I welcome Mr. Seán Kelly. It is important to have uachtarán Chumann Lúthchleas Gael with us today. The joint committee is doing a study of volunteering and voluntarism and is happy to have a contribution from an organisation with one of the largest volunteer inputs. I am sure Mr. Kelly is aware of the report being prepared by the committee. We have met interested parties, many not from a sporting background. We would like to have met Mr. Kelly sooner but are happy that he is here today.
Volunteers and the GAA: Presentation.
Go raibh maith agat a Chathaoirligh, a iar-Aire, a Theachtaí Dála agus a Sheanadóirí. Ós rud é go bhfuil mé san áit stairiúil seo ba mhaith liom cupla focal a rá ins ár dteanga dúchais ar dtús. Gabhaim míle buíochas leatsa, a Chathaoirligh, agus leis an gcoiste as ucht cuireadh a thabhairt dom mar uachtarán Chumann Lúthchleas Gael cupla focal a rá libh ar obair dheonach an chumainn. Tá an t-uafás obair dheonach ar siúl ag Cumann Lúthchleas Gael le breis agus céad bliain anois. Is í an obair dheonach an obair is fearr. Aon rud a déantar go deonach déantar éón gcroí agus ní bhíonn duine ag súil le haon rud a fháil ar ais. Dá bhrí sin is fiú an obair dheonach a coimeád agus molaim an coiste as ucht smaoineamh ar an ábhar seo.
It is a pleasure for me to be here as uachtarán Chumann Lúthchleas Gael to speak to the committee about voluntarism. The GAA is one of the biggest and best voluntary and amateur associations in Ireland and the world in its size, commitment and ambitions. The association was founded in 1884 on a voluntary and amateur basis and has continued in that way since. It has grown enormously in the intervening 120 years and consists of approximately 2,000 clubs in Ireland, 100 clubs throughout the world and 500,000 members. It has developed and grown. On a largely voluntary basis it has put an infrastructure in place, of which the association can be proud and which is the envy of every other organisation. It owns property valued at €2,600 million which is entirely non-profit making and solely for the playing of games. Each of these fields, whether in Finuge, Valentia or Falcarragh, was acquired by voluntary effort and people raising finance through raffles, lotteries, markets, fairs or selling buns and cakes.
Much of the work of the association is done on a voluntary basis. In my own parish of Fossa we recently opened a new clubhouse and two playing fields at a cost of €300,000, with a voluntary contribution of at least €100,000. In Canton, Boston, which I visited a few weeks ago, a fantastic facility has been developed with three or four playing fields. It is reckoned that approximately €1 million worth of voluntary activity went into the development. Such voluntarism is replicated throughout the GAA world. It has been our way since the association was founded and is continuing apace. The GAA club in Ratoath, County Meath recently opened a clubhouse at a cost of €1.5 million. It involved enormous voluntary effort. Voluntary work involves more than physical labour. Architects, engineers and other professionals often charge nothing or very little for their services. This is something of which we are very proud.
The association has continued to grow and develop. Clubs now cater for far more members than in the past when a club would have considered itself fortunate to have a senior and an under age team. Large clubs such as Ballyboden, Kilmacud Crokes and St. Vincent's now field as many as 50 teams and the vast proportion of this work is voluntary. This expansion has meant a need to supplement voluntary work with full-time officials. Croke Park requires full-time officials while in each county there are three or four professional coaches. The association has provided professional coaches for third level institutions because students do not have the resources to work on a voluntary basis. The association has approximately 200 full-time paid officials. The rest are volunteers.
We will probably need more paid officials in due course as the games begin to grow. We are certainly trying to grow our games. From the individual's point of view, we hope each player will play a set minimum number of games. No matter how good or bad a player is, he or she should be guaranteed approximately 20 games per year. Facilities must grow.
I chair an integration committee which envisages closer co-operation and liaison between ladies football, camogie, the GAA and handball. This will require more facilities at club level because we envisage our clubs catering for all these games as a unit. Rather than having separate football, hurling, ladies football and camogie clubs, the GAA will take ownership of all of them and there will be a single membership with sub-committees for the various teams. This has happened in many places. A number of clubs have adopted this amalgam. It is something at which we will be looking and which will require more resources and coaching. At national level our coaching manuals must change to incorporate the ladies games. We are pleased about this and will do it but it will stretch the voluntary effort. We will need more volunteers.
People sometimes wonder how the GAA can get so many to volunteer for activity at all levels. There are a number of reasons of which the first is pride of place. People are involved in their own club and take pride in it. They have a sense of place and community. They want to make their community a better place. The GAA provides them with great games. There are two main games, whether for men or women. Hurling and football are good games. People abroad who have seen them think they are excellent. That is an important factor.
It is also important that the games are Irish. As the world becomes more of a global village, people want to have something with which to identify and which is unique. Gaelic games provide this. I have seen men who were never involved in the GAA in Ireland joining, and even setting up, GAA clubs as soon as they go abroad. In recent years we have seen young educated Irish people, particularly throughout Asia and Europe, bringing about huge growth in GAA clubs. Last year the President attended the Asia GAA games. When young Irish people go abroad, they like to keep a link with Ireland and the best link is through the GAA.
The amateur status plays an important part. Every day people tell us our games should go professional. If our games were professional, we would lose half the voluntary effort. Our players must be well taken care of, an area in which there has been huge improvement. However, if we went professional, we would lose a great deal. Players would no longer identify with their club but with their pockets. This happens with players of professional games, for which we cannot blame them. If one is a professional, one wants to be paid and one will go where one is paid best. Colm Cooper starred when Kerry won the All-Ireland championship this year. The following week he played for his club and was out with the young lads in his club. He is now visiting schools in Kerry. The same was true of Deputy Deenihan when he captained Kerry to its fourth All-Ireland championship win in a row, although he may be embarrassed to be reminded of that now. That link with the club is vital and if the GAA went professional, it would be lost. One would then lose that lovely link between everyone in the association and the stars. We are all at the same level most of the time. On the big day the stars are in Croke Park but they come back down to our level again. People can identify with it. If there is a person from their club on an all-Ireland team, they can say he played with them and he will be down at the field the following week and so forth. Amateur status is an important part of our voluntary ethos.
While we have raised a great deal of finance ourselves, we have received a lot of grants at all levels from the national lottery, particularly in recent times, from club level up to national level. We recently received €40 million from the Government which was much appreciated. It was very important to us because, again, it was a vote of confidence in us. That is how people look at it. We see ourselves working in partnership, particularly with the Government and Government agencies, to try to better the lot of society. Essentially, that is what we are about. We have a great deal of work to do but infrastructure is in place which we would hope to maintain.
