláiste Ghlór na Mara in Balbriggan, only for them to be told that Gaelcholáiste Reachrann in Dublin 13 is actually their local gaelcholáiste. By geography and distance, yes, it is, but Balbriggan is actually closer in journey time and avoiding traffic among other things. An element of flexibility needs to be built in but it should not be a free-for-all. There are unique geographic circumstances at play across the country. We need to be able to recognise that, quite apart from the fact that Coláiste Ghlór na Mara is a relatively new school whereas Gaelcholáiste Reachrann is still languishing in prefabs almost a decade after it is supposed to have gotten a new building. It is fair to say that the school bus service as provided is absolutely fantastic when the buses show up and people have a ticket. Unfortunately, however, as is the case with many public services from time to time, when mistakes happen or errors or delays occur, it can be fairly catastrophic for the children in question.

The Minister of State knows my constituency, which she visited not too long ago. It is a large geographic community with five major towns and five minor towns. There is quite a distance between some of them while others are joined together. At the same time, we must take cognisance of the fact that my constituency, not unlike the rest of the country, has large geographic spreads between it and different requirements both in terms of the Irish language medium but also non-religious education. That is something I would like the Minister of State to consider and put to the Department.

An Ceann Comhairle

I thank the Deputy. Deputy Martin Kenny is sharing with Deputy Paul Donnelly.

Deputy Martin Kenny

This school transport issue goes back some time. In fact, I remember the first school I started in was a little parish school in Carrigallen. Then, it was centralised into the central school in the parish. The smaller schools that people could walk to closed and the deal was that everybody would be bussed to the central school in the parish. That is how it happened across all of rural Ireland when that programme was put in place in the mid-70s. It worked very well until 2012 when the report came out, which I believe was produced by the then Minister, Mary Coughlan. That is when we developed this notion of some children being a concession and others being entitled. The very terminology gets under my skin.

We must recognise that as part of a free education process, every child is, and should be, entitled to a reasonable school transport service wherever he or she lives in the nation. That is what we should work towards. That particular scheme introduced that, however, and it introduced a whole range of other provisions that have caused endless problems, including the numbers of children that had to be on a route and the distance they had to be from a school. They are just endless. We all have people and families contacting us, including many in my constituency. I know of three children in one family who travel on the bus, one of whom gets a ticket. The other two children cannot go on the bus. They do not have tickets because they are concessionary. This notion is driving people insane. The reality is that Government needs to get to grips with it and come up with a solution that works for everyone.

I am aware of numerous situations. In fact, the parents of a child with special needs contacted me recently. The child lives in County Leitrim and has not been able to go to school in County Roscommon. A taxi service is being put in place now. I spoke to the organiser only today. They finally got the service in place, but now the school has to try to find an escort to go with that child. These difficulties and problems are being worked out logically by people on the ground. Sometimes, when Members come in here, I am amazed by the common sense I hear from Government and Opposition spokespeople and backbenchers about how we can try to find a solution to these issues and all work together to get them sorted out, but it never seems to get any further than this Chamber. It is dead when it leaves here. Nobody is prepared to apply common sense and a sense of delivery for people after that. Indeed, when it comes to our own representations, when we ring the Oireachtas representatives' line for Bus Éireann, we cannot get a response or any sense of a service from it either. That is one issue the Minister of State needs to examine. At the end of the day, however, until Government gets to grips with this and delivers equality for all children, we are in trouble.

Deputy Paul Donnelly

I have prepared a litany of examples of children trying to access school transport in recent months in the run-up to the new school year. There has been year after year of people left standing on the road, unable to send their children to school. Like many colleagues, I have many examples of parents frantically contacting local Deputies, including me, to get answers as to why they do not have school transport available to their children's school.

For example, one parent said that in the past couple of years access to basic services, including therapeutics supports, OT, etc., supportive equipment and even medical supports have been increasingly difficult to access, and that parents and families of children with additional needs are under enormous pressure already without having to deal with the absence of school bus services. This person went on to say that the family had applied for individual transport for their son in March 2023, as he was finding it difficult on the present service. This parent was in contact with the Department, and a letter was requested, via email and telephone in April 2023, from the child's team, which was supplied by the school. No more emails were received, despite updates being requested. In August 2023, this parent received an email, marked "high priority", from the Department requesting that a form be filled out and returned as soon as possible. That form was returned the following day, but, to date, this person has not received a report. Another email was sent on 5 September but a response still has been received. I was again contacted just last Friday by a parent who has to travel to pick up her child from a Gaelcholáiste because there is no direct bus to the school. The school bus transport could make a small detour that would mean another cohort of students could be picked up from a particular estate. There is plenty of room on the bus, but there is a "Computer says no" attitude.

I represent an urban constituency, yet we experience some of the problems our rural communities face every year. We need a comprehensive school bus transport system that is responsive to the needs of students. In particular, this service needs a radical overhaul in respect of children with additional needs. No student should be left behind because of any difficulties they have. They should have this public transport system available to them when they need it.

Deputy Richard Boyd Barrett

The reason we are holding this debate today is People Before Profit-Solidarity asked the Business Committee to put it on the agenda and asked the Government to facilitate the debate. The reason for this is at the beginning of the school year I received communications concerning this issue. It was obvious, though, that Deputies all across the country and from all parties were receiving similar communications and that we have a major problem.

The particular issues brought to my attention started with the Enable Ireland-run special school in Sandymount, where five days before the new school year was due to commence there was a shortage of seven buses to provide the school population, most of whom are wheelchair users, with transport to school. There were three or four children, mostly wheelchair users, on each of those buses. The basic right, therefore, of these children with disabilities to get to school was prevented from being exercised and the parents and members of the school community were only informed of this five days before the school year began. I have raised this specific case on several occasions, as has the parents' association. I have a letter from the chairperson here describing the stress and hardship imposed on the families in trying to get their children to school. A month later, however, that school is still without two of the buses it needs and some kids are simply not able to get to school because their parents cannot drive, they cannot make other arrangements, etc. Children's basic right to go to school, therefore, is being denied. In this case, these are very vulnerable children.

