On a point of order, before we turn from questions, the Minister for Agriculture has made repeated references to some memorandum that he alleges originated in the Department of Agriculture when I was Minister last January 12 months. I have no recollection of the existence of this memorandum. Would the Minister authorise the Secretary of the Department to place at my disposal documents to which he refers so that I might check my recollections in regard to them?
Access to Official Documents.
The document I referred to is dated 31st January, 1957, and it proposes to the Minister for Finance the abandonment of the double byre grant. That was on 31st January, 1957.
All I am asking——
I am going to reply to the question that has been addressed to me.
Speaking from recollection, on the 11th of the following month the approval of the Department of Finance was received to that proposal. These two documents are in my office. When I was previously in this Department I remember subsequently making an inquiry regarding a matter somewhat similar to this. I made a claim and it was denied.
By whom?
When I went back I found that the claim I had made was perfectly accurate and perfectly correct, as I knew it was. Nevertheless it was denied. I have given my word. I have given the dates of these two documents to my colleague, the Minister for Finance, and he can do what he likes with them. I have not got very much co-operation in my time from some of the gentlemen over there. As I say, the dates and documents are in the hands of the Minister for Finance, who can do what he wishes, but my files are my files while I am there.
May I take it, Sir, that the Minister having made this allegation now forbids the head of his Department to make these documents available to me? I understood I had a constitutional right of access to documents referred to in public by my successor in office, quite apart from the ordinary rules of courtesy. I do not know what the Taoiseach's opinion is. I understand we have a constitutional right of access to official documents confidential to our Departments referred to in public by our successors. Perhaps the matter would be looked into. I do not profess to have a clear recollection of everything that transpired in the Department of Agriculture 15 or 18 months ago, but I would like to see the documents referred to.
The former Minister for Finance has written to my colleague asking for these documents. As I say, I have supplied the Minister for Finance with copies of the documents to which I have referred. Those copies are on his own file and the Minister for Finance is naturally free to do with those what he wishes.
I did not ask for any documents from the Department of Agriculture. I asked for documents that were on the files of the Department of Finance.
And they are there.
I am not interested in what is there now. I am interested in what was there when I was there. That is all I am entitled to ask for and that is all I am asking for now. When it is alleged in public that I approved of a certain document, I think I am entitled under the constitutional position to see the document of which it is alleged I approved.
Riar na hOibre.
Before you pass to that the Taoiseach is Head of the Government. I do not want to be difficult, or anything like that. I understood that all of us who had been Ministers have certain rights, one of which is access to documents of a confidential nature in his own Department referred to in public by his successor. Perhaps I am wrong in that, but I do not think I am wrong. If that right in fact pertains may I assume that, as soon as the matter is checked, this document will be made available to me? If I have not the right, then of course I am dependent upon the Minister's courtesy, a courtesy which has been denied me. If I have the right, will the Head of the Government undertake to see that the right is given effect to?
I do not know whether or not there is a right. The Constitution itself does not provide anything of that sort, but it may be a custom which followed from practice elsewhere and was adopted here also. I shall look into the matter and see what the position is.