People tell me voluntarism is dying out. Perhaps it is to a certain extent but I do not think it is as bad as people make out. People are still willing to work if given the opportunity, encouragement and, above all, rewards which do not have to be monetary in nature but rather job satisfaction, knowing their job is appreciated and they are not burnt into the ground. That is one of the big fears people have in getting involved in organisations like the GAA, that too much will be left to them. When too much is left to club chairmen and secretaries, they get tired and all they can do is get out altogether but we are beginning to tackle this.
Last Sunday week in Croke Park I launched a club planning and administration course, in which we are investing a third of a million euro. The basic premise is that we will get clubs to examine their strengths, weaknesses, opportunities, etc. — a SWOT analysis — to assess the available opportunities and, in particular, provide for best practice. We have already done this in a few clubs. For instance, when Adare won the Limerick hurling title last year or the previous year, the club said it was largely as a result of that course which helped them to look at what they were doing, to reorganise, to get more people involved and have properly structured coaching facilities. This is certainly something which will help us big time, not just in keeping the volunteers we have but in getting more.
One of the problems with young people is that they are not given enough opportunities to take responsibility. They are not encouraged to do this but if they are, they will become involved. The European board is run by fellows in their 20s and 30s. The same is true of the Asian board and many of the universities. At the weekend I was in a club in Huddersfield where the chairman and secretary are two young men. They went over when they left college and got involved with the club and are as active as anyone else.
The introduction last year of the five year rule for club and county officers had a big effect. There was a tendency for people in the GAA to get a job and stay in it for life and not give anybody an opportunity to take it from them. If some whippersnapper went up against an incumbent, he was regarded as an upstart who had to be put down with the greatest possible speed. As a result, people did not stand for election. Now regular elections will take place because people have to get out after five years. I do not use the words "get out" in a disparaging way as people can move on to something else. At least there will now be vacancies.
Deputy Deenihan will be aware that for years there was no election for any office on the county board in County Kerry. First, people do not like taking on an incumbent because usually he is a nice guy and, second, they would have no chance of beating him because the incumbent knows the ropes and it would be impossible to beat him. The new system promotes mobility and will allow for the introduction of new people who I am sure will have fresh ideas and will reinvigorate the organisation to which we look forward. I am not at all pessimistic about the involvement of young people in the organisation, once they are given an opportunity, not overburdened and there is some recognition.
We are looking at a number of issues which, again, I think will attract many people to us. I am aware committee members are involved in discussing the issue of obesity in society which is becoming an important factor. We have also examined the issue in trying to get games for all and to spread our games in terms of not just having an A team, an elite team, to try to get more people playing. Last Sunday in Croke Park a recreational game was played at half time. It was developed by one of our members in Portmarnock and involves boys and girls from 16 to 60 years. There is no physical contact and a maximum of one hop and one solo is allowed. The purpose is to encourage people to play longer. Ageism and obesity are problems in society which we can help to address. We will launch our indoor games programme in Dublin in November. These initiatives will attract people because they will be attracted to what they feel is good. If we can get people playing on a recreational basis, they will also become involved in other areas. It will also be a help if we can let people know there is life after 40, that they can play until they are 50 or 60 years of age.
Alcoholism and drug abuse are major problems on which we are in discussions with the Department of Health and Children. We have set up a committee under the chairmanship of Mr. Joe Connolly from Galway. We hope, with our partners in government, especially the Department of Health and Children, we can bring common sense to this whole area. Because we have these missions and products, people will stay involved in their local clubs for life. Little harm will be done as a result. If there is a problem of alcohol abuse, it will be tackled.
There are a few other barriers to people getting involved in voluntarism. One of the big ones we have come across which thankfully is being tackled is the question of insurance. It was a big worry for many, particularly if there was a question of matters ending up in court. Thankfully, we now have a good insurance scheme and have all areas covered. Insurance is compulsory with the result that the individual is covered and will not be liable which is source of great consolation to those who want to get involved. The same is true in regard to injuries in respect of which we have a good scheme in place which is well funded. Those in charge of teams know a player will not be let down in case of injury. When the scheme offers insufficient cover, one nearly always finds that a club or county board will make up the deficit, which is important.
One area causing some concern is the question of players going to court which has happened this year. This results in voluntary officials having to go to court to defend their actions. I know from speaking to voluntary officials that the last thing they want to do is go to court. After all, they are acting in a voluntary capacity and cannot be expected to have expert legal knowledge. However, when they go to court, they can discover that some little thing they may not have done will be the cause of an individual winning. We need to tackle this problem because if it is to grow, it will certainly undermine our disciplinary system. As a result, people will decide it is not worth it to be a member of a committee because they may end up in court and they do not want the hassle. They do not mind being involved once there is not too much hassle. If we can remove this from the job, they will stay involved. They will take a certain amount but not too much of it, which is understandable. We are lucky because most of those involved enjoy what they do. They enjoy the games and like to see young people getting on and their club doing well. They also enjoy meetings and the social aspect which are all important. If we can reduce the hassle or stress, we will do fine.
The one place where we need to change — we are trying to address this — is in urban areas. Fast growing urban areas present a big problem for everybody. I am chairing a committee and on 22 November the Taoiseach will launch our plans for Dublin which will involve us in trying to get a greater market share for ourselves there, to get more clubs up and running and to have more people playing our games, first for enjoyment but also to raise standards. We will employ a number of coaches, three strategic personnel and three development officers in three Dublin regions. They will supplement rather than replace the voluntary effort. It will be part of their brief to get volunteers and coaches into clubs. They will oversee the job being done.
The GAA has been and is still strong on voluntarism. I have no doubt that by following the course we have taken in partnership with the Government and with the help of aid from other agencies, the GAA will continue to grow and serve this country largely on a voluntary basis in the future.
I found some of the points made pertinent. Some of the political organisations could learn from the five year rule. I look forward to seeing how it will work in five years. The political organisations have tried to introduce such measures but we still see many of the same faces. While they are good politicians, there is a challenge to let others come to the fore.
I commend the initiative on alcohol. The committee published a report on the matter and pointed out that being involved in sport or the arts minimised the risk of alcohol and drug abuse. If we can do anything to assist in this important initiative, we will be delighted to help.
The GAA club is the focal point of many communities at local and county level. No other sport can surpass it. People see pitch development on a scale that has not been seen for some time. Does this lead to a feel good factor that encourages others or might it cause complacency or jealousy? Is there a potential difficulty that success might result in people thinking everything is being done already?
What has caused the success of the ladies' game in terms of participation and spectators at matches and on television? Mr. Kelly stressed that volunteering is not declining in the GAA. It seems to be because the organisation is so proactive in getting people involved. An audit of the strengths and weaknesses in the GAA is being carried out. Is there any idea what will be done when those weaknesses have been assessed? Will county players play a serious role in local clubs to raise the level of involvement?