The second communication I received should be of interest to the Minister of State, Deputy Madigan, as it is from St. Mary's Boys National School, where we both recently attended the opening of the autism spectrum disorder, ASD, unit. The school applied for transport for two children in July 2023 and it has still nothing. In fact, it has been informed that none is available. One of the children for the autism class is coming from Dún Laoghaire and the other child, who has cerebral palsy and a co-occurring diagnosis of developmental language disorder and speech disorder, and has a foldable wheelchair and needs a walker at all times, cannot get transport. It is outrageous that this is the case.

The third communication is from the parents of a young girl with special needs who attends the New Court special education school in Bray, County Wicklow. Again, despite contact having been made with Bus Éireann, the school and so on, no school bus is available to take the daughter of these parents to school. They have to leave their elderly mother, who is not well either, alone without assistance to try to get their daughter to school, but it is extremely stressful for them all.

Those are just three examples but it is completely unacceptable that this should be the case. Clearly, this issue is occurring right across the country, most egregiously to children with special needs and disabilities, but all children have the right to get to school and for the State to ensure the access to transport required in this regard is provided. I ask the Minister of State, therefore, to examine the examples I have given and address them urgently, but also all other issues raised by Deputies. We have a responsibility to children and young people to ensure they can get to school, which is their right.

Deputy Mick Barry

Ireland is not a poor, backward country, not by any manner or means, yet we cannot get significant numbers of our kids to school in the morning. The Government has serious questions to answer on that. I wish to bring to the attention of the Dáil the situation facing the people of Glenville in my constituency of Cork North-Central. In particular, I wish to raise the situation facing 12 students and their families. These students have been, as the saying goes, knocked off the bus. They attend school in nearby Fermoy, which has been the traditional location for school attendance for many young people from Glenville down the years. The bus from there to Fermoy, though, is oversubscribed. Bus Éireann has asked parents to send their children to the nearest school in Carrignavar or Dublin Hill, but there are no transport services to these areas either.

The end result is that parents have to turn themselves inside out just to try to get their kids to school. I am told that at least two parents face the choice of keeping their kids away from school or giving up their jobs. What is happening in Glenville is wrong. It is one example of the injustices happening across the country. The State must show greater flexibility on these issues and the school transport system needs to be properly and adequately financed.

Deputy Steven Matthews

I have been listening to the debate from my office and we have all experienced many of the complaints and issues raised by Members across the House. One of the issues that really frustrates us as public representatives is the poor communication response we get. I am sure the people in the Bus Éireann office are overwhelmed and overrun with queries, complaints and issues. I know they are probably doing their best to answer us, but it really does put us in a very poor position when we cannot even get the answers for the parents and children who are not getting buses. County Wicklow was particularly badly affected and still continues to be so. I am going to a meeting in Moneystown in the county on Thursday evening.

I cannot get information on when the bus services for Laragh, Moneystown, Ashford and Rathdrum will be up and running. That is not good enough. It is not good enough for the parents, as outlined by other speakers, who have to postpone their work start times and make all sorts of arrangements that rely on family members or friends. People are operating an ad hoc system. For all parents, the primary motivation is to ensure our children are looked after and safe. People are having to resort to all sorts of arrangements for that purpose. It is not good enough at all.

If the Minister of State takes just one point back to the Department, I ask that it be the need to improve communication. I have sent emails that have gone unanswered since August. I am at a loss as to what I will say as a Government representative attending a public meeting on Thursday night, where all the criticism relating to the bus service will be levelled at the Minister for Education. I really would like to have a response from the Department before Thursday that would give some hope to those parents. As it stands, I will be going there with nothing.

Responsibility for school transport provision should go into the Department of Transport. The latter deals with every aspect of transport in the country except for the school bus system. We introduced free school transport last year, which increased the numbers participating. We really failed to produce the services required to meet the expanded demand. We only have to look at the situation in our schools to see that is true. We need to consider school transport in much broader terms than just rural school bus services. Much of the morning traffic congestion in our towns and villages is a consequence of people driving their children to school because the roads are not safe for cycling and the footpaths are too narrow for walking. Parents become concerned for their children's well-being and that leads to more parents driving the children to school. We need to look in its entirety at the question of how we get our children to school in a safe manner.

I ask the Minister of State to get back to me before Thursday with a response on the issues in Moneystown. That would at least mean I can go to the meeting and tell the parents that although we have failed in the past three weeks to provide a bus service, we are working on it and should have something for them in the short term.

Deputy Jennifer Murnane O'Connor

There are massive issues with school transport. There has been a 22% increase in the number of tickets allocated but, in some cases, there are no buses to operate the service. Last year, funding was put in place to increase capacity but loads of children were left without a seat. Some families in Carlow tell me there is no driver to serve a central location. They have to wait for a bus when it would be quicker for them to stay in the car and drive ahead with the child to school. There does not seem to be joined-up thinking. I know of a family in which two of the children got tickets and one did not. I really do not understand how that can happen. There are often empty seats on buses that pass by the homes of students who were not allocated a ticket. While this may be a temporary situation, there is no waiting list for such children to be offered that seat on that day to help take the pressure off their parents and reduce car traffic. Sometimes, a bus might have a full allocation of seats but some students might not take up their place. Those seats are often left empty for weeks. We need a joined-up approach between the Department, Bus Éireann and schools. That is not happening. I could give loads of examples but I will refer to one I am working on at the moment. A parent in my constituency contacted me to say a child was allocated a concessionary ticket but did not get a place. The bus passes right by the family's door. The school is in the small village of Gowran in County Kilkenny, near the Carlow border. There is a bus going to the Kilkenny school but this family cannot access it. The same family cannot access public transport to any of the secondary schools in Carlow. I am worn out from contacting the Department about it. Like so many parents, I am still waiting for a response. The second level school in Gowran was closed in 2005. There is no public transport route for pupils. It is a huge issue.

