I welcome the Minister of State at the Department of Health, Deputy Anne Rabbitte to the Chamber.
Nithe i dtosach suíonna - Commencement Matters
Health Services
I thank the Leas-Chathaoirleach, and the Minister of State is very welcome to the Chamber today. I wish to discuss the investment into community rehabilitation teams across the country, but more specifically with regard to my own community health organisation, CHO, 8, which County Louth is part of. As the Minister of State knows, CHO 8 represents Laois, Offaly, Longford, Westmeath, Louth and Meath. It has a population of 592,388. There are no local teams, as far as I am aware, to support patients who are really in need of suitable therapies. The national strategy for neurorehabilitation states that nine teams are required, but according to the Neurological Alliance of Ireland, only two have been delivered. Everyone deserves access, as the Minister of State well knows, to community neurorehabilitation teams. Investing in community neurorehabilitation teams provides function and well-being for patients, and the Neurological Alliance of Ireland has stated that every €1 spent on teams in the health services could potentially save €11.
The Minister of State is well across her brief and she speaks to an awful lot of patients who are in need of neurorehabilitation teams quite regularly. For the record, the neurological conditions are stroke, traumatic brain injury, multiple sclerosis and Parkinson's disease. These can have a profound impact on a person's life. However, with the right support and medical intervention, these individuals can have opportunities to recover and have a far better quality of life.
Every neurorehabilitation team should have a specialised branch of medicine that would focus on comprehensive care for individuals with neurological conditions. These teams could consist of neurologists, physiotherapists, occupational and speech therapists and psychologists, among others, who would work together to assess the plan, and implement effective treatments and strategies tailored to the specific need of the patient. A lot of this is down to access, and we quite regularly talk at various meetings about people having access to adequate therapies in their own community. We all know the importance of not having to travel long distances to get therapies and treatments. To get therapies full stop is very important. Of all Ministers, I know that the Minister of State is at the very front of this.
I have met with a few multiple sclerosis patients from County Louth recently who have to travel to Dublin for treatments and physiotherapy because there is no neuro-specific care in their locality. This is obviously tiresome and costs a lot of money. They have to take time out of work or whatever to be able to. There is a burden from that travel, and it often takes the focus off the treatment and the recovery and on to that burden of having to travel. It is added stress.
I look forward to the Minister of State's response, because she knows. I do not have to convince her of the importance of therapies for people who have a neurological condition. There is a proven result when we have proper care and intervention, and we have seen it time and again. For many years, this area has been ignored, but the Minister of State is not one to ignore a challenge, and I look forward to listening to her response.
I thank the Leas-Chathaoirleach and the Senator for giving me the opportunity to address this important issue in the House this afternoon. The programme for Government, Our Shared Future, includes a commitment for advancing neurorehabilitation services in the community.
The HSE is leading on the implementation framework in respect of recommendations of the national policy and strategy for that provision of neurorehabilitation services in Ireland 2011 to 2015. The implementation framework for the neurorehabilitation strategy was launched in February 2019 and provides guidance for the development of specialist neurorehabilitation services across the continuum of care from acute, to post-acute, and community services. I am delighted the Senator raised this because I read in the Meath Chronicle last week that Ms Sorcha Burke, or maybe Ms Sorcha Boyle, I do not know which, lives in Ardee, County Louth. She is an multiple sclerosis, MS, sufferer and she talks very clearly as to the need for the community neurorehabilitation teams. I met the Neurological Alliance of Ireland, NAI, in 2023 in relation to their pre-budgetary submission. It represents 34 organisations. Senator McGreehan mentioned some of those organisations and the Neurological Alliance of Ireland also represents the likes of the Brain Awareness Week, the Huntington's Disease Association of Ireland, Bloomfield Health Services, Cheshire Ireland, Chronic Pain Ireland, and many more, 34 organisations. Their ask for budget 2023 was to appoint 20 additional nurse specialists across adult neurology. Not only did I appoint 20, I appointed 28.
