Vol. 677 No. 3
48 Deputy Jan O’Sullivan asked the Minister for Defence the discussions he has had with the Department of Justice, Equality and Law Reform in regard to the increased number of hoax call-outs in 2008 to deal with suspect explosive devices; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [9775/09]
The primary responsibility for the maintenance of law and order rests with An Garda Síochána. The Defence Forces, pursuant to their role of rendering aid to the civil power, ATCP, assist the Garda as required. Requests for aid to the civil power are normally made by a member of An Garda Síochána not below the rank of Inspector. The explosive ordnance disposal, EOD, team responds when a request is made by An Garda Síochána to the relevant brigade, for assistance in dealing with a suspect device or for the removal of old ordnance.
The devices that the Defence Forces encounter in these situations include viable improvised explosive devices, IEDs, which have all the components of a bomb and are set to detonate, and elaborate hoaxes where a device is made to look as if it could explode. The Defence Forces EOD team is required to treat all suspect devices as real until the EOD officer confirms the nature of the suspect device. The determination as to whether a suspect device is viable or hoax can be made only following detailed inspection by the EOD officer. When the EOD team is satisfied the suspect device has been rendered safe, the remains of the device are handed over to An Garda Síochána for forensic examination and investigation.
There are well established channels of consultation and co-operation between representatives of the Defence Forces and An Garda Síochána. These consultations take the form of meetings, discussions, briefings and technical analysis. I have also discussed the situation on a number of occasions informally with my colleague, the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform. EOD operations are discussed at regular meetings of the improvised explosive device, IED, working group. The Defence Forces also liaise with An Garda Síochána in the technical analysis of evidence recovered from EOD operations.
The figures on call-outs of the EOD team are quite alarming. The number of call-outs in 2007 was 98, while last year it was 180. The number of hoaxes has increased by 500%, and is now one in three. The EOD team is called out on hoax calls. Obviously, the Army must respond to requests from the civil power but this is a large waste of resources. Where is this increase originating? There have been reports that ex-IRA people are assisting criminal elements in producing bombs. Given what has happened in Northern Ireland in the past few days, with the tragic death of two soldiers, the wounding of civilians and the death of the policeman last night, are there wider security issues of which we should be cognisant?
Up to 27 January this year there were four call-outs, one of which was a hoax. Does the Minister have the up-to-date figure? I feel that something is going on and it needs to be addressed. I take the point that the Garda is responsible for law and order but my concern is that there is a wider agenda that could be going further down the road in terms of undermining the State.
Not to put too fine a point on it, I agree with Deputy O'Shea that the recent trend has been quite alarming. In 2006, there were 101 call-outs, eight of which were hoaxes. The figures for 2007 were 98 and 11, respectively. In 2008, there were 180 call-outs, 58 of which turned out to be hoaxes. I have the up-to-date figures to 5 March. There were 32 call-outs, which seems to be a repeat of the pattern last year, and the number of hoaxes was ten, which, again, at approximately one in three is a repeat of last year's pattern. That is worrying.
The explosives ordinance team gets the request from the Garda and it has to act on it. There is a difference between hoax calls and calls to hoax devices. The fire service receives hoax calls but the calls received by the explosives ordinance team are from the Garda Síochána to investigate a device. A pattern is evident but as to who appears to be behind it or to what it is linked, that is a matter for the Garda Síochána. We simply respond to requests from it.
I accept what the Minister said but there needs to be more urgency and focus to deal with the situation than the Minister has indicated. This is an unwelcome developing trend. I accept what the Minister said that those are not hoax call-outs in the sense that it is the Garda who make the calls. There appears to be a deliberate pattern. On the other hand, however, the hoax devices are being planted for a particular reason. Does the Minister have information as to whether anyone has been apprehended or sentenced by the courts that gives any indication of where all this activity is emanating from?
I agree with Deputy O'Shea that there seems to be a pattern emerging. I have spoken about the matter on a number of occasions with my colleague, the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform, and I will discuss it with him again on foot of this discussion. I do not have the information about arrests, apprehensions and prosecutions but I will ascertain it and let Deputy O'Shea know.