Other groups have told us that the best way to get people involved is to give them a specific role for a specific length of time. Of all the groups, a volunteer in the GAA would like to think his or her specific role would last for as long as possible, where volunteers in other organisations want as minor a role as possible.
The payment of amateurs was mentioned, that it would ruin the game. What about Croke Park opening up to professional games? Would this threaten the amateur ethos?
The president gave a very good overview of the GAA and answered many of the questions we would ask. He mentioned the tension between volunteers and paid officials. As the GAA is rolling out a major coaching scheme in Dublin, there will be more paid officials. Will people ask why they should give up their Saturday morning if these others are being paid? In time the GAA will have to compete with soccer and rugby in communities. That is good for sport because the more development officers there are, the more school children will be playing and the better that will be for schools and students. However, the GAA will be under pressure to put more and more experts into the field. Is there any way to ensure tension can be resolved?
Traditionally the GAA was a male dominated organisation. Now it is changing, with phenomenal growth in ladies' football. In Listowel which did not have a ladies' team for years there must be 50 girls involved. It is becoming very fashionable. Will ladies' football become part of the organisation? Would this be good for the game or are they better off on their own co-operating with the organisation? Is it the same for camógaí? Someone said camógaí should be renamed ladies' hurling.
Deputy Tony Dempsey is a member of the committee dealing with indoor games. Tag rugby and soccer are safe games that older people can play but Gaelic football without contact can be played for a long time. I was involved in a game in Tralee and Liam Higgins and others like him were playing. It was an enjoyable game without any contact. There is potential for participation long beyond the time when players decide to retire from football, which can now be at an early age. Players are under pressure to keep going with their professional lives and maintain a high level of fitness. The GAA is going the right way with an outdoor game and an indoor game that people can play until they are quite old.
The code of practice was not mentioned. There were court cases involving people working with children. How is the GAA dealing with the implementation of the code of practice set down by the Irish Sports Council? How will this affect coaches? Now, anyone taking youngsters to a match must have another adult in the car with them. I would like to hear Mr. Kelly's views on the matter as I have met people concerned about the issue. Where the issue does not arise, it is not a problem. However, there is a difficulty for those in proximity to clubs where it does arise. As far as I know, it has not arisen in Kerry.
Mr. Kelly was a teacher. At this time 20% of teachers are male, which figure is rapidly declining. Does this pose a problem for the games in that young people need male role models? Long ago the class teacher — the man, the male, the master — was usually the person who took young boys out to the field on winter days to play football. He also took them to matches. How is the GAA getting around this problem? Is it sending people into schools or encouraging female principals to ensure they include the games in the schools concerned?
Mr. Kelly spoke about the issue of amateur versus professional games. Deputy Glennon knows more about this with regard to rugby than I do but from what I hear, the professional game puts a lot of pressure on club rugby in Ireland which it is affecting in a big way. This is fine at a macro level, but it is putting a lot of pressure on club teams at a micro level. At club matches one does not get the audience to increase gate receipts.
I have spoken to county players in the GAA and they are prepared to put in the effort. They do not want to be paid as professional footballers. However, they would like some remuneration for their efforts. They would like to have something at the end of an all-Ireland campaign. They would like to be reasonably well remunerated. If a player is working in the building trade, he loses out by leaving a site at 4 p.m. or 5 p.m. to go training. No matter what profession he is in, even if he is self-employed, he loses out to some extent if he has to take time off. People are out of pocket. Is there any system of remuneration for them?
There was a suggestion that 10% of the gate receipts should be divided among players. This was proposed by the committee last year and we tried to push it in the Dáil. Many members of the committee supported the proposal whereby county players would get a tax credit. Does Mr. Kelly have a view on this proposal? There is a system under which athletes receive direct funding from the Irish Sports Council. Can it be extended to county Gaelic footballers and hurlers in order that they would receive a direct contribution or grant from the council? Perhaps Mr. Kelly will address this matter because the problem will arise again shortly and the GPA is starting to lobby. The committee would like to hear his views on it. The issue of voluntarism is important but so is this.
I thank Mr. Kelly for being here. He has made a worthwhile contribution.
I welcome Mr. Kelly who has made a good presentation on the position of the GAA at this time.
One of the factors which determine whether a person is a volunteer is what children want to do. The huge exposure of soccer and rugby on television probably determines what young people want. Does Mr. Kelly think the GAA is losing out with regard to the number of games presented on television compared to other sports to which children are attracted and parents accordingly? Parents will follow the child wherever he or she wants to go and lend their support to that particular sport.
Mr. Kelly mentioned a new initiative which will be launched in Dublin next month. Large estates do not place an emphasis on attracting young people to play games. This is not as strong as I would like to see. The same can be said about many counties, especially counties Kildare, Meath, Louth and Wicklow. There is much social discontent in the estates concerned. The reason is we do not have enough volunteers or initiatives in organisations to go into these estates and attract young people to play sport. What can we do about this?
I attended the launch of the interesting new club initiative in Croke Park. Mr. Kelly spoke about an umbrella body to oversee ladies' football and other sports arising from this initiative. Ladies' football is starting in many areas. While there are clubs which have been in existence for years, there are also new and fresh clubs. It would be ideal for the GAA to lend its support to the ladies' football organisation to ensure it has the right initiatives and structures in place starting off. We should look at the existing clubs to try to give direction to the new clubs. We should start off on the right foot with the ladies' football clubs and lend support. I would like to hear what Mr. Kelly has to say about this.
I was in Croke Park for the international rules match the Sunday before last. There was a lot of action from 60 year olds down to 12 year olds, boys, girls, men and women. Nowadays, when players reach retirement age, 35 years, they are fit and have had an active life and are looking for something else to do. Many are attracted to golf because it is a continuation of their sports activities. I play a bit myself. The initiative displayed at half time of the international rules match is something which could be looked into.
There is an argument about rural housing and development. There seems to be a problem in rural clubs in my area in that they do not have the numbers. Newtownshandrum may defy this argument as the club won the all-Ireland hurling final. However, there is huge pressure on the clubs in question because local authorities are making it more difficult for people to build in rural areas. The emphasis is on towns and villages. For this reason, we may lose clubs in the GAA, a matter about which I am concerned.
I visited England at the weekend. I was in Manchester with the Castlemitchell club which was playing St. Brendan's. The feedback was not good from the clubs. There used to be 12 or 14 clubs in Manchester but now there are only five. They are finding it difficult to survive. The problem is people are returning home. The initiative is to get second and third generation Irish family members to partake in the games. What does the president think can be done to help these clubs? They are keeping the flag flying but are under a lot of pressure. I spoke to many of them and saw the problems they experience. What initiative is the GAA taking to support them?
