Vol. 220 No. 10
It is proposed to take business in the following order: No. 2—Votes 43, 28, 29, 30 and 31. Private Members' Business will be taken from 6 p.m. to 7.30 p.m.
Motion No. 12 is being taken in conjunction with the Fifth Stage of the Housing Bill; consequently, when the Offences Against the State Bill is dealt with, the House will go on to Motion No. 13 on the Order Paper.
With your permission, Sir, I propose to raise the subject matter of Question No. 53 of last Thursday on the Adjournment.
I will communicate with the Deputy in the course of the day.
I want to question the Order of Business. Last Thursday morning I moved the First Stage of a Bill in the names of members of the Labour Party—the Offences Against the State Bill, 1966. It was accepted by everybody present in the House, it was accepted by all present in the Press Gallery, it was announced on the radio and on television and in the evening papers and the following morning's daily papers, that the First Stage of this Bill had been accepted in the House by the Taoiseach. Then, suddenly, from the record which we read here today, this First Stage would appear not to have been accepted. I want to direct the attention of the House to the fact that no definite obvious indication was given in this House to the effect that the First Stage was not being accepted. I know that incoherent mutterings and mumblings of the Taoiseach's satrapy in this House——
I cannot allow the Deputy to proceed. In the first place, he gave me no notice.
I said the Bill was opposed. The Official Reporters heard me.
You certainly did not.
If the Deputy did not hear, that was his fault.
I cannot allow the Deputy to proceed. The Deputy will resume his seat, please.
You leave me no alternative but to resume my seat for the moment.
The usual procedure in respect of the introduction of a Bill of the kind the Deputy speaks of was followed. He was allowed to move it and the Chair asked the Taoiseach if it was opposed. The Taoiseach said "Yes".
Nobody knew what the Taoiseach said and we all took it that it was accepted.
When the Taoiseach said "yes", I conveyed to the House that it would be transferred to Private Members' Time. That is the usual procedure that has been adopted at all times in accordance with Standing Orders.
Would the Ceann Comhairle say if the question: "Is the Bill opposed?" is the usual way such Bills are put before the House?
That is the usual question.
I never heard it before.
That is the first time, in my short time in the House, that I heard that happening. I am quite satisfied that that is not the impression that anybody in this House got.
That is the usual procedure.
Let us hope we have an end to the mutterings and mumblings that go on here, as I said, by the Taoiseach's satrapy in this House, by the more ill-bred of them. Let us have clear speech.
Let the Deputy set an example. He is muttering away now.
I have heard Deputy L'Estrange saying that the Taoiseach was not asked. That is challenging the veracity of the Chair. I want to know what the Deputy has to say about it. He said the Taoiseach was not asked.
It is a tribute to your hearing.
He said the Taoiseach was not asked. I said the Taoiseach was asked was he opposing the Bill. He said he was. Deputy L'Estrange says the Taoiseach was not asked. He said it so that I could hear him. Has the Deputy any remark to make in respect of what he said, that the Taoiseach was not asked?
I was speaking to a colleague behind me. I made a statement. I have nothing to add to or take from it.
The Deputy said he was not asked.
I said I was speaking to a colleague behind me.
The Deputy said that I did not ask the Taoiseach.
I said he was not asked.
That challenges the veracity of the Chair.
Who knows what we were speaking about at the time?
I could not avoid hearing what the Deputy said. The Deputy appeared to me to have challenged the veracity of the Chair.
I said nothing at all to the Chair.
This is censorship of private conversation.
It is about time, too.
Do you hear himself?
We will have more of this later. Ní hé seo deire an chláir.
