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Dáil Éireann díospóireacht -
Wednesday, 7 Nov 1928

Vol. 26 No. 13

IN COMMITTEE ON FINANCE. - VOTE No. 22.—STATIONERY AND PRINTING.

I move:—

Go ndeontar suim ná raghaidh thar £34,999 chun slánuithe na suime is gá chun íoctha an Mhuirir a thiocfidh chun bheith inioctha i rith na bliana dar críoch an 31adh lá de Mhárta, 1929, chun Páipéarachais, Clódóireachta, Páipéir Greamuíochta agus Leabhra Clóbhuailte i gcóir na Seirbhíse Puiblí, chun Tuarastail agus Costaisí Oifig an tSoláthair d'ioc; agus chun Ilsheirbhísí Ilghnéitheacha mar aon le Tuaraiscí Díospóireachtaí an Oireachtais.

That a sum not exceeding £34,999 be granted to complete the sum necessary to defray the Charge which will come in course of payment during the year ending on the 31st day of March, 1929, for Stationery, Printing, Paper, Binding, and Printed Books for the Public Service; to pay the Salaries and Expenses of the Stationery Office; and for Sundry Miscellaneous Services, including Reports of the Oireachtas Debates.

Mr. BOURKE

The Stationery Office Estimates for the year 1928-29 show decreases spread practically over all sub-heads, amounting in the aggregate to over £13,000. This Department provides for the use of the Public Services: (a) stationery such as paper and small stationery, stamping instruments, typewriters, duplicators and duplicating and accounting machinery, leather bags, etc., etc., under the Sub-heads J and K: (b) paper for printing, printing for Departments, Oireachtas, Dáil and Seanad Debates, Bills, Acts, "Iris Oifigiúil," Sub-heads E, F, G, I; (c) binding, Sub-head L; (d) published books for use of Departments and Oireachtas, Sub-head M.

The estimated cost of supplies to each Department, which is a figure based on the expenditure of the last completed previous year, modified by Departmental expectations for this year, is shown at the foot of each separate Departmental estimate in the Estimates. The above services are generally free, that is, the cost of them is borne by the Stationery Office. The Stationery Office also supplies printing, binding, stationery and publications for a number of services the cost of which is borne elsewhere. The Shannon Development Branch of Industry and Commerce, the Electricity Supply Corporation, the Currency Commission, the Agricultural Credit Corporation, the Savings Bank, the Roads Department of Local Government, provision of textbooks in Irish for Department of Education, Sub-head F, Vote 47, provision of General Readers in Irish, Sub-head C 1, Vote 49, come under this head. In these cases the Stationery Office meets all charges and recovers the total cost from the services periodically.

The Stationery Office does not provide for any requirement of public bodies. There is one exception, however, and that is the printing of electors' lists, claims and objections, and registers of electors under the Electoral Acts, Sub-head H, page 86. This is, however, more in the nature of a national service, and has been undertaken by the Stationery Office since 1918, and the annual register includes the list of qualified electors for Dáil, Seanad and local government elections and those persons entitled to act as jurors. Four-sevenths of the cost of printing under this service is recovered from the local authorities, as will be seen from Sub-head N, page 87. Also pages 85 and 87 give in detail the anticipated expenditure and receipts shown on page 85. Pages 88 and 89 show the actual expenditure of the Stationery Office on supplies to each Department in a previous year, for the information of the Oireachtas and the public, that for 1926-27 being the latest available year. It would not be possible to have given the year 1927-28, for the reason that the Estimates were prepared in December and January last. The expenditure of the Stationery Office on page 88 is shown as £32,238. As, however, will be seen from the footnote, these are mostly purchases for stock to meet Departmental demands.

The prices of Stationery Office publications have been reduced very considerably in recent years so as to attract the largest public support. Every avenue of developing Irish manufactured stationery is being explored. This Department at present obtains exclusively from Irish manufacturers its total supplies of writing and fountain pen inks, leather goods such as gusset bags, attaché cases, etc.; gum and office paste, with the exception of small supplies of specialised articles such as glucine; cords and twine for wrapping purposes, rubber stamps, inkstands—wooden, ink baskets, wooden rulers, metal filing boxes, metal cash boxes, metal deed boxes, metal damping tins, pocket diaries, wood and cord folio boxes, canvas bags, metal seals.