That does not sit under my brief. It is the Minister for Health's brief believe it or not but because it was such an important part within the strategy, the acute services needed to be connected to the community to work the strategy correctly. I actually paid for 28 neuro nurses from my own budget into acute. That is done.
The next piece was to fully resource at least four of the seven required community teams in neurorehabilitation. That was at a cost of €1.8 million. I have appointed the €1.8 million so I have fully funded CHO 2 and CHO 4. I discovered why CHO 6 and CHO 7 were not fully operationalised. The reason they were not fully operationalised was that under proper clinical governance what was provided for funding in budget 2019 and probably 2020, before we hit Covid-19, was actually not proper clinical governance. Five people on a team was not enough, a minimum of ten was needed. Guess what I have done? From unspent money this year I will award the additional funding to step up the teams in CHO 6 and CHO 7. I have worked very closely with Mr. Brian Higgins and the HSE, which is under reform. To be fair to Mr. Higgins he worked in Bloomfields so he has a great understanding of the value of community neurorehabilitation teams. He and the HSE understand the connection between the acute piece, the community piece, and actually living one's best life in their community and being supported in their community. That is why we are stepping up and the advertisements have taken place for CHO 2 and CHO 4 as we are talking. Any unspent funding will go towards the recruitment and stepping up of CHO 6 and CHO 7.
That is the four CHOs reached. The way Mr. Bernard Gloster is operating since 1 January 2023 is that we will have six regional health authorities, RHAs. Why would I fund nine when there will be six? We need to keep it married correctly. What I will commit to doing is, the NAI need to relax on their campaign, and their marketing, and everything else like that. This is a Minister of State who has her hand on the pulse and knows exactly what she is doing, working with reform, delivering on implementation of the framework and the strategy into which they all fit in, but also actually expanding the teams. If it means we need to have 45 people on a team, which was what one consultant told me, we will have 45 on a team. That is where we have to start at ground level. I will conclude in the next part.
I would almost cede my time to the Minister of State because what she is doing is incredibly impressive, as is across all her brief. The Minister of State, Deputy Rabbitte, has always had her hand on the pulse of what is going on at a local level and national level regarding disability care, neuro teams, and all of that. I am scrambling to take notes on all of what she has been doing over the past couple of months and I will continue the conversation, and my scribbling, during her next contribution.
I have a lot to say on this matter because I seldom get out to speak about it. Community neurorehabilitation is incredibly important and when one talks about the strategy, what we want is people to come out of the National Rehabilitation Centre, NRH. What we want is people to come out of long-term residential care to be supported in the community. That is the priority. What we do need to do is work to the strategy.
I have to be fair to the Minister, Deputy Michael McGrath. I put this proposal to him last year as part of the budgetary process. I had to make difficult decisions and I focused on neurology, with the appointment of 28 neurology nurses at a cost of €1.4 million and the two teams at €1.8 million. They were prioritised within my budgetary line. The next step was to speak to Brian Higgins and Anne Ennis to understand why it was not working in CHO 6 and CHO 7. That was a vital part of the engagement in the context of the need to fund another ten people to have the critical piece.
The next matter I am addressing is the lack of a paediatric neurology strategy. We need to ensure children who live outside the beautiful M50 commuter belt, as the Senator and I do, and have to go to Temple Street or Crumlin children's hospitals are supported. We need to ensure those children are supported in Galway, Cork, Clare and everywhere else in the country. As I am developing a paediatric neurology strategy in budget 2024, people can relax in that regard.
Health Services
I welcome the Minister of State.
I, too, welcome the Minister of State to the House and thank her for joining us. I thank the Cathaoirleach for selecting this matter for discussion. Willow Community Counselling Services was founded by Sharon Malloy in 2018. It is managed by a dedicated board of directors. I wish to again put on record that I am one of those directors. I am seeking additional funding because I was told at a board meeting I attended last Thursday night that money is running out. If the service does not get additional funding, it will only last another couple of months.
