Vol. 421 No. 5
1 Mr. Spring asked the Taoiseach if he will outline the timescale and programme of action that will now be taken to honour the commitments made in the statement issued by four party leaders, including himself, in regard to the copperfastening of rights of travel and information for Irish women, and in relation to the substantive issue of abortion, having regard also to the rights of Irish women; and if he will make a statement on the matter.
For the information of the House, the statement of the four party leaders referred to by the Deputy stated the following in relation to the issues raised by his question:
All the Leaders who have signed this statement agree that the right to information, appropriately regulated by law, and to travel will be copperfastened in a further Referendum in the autumn.
Legislative and/or Constitutional changes arising from the Supreme Court decision on Article 40.3.3 of the Constitution will be placed before the Dáil by the Government as soon as is practicable and, in any case, by the autumn.
This extract from the leaders' statement already sets down the timescale for action in regard to the copperfastening of rights to travel and information for Irish women and in relation to the substantive issue of abortion. I am happy to assure the Deputy that it is the Government's intention to meet this timescale and that the Cabinet sub-committee established to consider these issues will complete their deliberations with this timescale fully in mind.
Can the Taoiseach outline to the House the number of times the Cabinet sub-committee have met since they were established? Is he aware of the statement made by the Minister for Industry and Commerce on radio last Sunday to the effect that little or any work has been done by the sub-committee to date and is he happy with the urgency being displayed by the sub-committee?
A considerable amount of work has been done on the legal and medical aspects by the Minister for Justice and Minister for Health. Position papers have not been arrived at yet.
Can we take it that the work of the sub-committee is still being informed and influenced by the statements made by the Taoiseach in this house to the effect that he has no wish to preside over a society where the rights of women are inferior in any way and no wish to preside over a police state or an intolerant state? In particular, can the Taoiseach confirm that it is his view that there should be no change in the law or Consitution that diminishes the rights of women in Irish society?
The Deputy can be assured that all aspects of this very complex matter are being taken on board by the sub-committee. The Deputy can be assured that my declaration at an early stage in this matter that I was not prepared to preside over a police state where the rights to travel would be interfered with is uppermost in everybody's mind.
May I make some inquiries as to the timescale involved here? The Taoiseach said it is proposed to take this in November. In view of that, the relevant legislation must have passed through both Houses of the Oireachtas before, at the very latest, the end of October and probably mid-October. May I ask the Taoiseach what are the arrangements for the early resumption of the proceedings of this House with a view to ensuring that we have adequate time in this House to take the relevant legislation? For example, will the House resume in September particularly to deal with this matter?
No decision has yet been taken as to when the House will resume. The Deputy can be assured we are all well aware of the timetable required under the Consitution for the passing of legislation to prepare for a referendum.
I do not want to be niggling about this but has the Taoiseach considered the possibility that the Dáil will need to resume its sittings in September particularly for this purpose?
The adjournment of the House is a separate matter.
The timetable required is being kept in mind. No specific dates have yet been decided upon in relation to the next session and when it will commence.
The statement makes two references to the autumn. The statement states specifically that the right to information and travel will be dealt with in the autumn. In relation to the question of abortion and the matters arising from the Supreme Court decision, the statement refers to it being taken by the autumn. One presumes that means before the end of summer. May I ask the Taoiseach specifically what he intends to do in relation to the question of abortion, whether he will be complying with the solemn commitment made by the four party leaders that this matter will be dealt with by a referendum and/or legislation by the autumn? How soon, therefore, does he expect the Cabinet sub-committee to report in order for that to be done and how soon will the Dáil reassemble for that to be done?
We are having repetition.
I thought I had already answered that question very clearly. The timetable required is that the legislation should be through the House, as Deputy John Bruton has correctly said, by the end of October——
At the very latest.
——to enable a referendum to be held in the very minimum of 30 days afterwards, as required by the Constitution. The matter in relation to the substantive issue of abortion will be dealt with in accordance with the statement of the four party leaders by referendum and or legislation.
In relation to the declaration by the four party leaders which guarantee a referendum in 1996 on the question of defence, can the Taoiseach indicate what he proposes to do with regard to the establishment of a European affairs committee so that the Dáil and the public can be kept informed and, indeed, involved in developments between now and 1996 in that sphere?
That seems to be a separate matter.
It is referred to in the joint statement of the four party leaders. There is a specific commitment in that statement.
The need for a referendum will have to be considered in the light of proposals that may be made by the intergovernmental conference in 1996. It is only in the event of a change in direction that a referendum would be required. The setting up of the committee has been under discussion by the party whips for some considerable time. The sooner they are set up the better.
I call Deputy Garland, and then I am calling Deputy Spring for a final question on this matter.
I think we are all agreed in this House that great care must be taken in the drafting of this legislation and for that reason it must not be rushed. In the meantime, we have a problem in that pregnant women who are travelling, or are about to travel, to England do not know what the situation is. Could the Taoiseach give instructions to the Attorney General that pending the introduction of the legislation, that is, between now and the end of the autumn, there should be no further injunctions issued against pregnant women?
The Deputy should recall that I made that position abundantly clear long before the referendum was held. The Deputy and the House can be assured that there will be no injunction sought by the State in relation to the right to travel of anyone in those circumstances.
Would the Taoiseach agree that it is in the public interest that the sensitive and complex matter of abortion be approached in so far as is possible on an all-party basis? To facilitate that, would the Taoiseach now consider taking steps to supply the leaders of the other parties in this House with the broad range of legal advice available to him or the position papers now available in the sub-committee? Alternatively, would he consider having meetings with the other party leaders to discuss the complexities of the issue?
The Deputy can be assured that I shall certainly consult the party leaders as soon as the position begins to crystalise and we have various options clarified and the implications of all options available to us. I should be glad to proceed on the basis of consultation with the leaders of the other parties and I hope that we can continue the consensus that proved so fruitful in the recent referendum. I personally believe that this should not be a matter on which parties divide; it is a question of trying to do the right thing for all of us.
