asked the Minister for Energy the total royalty payments made to the State by Tara Mines Ltd. in respect of its mining operations at Navan from the commencement of the operation of the mine to the latest date for which figures are available; the estimated total royalties owed by Tara to the State; the measures the Government are taking to have outstanding royalties collected; and if he will make a statement on the matter.
Ceisteanna—Questions. Oral Answers. - Tara Mines Ltd.
1.
As I have informed the Deputy in reply to previous questions, the profits of Tara Mines Ltd. for corporation profits tax purposes, which is the basis for calculation of the company's royalty liability, have yet to be agreed with the Revenue Commissioners. Consequently no payment of royalty has been demanded from the company. The matters at issue involve a number of complex points and, whilst progress is being made towards their resolution, it is not possible to say precisely when they will be resolved.
Pending resolution of the matters at issue it is not possible to estimate the company's royalty liability with any accuracy.
I have asked this question every six months since June 1984 and I have got the same answer each time. The Minister has said this is a very complex matter being negotiated with the Revenue Commissioners for over 18 months now. Could the Minister say what stage negotiations have reached? I understand that Tara Mines are making considerable profits and the State have not got a penny in royalties——
The Deputy will have to confine himself to a question.
Is the Minister correct in his statement issued the last time I asked this question, that under the terms of the lease the State should get 66 per cent? When does the Minister expect the State to get something?
The question related specifically to royalty payments and I must confine myself to my reply in regard to that. This is really a question of decisions by the Revenue Commissioners and not my Department. In previous replies I told Deputy Mac Giolla quite clearly that the questions are complex. From information I have received I understand they have wide implications. I am not in a position to give a finite opinion on this matter. Complex negotiations are going on between the company who have raised complex legal issues and the Revenue Commissioners. I hope these matters will be resolved sooner rather than later but procedures must be gone through before a determination is made. For the information of the House, the State is receiving considerable revenues from employment at Tara Mines in the form of PAYE, PRSI, VAT and rates on industrial buildings, so revenues accrue to the State from this important economic activity. In relation to the specific question asked by the Deputy, it is a matter of procedure which is set down in the tax laws to be settled in the normal course which is outside of my control.
A Cheann Comhairle——
A short supplementary, and a short answer.
Will the Minister confirm that negotiations are proceeding for the sale of Tara Mines to this Finnish state mining company? If it is true, does the Minister not consider it of great urgency to ensure that Tara's royalties have been paid to the State before such an agreement is made? Can the Minister confirm that this will be done and that all payments will be made before such a deal is completed?
I am aware of moves in respect of the acquisition of shares in relation to the ownership of Tara Mines Limited. That would not affect the liability of Tara Mines Limited in relation to the payments of royalties to the State when this falls to be determined by the Revenue Commissioners.
Question No. 2.
Will the Minister confirm if the proposed take-over of a majority share in Tara Mines by the Finnish state mining company will need the approval of his Department and if that will be forthcoming? Is the Minister hopeful that this will take place so that the long drawn out saga of Bula Mines may be finally resolved?
I must be reticent on this point because certain procedures must be gone through on the Canadian Stock Exchange in relation to the acquisition by the Finnish state company of the shareholdings relevant to Tara Mines Limited. I do not wish to comment on procedures at this point.
I would not ask the Minister to comment either because this is a complete departure from the question.
In relation to the question of Bula Mines Limited, that is an entirely separate question which is not at issue today.
Question No. 2.
A Cheann Comhairle——
Deputy Mac Giolla has another question after this and we might not reach it.
It does not relate to this. The same answer as before has been given. The Minister is telling us about the complexities. Can the Minister say after two years what are the complexities? What is preventing the State from saying to Tara Mines: "You owe us so much in royalties. Pay them up"? What is the problem?
I have tried to explain that this is a matter for complex negotiation and perhaps a contest between Tara Mines and the Revenue Commissioners. It may involve the arbitration procedure and perhaps litigation. In those circumstances it would be inappropriate for me to go into this matter which has been raised by the company with the Revenue Commissioners.
Question No. 2.