Another issue with school transport provision in Carlow is that there are not enough drivers to accommodate the increase in students. I have parents telling me about children being left behind on the road waiting for State-supported services because there is oversubscription. The age restriction on drivers is mentioned often and I just cannot understand how it is happening. There are people over 70 who are fit, healthy and willing to drive the school buses. A number of men and women aged over 70 have come to me who are in the full of their health. They are willing to take medical and eye tests and do anything the Department wants to prove their fitness. They would love to continue doing what they are doing. The part-time work suits them and gets them out of the house. They have been doing it for years. However, the Department is adamant that such people will not be allowed to drive a school bus, as stated in a letter I got back from it.

I am really concerned about these issues. While I know the Minister of State is trying to do her best, there is something seriously wrong with the school transport system and it has been going on too long. Every summer, we all get the telephone calls and we are worn out trying to contact Bus Éireann. We are not getting the feedback we should be getting. It would be a good idea to put school transport provision under the remit of the Department of Transport. Something needs to be done because what we have is not working. I ask the Minister of State to go back and see what can be done for the parents about whom I have contacted her, her Department and Bus Éireann. I am contacting everybody. I really need something to be done.

Deputy Fergus O'Dowd

The number of contributors to the debate, from a number of different constituencies, shows the importance of this issue. The demand for school transport is rising because our population is growing. There are new housing developments in every county that are not on any public transport route, which creates problems. It is important when planning permission is being given to ensure there is a transport corridor that can and will be used. More than 150,000 children go to school every day on school transport. We all acknowledge and welcome that. There are 18,000 children with special educational needs taking school transport. Notwithstanding the individual difficulties we all encounter in our constituencies, when we meet children and families in that situation, the Department makes a huge effort to resolve the problem and, in the vast majority of cases, it is able to do so. More than 5,400 children from Ukraine and now living in Ireland are availing of school transport. The situation is not all bad. There are a lot of good things happening.

However, I will focus on where the issues are arising in my constituency. We have issues in east Meath, in Clogherhead and Collon, and in Dunleer, Darver and Tinure. Concerns arise on different routes where children are eligible for transport but there are no services available or Bus Éireann is still trying to secure services. I met recently with a person who runs a private bus company. He showed me a letter he received from Bus Éireann stating that if he could supply as a matter of urgency a bus for school transport and a driver, Bus Éireann would be more than happy to take up that offer. The difficulty, as Deputy Murnane O'Connor alluded to, is that the only bus drivers he can offer are over 70 years of age. It is not acceptable that they are excluded. If a driver meets the medical, vision and hearing requirements that are critical for driving a bus and if he or she has insurance, there is no risk in taking on somebody of that age. I reached the ripe young age of 75 last week. I am not a bus driver and, in fact, my wife does not think I am a great car driver at times. I hope she does not hear what I have said or she will give out to me. My point is that, in the modern world, many people, as they age, are very capable of driving buses or of being a Minister, if the Taoiseach would wish to appoint me.

Age should not come into it if the person is physically fit, is able, has all the requirements and can get insurance.

There is another issue with concessionary applicants who have had tickets for years. If it is a concessionary ticket the name goes into the lottery. What happens? Somebody who has applied in their first year as a concessionaire may get the place, meaning someone who may have had four years on the school bus is left out on the road. It is not good enough. We need change. While I accept there is a review, the sooner we get those changes in place, the better.

Deputy Louise O'Reilly

I very much welcome this debate. I wholeheartedly endorse Deputy O'Dowd's call for change. It has never been more needed. I am also trying hard not to enjoy all the Government speakers coming to the House to speak about the deplorable state in which the Government has left transport for kids trying to get to school.

We all know that school transport is an essential service, particularly in my constituency and constituencies like it. Vast swathes of north County Dublin are rural and we have urban areas, towns and villages, with children and learners commuting between them. Many learners in my constituency want to attend a school in their catchment area but may need to leave their immediate vicinity to be able to access the school of their choice, be that a Gaelscoil, an Educate Together school or a school for children with special needs. In many families, the parents are working and commuting and cannot bring the students in the family to school, so they are reliant on public transport. I spent much of the summer engaging on behalf of many parents in my area to try to ensure they have a secure route to school for their kids. In some cases, parents have had to change jobs. Some have had to change shifts and others had to go part time in order to get their children to school.

One of the areas where this problem is highly pronounced is Balbriggan where Coláiste Ghlór na Mara services a massive catchment area. We do not have enough Gaelscoileanna in my constituency. There are 35 students in the school who live in Swords. Many of them went to Gaelscoil Bhrian Bóroimhe, which is a feeder school for Coláiste Ghlór na Mara, yet they have been told the school they should go to is Gaelcholáiste Reachrann in Donaghmede. Many of them were denied a place there, so they have no choice. They have approached a local private provider which stated it has the capacity to get the students to school, yet there does not seem to be a resolution. It makes me wonder if this Government is committed at all to Irish medium education because it is not facilitating these students.

Deputy Réada Cronin

I wrote a couple of pages on this issue but I could have written a book on the state of school transport in north Kildare. The Minister knows how often I have been in touch with her about this, particularly about the 41 children from Rathcoffey and Straffan who are trying to get to school in Celbridge and Maynooth. She knows how often I have stopped her in the Chamber to tell her about the trouble these families are having because they cannot get a place on a school bus for their children. I tell her about the mothers like Anne-Marie and Michelle, who I was talking to earlier, who are worried about having to give up work to get their children to school. One of them told me she is a professional woman who has battled the corporate world to make it to the board and into top management. She is worried that with no bus ticket for her child, she may have to go part time to get her child to school. This is 2023 and a school transport issue is now an equality issue for that mother.