Willow, and I as one of its board members, are extremely grateful for the €47,500 it has already received from the HSE this year. It has put that money to good use, making a direct and significant impact in Athy and the surrounding area this year. Like many towns of its size, Athy, which is my home town, has experienced an increase in the number of those needing help and advice with drug addiction. Without additional funding, Willow will have to close its doors in the coming weeks, which would have a detrimental and devastating effect on those who are coming through its doors in ever-increasing numbers.
Willow is the most effective local service in Athy. It has built on the trust Sharon and her team established with people in recent years. This trust has reached many within the community who previously never engaged but, rather, kept to themselves and shunned attempts to help them. Some years ago, Willow predicted a growing crack cocaine problem not just in south Kildare but in rural towns and communities throughout the State. Unfortunately, that prediction has come true. Those treating crack cocaine users point out that the fact there is no clinical substitute for the drug makes clinical detox problematic because the client first needs to cease using crack cocaine. This is why we need to fund established schemes such as Willow, which has proven it can get to those who need its help most and in recent years has established trust such that 80% of its clients come to its doors by word of mouth.
In the short few years since it was set up, Willow has seen an increase of more than 100% in the hours needed to reach out to those who need its help most. The group needed to find and relocate to a new premises which offers more room and privacy to treat those who need assistance. The new premises can now accommodate group therapy sessions, which are another important step on the road to recovery, as the Minister of State may be aware. Without the necessary funding, however, Willow will not be able to progress to this important step in what it can offer to those who need its help.
In recent weeks, I have spoken in confidence to several people who have been through the doors of Willow. The one issue that comes up is the life-changing experience that using Willow's services has been for them, to the extent that they are now offering to fundraise to keep the doors open. They do not want anybody to lose out on the wonderful service they received. They want to ensure the services are there for anyone who needs them. Last Thursday night, I heard they are organising fun walks, golf classics and fishing classics. That is what is happening. I hope the Minister of State will have good news for the service today.
Athy and south Kildare have their problems but those problems are also present in other towns and communities throughout the State. We are told by those in the know that drug use is a coping mechanism for trauma.
We have a service in Athy in south Kildare that is working, growing and, most importantly, needed. There is no need to set up another service or even start again. I hope the Government recognises the importance of this service in the area where I live. I hope the Minister of State comes with some good news because Willow Community Counselling Services have made a difference to Athy in recent years. The Minister of State is most welcome to come to Athy any time and talk to those who have been through their doors.
I thank Senator Wall for raising this matter. This is not my area of responsibility; I am here on behalf of another Minister. However, I would be very interested in going to see the services provided. It is extraordinary what the commitment of that community group and the drive of individuals in community support can bring to a particular matter. Sharon Malloy is to be commended, as are all those involved, on the work they are doing and the intervention that is being made. I know that Willow takes a broader approach than simple diagnosis and treatment; it also includes the really important elements of mental health counselling and addiction counselling, without which no long-term impacts can be achieved. I appreciate that approach. The Department of Health suggests that because Willow Counselling covers a number of different disciplines including substance use and mental health, and because they cater for young people also, there are broader streams of funding that may be available to them including from HSE mental health services, Tusla and other organisations. I do wish this was my own area of direct responsibility so I could provide a deeper answer to the Senator today. I apologise to him that it is not so.
I had understood that Willow was in receipt of public funding of €40,000 a year, although the Senator said it is €47,500, under the grant aid agreement. I am also aware that it received €15,000 in December 2022 in one-off additional funding for the provision of extra counselling hours. I hope that has been useful but it may have also shown the path in terms of quite how useful it is and how much more needs to be funded. I am aware of that also. The Ministers of State, Deputies Butler and Naughton, have published the strategic action plan for the implementation of the national drugs strategy for 2023 and 2024. The plan has a total of 34 actions based on the six strategic priorities following the review of the strategy in 2021. However, that only matters if those concrete actions make a measurable difference to the lives of people affected by drug use. One of the six strategic priorities is to enhance access to and delivery of drug and alcohol services in the community, exactly as the Senator has described. That priority seeks to enhance community care, which is important for people who are using drugs, by providing health and social care services at community level to meet the identified health needs. The Department of Health is very aware of the important role that organisations such as Willow Community Counselling Services play under the drugs strategy in assisting individuals and their families to cope with mental health and addiction issues. There is a commitment of the HSE addiction services to strengthen links with Willow Athy to support those presenting with drug and alcohol issues. The Department also suggests exploring those additional streams of funding, which I am sure the board has already considered and may in fact be activating at this point.