I will address the issues raised as quickly as I can. The provision of pitches will be an ongoing challenge for the association. In 1984 the target was that each club should have one pitch. Now, the target is two pitches for every club. Facilities have been improving continuously and, because of its scale and grandeur, Croke Park has set a target for every county and club ground. This will be an ongoing challenge for clubs, particularly ladies' clubs. One of the points that came across at our committee was that in planning for the future there had be provision for separate ladies' dressing rooms. All these matters have been brought to the attention of our club units.
The ladies' clubs have improved because their game is a good one. They have good support and remained autonomous. There has been debate about whether they should join up but a consensus has been reached between the GAA, ladies football and camogie. Amalgamation at club level is possible, as is co-operation with regard to fixtures and coaching at county board and provincial level to afford ladies' teams as many opportunities as possible to play games and draw up schedules whereby they can provide the curtain raiser to major matches, for example. However, they have autonomy to run their own affairs at national level. If we were to take over ladies' football and camogie, they would automatically drop in terms of priority. One can only have one priority and everything else is pushed back. If ladies' football remains autonomous, it retains its priority and will be able to secure separate sponsorship, media coverage, launch days and so on. Therefore, we envisage close co-operation all the way through and amalgamation, where possible, at club level. Deputy Deenihan mentioned Listowel as an example. It is happening with many clubs.
The amateur status of county players is an ongoing problem but one that is more pronounced in the media than in reality. Our players are treated well, particularly in recent years, and given, for example, opportunities for endorsements, adequate and prompt expenses, good medical care and so on. Most of this year's inter county players, from Kerry, Dublin, Mayo, Cork, Kilkenny or elsewhere, would say they are quite happy with their lot. I disagree with the idea of financial rewards for players because it would be difficult to draw the line in this regard. This issue was considered by the amateur status committee, of which I was a member, which decided not to introduce such rewards. The players understand this once it is explained to them.
I agree about the importance of taking proper care of gear and so on. The GAA would like to see a movement in the direction of tax credits for inter county players, though such a provision may not be possible for all players. The card system may also be a possibility as it could be facilitated without compromising the GAA's own rules. I was delighted to hear the reactions of Deputies Deenihan and Wall to the recreational games initiative. The committee is chaired by their colleague, Deputy Tony Dempsey. The recreational aspect is very important to us and includes indoor games and so on for both adults and the very young. Boys of six or seven years of age and above can play indoors on a day like today and nothing could be better for them. We will be spending a lot of time in the next couple of years in efforts to secure indoor facilities and acceptance for these games around the country.
The code of practice is important and an issue on which we have done a lot of work in recent years. Our committee is travelling around the country, meeting the people in charge of under age teams and emphasising the guidelines. Because we have been able to reassure them, they do not feel isolated, one of the potential difficulties for voluntary workers, particularly in clubs. As Deputy Deenihan observed, a volunteer is exposed to the danger that an unfounded allegation may be made against him or her. The code of practice and the backup we provide remove many of the worries people may have which are real as things can go wrong.
There is no longer the same number of male teachers coaching on the field as there was in the past. However, female teachers can do a lot and are prepared to do so if given encouragement. For example, a coaching course for trainee teachers was organised last year in University College Galway for both the GAA and one of our rival sports. I believe ten of the 200 students did the course for the rival sport while all 200 undertook the GAA coaching course. This is an indication of the level of goodwill into which we must tap. The school-club liaison officer in each club can help to fill the possible void because of the lack of male teachers who did so much work in the past. Most clubs are beginning to realise that it is a question of harnessing the support and encouragement that are forthcoming. Cumann na mBunscoil is doing a lot of work at national level and there is also much activity in vocational schools, with which Deputy Deenihan was involved for many years, and at third level. The emphasis is on encouraging as many people as possible to play and fostering a good attitude. Once teachers see this, they are willing to offer support.
There is no doubt that soccer and rugby on television present a significant attraction. There is probably not a child in this country who does not support an English Premiership team. However, the time comes when people have had enough and there is such a thing as saturation coverage. I am not as pessimistic as I was five or ten years ago because I have seen my own and other children growing up under the influence of this saturation coverage and supporting and playing soccer. However, in Kerry at least, when they get to adult level, the majority give priority to the GAA. Tousist, to which I moved only a few years ago, had a very strong soccer club 20 or 30 years ago but it no longer exists, although most of the population support soccer. Soccer and rugby are played in most rural areas but are not impacting on the GAA in a significant way because ours is basically a summer season, extending somewhat into spring and perhaps autumn. Most people who play soccer do so during the winter. It is good that these other sports are played. Neither soccer nor GAA can supply a player with games throughout the year but a combination of the sports will. The same is true of hurling. Young children — four, five and six year olds — will initially all be playing soccer, it is part of their psyche. However, as a consequence of coaching structures, tradition and place, and a good games' programme, we eventually reel most of them in. There is room for all three sports in any case.
The Chairman mentioned the issue of playing in Croke Park but this is not an issue for our players. Last Sunday the professional Australian football team played against the Ireland team and there was no difficulty. Much of it is about how we position ourselves. Our players are training hard and expending a significant effort and will consider whether they are being appreciated and rewarded reasonably. They will be happy if this is the case. I have spoken to many players and this is how they look at the matter.
Deputy Wall is right that the problems highlighted in Dublin are replicated in urban areas all over the east, including Meath, Kildare, Wicklow and so on. As soon as we are finished with our package in Dublin, we will be moving to deal with the same situation in these other areas. A significant challenge for the GAA is to strive to create a sense of community, to get people involved on a voluntary basis and foster a sense of pride in one's parish in urban areas. Urban communities are crying out for this because people want to identify with the areas in which they live. As Deputy Deenihan suggested, some more full-time officials may have to be appointed to advance this work. Most clubs in Dublin, for example, have only one coach. Players will not refuse to play for a coach who is paid because the job of the coach will be so significant and important that it will serve to increase the voluntary effort. That is the way they look at it, which is good. It would be problem if, for instance, coaches were running all over the country, claiming expenses but doing nothing. However, if a coach is based at a club, everyone can see whether he is doing his work. If he is, this will help the club, as Deputy Deenihan and I have seen at Kerins O'Rahillys which was the first club in Kerry to take on a full-time coach, Paul Hayes, who was instrumental in developing the club and its winning the county championship under Eoin "The Bomber" Liston.
On the amalgamation of ladies' clubs at local rather than national level, there is a problem for some clubs in rural areas because the population is declining and people cannot build houses, although these factors affect some clubs more than others. If a club is based in a village, it will not do badly because development of the village can take place. However, there can be serious problems for clubs not based in towns or villages, although this affects a small minority.