Is there any joined-up thinking? The Minister of State, Deputy Madigan, was asked that question by a Government Deputy a couple of minutes ago. The Government is running a ridiculous "Why your journey counts" campaign while forcing families to put their children into cars to get them to school. It is not a farce; it is a three-ring circus of neglect, indifference and incompetence.

When I submit parliamentary questions the Department's responses are mortifying. They are cut-and-paste replies. They are so out of touch that I am embarrassed to send them to parents. We need an urgent review of school transport because the criteria, even when we know what they are, are out of date. On distance, the closest schools are often full and the admissions policy might exclude children. The so-called agreed selection process on concessionary tickets is a mystery. What process is agreed and with whom? Parents need to know.

The route between Straffan and Rathcoffey is served by a 58-seater and a 16-seater bus. If we had two 58-seater buses, it would sort out the problem for 41 children. The Minister of State was so gung ho about trying to get kudos for the free school bus plan last year that she neglected to ensure sufficient buses were available to implement it. In north Kildare, this has left 41 children paying the price for the Government's vanity, neglect, indifference and incompetence.

Deputy Peter Fitzpatrick

Last October, the Department initiated a review of the school transport scheme, which included an examination of the current scheme, how it operates and its broader effectiveness and sustainably. This was to ensure adequate support and the provision of services to students and families. The final report has not been published. It is important to acknowledge that there was a significant investment in school transport last year at a time when many families needed it. This was really appreciated by many families. This year, however, my constituency office was again inundated with calls from parents who are struggling to get access to public transport. They have queries about buses not running due to non-availability and the poor rates paid to private operators and previous concession ticket holders being rejected despite free seats being available on buses.

In today's society the majority of people work to end make ends meet. Getting children to school is a huge stress. School transport is even more important to families who have a child with special educational needs. Why are issues with under-provision raised every year? Should parents risk losing their jobs to drive their children to school because they can no longer rely on buses that had been available for years? When families have a special child they need actual support but they do not get responses from the dedicated support email facility provided by Bus Éireann. These people have big issues with that. This is causing unnecessary stress to many people. It has caused many difficulties and division in rural areas. Children are only eligible at primary school level if they attend their nearest national school and reside not less than 3.2 km from the school. At post-primary level, they must attend their nearest post-primary school and reside not less than 4.8 km from the school.

If we want to get people out of their cars, we need to move away from eligibility criteria and towards provision for all. We need to ensure better access to capacity and resources. How can we do that when there is so much red tape? Some bus services apply an arbitrary age cap, which restricts drivers from taking on this part-time employment. We need to incentivise people, especially in rural Ireland, by removing any such barriers and rolling out an attractive package. If we can get ahead of the capacity and resources, we can ensure an adequate school transport service is available to student and families. To do this, we must provide adequate funding in budget 2024 to expand the provision of the school transport scheme, with the aim of dramatically increasing resources and incentives, while at the same time addressing the impact of climate change by reducing car journeys.

As I said, a significant amount of money was spent over the past three years in County Louth and east Meath. I commend the number of extensions being done on schools. There is serious demand for school places, be it in primary or post-primary schools, and it is very important that money is invested. A lot of money has been invested in school transport, yet we have the same problems. A lady visited my constituency office this week who is spending more than €50 per week on taxis to take her child to and from school. She just cannot afford this as this affects whether she can put food on the table.

What is the problem? School transport has very serious issues at the moment. While I understand the Government is doing its best to facilitate Ukrainians and is doing a fantastic job in that regard, at the same time we still have a problem with school transport despite the investment in it. What can we do? This problem needs to be sorted out. Is the money going to the right places? As many Deputies have mentioned, the age limit for drivers is an issue. People should not be judged on their age but on their ability to do the work. In Dundalk, a large number of people who contact my constituency office want to work. Once people reach a certain age they cannot work. I have raised a number of issues and I ask the Minister to examine them.

Deputy Verona Murphy

This is my fourth year as a Deputy and my fourth year debating school transport. As bad as the school transport scheme was, last year's decision to give free seats on school buses to everyone in the audience backfired badly.

Private operators were left without any students on their buses and having to charge double to those who were left using them. Ultimately, their mantra now is, "Any route but a school route." They can only provide a driver, if contracted to the school transport scheme, under 70 years of age. This notion is 30 years old. The Secretary General of the Department of Transport should be called to task. He has been advised of this, certainly by me, for four years now, and he has not changed it. We have been conducting a review every year since I have mentioned it and we have not yet seen the results of that review. The Department does not need a review. It needs to understand where people operate privately and where there is a school transport scheme; they do not marry. We had the worst increase in fuel prices two years in a row and it took the Department almost three years to do anything for the operators it was contracting. In most of that time, their operations were unsustainable and they were playing catch-up. That is why they do not contract to the school transport scheme and that is why, this year, we have many routes that cannot be fulfilled. It is not only children and families who did not get seats on buses. There are routes that do not even have buses for all of the aforementioned reasons. I am not sure what the review will yield that I have not informed the Minister of for the past four years.

There was a misleading headline in a local Wexford newspaper last week. It intimated that we had given almost 1,123 extra school bus seats to students when what we had done was given 1,123 extra temporary alleviation measure seats. These seats were taken from concessionary ticket holders, whose middle-income earning parents are hard pressed to stay home to bring their children to school, and given to the temporary applicants. We did not increase the number; we only moved them around and left approximately 1,100 students without seats. Shame on this Government. I take no joy in the fact that every backbencher in this Government has come in here today to tell the Minister what a mess she has made of it and to tell her how middle-income earning two-parent families cannot get their children to school and are risking their children going to school on bikes when they know perfectly well there should be an alternative for the tax they are paying. What would have to happen for the Department of Transport to get a reprimand from this Government or its Minister to say why has is not sorted out this mess. This is something that is well known. It is not something we can do overnight. There should be preparation and planning for the number of children we take in.

