asked the Minister for Education if he will state, in respect of each national school in the administrative counties of Meath, Louth and Dublin, (a) its name and location, and the year in which it was erected, (b) the number of rooms and the number of pupils on the rolls on 30th June, 1952, (c) the amount granted in 1952 for heating and cleaning, and (d) the amount granted in 1952 towards the cost of free school books for necessitous children.
Ceisteanna—Questions. Oral Answers. - Primary Schools: Statistics.
The ascertaining and compilation of the information which the Deputy has asked for would involve a considerable amount of work and of official time, and I feel that the expenditure involved therein would not be warranted.
Furthermore, I feel that it would not be in the public interest to disclose information regarding grants payable or paid in particular cases, as such information is regarded as confidential.
Mr. J. Tully
Arising out of the reply, is the Minister now saying that it is not possible to find out the information I have asked for considering the fact that I can get the total figures in the Government Publications Sale Office? If the total figures are available can the Minister say if the figures out of which the totals are made up are available? Further, does the Minister say that the public should not be informed of the amount of money that is being made available for heating schools and which I maintain is not being used for that purpose?
First and foremost, the Deputy has asked me for the name and the location of every school in Meath, Louth and Dublin and then for the year in which each school was erected and for the number of rooms in each school. Just to take that for a moment, it would take quite a lot of officials away from their ordinary work to compile that and I am not quite clear what useful purpose would be served to the House and to the Deputy. While on that point I should like to say we have been endeavouring to cut down the overhead cost of the Department. A very considerable amount of work has been done in organisation and method arrangement in order to prune down the staff. In so far as building schools is concerned and getting rid of old schools, such is the improvement on that side that, not yet having got a corresponding improvement in organisation in the Office of Public Works, in the last two years £2,000,000 of abnormal arrears have accumulated on the Board of Works side. I think we are using the staff in a much more effective way, preparing and getting ready for an increasing number of new schools and the elimination of the old ones, than we would be doing by going into research in relation to, say, three counties with regard to every school, as to where the school was, when it was built, how many rooms were in it, and so on. I think the Deputy will appreciate that if there is any aspect of that which is of particular importance to him, and if he will indicate it to me, I will do all I can.
On the question of grants for heating and cleaning schools and all that, the Deputy has been asking the amount granted to each of these 340 schools for heating and cleaning and the cost of free school books—it is not customary at all and not advisable, and I do not think I could agree to indicate the grants for each school in the three counties or in any county, or the amount spent on heating and cleaning of that particular school or the amount paid for free books to that school. As far as the total amount is concerned, I am not in a position to say the total amount paid in 1952 for free school books but I do know that the total grant paid, say, last year for heating and cleaning amounted to about £69,000.
I appreciate that it may be difficult to obtain some of the particulars for which I asked but I assure the Minister I have a very definite reason for asking for them. I do not see how the Minister can say it is not in the public interest to give the information asked for in the latter portion of my question and I would ask him to reconsider the matter.
I thought he made it clear to you.
I would not mind what you think.