On the question of overseas organisation, committee members are correct to state emigration has slowed. This will not change and the emphasis must be on under age participation. We are investing €500,000 per year in coaching under age players overseas. I visited New York in July for the first ever intercontinental youth competition. Players came from all over the United States — from New York, San Francisco, Boston and Chicago — and Canada. They had come up through the ranks from under eight, under ten, under 12, under 14 and under 16. The club I visited at Hurlers Field in Britain last weekend, Brother Pearses, had previously always fielded all-Irish teams. However, it saw what was happening and introduced an under age programme. This year, in its golden jubilee year, it won the county championship with 11 English born players on the team. The product is there. If we approach this issue from the right direction and hold onto people, we can get results.
It is an honour to welcome an t-uachtaráin, Cumman Lúthchleas Gael. As a sportsperson, as most of those present are, it is a pleasure to listen to him discuss a subject to which he is obviously committed. I congratulate him on his presidency of the GAA and wish him well for the remainder of his term. While, of those present, I may be the only outsider looking in, I have no hesitation in saying this country would not be anything like it is without the input of the GAA for the past 120 years. It is an organisation which has no peer in amateur sport anywhere in the world. If there is a similar organisation, I would like to know of it. If there was to be a Nobel prize on a worldwide basis for community work, it would win it. Perhaps I am privileged in having a degree of objectivity about the organisation, but the quality and quantity of work done by the GAA in all our communities are unsurpassed.
As a group of sportspeople, we have given in to the natural temptation to chat about our favourite topic. In doing so, we have probably lost some of the focus on the primary theme — voluntarism. I have a rugby background and was heavily involved when what is euphemistically referred to as the "open game" suddenly descended upon us in 1995. At the time I was manager of the Leinster senior side, working with a group of approximately 40 people who I had painstakingly organised over the previous four or five years on an amateur basis. Suddenly, overnight, I had a budget of almost £1 million, 40 to 45 employees and a large degree of responsibility for their careers. When I got over the initial shock, I did not like what I saw or what I was doing on a daily basis. I left the job after a couple of years, although I undertook to oversee the changeover.
The values I grew up with in amateur sport, particularly community sport, were markedly absent from the "open game", as it was called. As time has passed in the past nine years, these values have become increasingly diminished.
Rugby turned professional due to global pressures. Ireland was the last country to be a candidate for the professional game simply because of basic economics. The major push came from the southern hemisphere and Ireland got sucked into it. I am delighted that the same global pressures do not apply to Cumman Lúthchleas Gael, although there are certain pressures from within the country to move in that direction. I have stated publicly and have no hesitation in restating I hope the GAA never moves in that direction because it would diminish the organisation and Irish life as a result.
I do not want to be misunderstood. I fully accept the importance of professional assistance in all sports bodies but there is only so much volunteers can do. However, when the primary exposition of the particular sporting endeavour becomes professional, problems arise — I include in this coaching and selecting. The payment of individuals for their input to any sport should be kept as far away as possible from the playing arena.
I was delighted and agree with the optimism of an tUachtaráin in regard to voluntarism which is probably not in as poor a state as we are led to believe. If the package and product are right, one will not just survive but thrive. The five year rule is an excellent one and other organisations with which I am more familiar could benefit from it. However, Mr. Kelly may have undersold the organisation. He wondered why players also involved in other games generally came back to the GAA when they reached a certain age. I have no doubt they do this for the sense of family in the GAA, not only in the micro but also the macro sense of the word "family". It is the sense of family and community that gives a real identity to the GAA wherever one goes.
I particularly compliment the GAA on the manner in which it has treated women in Irish sport. It was miles ahead of other organisations, particularly in the major sports of soccer, rugby and golf. It was well ahead in terms of the respect with which women were treated when women's issues became active political issues. It is now reaping the benefits of this in that the role of women in GAA clubs is taken for granted. They could be a chairperson or a secretary, work in the kitchen or on the playing field. No other sport has that and it is the secret of the community and family atmosphere that pervades every GAA club. I have no doubt about the GAA's capacity to flourish in the future on the back of voluntary effort. It is a labour of love.
Mr. Kelly mentioned the spectre of litigation. It is a problem on and off the field, shared with every other sport. The thought of any sporting dispute ending up in the courts appals us all but it has become an all too frequent occurrence. Has the association considered the court of arbitration for sport systems and at what stage is the debate within the organisation on this issue? The international model can offer a great deal to sport in this country. The future of sport in this country is dominated by Cumann Lúthchleas Gael and long may that continue to be the case.
Cuirim fáilte roimh uachtarán Chumann Lúthchleas Gael go dtí an comhchoiste. Tá lúcháir orm deis a bheith orm casadh air agus cúpla rud a rá. Bhí mé ar mo bhealach go Cill Chainnigh cúpla seachtain ó shin agus bhí mé ag éisteacht le clár Marian Finucane. Bhí an t-uachtarán faoi agallamh agus ag inse fána chuid oideachais i gCiarraí agus ag teacht go Coláiste Phádraig i mBaile Átha Cliath. Chuir sé in iúl dom an bealach a shiúil mé féin go dtí Coláiste Phádraig ó Choláiste Íosagáin i mBaile Bhuirne. D'imir mé na cluichí don chéad uair i gColáiste Íosagáin. An bhliain sula d'fhág mé, bhuaigh muid Corn na Mumhan.
Tá creidiúint mhór ag dul do Chumann Lúthchleas Gael as an obair atá déanta aige le céad bliain ag cur cúrsaí spóirt sa tír seo chun tosaí. Tá tagairt déanta ag na Teachtaí Deenihan, Wall agus Glennon do chúrsaí spóirt. Aithnímid go léir an t-ionchur atá déanta aige ar mhaith na tíre ar fad. Chomh maith leis sin, ba mhaith liom aitheantas a thabhairt don tacaíocht atá ag an CLG do réimsí de chultúr na tíre — an Ghaeilge, an ceol, an damsha agus an t-amhránaíocht, Scór na nÓg, ranganna Gaeilge agus tráthanna na gceist. Ní amháin go gclúdaíonn sé cúrsaí spóirt ach réimse iomlán cultúir fosta agus tugaimid aitheantas dá n-iarrachtaí.
Bíonn na bunscoileanna mar nurseries ag na cluichí Gaelacha. Bhí mé i gComórtas na mBunscoil i mBaile Átha Cliath nuair a bhí mé ag teagasc. I mo pharóiste féin, tá cúig bhunscoil agus nuair a bhí mé ag teagasc ansin, bhí cúigear dena príomhoídí ina bhfear. Níl ach duine amháin ina fhear anois. I mo scoil féin bhí cúigear fear agus ban amháin agus anois, tá seisear ban agus fear amháin. Thagair an t-uachtarán dó sin. Tá lúcháir orm go bhfuil na mná an-ghníomhach san fhóchumann agus tá súil agam go mbeidh siad in ann an nós sin a bhí sna bunscoileanna a leanúint agus go mbeidh na páistí ag imirt cluichí Gaelacha.