I absolutely refute Deputy O'Dowd's figure of more than 5,000 children. There are nearly 1,100 in Wexford and we have 26 counties which are availing of the transport scheme. I am sure there are many more children who have come in who we did not plan for, leaving those in the lurch who have actually had tickets for up to five years in some cases, and who are now not able to travel on the school bus with their friends. This is absolutely unnecessary. It is a disgrace that we should be talking about it, given that it has been four years since I have been elected, and I would say probably 24 years for everybody else.

It is a pity the main line Minister is not here because she is the one responsible. Her Department created a big spin by giving out free school transport seats and the following year putting many private operators out of business. There is nobody to take up the slack. The Minister of State should plan properly.

An Ceann Comhairle

Our next slot, a bit like a lucky dip, is Deputy Troy sharing with Deputies Colm Burke, Flaherty, Chris O'Sullivan and McGuinness.

Deputy Mattie McGrath

The Dolly mixture.

Deputy Robert Troy

I welcome the opportunity to contribute to this debate. School transport, as many have said, is a critical service, particularly in rural constituencies and yet still, every year, as the previous speaker has said, we are in here in September or even October talking about the shortcomings of this critical scheme. Last year, there was a review promised. That review was promised to be completed in advance of this school year but that has not happened. Why has it not happened? No doubt the respective Ministers gave the instruction for this to be completed, but who within Bus Éireann, the Department of Transport or the Department of Education failed to carry out those instructions? Whoever it is should be held responsible because reform is overdue in this area.

I will give a few examples of the lunacy that pertains in my constituency. In Castledaly, outside Athlone, there is an 18-seater bus driving by the gates of three families with five children being excluded because they are not going to the closest school despite the fact they are going to a school within their own parish. Those who represent rural constituencies know people want to attend their parish school. Some of these children availed of concessionary tickets in the past and cannot get them this year. It is a lottery. All that needs to happen in that instance is for Bus Éireann, instead of putting on an 18-seater bus, to put on a 23-seater bus where everybody would be accommodated and parents, who are working hard, could continue to do their jobs.

There is a family outside Killucan whose eldest son had a concessionary ticket last year. This year, his twin brothers wanted to attend the same school. Lo' and behold, none of the family gets tickets this year despite the fact that there are still spaces on the school bus. We have a family who wanted to attend a non-denominational school, and that is not as close a school. They cannot get a concessionary ticket either.

We have an issue with Bus Éireann, which wants to change the drop-off spot in Athlone servicing three schools. Bus Éireann is refusing to engage with the school authorities in relation to dropping off pupils for three schools. This involves multiple hundreds of children. It is a retrograde step but Bus Éireann refuses to engage to ensure they are on the right course of action.

We want to encourage people to use public transport. What better way to do that than by enabling children to establish this habit at an early age? I ask the Minister of State, Deputy Madigan, with the senior Minister, to identify when the review will be published and how they intend to iron out the anomalies in the scheme currently.

Deputy Colm Burke

I thank the Department and the Minister, and indeed Bus Éireann, for the work they are doing in trying to resolve the difficulties. The question I have to ask is why it takes until the schools go back after the summer holidays to deal with this. The schools return in September but we are still dealing with problems right up to October and November. We surely should be able to announce the decisions at an earlier date so that we can resolve the issues.

Another issue I wish to discuss relates to feeder schools. Where a primary school is approached and told it is a feeder school to a secondary school, parents then have the children enrolled in the secondary school and suddenly find they do not qualify for school transport. Surely we should have a mechanism in place whereby when a primary school is a feeder school to a secondary school, transport ishould be automatically provided. In Upper Glanmire, which is a feeder school for Carrignavar, it appears that some of the children are not entitled to get free transport to the school.

The third issue I wish to raise relates to commitments which were given previously. We have the situation in relation to Rathcormac primary school and another school that closed. When it closed a number of years ago, there was a clear commitment given that parents from the area of the school that was closing would have free transport to the primary school the children now have to attend but suddenly this year we find that commitment no longer applies.

There are some issues now resolved. I understand that progress has been made on resolving that problem in Rathcormac and likewise with Glenville. Glenville is a feeder school into Fermoy, but transport is not available for 12 children there. This could be easily resolved by having a bigger bus. There are solutions that can be found but it is a pity they cannot be found earlier in the year, in June, July and maybe even mid-August, rather than trying to sort them out in October and November.

Finally, I want to touch on the issue of discretionary seats raised by a number of colleagues. I have a number of cases where families have discretionary seats for four and five years and suddenly they are told they are not available to them.

I refer in particular to cases where both parents are working. They have a clear schedule made out but at the last minute, they are suddenly told the discretionary seat is not available. It is important that in cases like that where someone has a discretionary seat, it is not suddenly withdrawn. We need to be far more constructive and innovative in how we deal with this issue. The important thing is the time period for making decisions. We ought to be making them earlier and ensuring that the issues that arise, and issues will arise no matter what one does, can be more easily resolved at an earlier time.

I thank the Department and the Minister for the work that is being done. Hopefully the outstanding issues can be resolved at an early date.

Deputy Joe Flaherty

I will be as quick as I can because I have two esteemed colleagues, Deputies Christopher O’Sullivan and McGuinness who want to get in.