I thank the Minister of State. I appreciate that she is not with the relevant Department. I also appreciate the response she gave. She hit on one point I would like to take up, namely, the families affected. This is one of the areas that Willow would like to explore more. One of the reasons we went to a new premises was to accommodate families and bring them in for the care that is needed at this time, and rightly so, as the Minister of State said. The Minister of State indicated that the board of Willow needs to go back to the HSE. We will do that. I hope the Minister of State will also put a word in following our conversation today. The most important thing I can say is that Athy needs Willow and Willow needs Athy. We need to keep its doors open. The couple of weeks we have left needs to be extended. Even if we had another award of temporary funding, which the Minister of State mentioned previously - and all money has been very well spent - it would be much appreciated. I would be grateful if the Minister of State brought that back to the Minister and I appreciate her turning up today.
I can assure the Senator that I will do that. I understand that in order to have real impact, the support of families is central to the approach that has to be taken. Community-based drug and alcohol services are a key part of the national drugs strategy in assessing the extent and nature of the drug problem and really getting at the issues behind that problem, which are often extremely complex, as the Senator, who is a member of the board of Willow Community Counselling Services, knows better than I do. The complexity of the challenges associated with improving outcomes for people with co-occurring mental illness and substance misuse problems, or dual diagnosis, is recognised in the mental health policy, Sharing the Vision, as well as in Reducing Harm, Supporting Recovery: A health-led response to drug and alcohol use in Ireland 2017-2025, and the national drugs strategy.
However, recognising that no single service can cater for the diverse needs of service users with dual diagnosis, we have to improve the overall structure. Willow Community Care is exactly in that space. It is clear to me that the model of care provided there is part of the dual diagnosis programme. It is clear that a model of care that describes a clear clinical pathway for all adolescents and adults suspected of having a dual diagnosis are supported through an integrated approach through primary care, substance misuse, community mental health and acute services.
I thank Senator Wall. I thank the Minister of State for her time here in the Seanad this afternoon. Our next Commencement matter is that of Senator Seery Kearney. We will wait for the Minister of State, Deputy Thomas Byrne, to arrive.
School Enrolments
I welcome the Minister of State and thank him for taking this matter. I raise this issue on behalf of parents and residents within Dublin 8 who have a campaign seeking a secondary school in that area. Over the past number of years they undertook professional and fact-based surveys and analysis of the CSO as well as engaging with the community. Their findings are that in the area of Dublin 8 currently there are five secondary schools. That leaves a ratio of provision of secondary school places of 39 children for every one space in a secondary school within the Dublin 8 area. The same analysis conducted for Dublin 4 found there are 13 children for every one space. There is a disproportionate lack of provision for Dublin 8. The population of Dublin 8 has changed considerably over the past number of years. The five schools there are predominantly Roman Catholic or Church of Ireland, despite the fact that 53% of the people living there are of neither denomination. Therefore there is huge demand for having a non-denominational school, be that a Gaelscoil or an Educate Together which is not a Gaelscoil. Either would be fine.