Ó cuireadh rial 21 ar cheal, cén tionchar a bhí ag sin ar an chluiche agus ar an eagraíocht i dTuaisceart na hÉireann? An rud maith a bhí ann nó rud olc nuair a amharctar siar air?
This may be controversial but I have been here long enough to remember a well organised campaign by the GAA for the removal of VAT from camáin. Caidé a tharla? Ar tarraingíodh siar an VAT nó an bhfuil sé ansin go fóill? Má tá sé ansin, is it your intention to resume the campaign?
Ba mhaith liom tuilleadh a rá ach tá ceisteanna ag daoine eile agus tá an t-am ag éirí gairid. Tá lúcháir orm deis a bheith agam an t-uachtarán a fheiceáil agus labhairt leis. Tá súil agam go leanfaidh Cumann Lúthchleas Gael leis an obair, ní amháin fá choinne na chluichí ach leis an chultúr ar fad.
I also welcome the president before the committee. We are honoured that he came here to speak about voluntarism. His patience and measured approach to the debate on the opening up of Croke Park deserves praise. It is a decision solely for the GAA and any interference by politicians will not help. I would, however, like to see a conclusion sooner rather than later because the present situation only suits those who want to attack the GAA.
The five-year rule is a great idea but does it have any downsides? Was any expertise that was built up over the years lost?
Safety in stadiums has been addressed and, for an amateur organisation, the GAA has its act together in Croke Park and local grounds, but more can be done. In addition, referees are not being supported. They are volunteers and I expect they get a certain recompense but no referee should have to put up with the verbal abuse that has crept into the game. Many managers, players and spectators, at all levels, think they have a divine right to attack and abuse referees. What is the GAA doing about this? Some progress has been made in recent years but what more does the GAA intend doing? A referee must be impartial. People think we are mad to enter politics but no politician with his or her wits about him or her would referee a football match. I pay tribute to referees. The standard of their work has improved and I welcome the introduction of referees from different provinces. Ten years ago it was considered wrong to have a referee from a neighbouring county. This is the one area in which the GAA has fallen down. Can the president explain the situation? Once again I sincerely welcome him.
It is the same as the glamorous granny or bonny baby competition. It is the same difficulty.
I welcome Mr. Kelly to the committee. It is interesting that his core contribution was based on the set up and structure of voluntarism. The GAA has never found itself wanting in terms of contributing to and building communities. As the Chairman knows, it also built bridges across the Border, in terms of the Ulster championships and cross-Border tournaments.
I was glad to hear him mention the diaspora. I was a member of the highly talented United Arab Emirates team in 1996 when a tournament was organised in Bahrain. It was a great celebration of Irishness, although the level of skill may have been suspect. However, being abroad for a year there was a sense of pride and, perhaps, homesickness. It was a way for people to express their love of being Irish and their sense of Irishness. It is the same across Asia and the world and not necessarily in traditional emigration spots, whether on the east coast of America or in England.
Can the GAA explore the possibility of an international gathering of teams from the wider diaspora, utilising our magnificent Croke Park, be it for a weekend or more? This would not be a problem in terms of financial backing, as there are many successful and wealthy Irish people willing to invest in anything Irish. At the time of the Bahrain tournament, many Irish investors competed to put us up in the Hilton, provide our air fare, buy tracksuits and provide us with sports gear. There is no lack of investment, financial or otherwise, in these different locations. It may be an avenue to explore.
The British Government has suggested that a stadium may be built in Northern Ireland. Is the GAA involved in the negotiation of this possibility? There is a stipulation that all codes would be played there.
I concur with Senator Feighan. Perhaps it is best if politicians stay out of the debate about the opening up of Croke Park. As we say in politics, it is a matter for the organisation to decide. However, returning to my point about the celebration of Irishness, we are proud of our Irish sports stars across the water. We are proud of players such as Shay Given, who represents Irishness in Newcastle. Irish emigrants there see him as a symbol of attachment. He has said that to set foot on the hallowed turf of Croke Park would be a moment of glory for him, surpassing anything he has done. This man has played in World Cup tournaments, but he said that stepping out in Croke Park would be the highlight of his career. However, I agree with Senator Feighan in that it is a matter for the organisation to decide.
I welcome Mr. Kelly. I am not going to ask any questions, nor am I going to make any comment about the GAA, except that it is probably the greatest amateur sports organisation in the world. If anybody wants to know about volunteers, ask the GAA. If anybody wants to know about the GAA, ask the volunteers.
Mr. Kelly has one of the most important positions in Ireland. It is a great honour to be in charge of the organisation. We are surrounded by great Kerry people in sport. I seem to be surrounded since I joined this committee. Deputy Deenihan, the Minister and the president of the GAA are all from County Kerry. I am honoured to be with these gentlemen.
If anybody wants to know about voluntarism, I can point to the Longford County Board and the Longford Slashers GAA club. County boards state the clubs have plenty of money and the clubs state the county boards have plenty of money. They will sort it out among themselves.
There is great tradition in the GAA. Someone asked me about the GAA recently in a radio interview. I said the association was right and will continue to be right, and I will back it no matter what it does. The GAA can do what it likes.
My uncle Jack lived to be 93 years old, and died earlier this year. He played hurling and football for Meath and Offaly, and was the only Meath man to captain a Meath minor hurling team to win a Leinster hurling final. He kicked the ball over the old Hogan Stand one day, although he told me it was a fluke. He did not mean to kick it over the stand. He explained that usually the full-back would say, "Jack, I will get the man. You get the ball." As the man had slipped in by the full-back, he had no choice but to give the ball a big kick.
Where did the man wind up?
: We never heard of him since. I wish Mr. Kelly well in Croke Park. As a County Longford person, I am proud of Liam Mulvihill, from Keenagh, and Peter McKenna, from between Lanesboro and Newtowncashel. That is our input into the GAA for the moment. If we were to give the same input on the pitch as we give in administration, we would be fed up winning all-Irelands.
Three members of the committee are from Donegal. We must look at the list of past presidents and consider the future.
I am substituting for Deputy Breen. I am not a member of this committee. I welcome Mr. Kelly. He gave an excellent overview of what the GAA is about. Many of us are aware of the valuable work it contributes to society at large.
The theme of today's discussion is amateurism and voluntarism within the GAA. We talked about not playing and not becoming professional. There are players within the GAA who have been supplied with items, such as top-of-the-range cars. This has been well-publicised in some cases. Where do we draw the line? Do we accept that some players should receive such benefits, while others make so with less and observe the individual with a nice suave car? Do we turn a blind eye to the situation?
