This, at any rate, is a very interesting Estimate. The first part deals with the veterinary college on which the Minister would have been well advised to have expended much more than the few paltry pounds that he did expend. I would like the Minister, between now and the time when he will be preparing the main Estimate, to turn over in his mind whether we should not wipe out this veterinary college altogether and establish in this country the kind of veterinary college that we ought to have. Owing to a series of unfortunate circumstances the Bureau of Agricultural Research which very nearly came to Ireland went to Rome. The result of that is that a great international centre of agricultural information is now located in Rome. The fact really is that Italy does not seem to be an export country at all, in a sense, and the valuable publicity that will be associated with an international association or bureau of that kind will be lost. If that Bureau of Agricultural Research were established here it would be of immense value to our agricultural community. In addition, it would be a great centre of agricultural learning from which our people would directly benefit.
I now see a chance of establishing something perhaps not so advantageous from the publicity point of view, but something that would be of direct additional advantage to this country —that is a great veterinary college which would become, in time, the finest veterinary college in the world. There is no reason why we should not have such a college here. This country can, and I hope will, remain the headquarters of the horse and cattle breeding industry in the world. It is not our aim to produce the largest number of animals, but it is our aim to produce the best quality. This country has also become the centre for the production of the sporting dog. So that in all sorts of live-stock production, particularly the section associated with the luxury side of trade, this country has a great position. We have all the best materials and we should take advantage of these conditions.
I would like to see built up here an agricultural college on the most modern lines. I would like to see, in addition to the highly efficient staff we already have, endowments founded so as to draw to this country the most distinguished veterinarians in the world. It would surprise Deputies to think how small a sum will attract men of outstanding capacity in the learned professions. It is very difficult to realise that a man at the head of a big joint stock company may get £100,000 per annum as a salary while the most distinguished living scholar looks upon £2,000 a year as a princely reward. If we establish in this country five or six professorships with annual salaries of £2,000 a year I think we could take from the world its most distinguished men who would be free in the sphere of veterinary science to take up a position away from their own country. If we could gather into this country a body of men who would make it a great centre of veterinary learning, I think it would be of immense advantage to the country. I have dwelt on the publicity side of this matter. There is no need to dwell further on it, though I think the value from an agricultural point of view would be immense.
Take the case of cows which do not breed regularly in this country at the present time. One of the great causes of that irregularity in breeding is contagious abortion. If a specific remedy could be discovered for that bacillus it would save this country an almost unheard of sum per annum. In addition to that recognisable disease there is the catarrhal condition which prevents cows breeding regularly in this country. This is a very simple disease, but it has cost the people of this country, I estimate, about £3,000,000 per annum. That cost is falling almost altogether on the small farmer. What the cost of that disease must be in other countries is a matter that I would hesitate to attempt to estimate. But it would be worth all we could possibly spend on any veterinary institution if we could discover remedies for those two diseases alone, never mind all the other branches of veterinary medicine that might advantageously be investigated. This is a matter to which I have given some thought, and no doubt it is a matter also to which the Minister has given some thought. I do not ask him to give us a considered opinion on these problems to-day, but I do take this opportunity of inviting him to occupy the time between now and his main Estimate in considering whether a substantial sum of money, invested as I suggest, would not be a good investment for the country.