I want to use my time to highlight some of the school transport issues we are trying to resolve at local level in County Longford. I know of a young boy with special needs who attends a special school 40 miles away. He was availing of customised transport to date. A few days before the eve of starting school, his mother was contacted and told he would have to share the transport with three other pupils. As a result, he would have to leave the house at 7 a.m. and would not be home until 6.30 p.m. That is roughly a 12-hour round trip for a young lad who is battling multiple health issues. It was simply inconceivable. Subsequently, she was told he would retain his initial transport provider but several weeks into the school term the matter has not been resolved.

Elsewhere, several pupils on the Ennybegs to Longford town route have been issued with tickets for another bus, even though they could walk to the pick-up point in their local village. Again, there have been several unsuccessful attempts by parents to resolve this issue. On the other side of Longford town, I understand the bus from McGiffs Cross to Ballymahon is at capacity but a number of concessionary ticket holders are still seeking access to the bus. Another pupil with full eligibility for this bus was issued with a ticket for another bus from another pick-up in a village 5 miles away. There have been multiple efforts by the parent concerned to resolve the issue but the same wrong ticket was reissued on two more occasions. A family with three children on the Ballinalee to Moyne bus were concessionary ticket holders but, much like the man who was struck by lightening on three occasions over the past three years, they have not been lucky enough to come out of the lucky dip box for a concessionary ticket. Their father has pointed out that the school transport bus operator has a larger bus sitting at home in the yard that could be used to bring his three children and the other two concessionary ticket holders looking to get that bus. As for the Lisryan to Granard bus, the bus passes the door of four young pupils but yet they are expected to go to a pick up point that is up to 7 miles away. On the Keenagh to Ballymahon bus, siblings had availed of full tickets on the basis of a medical card but there is no ticket for that family this year. The mother was told the bus is at capacity. There was an expectation that they would have got the ticket again this year and this has created an extremely difficult and trying situation in the household. The Drumlish to Moyne service is overrun because of an inordinate increase in the number of pupils attending the school this year. This has had a knock-on effect for the concessionary ticket holders from nearby Newtown Forbes. As a minimum of 14 people are looking to access this bus, clearly we need an additional bus. Another pupil was accessing the service from Ardagh to Ballymahon. The pupil decided to change schools to Longford town. One would imagine it would be a simple task of changing a ticket but this is not so when it comes to Bus Éireann. Finally, I raise the case of a young pupil who was recently diagnosed with life-altering functional neurological disorder. He is a number of years into his secondary school of choice. It is critical that we are able to arrange appropriate school transport for him. I hope the Minister of State will follow up on each of these cases for me afterwards.

An Cathaoirleach Gníomhach (Deputy Seán Canney)

For clarification, there are two Deputies still to speak and they have 1 minute 13 seconds.

Deputy Christopher O'Sullivan

Fifty seconds is all I need and that will give Deputy McGuinness ten.

Deputy Mattie McGrath

Have you no parliamentary party?

Deputy Christopher O'Sullivan

When it comes to school transport and the review, we need to over-provide. This whole eligible versus concessionary thing has to go, within reason. It has to go for so many reasons, including for climate action because we need to get cars off the road. Traffic is clogging up our towns and villages. The busiest time, which people try to avoid, is during school times when the traffic is delayed. Parents are having to spend hours on hours in cars when they should not have to. Then of course, we need to do it for the students. This is my message here today: let us over-provide, within reason. If someone wants to send their kid from Clonakilty to Cork that is beyond the realms but within reason, let us over-provide.

The three black spots in west Cork at the moment are Baltimore to Skibbereen, Ardfield to Rosscarbery and Ballinhassig to Kinsale. We need to take note of that and get them sorted.

An Cathaoirleach Gníomhach (Deputy Seán Canney)

Deputy McGuinness, speedily.

Deputy John McGuinness

I just want to mention the service from south Kilkenny to Waterford and from Gowran to Kilkenny. It requires immediate attention because of the number of families affected. I ask the Minister to bring before the Dáil the complete details of the school bus system, its costs and so on and I ask that we put the school bus system out to public procurement as soon as possible.

Deputy Mattie McGrath

Some might say the definition of insanity is doing the same thing year after year and expecting a better result. This is a shambles. First, the Minister, Deputy Foley is not here. I cannot understand. I used to be in the Fianna Fáil Parliamentary Party at one time. You would bring these issues up inside in the parliamentary party, you would get respect and would get them changed. All the backbenchers were in here this evening lamenting the woes of Bus Éireann and the families that are affected by them. I do not know. They are the Government parties. Do they know what is going on at all here? I do not know. Incompetence-----

Deputy John McGuinness

Of course we raise it at the parliamentary party.

Deputy Danny Healy-Rae

And it did not do any good.

Deputy Mattie McGrath

Incompetence in the extreme is going on in Bus Éireann. In my short time, I will pick one area which is the over-70s, and ageist discrimination. I have been raising it in this House for four years with different taoisigh and tánaistí; Tweedledum and Tweedledee. They told me they were sorting it out. I was sitting here last week and I called up to Deputy Chambers, who was just passing. I asked him whether he could do something about the over-70s, as many routes have been thrown up this year because good contractors could not fulfil the contracts because those aged over 70 could not drive. That is discrimination on health grounds. I asked the Minister of State who shook his head and replied the Government could not do anything; it was Bus Éireann. I rest my case. The Bus Éireann mandarins are running the country. The Minister of State here is taking money under false pretences. The Ministers are not in charge. They should have the common sense to get out of the job and let the officials run the whole show altogether.