Mr. Kelly spoke about the over-40s. Is it safe to encourage people to play GAA, particularly at inter-county level? People remain competitive. Their minds do not tell their bodies they are getting on. People who have had a good sports career at inter-county level should consider not playing at a competitive level. That filters down to club level. Boys think they can play a sport at the level they played it 20 years previously. What is Mr. Kelly's attitude?
Mr. Kelly mentioned golf. A GAA inter-county golf tournament was organised in Athlone for a number of years by the late Donal Keenan. It was extremely popular and allowed former inter-county players to get together again. In Ulster we ran such a tournament in Clones this year. They have proved very popular and are a way of telling former players they are not forgotten.
Since the death of Cormac McAnallen earlier this year has the GAA taken steps to facilitate the early detection of heart defects or health problems in players? Is the association proactive in this matter?
The international rules series attracted much attention. There is talk of the series becoming international and involving clubs in London and New York. If this becomes an international event it is likely that the question of professionalism will raise its head. Does Mr. Kelly have views on that issue?
It may not be fair to ask Mr. Kelly's views on the opening of Croke Park to other games because past presidents of the association will come together to make that decision. Nevertheless, I believe the vast majority of GAA supporters realise that Croke Park is an untapped resource. Opening it to other games would help to clear its debts and provide resources for coaching. Deputy Glennon has talked about not paying coaches. However, this is one area where the GAA must be professional. Coaches must be paid if there is to be consistency. Players must be trained when they are young. It is important to have professional coaches.
Provincial finals are the football and hurling show pieces of each province. Does Mr. Kelly think the Munster hurling final, like the Ulster football final, should be played in Croke Park? If the Ulster football final can be moved from Clones why should other provincial finals not also be played in Croke Park?
Reference has been made to abuse of referees. Many parents can make very hurtful comments about children. Concern has been expressed about suicide among young people and about people valuing themselves. Comments by parents on the sideline about a child's performance in a game can be very hurtful. The GAA should try to spread the message about the danger of abuse on the sideline. On occasion, the abuse children suffer is nothing short of cruel. Some of these children are not natural sports people. The great thing about the GAA is that it includes everyone and people perform at different levels.
The camogie association is fully affiliated to the GAA. Why are the three Southern Ulster counties not fully integrated into the Ulster camogie council? Last night I met a number of people who are involved in those counties and who felt they had been set aside and were being given the crumbs from the table.
Having come to discuss volunteering, Mr. Kelly is being tackled by forwards, mid-fielders and backs. Deputy Deenihan used the word "recompense" for volunteers.
I used the word "remuneration".
It was "remuneration". I apologise. Most people who have discussed voluntarism with the committee have referred to recognition. Would Mr. Kelly like to comment?
There has been a wide variety of comments, statements and questions. I invite Mr. Kelly to respond to them.
There is plenty of food for thought. I thank all contributors for their positive words about the GAA, which I will take back to my own people. It is very encouraging for us. Members have a wide knowledge of what is happening on the ground. I presume that is why they hold their political positions. They appreciate the role of the association. This is very encouraging for us and helps volunteers to keep going. Most volunteers do not seek financial reward. Encouragement and recognition are the most important things of all.
The five-year rule has been mentioned. It is too early to say what effect it will have because it was introduced only last year. I believe it will have a positive effect. It will not have a negative effect because there will be room for mobility. There are 12 positions on each county board. An officer may be chairperson, vice-chairperson, secretary, PRO, development officer, youth officer, coaching officer and so on. If Deputy Wall wished to hold all the positions on the Kildare County Board he could serve 60 years. The same is true at club level. The five-year rule will encourage people to move along the line, will bring in new ideas and will help to keep our thinking up with the times.
Litigation is a worry. Clubs and individuals are seeking interlocutory injunctions, which mean that a person gets off scot free. In such cases a judge demands a low burden of proof in an arguable case and no Irishman has ever failed to put up an arguable case. When the interlocutory injunction is granted the player can play in a major game and our disciplinary system is thrown into chaos. This is a major problem on which we would appreciate advice from Oireachtas Members.
We are tackling this problem to a degree. I established a rules revision committee because I could see that many of our rules were archaic and not in keeping with modern European law. Four or five top solicitors and two ex-judges sit on that committee. They are working night and day and every weekend and they hope to have recommendations for congress next year. They are examining modules on the rules, an appeals system, a tribunal and arbitration. This will help to stop litigation.
We have also asked our solicitors what we should do and we will provide a training course on best practice, particularly for our county boards. It has always been assumed that if one was elected chairman of a county board one knew the rules. One might then be faced with a smart solicitor who would argue that the three-day notification was not given or that a player was charged under rule 48 but found guilty under rule 49. We are trying to improve the association's knowledge and application of the rules.
Schools are very important to us. Tá an cultúr go léir an-thábhachtach dúinn. Tá Scór na n-Óg ag dul ar aghaidh go breá. Tá Scór na Sinsear níos deacra ach tá sé ann fós agus tá súil agam go leanfaidh sé ar aghaidh.
Ba thionchar dhearfach é deireadh a chur le riail 21. Bhí daoine ag rá go ndéanfadh sé praiseach den chumann, go háirithe sa Tuaisceart, ach ón méid a chloisim agus a fheicim níor tharla sé sin. Ghlac gach duine leis an gcinneadh daonlathach, d'imigh an riail agus lean an cumann ar aghaidh.
The GAA makes a VAT payment but receives it back by way of a grant, an Irish solution to an Irish problem. Therefore, it is not a significant difficulty at the moment. We have lodged a submission with the Department of Arts, Sport and Tourism for funding for hurling. The Minister, Deputy O'Donoghue, is very amenable in this regard and this funding would help overcome any other problems that may be apparent.
There have been some positive developments in the last year on the issue of whether Croke Park should be opened to other sports. The payment of the grant has removed much of the ill-feeling that may have been evident among our members that they had been let down. The Minister for Arts, Sport and Tourism, Deputy O'Donoghue, and other Ministers and committee members from all sides of the political divide have said clearly that this is a decision for the GAA. The same has been said by the FAI and the IRFU and this has removed many of the obstacles to debate.
People now know the GAA is under no significant pressure to take any course other than that which it decides itself. The important issue is that any motions which come forward from units should be on the agenda for congress. There is a motion for the forthcoming special congress which will help to ensure this happens. Some changes have taken place in the terms of rule 48 which was used last year to prevent a debate. I hope this debate takes place this time. It is then a matter for congress to decide.