When the Harold's Cross Educate Together was built, Dublin 8 was not deemed to be within that catchment area although proximity-wise it would have been closer than Sandymount Park Educate Together that was found to be in the catchment area. It is taking children up to 90 minutes to get to school at Sandymount Park. The statistics and everything about the situation clearly indicate there is a desperate need for a secondary school within Dublin 8. Sites have been proposed and suggestions put forward. I have engaged with the group. Recently, in a discussion with the Minister, Deputy Donohoe, in a different context, the Minister reflected that there is a system within the Department of Education that is very good and accurate at looking at the provision and forward planning of secondary schools throughout the country. Somehow that system has failed within Dublin 8. It is not working. Whether the population rise has been so significant, I am not quite sure, but a recent academic publication looked at the disproportionate experience. Comparing urban or inner city areas with rural areas, the chances of a non-denominational school being available are considerably reduced. We should be investing all the more, especially in Dublin 8 with its mixed community. The community there statistically has not attained the same level of third level education and progression to third level education as exhibited elsewhere. This is all the more reason for having one now in order to progress. My Commencement matter is to establish why the Department of Education’s system, which is supposed to be robust, has not picked up on this.
If it has, when can we have a meeting with the Minister, Deputy Foley, or an opportunity to progress with officials that the need for the school is established? Then we can have a discussion about what sort of school it is going to be but the need for the school must be established as a matter of urgency.
I thank the Seanadóir for raising this issue. The requirement for additional school places is kept under ongoing review in the context of available information on population, enrolments and residential development activity. In order to plan for school provision and analyse the relevant demographic data, the Department divides the country into 314 school planning areas and uses a geographical information system, using data from a range of sources, including child benefit and school enrolment data, to identify where the pressure for school places across the country will arise and where additional school accommodation is needed at primary and post-primary level.
Where demographic data indicates that additional provision is required, the delivery of such provision is dependent on the particular circumstances of each case and may be provided through: utilising existing unused capacity within a school; extending the capacity of schools; or the provision of new schools.
The most recent projections for the Dublin 8 school planning area indicate an increase in requirements at primary level up to 2026 and decreasing thereafter. At post-primary level, the recent projections indicate a slight increase in requirements at post-primary level up to 2031 followed by a projected reduction in enrolments thereafter.
A new co-educational, multi-denominational post-primary school under the patronage of Educate Together was established to serve the Dublin 8 school planning area, along with Dublin 2, Dublin 4, Dublin 6 and Clonskeagh areas, as a regional solution. In 2018, the school opened in interim accommodation and the major project, which will provide for a 1,000 pupil school when complete, is currently at stage 3. This new school will reduce pressure on schools in the Dublin 8 school planning area.
The Department will continue to liaise with local authorities in respect of their county development plans and any associated local area plans with a view to identifying any potential long-term school accommodation requirements across school planning areas, including in Dublin 8.
Details of large-scale projects being delivered under the school building programme may be viewed on the Department's website and the information is updated regularly. In addition, a list of large-scale projects completed from 2010 may also be viewed.
I am at a loss to know how the statistics and the population levels from the CSO are so at variance with the predictions from the Department of Education because, with all due respect, I would dispute the paragraph of the Minister of State's speech which states that the population is going to reduce from 2031 thereafter. The provision of that school in Sandymount - this is something we need to be clear about - is around the fact that 47% of the households in Dublin 8 have no car compared to an average of 13%. It is not within walking distance of the Dublin 8 area and the bus services there and back take an average of 64 to 90 minutes in travel time. All of that is ridiculous. There should be a greater plan. There is the Dublin Institute of Technology, DIT, campus and it would be an ideal location for a school. A new Educate Together primary school was opened in 2018 which was fantastic. If there was a need for a primary school, there is definitely a need for the follow-on of a secondary school.
I thank Senator Seery Kearney for giving me the opportunity to address this issue. I speak as someone who is not just a Minister of State in the Department but as a Deputy in a constituency where this was an issue a number of years ago, where the demographic projections of the Department did not match what was happening on the ground for various reasons. I believe the Department system has improved immensely since then. If the Senator has specific information on numbers, and if the teachers and principals of the primary schools have specific information which she believes the Department does not have, I ask her to send it in.
Over the past number of years, we have not had situations where children were without school places. It happened on a number of occasions, including twice or three times in my area, but that was a failure of planning. The system has become much more robust and it is better but I ask the Senator to send in whatever she has to the senior Minister and it will be reviewed.
I thank the Minister of State very much for his time and I thank the Senator for having raised this matter.
