Dáil Éireann Debate, Tuesday - 27 April 2004
98 Ms Harkin asked the Minister for Community, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs if he will reconsider his decision not to use the existing and effective structure of ADM to distribute the dormant accounts fund. [12139/04]
View answerAs I have outlined to the House on several occasions recently, decisions on the disbursement of funds from dormant accounts moneys are currently a matter for the Dormant Accounts Disbursement Board, an independent body established under the Dormant Accounts Acts.
The board is currently deciding on the disbursement of up to €30 million. In that regard, the board has engaged Area Development Management Limited, or ADM, to administer the initial round of funding on its behalf. The closing date for receipt of applications for this round of funding was 5 March 2004, and I understand approximately 1,500 applications had been received by the closing deadline. The process of appraising and evaluating those applications by ADM is under way, and to date the board has approved 46 projects totalling approximately €5 million.
The Deputy will be aware that the Government decided last December to make several changes regarding dormant accounts. Legislation to give effect to the proposed changes is currently being drafted and will be published in the next few weeks.
I emphasise that the objectives of the disbursements scheme as set out in the board's first disbursement plan will remain unchanged, that is, funding to assist programmes or projects targeting three broad categories of persons — those affected by economic and social disadvantage, educational disadvantage, and persons with a disability. It is also important to note that the Government decision provides that decisions in the area be taken following a transparent application and evaluation process.
The Government proposes key roles for the board, with particular regard to advising on priority areas to be considered annually for funding and preparation of the disbursement plan.
Furthermore, the board will critically assess the additionality and impact of spending on a regular basis. That is of critical importance, and arrangements will be put in place to ensure that spending under the Dormant Accounts Disbursement Board be kept separate from the normal Estimates process so that additionality can be verified.
On the possible future role of ADM following the legislative changes proposed regarding dormant accounts, the Deputy will appreciate that arrangements for processing and so on have yet to be worked out. I point out, however, that arrangements to be put in place will have full regard to best practice in the disbursement of public moneys while seeking to avoid undue bureaucracy and excessive administrative and overhead costs.
I asked whether the Minister would reconsider his decision to allow ADM to disburse the dormant accounts rather than set up a new board. The Minister did not address that. Does he not agree that ADM was set up by the EU to provide an independent conduit for funds to communities, voluntary bodies and others and that the critical aspect is that it is an independent body not influenced by political manoeuvring, not dependent on being in a Minister's constituency and not a slush fund?
Does the Minister agree with the comments of the Minister of State at the Department of Education and Science, Deputy de Valera, at the weekend when she said that politicians need to get back to the basic principles of honesty and integrity if people are not to become cynical about politics? Does the Minister acknowledge that it is cynical in the extreme that the Minister for Finance, Deputy McCreevy, said in 2001 that the dormant accounts fund would not be used as a slush fund, and yet two years later, that decision was rescinded, with the dormant accounts fund to be used as just that, out of the hands of independent bodies such as ADM?
I recently asked the Minister, Deputy Ó Cuív, about ADM, and his reply to me was that it was not right to detach taxpayers from their money. Does the Minister of State accept that, according to the Minister, it is not right to detach politicians from the disbursement of money? These funds are not tax raised by the Exchequer. This is money on which tax has already been paid, and such moneys should be disbursed by an independent body. I ask the Minister's view on that.
The board currently distributing the money is independent. ADM was hired by the board, since the latter was set up without staff, a structure, expertise or processing staff. In the short term, the board is therefore hiring ADM to carry out the job of evaluating and processing applications against certain criteria. In the future, that may continue. However, it is not a slush fund. Having examined what was set up, we feel that there are gaps and deficiencies in it.
What are the deficiencies?
It was set up as a board to distribute €30 million a year with no structure.
ADM has a structure.
It does not have a structure. The board is the legal authority and does not have its own staff. In the short term the board exists, with some seconded civil servants. Other people are being hired, namely ADM, to do a processing job for the board. It just proves the point that the board was set up without a staff or a structure. Giving it seconded staff from within the Civil Service works in the short term, but it is not a proper way to go about matters for the future. From the viewpoint of accountability, the part-time chairman is legally accountable and responsible for perhaps €170 million. That is unsustainable. There were gaps in the way it was set up and we are trying to improve on and correct that.
Why was the Dormant Accounts Disbursements Board set up? An independent body, ADM, already existed which, with a few extra seconded staff, could have carried out that function. In effect, what this means is that decisions in this matter will rest with the Minister. They will be political decisions and will not be taken by ADM. The body will appraise the projects etc. The Minister of State says it is accountable and transparent, but the decisions will ultimately be political. A body such as ADM was set up because the EU recommended the need for an independent body. I have asked the Minister of State a question and still have not received an answer. What was the raison d’être to change from ADM to the Dormant Accounts Disbursements Board when a body was in place that could have done the job adequately?
The Deputy has misunderstood. There is no reference to ADM in the legislation setting up the dormant accounts board. ADM——
Why set it up?
Whatever about the reason it was set up, it has nothing to do with the dormant accounts board. It was hired by the board on a short-term basis to do a job. ADM is not in charge of the dormant accounts fund.
Exactly.
It was not part of it.
It should have been.
That is the Deputy's view. I do not know that anyone else expressed that view when the legislation was going through the Dáil a few years ago. She will have an opportunity to express it again when the legislation is brought forward in the coming weeks. We may be changing the dormant accounts board and its functions, but not ADM. The board could have employed anyone to do the temporary processing of the applications. It has employed ADM but that body is not part of the process. It is just being employed and paid in the short term to do a job.