The committee is aware of my view that Croke Park should be opened to other codes. Apart from the issue of the closure of Lansdowne Road for refurbishment, it is the case that Croke Park will be open only for St. Patrick's Day between now and the middle of June. From a business point of view, it costs too much for such a valuable asset to be lying idle for nine months of the year. However, many people do not agree with this view and I understand their position perfectly. These issues can be considered during a debate and the most important issue is that such a debate takes place.
There are no significant issues regarding safety in stadia because the safety officers are quite demanding and will not let us in unless everything is in order. Significant and often costly improvements have been made to ensure compliance with these standards. Committee members may recall that the Munster hurling final could not be televised two years ago because the safety officer was concerned about steps up to the press box, a situation which has since been rectified. It is good that standards are so high and that safety is always paramount.
A serious concern for the GAA is the situation of referees. Both the general public and the GAA often seem to subscribe to a cultural condemnation of those in authority, which applies in the case of the GAA to referees. At the first under 12 match a youngster plays, one will find parents and others on the line eager to criticise the referee. Children are growing up with this attitude, therefore, and it represents a significant challenge for the GAA and society in general to effect a change in this regard. We must start at this level while also considering such issues as penalties and rules and ensuring that rules are imposed.
A negative element of this year's championship was that managers were criticising referees from the beginning and there have been occasional attacks on referees at club level. This problem is not unique to the GAA as it happens in other codes. However, rugby scores well in this regard. There is a far better attitude to refereeing and discipline in rugby and we would do well to learn the secret of this success. The first step is to recognise the problem and we can then set about addressing it. The ultimate objective is to attain widespread acceptance of the referee, whether his or her decision is right or wrong. People must accept the referee's judgment and not go overboard with their angst.
Members' comments regarding Northern Ireland were interesting and correct. The GAA has a major role to play in building bridges and reaching out to communities on both sides of the political divide. The work we have done in this regard over the past few years has in many ways been covert, both at national and local level. It is evident from my discussions with clubs and communities in the North how much has been achieved. There is little awareness of how much the GAA has done on the ground to reach out and welcome people. This work will continue.
Another element of this work, as observed by committee members, is the GAA's support for the proposed new stadium in the North. The Ulster Council came out in favour of it and I agree. There cannot be a national stadium in the North without some GAA involvement. It would be meaningless without such support. In some respects, the stadium is not needed by the GAA, considering its significant investment in Casement Park. The logical approach might be to invest more money there and expand its capacity. However, because of the peace and reconciliation effort in the North, we have given our support to the new stadium and this is a positive development.
International games are important to the GAA. A camogie international took place for the first time this year, camogie's centenary year, for which the GAA provided funding. It was played last weekend and involved teams from the United States and Britain. Both mens' and ladies' shinty games have also been held in Ireland. Next year, a ladies' football international will be held, probably in Portmarnock or elsewhere in Dublin, involving teams from all over the world. The All Stars team will travel to Hong Kong in January and will play a tournament organised with the assistance of the local Irish community. The final of the Inter-provincial Cup, formerly known as the Railway Cup, was held in Rome last year and will be held in Paris this year on 13 November. All members are welcome to attend. I believe the former Minister, Deputy McCreevy, has to keep popping over from his new job in Brussels to see what is happening. The annual general meeting of the European board will be held to coincide with the game in Paris and a tournament will be arranged. The Murphy Cup final was played in Boston, the first time a competitive game held under the aegis of the North American Board involved a county team from Ireland, which is difficult to countenance.
Longford was the only county to beat Kerry this year and did so in the first game of the year, as Deputy Deenihan is aware.
It was like winning the All-Ireland final.
Neither the clubs nor the county boards have plenty of money. Some 19 county boards are basically insolvent when expenses, such as the cost of training teams, are paid at the end of the year. Clubs are ploughing all their money back into the game. They would like to do many things, such as purchase mini buses for the teams and build better dressing rooms, social centres and extra pitches. A club with plenty of money is one that is going downhill quickly. If there is plenty of money in a voluntary organisation at club level, there will be people with their hand out, siphoning it off. That will not happen.
The issue of players' cars is no longer a difficulty. The bottom line is that they are not paid to play. Players are allowed endorsements, however, and if a business wishes to give a player a car for endorsement purposes, the player is entitled to take it, just as he or she is allowed to take part in advertisements. This situation did not exist during Deputy Deenihan's time but it is in place now.
We were supported by Adidas.
That might have been illegal.
No, it was fine because the jerseys were made in Donegal. After that, in the mid-1980s, there was a deal with Bendix, about which I have no knowledge.
Nor do I.
It is correct that over 40s should play for recreational purposes and not take it too seriously. For this reason, I scrapped the relevant committee when I took over and renamed it as a recreational committee. I would prefer to see them playing at local level. If they want to play football for over 40s, county level is fine but it should not be taken too seriously. The recreational game modifies the rules by removing the physical aspect. Perhaps the teams that win should be fined rather than given a cup, for example. A penalty for winning would encourage a recreational approach.
A point was made in regard to Cormac McAnallen. The relevant issue has been taken on board and the medical committee are considering it. I intend to visit County Tyrone where the Tyrone county board will shortly provide defibrillators for all clubs in its area. The question of the international rules series was dealt with and the other aspects are straightforward.
Reference was made to suicide and I agree with the points made. One message for us all is to put the emphasis on the child attending, enjoying and wanting to come back. Too often in the past the emphasis was on the elite. The poor player was put in the corner and not given a chance to play, or else left on the sideline day after day. We are trying to change that and to increase participation. One of the key aspects of our coaching is that every child who attends a coaching session will have 200 contacts with the ball, be it hurling or football. If every child gets the ball in his hand 200 times, he will enjoy the session and will want to come back.
The point made on suicide was correct. Much of the problem lies in people feeling marginalised and not feeling a part of the group. Our job is to make everyone feel part of it. All have different talents. While some might not be able to play on the first team, there are other teams such as the second team, the recreational team or the social team. There is room for everybody, male and female. I think I have covered all the issues. Have I left anything out?
Mr. Kelly has contributed more than was fair. Sport has been in the remit of this committee for the past two years. If Mr. Kelly enjoyed his time here, he and his officials might consider coming back on a relatively regular basis in order that we can provide help for the GAA and it can discuss its progress. Given that there are so many activities and initiatives in progress, it is important we help in any way we can and give the GAA the opportunity to explore outstanding matters. This hopefully would be of mutual interest and benefit.
I thank the committee for inviting me. If we can be of assistance in the future, we will be delighted to do so. I thank the committee for its commitment to the GAA. I know many members have done much work in different ways, be it through helping local clubs or otherwise. This is important and much appreciated.
The joint committee adjourned at 6.15 p.m. until 10 a.m. on Thursday, 28 October 2004.