Deputy Michael Collins

The utter lack of accessible public transport in rural areas and this outdated system have left countless students stranded without reliable transportation to their schools. It is an absolute disgrace. The Government has the audacity to preach about reducing car journeys for the sake of our environment, but the absence of adequate public and school bus transport is a glaring contradiction that smacks of hypocrisy. So much for reducing our carbon footprint. Imagine a young mother, slowly going blind, desperate to secure school transport for her son in west Cork, only to be met with deafening silence when she contacted Bus Éireann. It offered her no solution and no hope for getting her child to school. And what about the child battling cancer? Imagine a young student, in the fight of their life, unable to secure a seat on a bus. Shame on the Government. It offers no solution, no compassion to children in such dire need. And what about the so-called concessionary children? One year they receive tickets and the next year they are left in the lurch. It is a cruel joke. We have families where some siblings get tickets while others in the same family do not. Parents are left driving behind the bus, wasting fuel and adding to our so-called carbon footprint. It is an absolute travesty.

Ballinhassig, Bantry and Baltimore are just a few of the places where groups of children are left without transport options. Yes, they might be considered concessionary but these children, through no fault of their own, cannot attend their nearest school. The system is broken and needs a complete overhaul.

Deputy Carol Nolan

The fact we raise this problem every year like Groundhog Day is unacceptable. I have been here since 2016 and every year without fail. it has come up. It is ridiculous. In a reply to a parliamentary question I put down recently, the Minister for Education stated that Bus Éireann had reported "a small number of families assigned to school transport services [were impacted and] a number of difficulties have arisen in some localities with just under 2% of contracted services nationally affecting less then 1.25% of those pupils". I seek a breakdown of how Bus Éireann arrived at that figure. I believe that far more than 1.25% of pupils are affected by this issue. All we have to do is look at the number of Deputies who came in to raise it here today. The issue is prevalent. During the summer, I spent my time trying to deal with many cases of school transport. I have seven pupils in Croghan, north Offaly, without school transport. I understand that during the pandemic, a way was found to run two buses in the same area but now the goodwill is not there when these kids are stuck. There is no public transport. It is causing the pupils and their families unnecessary distress. I ask for that situation to be sorted out as soon as possible.

I sent several emails to the Minister and to Bus Éireann. All I have got back is an acknowledgement and it is not good enough. If a way was found to get two buses into that little area during the pandemic, why can a way not be found now to get the same two in? It is just not on. We have a farcical situation here. There is time being wasted in the Dáil every year when the same issue arises. I am asking for answers. This is entirely foreseeable. If there was forward planning, forward thinking and common sense, we would not be at this situation and we would not be debating this issue again here today.

Deputy Danny Healy-Rae

First, I have to say that my family operates a school bus service and has for many years. All parents really depend on school bus transport to take their children to school. Practically all parents need their children to be taken to school safely. Back in the late 1950s and early 1960s, Governments promised that when the outlying school would be closed down, the schoolchildren would be bussed to the central school. Even last year, the Minister promised that all children would get free travel to school. She has gone back on that. If a child needs to go to school, there has to be ten children to start up a new run. That is not fair either.

I want to thank our inspectors, especially Michael Tyther, Tim Collins and Brenda Kirby in our local office school bus section, who have done tremendous work with limited resources. This over-70 rule is absolutely ridiculous. I have been raising it for three or four years now. All I am asking is that these excellent drivers be allowed drive once they present for a medical that is ordained by Bus Éireann. Bus Éireann is the only organisation that is preventing them from driving. They can drive the Local Link bus, they can take children on school bus tours organised by the school, the very same children they cannot bring to school.

I also have to say this. We need to treat our own Irish schoolgoing children the same as all the other children who have come into the country. While we welcome all those other children, there is an anomaly there. If you are inside the 2-mile limit you will not get what is known as a concessionary ticket but that does not apply to new children who come in. We have two sets of rules around Killarney and around many of our towns and villages whereby the new children who come in are bussed and it is organised for them but our own local children, whose parents went to the same school, cannot get that facility.

Deputy Thomas Pringle

I am grateful for the opportunity to speak today on school transport. I would like to take this opportunity to highlight an issue that has affected multiple schoolchildren who use the Bus Éireann school transport service in my constituency of Donegal. There is a major communication issue between buses and schools regarding drop-off times. It seems that the drop-off time of schoolchildren to schools is decided by Bus Éireann, based on fulfilling all the needs of the area, without prior discussions or arrangement with the schools. One constituent contacted me about her son who just started junior infants in Letterkenny last month. At this particular school, Bus Éireann has decided that the drop-off time is 8.45 a.m. However, the school is adamant that supervision of the children cannot be provided until 8.50 a.m. This means that children as young as four years old are left on-site without supervision. While five minutes may not seem long, those five minutes are excruciatingly long for anxious parents who are sending their children to school for the very first time and five minutes is long enough for very young children to find themselves facing a situation that they are not equipped to deal with.

When applying for the scheme there is no mention of the fact that this is a possibility and it is also not mentioned in the terms and conditions. It is very possible that some people are not even aware that this is happening. This could potentially be an issue that is affecting many children across the country and it is also possible that some children are being left for more than five minutes. It is not clear who is legally responsible for schoolchildren after they are dropped off by school transport and before the school is opened. This oversight means that both Bus Éireann and the school are able to pass responsibility to the other. Despite both Bus Éireann’s and the school’s child protection and safeguarding policies claiming to put children's safety first, I can only imagine that, should an incident arise, these policies will only be deemed to take effect once the child is in the care of the relevant body. Due to the fact that the drop-off time is imposed by Bus Éireann on behalf of the Department of Education, schools should be obliged to provide staff to supervise children from alighting from the bus to the beginning of lessons. I believe it is reasonable to ensure supervision for the few additional minutes where needed. Both Bus Éireann and schools are in agreement that it is the Department of Education that needs to resolve this issue. I have, however, raised this issue with the Minister for Education multiple times in the last month to no response. I am asking today that the Minister of State investigate this issue and ensure that children as young as four are not left unsupervised on school grounds for any length of time at all. I would also like to ask the Minister of State what the cost of providing school transport for all children would actually be across the country. I do not believe it would be prohibitive. It would certainly free up time in this House every year if every kid could get transport to school in the first place.