Forestry Sector
I thank the Minister of State for coming to the House to deal with this matter related to forestry, which is an area to which she is hugely committed. She will recall we had our last little engagement on this matter back in April. I had hoped we would have made some progress. In case there is any misunderstanding, I am absolutely committed to forestry. I see its significance and importance. As well as sitting on the Committee on Housing, Local Government and Heritage I sit on the Committee on Agriculture, Food and the Marine. The forestry issue has exercised the latter committee quite extensively, as the Minister of State will know. To be fair, she has engaged extensively with us, as she has with other people.
I will take her through a few points. In November 2022 the Government announced a new €1.3 billion forestry programme for 2023 to 2027. This new programme was expected to replace the previous one, which expired at the end of 2022. The Department submitted the request for state aid approval only in early 2023. We had difficultly in understanding the date, but we now know that is all done. It is July and the new programme is still awaiting formal state aid approval from the European Commission. The new programme is also subject to an ongoing strategic environmental assessment, SEA. There may have been a draft or a preliminary SEA and then there is the other issue of an appropriate assessment process. The Minister of State is familiar with all the assessment processes. The Department of Agriculture, Food and the Marine is not in a position to launch its new forestry schemes until a satisfactory strategic environmental assessment is in place, along with a number of other issues. I understand the Department has been engaging with the Commission in the past few months to secure approval.
As the Minister of State knows, the Department cannot issue licenses for granting afforestation roads or forestry support schemes until the new programme is in place. There has been slow progress and I would like progress on that. I understand there can be no new approvals until the appropriate environmental assessment has been concluded and that is ongoing work. Strategic environmental assessment is a process for formal, systematic evaluation of the likely significant environmental effects of implementing a plan or programme before the decision is made to adopt such a plan. It has been suggested the SEA report does not appear to adequately address concerns about the piecemeal forestry plantations on high-value farmland. I have engaged with people in Europe on this issue, as well as other stakeholders and with people I would expect to be close to these ongoing and protracted exchanges of information with the Department and the Commission itself. There is a suggestion there are issues around the SEA.
The Minister of State is clearly very favourably inclined to the protection of the environment and biodiversity, as am I, and that is good, important and significant. However, what is clear with respect to this debate is the need for transparency. We have talked about transparency across the whole field of public life in these Houses in recent weeks, but the Government needs to share with all stakeholders rather than just some how critical the EU is of the entire Irish forestry model being advanced in this programme. I am told the Commission is seriously critical of the sitka spruce model that has been ongoing and which it is proposed to continue as part of the new plan. I hear the Commission is extremely concerned about the Coillte-Gresham House deal. There are a whole range of issues. The Government has a programme. The programme is ambitious and rightly so, but the stakeholders at large are outside and do not know what is happening. They want more information and greater clarity.
I finish by saying I have raised time and time again with the Minister of State and the Department the role of the Social Economic Environmental Forestry Association, SEEFA. On its behalf I again ask that the Minister of State and her officials meet with its representatives. SEEFA represents a huge sector within forestry. Its members are keen and have made numerous requests to meet the Minister of State and Department officials and have not been successful. She might shed some light on the reasons behind that.
I welcome Senator Boyhan's interest in forestry and I am glad he shares my commitment to forestry. We both appreciate it is an extremely valuable sector to our country and will be very important for our climate ambitions. A strong funding commitment is imperative in realising the Government ambitions for the Forestry Programme 2023-2027. As such the referenced €1.3 billion package remains fully allocated for the Department's forestry commitments. As the Deputy will be aware, the forestry programme is subject to state aid approval from the EU Commission under the guidelines in the agricultural and forestry sectors and in rural areas. As he highlighted, it is also subject to an ongoing strategic environmental assessment-appropriate assessment process which is well advanced.
My Department, after an extensive pre-notification process, submitted the formal state aid notification for the Forestry Programme 2023-2027 on 20 April 2023. My Department is engaged proactively with the Commission in order to secure state aid approval as soon as is allowable.