I am reluctant in connection with the sub-head for the purchase of horses to express dissatisfaction with the Horse Commission. But it does seem odd to me that we should be opening. a sub-head authorising the Minister to purchase racehorses. I do not think that breeding racehorses is a business susceptible of too much Government interference at all and I think if it is attempted by the Government they must make a mess of it. The breeding of racehorses is, most essentially, a matter for private enterprise. It is the judgement of the individual in the choosing of yearlings that results in the Blandfords and the other great sires that have appeared in this country. It is a type of business into which skilful men are induced to go by the immense awards that are sometimes available. It is not like any other farming business. The breeder of racehorses knows that for two or three years he may have to meet heavy losses. It is just his luck if he happens to breed poor stuff. Then, suddenly, in one year he may breed one horse that will bring him a fortune, and in that way he is compensated for the lean years which he expects in the business. That is not the way that Government experiments can be carried on. No Government could undertake risks of that kind. I am aware that we have had here for some time a stud which was controlled by the British Government. I am not at all sure, and never have been sure, that that was a desirable institution. I would much sooner have seen a guarantee given to the big breeders in this country, men like the Aga Khan and others, with large establishments here, that their interests would be very carefully looked after by the Government, and that any facilities the Government could provide them with would be forthcoming. I would then leave this matter of horse breeding in their hands, that is, horses of the racing type. I should prefer to see the Government giving attention to the type of horses bred by the small farmer, troopers, hunters and farm horses. I think there is a great potential market for troopers and an immense one for hunters. If the Minister means to try to help this branch of the trade, I think he will be doing good work. I would, however, urge on him that he should not commit himself in the matter of racehorse breeding, because I do not think he can make any valuable contribution to that branch of the agricultural industry.
I do not understand the Minister's explanation in connection with the oats and barley scheme. He says that he gave a guarantee to the grain buyers that he would take the oats and barley off their hands at a certain date at a certain price. He now proposes to pay compensation to the extent of £2,145 to the oats and barley buyers for transferring these oats to the millers. I do not know what the ruling prices for oats and barley were at that time. I would like to know from the Minister if the millers, at his suggestion, took over this oats and barley at a fixed price and soaked the maize meal mixture with the cost of that operation, because I suspect that is what happened. I think we ought to know. It is getting quite tedious and boring for Deputies of the House to try and follow the devious operations of the Department of Agriculture, but it is a source of never-ending amazement to those who are intimately concerned with agriculture to discover the astute methods which the Department has devised for soaking the taxpayer in taxes without letting Dáil Eireann know anything about it. The number of adjustments that can be made between levies and payments with a view to extracting taxation out of the consumer, and of passing it on to a beneficiary in the form of a dole or bounty, are so numerous that it is becoming increasingly difficult to keep track of them.
The Minister referred to the change in the agreement with Germany necessitating the purchase of more cattle. What was the change in the agreement with Germany? Some of the more guileless members of the Fianna Fáil Party hear of these trade agreements with Germany with some satisfaction. I wonder do they realise that when we send cattle to Germany we pay the land annuities, not only to Britain, but to Germany as well. The Germans buy cattle here on the Dublin market for about 23/- per cwt., while the price that the Germans would have to pay for the cattle in Denmark, or in countries contiguous to Germany, is 34/- or 35/- per cwt. So that we are actually paying the land annuities to Germany as well as to Britain on all the cattle that are shipped under this German trade agreement. The Minister here is apparently buying cattle and selling them to Germany. Would the Minister give us the average price that he has got from Germany for those cattle up to now? I think we ought to have that figure. Would the Minister also give the average price that we get from Germany for our eggs and butter? I ask Deputies to read the newspapers. If they do they will find that at the present time the Germans, owing to the policy that they have elected to pursue, are starving themselves for butter, not that there is not plenty of butter if they wanted to buy it, and plenty of people who want to sell butter to them, but owing to the policy that they have embarked on they have determined to suffer the want of butter. These people would be very glad to get butter if they could have it on terms which would fit in with their economy. The astonishing part of it is that they can come over to this country and buy our butter on the terms that there is a willing seller and that they are a willing buyer. We give them butter for half nothing, and we charge our own consumers 5d. a lb. on butter in order to enable the Minister for Agriculture to sell it cheaply to the Germans. The Minister knows as well as I do that when we settle the economic war, if it is ever settled, the devil a pound of butter will we ever sell to Germany again. When the Germans finish their armament programme and all the other codology that they are going on with at present and return to their normal sources of supply, they will not take 6d. worth of butter from us, and the Minister knows that as well as I do.