Deputy Catherine Connolly

I welcome the opportunity to speak on this, however short our time is. In her speech, the Minister acknowledged that this is a vital service and pointed out that it is going now since 1967, which is 56 years. During that time it has proven to be a valuable service but completely limited and exclusionary. The Ombudsman for Children in his 2022 submission to the review on transport highlighted a lack of transparency in how distances are calculated. As we know, issues arise every single year and this year is no exception, which is extremely stressful for children and for parents. In 2022 again, the ombudsman highlighted the negative impact on children of delayed decision-making regarding children's access to supports and services. He said that for this reason, decisions affecting a child's access to transport should be timely and made in the shortest possible time so that there is no barrier. I listened carefully to the Minister's speech and re-read it. The review started back in 2021, two years after we declared a climate emergency and a biodiversity emergency. There is no mention of climate change or the possibilities of expanding school transport to comply with our obligations under climate change legislation. I find that extremely worrying. I welcome the positive changes the Government has made over the last number of years but it is tinkering at the system and 56 years later, we deserve a proper review that should be published as soon as possible. The review started back in 2021, over two and a half years ago. We need a recognition that Departments are working together in respect of our climate change obligation.

The Minister tells us how many children are included and so on. I welcome all those figures. However, she does not deal with what has been mentioned by different Deputies such as drivers over 70. She does not deal with the amount of buses that I know are sitting in Galway down near the docks. They are owned by Bus Éireann and sitting there. I have no idea what the potential is for the use of those buses. On the local problems that we all have, some of those have been resolved.

If we are serious about climate change, surely we should look at school transport and how wonderful it could theoretically be, notwithstanding the problems. The demand for a school bus service has illustrated that people do not want to use their cars. They want a bus transport service to schools. Most of the peak time traffic in Galway city is caused by parents bringing their children to school. I myself have been through that. We tried to get concessionary tickets in the past. Sometimes we were successful, sometimes we were not. I was most upset that I or my husband was putting a car on the road to bring children to school about 2 miles away from our house because it simply was not safe to let them go on bicycles. I am appealing to the Minister of State, in the few seconds I have left, to realise the potential of free transport for the country in terms of climate change obligations. We have no choice but to look at it. We talk about the cost of it but we never talk about the cost of not doing it.

Deputy Violet-Anne Wynne

I begin by acknowledging the Minister's well-intentioned idea of last year to provide free school transport. However, it was poorly executed, as there had not been enough forward planning and it was incredibly disappointing to see capped fees reintroduced this year. I hope that next Tuesday there will be a line in the budget to ensure there will not be a reintroduction of full fees next year in this ever-worsening cost-of-living crisis.

Education is still a massive cost for families. It often seems like it is never-ending, especially with fundraising efforts and all that is involved in keeping a school running. That in itself causes families great distress and to have to contend with wondering how a child to school is a whole other level of stress that we do not want to see normalised and to become part of the back-to-school process. It is unacceptable for parents to have to take days off work to drop kids to school and pick them up. It is happening because there are so many holes in the current school transport scheme. Shamefully, kids have been left without a seat. That is not a great footing for a fresh start for any child in a new school year.

I have tabled many written and oral questions to the Minister in recent years about when the school transport review will be concluded and I have never been able to get a concrete answer. Families need real changes now. Access, which is what is important, is a necessity for rural communities, not a luxury. I am deeply disappointed that the Minister was unable to give a commitment today about when the review will be published. Families all across County Clare and the whole country are being completely failed by this scheme, and big changes must be made. The scheme in its current form is not fit for purpose and needs a severe overhaul. It is completely unacceptable to be waiting more than two years for this report when the issue is so urgent for families.

I will finish on this last point. Clare County Council passed a motion at its September meeting calling for the Minister to use bus drivers over 70 to resolve school transport issues. If drivers over 70 were allowed to be used in Clare, there would never have been a child waiting for a school bus that never showed up this year.

Minister of State at the Department of Education (Deputy Josepha Madigan)

I again thank all Members for the opportunity to update them on school transport. It is important to note that the normal eligibility criteria of the scheme still apply and that tickets continue to be allocated in line with these criteria. I know that many families, whatever their eligibility status, rely on this scheme and this consideration has been factored into the analysis under way as part of the review of the scheme. I have noted the contributions of Deputies here this evening and I will bring them to the attention of the Minister, Deputy Foley.

I reiterate that no service has been cancelled. Obviously it is extremely regrettable that a number of contractors have handed back contracts at short notice but Bus Éireann is prioritising the establishment of new services for the small number of families that are affected. Bus Éireann continues to engage directly with families affected and updates them with regular communications on the position with the transport services. I understand that the last communication issued on 15 September.

I remind Members that what is known as the exceptional interim grant is being made available to families of children in mainstream schools who, following the application process, are eligible under the terms of the school transport scheme and are awaiting a school transport service to be put in place. The Department has established this exceptional grant payment to assist with the cost of private transport arrangements families may have to put in place until the service begins. An interim special transport grant is also available to families of children eligible for special educational needs transport. Families do not need to make an application for these payments. Those who have been issued a ticket or are eligible for special educational needs transport and do not have a service in place will be contacted directly by the Department of Education with full details of these payments.

As I mentioned, the Department is conducting a review of the school transport scheme. The technical working group has undertaken extensive consultation, including running a public survey for parents or guardians and students who use the service and those who do not use the service but who would like to use it. These engagements have yielded extensive data to consider, along with wider considerations relating to the operation of the scheme. The group has also consulted with a broad array of stakeholders including schools, special education interest groups, industry representatives and other Departments. Once approved by the Government, it is planned that the review will be published. Once again, I thank all Members for the opportunity to update them on school transport for the current and coming school year.