I should like to express at the outset my deep appreciation of the kindness and courtesy which the Seanad has extended to me by agreeing to take this Bill at short notice. I assure you that it is only the urgency of the matter that induced me to ask the Seanad to depart from its usual code of procedure, but I feel sure that, when the main objects of the Bill are explained to the House, the members will realise the necessity for expedition in this matter and will be anxious to accelerate the passage of the Bill through the House.
The main purpose of the Bill is set out in Section 2, which provides that the object of the Bill is to enable the making of reciprocal arrangements covering the field of national insurance, unemployment insurance, widows' and orphans' pensions insurance and insurance arising out of the injuries sustained by workmen in the course of or arising out of their employment. That is the main purpose of the Bill which, as you realise, on its face is clearly an enabling Bill designed to facilitate arrangements towards the end envisaged in Section 2.
The need for reciprocal arrangements arises very largely in relation to Great Britain and Northern Ireland. In Great Britain and Northern Ireland a comprehensive code of social services comes into operation on Monday next, 5th July, and that comprehensive code of social services covers a wide field of insurance, wider than anything we have so far attempted here. The necessity for this Bill arises out of the fact that the reciprocal arrangement which we have at present in respect of reciprocity in the field of national health insurance lapses on the coming into operation of the new British Bill, and must be renewed specifically under this Bill to enable us to continue the arrangement under the new British National Health Insurance Act.
Our desire in the past, and the desire enshrined in this Bill, is to enable us to achieve reciprocity in the field of social insurance so far as that objective is attainable. But, as the members will realise, reciprocity in the main can only take place in respect of services which are substantially comparable. In other words, we can achieve reciprocity in respect of services in this country which provide benefits substantially comparable with the benefits which are provided in the country with which we desire to enter into the reciprocal arrangements.
We have had, up to now, reciprocity in the field of national health insurance and the desire expressed in this Bill is to continue these reciprocal arrangements, not merely as they existed in the past, but in a wider form. It has been possible, as a result of discussions with the British authorities, to contemplate a somewhat wider measure of reciprocity in respect of the national health insurance field. A formal agreement with the British and Northern Ireland administrations on that matter has not yet been completed, but I have strong hopes that, within the next few days, it will be possible to achieve a formal agreement which will not only maintain our existing reciprocal arrangements with these two areas but will widen the extent of the reciprocity contemplated under the proposed agreement. Discussions have already taken place with the British Government or representatives of the British administrations covering not only the field of national health insurance but wider aspects of reciprocity. We have discussed with the British Government this reciprocity in the field of unemployment insurance, workmen's compensation and in the field of widows' and orphans' pensions. So far as unemployment insurance reciprocity is concerned, difficulties have presented themselves in the matter of negotiating a satisfactory agreement. Talks took place with representatives of the British and Northern Ireland administrations last year, and talks took place in Dublin and London this year, and whilst we have carried on the discussions to a fairly advanced stage it has not yet been possible to achieve formal reciprocal agreement with the two administrations.
We are hoping that the British authorities will recognise the merits of the claim which we put up on behalf of insured contributors normally resident in Ireland but at present employed in Great Britain. If we can get as full a recognition as we think the merits of our case entitle us to, then it should be possible to reach a relatively satisfactory agreement with the British authoritites in that respect. Any such agreement, as the House will quickly recognise, will safeguard the interests of insured contributors and provide for them benefit in circumstances which might otherwise be lost. If we fail to achieve reciprocity in this field—we have had, of course, no reciprocity in respect of unemployment insurance in the past—but if we achieve this reciprocity now it will be the first time that it has been possible to do so, and I hope our further discussions with the British Administration will enable us to achieve a relatively satisfactory measure of reciprocity to the advantage of Irish insured contributors at present employed in Great Britain and who may subsequently return to employment here.
In the sphere of widows' and orphans' pensions we have had no reciprocity in the past, and the dissimilarity between our widows' and orphans' legislation and the widows' and orphans' legislation in operation in Great Britain is such that I fear it might not be possible to reach any reciprocal agreement with the British authorities in respect of widows' and orphans' pensions until such time as we can evolve here a scheme substantially comparable to the scheme in operation in Great Britain and Northern Ireland. We hope to achieve a substantial measure of similarity when we proceed to the introduction of our comprehensive scheme of social services next year.
In the realm of workmen's compensation the position has been equally unsatisfactory. There has been no reciprocal arrangements in the past and there are no reciprocal arrangements to-day, and the position in the future may be even more difficult than it is to-day. As from Monday next, the British scheme will pass under State control and will be on an insurance basis whereas, as the House is aware, our workmen's compensation legislation is a privately administered affair in the hands of insurance companies. There is a wide dissimilarity between the two types of insurance provided, (a) in Britain and (b) here, and whilst it might not be possible, because of these dissimilarities, to introduce reciprocal arrangements until such time as we get our comprehensive social legislation, I am still not without hope that it may be possible to reach some measure of reciprocal agreement so far as the procedural elements in workmen's compensation are concerned. In the meantime, anything that can be done to advance the principle of reciprocal arrangements covering widows' and orphans' pensions and workmen's compensation will be availed of once this Bill has been passed.
I feel sure that this Bill will commend itself to all sides of the House as an effort to take reciprocity in the sphere of social insurance a step further, and that these reciprocal arrangements will obviate the hiatus which arises from time to time where workers contributing in one country return either to their home or to employment in another country. I have no doubt that the House will desire that these arrangements should be carried into operation at the earliest possible opportunity, and that the enactment of this measure will equip the Department of Social Welfare with the necessary powers to enable steps to be taken expeditiously to implement, first the agreement with the British authorities in the sphere of national health insurance, and secondly to permit us to carry on negotiations for reciprocal arrangements in the other fields as well. I, therefore, desire to recommend the Bill to the House, and trust that the House will lend its cooperation in expediting its passage.