The expenditure in Ireland on printing, binding, paper and envelopes, amounted to £90,000 approximately in the year 1927-28, the bulk of which represents payments to those actually employed—Printers, Binders, &c., &c. —in the production of the work. With regard to the formulation of Estimates for this Vote, the Stationery Office exercises the utmost care. The general service figures are based on the estimates furnished by each Department to the Stationery Office in November of each year, which figures are subjected in the Stationery Office to a close scrutiny in comparison with the most recent figures of actual expenditure on each Department. Provision must, however, be made for expenditure which it is anticipated will arise as a result of the legislative activities of the Oireachtas, a matter impossible of accurate and at times of even remotely approximate forecast, the only criterion in this case being the actual expenditure on the last complete preceding year. Another factor of prime influence on departmental expenditure is that arising from the number of new Acts of the Oireachtas. In most cases when an Act becomes operative law there follows considerable departmental activities involving expenditure by the Stationery Office on, say, printing and printing and binding; these may include the printing of Statutory Rules and Orders, Official Notices in "Iris Oifigiuil" (Sub-head G.S.O. Vote), the extent of which it is impossible to anticipate. It will be understood that there is, unfortunately, now no alternative to the purchase of paper outside our own borders, with the exception of higher grade certain correspondence papers and brown wrapping paper, satisfactory supplies of which, at favourable prices are secured from home sources.

It will be clear that such items as pens, pencils, typewriters, calculators, adding machines and proprietary articles generally, in default of Irish competition, have to pass to other competitors. Proprietary articles are never purchased, however, where it is possible to obtain something equally good of Irish manufacture, and it is interesting to record that the Stationery Office has in recent years replaced proprietary special binders by articles equally satisfactory made at home, at satisfactory prices.

The Estimate figures for this Vote for the past four years are:—1924-25. £187,029; 1925-26, £170,385; 1926-25 £155,325; 1927-28, £137,289; while for 1928-29 the figure is £123,999.

We do not wish to say very much about this Vote because we realise that this Department, though possibly unavoidably expensive, is nevertheless, indispensible and the only thing we would like to be certain of is that the greatest possible return is secured for the money expended. There are a considerable number of publications which have to be issued for the convenience and information of the members of this House who wish to keep in touch with the administration of the various departments. Many of those, we think, have a very high educative value and if they could possibly receive more general circulation, while we do not think it would lead to an actual reduction in expenditure, we think nevertheless, the return which would be secured in the shape of a deeper and more real interest on the part of citizens in the administration of the Government services would more than compensate for any extra expenditure incurred in circulating them. I remember the time when the price of the Estimates was something like 7/6 per volume. It has been reduced, I notice, to something like 2/6. The Appropriation Accounts were equally expensive and the cost has also been reduced in this case. For myself, I regard it as a tribute to the Department that that reduction in the cost of the official publications has been secured without any increase in the expenditure of the Department. At the same time, most of us feel that even at 2/6 per copy the cost of these publications is prohibitive. We also feel the force of the argument, which was advanced on the last occasion, I think — particularly by Deputy O'Connell—when this Vote was under discussion, that after the number of copies it is essential to print for the service of this House has been provided, the cost of printing extra copies is comparatively small. We would like the Estimates, Appropriation Accounts and all those records of official expenditure should be, so far as possible, within the reach of every citizen and taxpayer in the country because if we can once awaken an intelligent interest among those taxpayers in the expenditure of the public money then I feel we will have gone a long way to arouse a democratic feeling in this country and will have done something to make democracy an effective governing principle in the country. For that reason I would like to urge on the Ministry and the Parliamentary Secretary the desirability of circulating those two official publications, so far as possible, gratis even, to clubs, public libraries and other centres of social and educational intercourse.

We are particularly glad to see that the Department, so far as possible, has given a very marked preference to Irish manufacture. We only regret that the general policy of the Government in relation to a number of industries in the country does not permit the Department to extend that preference, say, to all classes of printing paper. We feel the Government in that regard should have realised that under present-day conditions paper is almost as essential an article of life as clothes, because people have been accustomed to a widespread publicity of certain matters, to look upon that publicity as essential as other things, in order to enable them to carry on their ordinary, every-day lives. We would have thought the Government would have considered earlier the advisability of imposing a tariff on paper so that the one mill which was manufacturing printing paper in this country might have been kept going and not allowed to close down. If that had been done we would have been able in addition to congratulating the Department on the fact that it uses notepaper of Irish manufacture, to congratulate them on having all their official publications printed on Irish-made paper.