49 Deputy Pat Breen asked the Minister for Defence the changes in the role and structures of the Defence Forces that may result should the constitutional amendment enabling the ratification of the Lisbon treaty be approved; if there is a possibility that conscription could be introduced under the Lisbon treaty; the grounds on which he reaches that conclusion; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [9864/09]
The Lisbon treaty will have no impact on the organisation, structure or roles of the Defence Forces. National security will continue to remain the sole responsibility of each member state. In addition, the treaty will not have any impact on Ireland's traditional policy of military neutrality.
Any decision by Ireland to participate in EU-led military crisis management operations will be for sovereign decision on a case-by-case basis and in line with Irish constitutional and legislative arrangements. The triple lock provisions requiring a Government decision, Dáil approval and UN authorisation will continue to apply in regard to the overseas deployment of contingents of the Irish Defence Forces for service in peace support and crisis management operations.
I am well aware that the issue of a European army and the possibility of conscription into such an army was an issue of great concern to many during the previous referendum debate. I would like to provide a concrete assurance to all those who were concerned, and to everybody else, that there is absolutely no provision in the Lisbon treaty, or in any other EU treaties, which would facilitate the establishment of a European army or the introduction of conscription to any such army. The obligation to military service is strictly a matter of policy for individual member states, which, in Ireland's case, is entirely voluntary and will remain so.
I welcome the Minister's response. I agree that in the previous referendum campaign it was a matter of major concern for mothers especially, that if they supported the Lisbon treaty their sons or daughters could be conscripted into a European army. That argument was used extensively by the "No" campaigners and it did register with people. I hope the Minister's clarification will resonate with all those people who had concerns about that matter and which was one of the reasons they voted against the treaty.
Does the Minister think there is a need for a protocol to be inserted in the next agreement to clarify the matter and outline clearly that if the Lisbon treaty is passed, in no way will it or could it lead to a European army to which Irish citizens could be conscripted?
That is a bit beyond the terms of the question in so far as the drafting of a constitutional amendment does not fall to the Minister for Defence.
But drafting does.
I accept Deputy Deenihan's point. People were led to believe, and some people unfortunately did believe, during the recent referendum campaign that no sooner would the ink be dry on the Lisbon treaty if it was passed than a press gang would arrive in the early hours of the morning to conscript everybody's sons and daughters from one end of the country to the other into a non-existent European army.
It worked.
Yes. Unfortunately, too many people believed it.
People were more concerned with the leader of the Minister's party.
There is nothing whatsoever in the Lisbon treaty which facilitates, enables or compels the establishment of a European army and since the Lisbon treaty does not provide for any European army, there is nothing to be conscripted into. That is the reality of it.
Regarding Deputy Deenihan's question on the need for a protocol, we have tried to make the issue as clear as possible and we will do so again. The Government is currently discussing the possibility of a protocol, which would make it even more clear. Discussions are ongoing on that matter. We will have more discussions on it this week. I agree that many people were badly and sadly misled by that allegation, which has no basis in fact whatsoever.
I wish to ask the Minister about a related issue. Will he give us an absolute assurance that nothing contained in the Lisbon treaty can undermine or change the situation regarding the triple lock mechanism that governs military actions in which the State can become involved?
I am only too delighted to give Deputy O'Shea that absolute assurance. The triple lock mechanism has to be complied with before this country engages in any foreign peacekeeping operation. That is the situation now and it will be the situation if the Lisbon treaty is passed. There will be no change.
50 Deputy Ruairí Quinn asked the Minister for Defence when the 12 members of the Defence Forces Reserve specialists will be dispatched to Kosovo; the length of time in regard to same; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [9779/09]
57 Deputy David Stanton asked the Minister for Defence if he will introduce legislation to allow members of the Defence Forces Reserve to serve overseas; when he expects that to occur; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [9845/09]
I propose to take Questions Nos. 50 and 57 together.
In line with the provisions of the Defence Forces Reserve review implementation plan, it is hoped that a small number of reservists will be able to undertake overseas service in late 2009.
