Pat Rabbitte
Ceist:3 Mr. Rabbitte asked the Taoiseach if his Department proposes to mark the 80th anniversary of the foundation of the Free State in December 2002; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [16578/02]
Ceisteanna – Questions. - Commemorative Events.
Enda Kenny
Ceist:4 Mr. Kenny asked the Taoiseach the way in which his Department intends to commemorate the 80th Anniversary of the foundation of the State; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [19903/02]
I propose to take Questions Nos. 3 and 4 together.
There are no proposals in my Department to mark the 80th anniversary of the foundation of the Free State in December 2002.
While it is the general practice to commemorate significant anniversaries of major historical events, it would not be appropriate to commemorate the 80th anniversary this year, as we commemorated the 75th anniversary of both the foundation of the State and the meeting of the first Dáil relatively recently, in 1997 and 1994 respectively.
The Deputies will recall that in December 1997 a State Reception was held in Dublin Castle and 12 special postage stamps were issued to commemorate the 75th anniversary of the coming into operation of the Constitution of the Irish Free State Act.
Similarly, the 75th anniversary of the first Dáil was commemorated in April 1994 by the holding of a State Reception in the Mansion House and the issue of a special commemorative postage stamp.
Those were two of the key events leading up to the birth of the State. If the Taoiseach does not think it appropriate to commemorate the 80th anniversary, is he aware that there is no definitive list of those who lost their lives in the War of Independence or the Civil War? Would it not be an appropriate commemoration to make available an official definitive list of combatants and non-combatants as well as people killed in error, as happens in other countries in relation to similar events or wider scale conflicts, or as happens, for example, in the case of the tragedies in Northern Ireland of the past 30 years?
It has been the practice over the years that 50th and 75th anniversaries are commemorated by the State. I am following that practice which has been followed by successive Governments. Otherwise there would be many events to commemorate. I did commemorate these events on important dates. A commemoration was held five years ago in Dublin Castle for the 75th anniversary, which was a major occasion.
In relation to Deputy Rabbitte's second question, the records of such data are held in the Department of Defence. If the Deputy says it is not a definitive list, I accept that. I know from personal experience of seeking data on individuals or relevant papers on behalf of families, that the Department has an authoritative list. If it is not a definitive list, I assume that is because it has not been possible to put one together. In the 1950s the Department endeavoured to produce a list that included not only those who were deceased, but medal-holders and those who held various ranks. That list has been updated and is still used when relatives make inquires and for numerous other purposes. I raised the matter with the Minister for Defence. I do not know why there is no definitive list. Obviously it was not possible to compile one at the time.
Last year the Taoiseach led the ceremonies in respect of the interment in Glasnevin of those who were shot in Kilmainham. Let me follow on Deputy Rabbitte's question by saying this is the 80th anniversary of a critical year in this State's history. I note the Taoiseach has €66,000 in his Department's Estimate for commemorative events. On what is it proposed to spend that money? Is there any element of it allocated to the commemoration of the 80th anniversary of the foundation of the State?
There is not. That money is good for two purposes – the Robert Emmet commemoration and I cannot recall the other. However, the event five years ago was elaborate and a lot of work went into it. I am sure it will be the same for the next major anniversary, as is the practice. Otherwise, those events would have to be organised on an on-going basis—
If there was an election due, the Taoiseach would find an excuse.
I would not. From my experience, even trying to bury people can get one into a lot of hot water in this country, not to mention trying to commemorate others.
Ag dul siar 80 bliain, tá sé soléir go raibh sé i gceist ag bunaitheoirí an Stáit go mbeadh an Ghaeilge lárnach i saol an náisiúin. An aontódh an Taoiseach liom nach gá go gcosnódh a leithéid de chomóradh mórán airgid, gur féidir ráiteas a rá a chur i gcuimhne do dhaoine go bhfuil an teanga ina croí-lár don náisiún agus gur cheart á comóradh trí úsáid na Gaeilge?
The Deputy is saying that the benefit of having the 80th anniversary is—
It is to remind people of the importance of the language.
The importance of the language is vitally important. There has been a practice, and one that is protected, that we commemorate these events in a significant way and only on 50th and 75th anniversaries. That was worked out for good reasons. The Deputy will recall that, at the suggestion of the Oireachtas committee chairman, former Deputy Donal Carey, an occasion to celebrate and commemorate the Irish language movement and the bodies involved in it was organised two years ago.
The Government buried the bodies.
There was a suggestion that we should commemorate and celebrate the importance of the language more often. I have no difficulty with that but it is a different kind of event. The purpose of that event was to bring our culture and traditions together. If I recall correctly, it was agreed on that occasion that we should do it perhaps every five years. However, that is different to what we are trying to do here, namely, to commemorate the events of 1919 to 1922.
Michael Collins would not agree.
To correct an earlier remark, Kevin Barry was hung.
Hanged.
Given the shared history of my party and that of the Taoiseach on the anti-Treaty side, does the Taoiseach agree that perhaps there is a different perspective from that tradition regarding the formation of the Free State than that articulated by others in the House? Does he also agree that, no matter what political differences exist in terms of our historical perspective, the critically important issue is to invest all our energy and effort in rebuilding the peace process—
The Deputy is wandering far from the two questions submitted.
I do not think so. I am asking whether the Taoiseach agrees—
The Deputy may not think so but the Chair rules that he is.
The important issue is to invest all our efforts and energies in rebuilding the peace process at this critical time in pursuit of the objective of all of those who struggled in the period from 1916 to 1921.
That does not arise in the context of the question.
I was referring to those who were executed and re-buried last year. I will answer questions on Northern Ireland later and will put all my efforts towards continuing to build on the progress made. I will address that issue later.
Does the Taoiseach agree that it would be a modest commemoration in itself if he were to cause the definitive list of those who lost their lives in those two events to be published?
I have no difficulty with what Deputy Rabbitte proposes if it is possible. I do not know why it was never done but assume the records are not there. I will check with the Minister of Defence, however the fact that it has never been done may indicate that there are incomplete records. As I said earlier, the Department of Defence spent much effort in the 1950s building up the records as far as possible.
The Taoiseach has treated us to one of his classics by saying that "the importance of the language is vitally important." Given that fact and that the participation rates in the deontais na Gaeilge schemes for those who speak Irish on a constant basis has declined seriously in recent years and that as a consequence the Taoiseach presides over its decimation as a spoken language, would he not consider it appropriate that there should not only be a cultural or artistic commemorative event but also a scholarship scheme to support investment and participation in the language on the 80th anniversary of the foundation of the State? I ask this especially given that his own party has always had as one of its twin pillars the restoration of the Irish language, which we are far from, and that such a commemoration would be very appropriate, as others have said.
As I stated, some years ago I held the first reception ever to honour those who were active in restoring and developing the language throughout the State. It was held in Dublin Castle with several hundred people from many organisations and none attending. It was suggested then that one be held every five years and I support that. It would be better to put our efforts and resources into lánscoileanna Gaeilge and to help the young and old to speak the language. That would be more productive and would be preferred by activists. I do not wish to mix up the 80th anniversary of the foundation of the Free State with honouring those involved with the language.