I want to point out that certain provincial and other printers frequently try to evade, and often successfully, the conditions governing the Government printing contracts, inasmuch as they do not endeavour, at all times, to carry out the Fair Wages Clause. Two or three instances have been brought to my notice in connection with some of the contracts provided for in this Estimate where great difficulty was experienced, when employing printers in the provinces, and, indeed, in one case in Dublin, to make them observe the conditions governing the contract.

There are just one or two comments I would like to pass, more or less of a domestic character, concerning the issuing and numbering of official papers, etc. A good deal of inconvenience is caused to librarians and others by the system in operation in numbering official papers, such as the returns presented to the Oireachtas, reports of Commissions, etc. In this case we have an outstanding example in the Report of the Liquor Commission, in which it was very difficult to ascertain where the evidence of one witness ended and where that of another began. To anybody who has occasion to do research work, it will be found most difficult in that respect, and one's task is increased tenfold. The British Stationery Office issued from time to time a Guide to Official Statistics. In that Guide they gave a summary of the subject dealt with, and in that case it was quite easy to find at any time the subject dealt with and the name of the speaker, whereas here, unless one has the exact date on which the discussion on a particular subject took place, one is in great difficulty to get the desired information. In the case of official documents, I suggest to the Parliamentary Secretary that sufficient attention has not been paid to indexing and numbering so as to make them readily accessible to anyone seeking information, such as Deputies here have to seek from time to time. It would be very useful in future to have such indexing and numbering properly done. I feel sure that any little extra trouble or labour that would be involved in that direction would be cheerfully given by the Staff of the Stationery Office. Indeed I must say that this Department is one of the best worked Departments in the State.

There is another matter to which I would like to refer, namely, the advisability of issuing booklets to Deputies. These need not be of an expensive kind, but they ought to contain the telephone numbers of the various Government Departments, and those of the Ministers and Private Secretaries. Information of that kind would be very useful, and would result in saving a lot of time. A Deputy has often to ring up a Minister or his Private Secretary. He is in the hands of the telephone operators who are also very agreeable and obliging, but it would facilitate him if he had a booklet with the required numbers in it. So far as this Vote is concerned, I agree with Deputy MacEntee that there is very little to be said. I join with him in hoping that all official documents and publications will soon be printed on Irish paper. I would also suggest to the Parliamentary Secretary, if it comes under his aegis, that more care should be exercised in regard to the Merchandise Marks Act. Perhaps the proper place to deal with that would be on the Vote for the Ministry of Industry and Commerce, but I desire to say that a large amount of printing is coming into the country bearing no marks of any kind to indicate the place of origin. Printing worth thousands of pounds is being imported in that way, and I suggest to the Parliamentary Secretary that he should cooperate with the Minister for Industry and Commerce in preventing the importation of foreign printing of this kind when so many printers are unemployed in the country.

I understand from the Parliamentary Secretary's remarks that the Stationery Office supplies requisites for the use of the Agricultural Credit Corporation and the Electricity Supply Board. Since these two institutions were set up they have not, I understand, been regarded as Government Departments, and if one asks a question here about one or the other of them, he gets a reply to that effect, but now it appears that in the Estimates for the Stationery Office, at any rate, they are regarded as Government Departments.

Mr. BOURKE

I explained that although they were not really Government Departments we were supplying them with requisites, and that our staff is doing other work for which credit is not given in this Estimate.

Are the two bodies paying for the stationery they get?

Mr. BOURKE

Yes, certainly.

resumed the Chair.

My only intention in intervening on this Vote is to draw the attention of the Parliamentary Secretary to the printing of the registers of electors. I understand that in the case of the majority of the constituencies the registers are printed in Dublin, but I would prefer as far as possible, where there are printing works in the various constituencies, that these registers should be printed there. Some time ago we had occasion to raise the question of the registers for County Dublin being printed in England. I am glad to know that they are now printed in Ireland. I read a Press report some time ago in which it was stated that the President promised so far as Cork City was concerned to make arrangements, if possible, to have the registers printed in Cork. That principle should, I think, apply to all the constituencies and the printing should not be centralised in Dublin. While we recognise that there is unfortunately unemployment among printers in Dublin we must also remember that there are also printers unemployed throughout the country. I would appeal to the Parliamentary Secretary to have the registers as far as possible printed in the various constituencies.

Progress ordered to be reported.

The Dáil went out of Committee.
Progress reported.
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