The organisational changes, enhancements to clothing, equipment, training and the piloting of the integrated reserve, all delivered as part of the implementation plan, have improved the capabilities of the Defence Forces Reserve. It was intended as part of the plan that those improvements in capability would build towards overseas service by members of the reserve.
The military authorities have identified a small number of overseas posts requiring specific skills that may be filled by members of the reserve. That is likely to involve deployment to the mission in Kosovo for a period of six months. Any commitment to overseas service by members of the reserve will be on a voluntary basis. The military authorities have sought expressions of interest from among suitably qualified reservists who have undertaken integrated training. The military authorities are at an advanced stage in identifying reservists who may be eligible and willing to apply for a small number of specified overseas positions. Final selection of personnel will be dependent on interested personnel completing an extensive training schedule to upskill to the requisite military standards to enable them to serve overseas. It will also be dependent on their personal availability.
It is intended to make regulatory provision to allow suitably qualified members of the Defence Forces Reserve to qualify for service with the Permanent Defence Forces for the express purpose of this overseas service. Terms and conditions of service are being actively examined and the representative associations will be consulted in the near future. I am pleased that such work is proceeding on schedule in line with plan provisions.
Obviously, that is a very welcome development. Will the Minister confirm the report that appeared in the media that 12 reservists will be taking part, including heavy-duty mechanics, medical specialists and information technology experts? What will be the position with regard to their pay? I take it a number of these people will be leaving paid employment to go to Kosovo. How will the issue of pay be addressed for the six months they will spend there?
It is planned to send 12 people on an initial pilot scheme. They will be recruited temporarily into the Permanent Defence Forces, PDF, to enable the deployment to take place, because the legislation provides that only members of the PDF can be sent overseas. When we are drafting legislation to allow members of the Defence Forces Reserve to be sent overseas on a regular basis, rather than by temporary arrangement as in this case, we will consider various issues. One of the barriers is conditions of employment and we must iron out the issue in that regard. We will learn some lessons from the initial deployment.
There have been 24 expressions of interest and I am informed that the people chosen will come from that group. They will be people whose personal circumstances, whether by arrangement with their employer or because they are self-employed, allow them to make the trip for six months.
Has the Minister any intention of introducing legislation such as that in the UK where the jobs of people who are members of the reserve and who decide to travel on missions such as Kosovo are guaranteed? Has the Minister made any progress on developing the first line reserve? If we had a first line reserve available, we would have people with previous experience on foreign missions who would be available to become involved in missions such as that in Kosovo.
First, to respond to a question asked by Deputy O'Shea, those sent will be specialists, such as mechanics, IT people and engineers, etc. These are the types of people we are targeting.
With regard to Deputy Deenihan's question on whether we will have legislation along the lines of the UK legislation, I imagine that will be factored in when the legislation is drafted. We must provide for something along those lines. We are getting over the problem temporarily by recruiting people from the Defence Forces Reserve into the Permanent Defence Forces so as to keep within the legislation. These people will leave the PDF a short time after their return. We will have to consider something along the lines of job protection.
On the first line reserve, we are still at the early stages and have made no significant progress. We are concentrating on upping the numbers of the integrated reserve to come somewhere near the targets we set out in the White Paper.
With regard to those who serve in the pilot group of 12 and subsequent groups, are there any prospects of them becoming members of the Permanent Defence Forces? The campaign for recruitment to the reserve is now on hold, although I understand that if people volunteer, they will be recruited. However, there will not be a recruitment campaign. Would it not make the reserve a more attractive proposition if people considering becoming involved in the reserve saw the prospect of becoming full-time members of the Permanent Defence Forces?
I do not know. The position is we have the regular Defence Force and the reserve. What we are doing here is allowing members of the reserve, for the first time ever, to serve overseas. This is a significant development. We are not short of applicants for the recruitment campaign to the Permanent Defence Forces, with approximately five applicants for every position. The campaign is stopped temporarily, but we hope to reverse that later this year.
Written Answers follow Adjournment Debate.