The Commission is currently reviewing this notification in detail to decide whether the proposed forestry programme is compatible with EU state aid rules. To this effect, my Department has now received further written correspondence relating to this notification on 6 and 21 of June 2023. My Department has responded in detail to the correspondence received on 6 June, which covered afforestation and creation of woodlands. My Department is preparing an additional reply to the further correspondence received on 21 June which covers support schemes and other such issues. That response will issue shortly.
Additionally, the Minister, Deputy Eamon Ryan, and I held bilateral discussions in person with Executive Vice President Timmermans and Commissioner Sinkevièius last month, during which we emphasised the importance of the forestry programme to our climate change and environmental targets, as well as our commitment to complying with all relevant EU environmental law.
Due to the ongoing engagement with the Commission, it is not appropriate to comment further, at this stage of the formal state aid process, on the details of the correspondence exchanged. However, once formal state aid approval has been received, details of this decision will be published on the Commission’s competition website via the state aid register. In addition, once formal state aid approval under the guidelines is received from the Commission, the Department will then be in a position to launch the new programme. This launch will be subject to the finalisation of the strategic environmental assessment, which will incorporate any relevant outcomes from this formal state aid process.
It is also important to note that, pending the formal state aid approval from the Commission, all afforestation files currently in the system will continue to be progressed up to the point of approval. While my Department cannot issue licences for grant-aided afforestation, roads or forestry support schemes until the new programme is in place, felling licences have continued to issue. To date in 2023, 1,575 felling licences have issued for 18,386 ha.
However, in recognition of the need for planting activity to continue during the state aid assessment of the forestry programme, the Department engaged with the Commission last December to secure an interim solution. This led to the introduction of an interim afforestation scheme, an interim forest road scheme and an interim ash dieback reconstitution and underplanting scheme. This ensured that those with valid licence approvals issued before the end of 2022 could avail of the current planting season under the higher grant and premium rates proposed to be paid under the new forestry programme.
Extensive work has been undertaken by the Department in this area and to date this year, a total of 288 applications have been approved under the interim afforestation scheme representing 1,752 ha. Of those, almost 1,195 ha of planting has been completed. Planting has commenced and will be completed on the remaining 261 ha.
I thank the Minister of State for the clarity of that information. There is much in it. The welcome news is that the ring-fenced €1.3 billion is still in place. Regarding engaging with stakeholders, I accept that the Minister of State and the Minister, Deputy Eamon Ryan, are in sensitive negotiations. At some point, there is an onus to share as much information as the Minister of State can. Is she confident we will get state aid approval?
Is that something on which the Minister of State wishes to comment? I would like to think she is confident. I accept there are negotiations to be completed.
I will not ask the Minister of State to reply to my final point. That would not be fair because it was not mentioned in the Commencement matter. However, I ask that she bring the message to the Minister that it would be meaningful for him, the Minister of State herself and the officials in their Department to meet with the Social Economic Environmental Forestry Association, SEEFA. The group has a lot to offer and a lot of experience to bring to the table. We need to engage with it.
I thank the Senator once again. I share his frustration and that of the Joint Committee on Agriculture, Food and the Marine and stakeholders across the country regarding the protracted nature of this state aid approval process. I reassure people that we are making every effort to make sure this is right. We need to get it right. We are coming off the back of decades of legacy issues and that has impacted our ability to seek and obtain state aid approval quickly. That baggage is still there and we are trying to show that this proposed programme represents a change from previous programmes. In my mind, it does. It is a significant change.
I was surprised to hear the Senator's criticism of the Sitka spruce model in his opening statement. It is not the tree per se that is the problem; it is the management of the tree. Unfortunately, we need those fast-growing conifers, of which Sitka spruce is a particular variety, to supply the timber of the future. As we try to fix the problems of the past, we also have to look forward and look to decarbonising our construction sector in the future. That is one part of what we aim to do.
Cuireadh an Seanad ar fionraí ar 1.47 p.m. agus cuireadh tús leis arís ar 2 p.m.
Sitting suspended at 1.47 p.m. and resumed at 2 p.m.